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More bloody Constructs


fmitchell

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While (re)reading Call of Cthulhu, I came across this mechanic for Skeletons:

 

 

Dried bones are fairly brittle, and snap and splinter easily from a heavy blow, but no area of a skeleton is more vulnerable than any other. To simulate this, ignore impales, critical hits, and so on. Any blow striking a skeleton has a chance of destroying it equal to or less than the damage done x4, as rolled on D100. For example, if an axe hit a skeleton and did 8 points damage, there would be a 32% chance of destroying the skeleton by shattering it. Unless the skeleton shatters, it remains totally undamaged.

 

Constructs are most like Skeletons, especially in BRP and Magic World.  The above rule also makes Skeletons more suitable as mooks: no HP to track.

 

With some modifications, this could be a way to handle magical constructs like Golems and mad science automatons.  Said modifications might include:

 

  • Armor that subtracts damage before multiplying by 4.

     

  • Tweaking the multiplier to reflect the construct's sturdiness.  Iron golems might have x1, while the Robots of Doctor Satan might have (EDIT:) x5 or more.

     

  • Instead of destroying the thing outright, a solid hit could disable a hit location or prompt a roll on the Major Malfunction Table.

     

  • Different armor/multiplier damage based on the source.  A clay golem might be highly resistant to fire and piercing or slashing attacks, but vulnerable to blunt force.

 

Or, golems could just build on the Abomination in Advanced Sorcery: HP = AP, and only a sufficiently strong single blow can harm it.  How golem's "work" is anyone's guess, because they actually don't, so it's a matter of how unstoppable one wants to make them.

 

I've also thought about borrowing approaches from robots and vehicles in Traveller: increments of 5 HP take away structural integrity points or specific systems, excess damage lost.

 

BTW, I've been picking at a revised version of "Constructs in BRP".  Changes I plan to incorporate include:

 

  • A complete overhaul for magical constructs (if it's not a separate document with a little repetition).

     

  • A fuller explanation why I dropped CON, and why and how someone can add it back.

     

  • A fuller explanation why I up AP rather than increase HP (short answer: metal is more resistant to damage than flesh and bone).

     

  • Formal rules for "split SIZ", where one number represents weight and the other height/width/reach.

     

  • A larger "bestiary", including the aforementioned mad science automatons.

 

Anyone interested?  Or am I exceeding everyone's Fun:Work ratio?  Because, really, I want damaging a thing of metal or stone to feel different from hitting flesh and blood.  Maybe even simpler, if I can swing it.

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Frank

"Welcome to the hottest and fastest-growing hobby of, er, 1977." -- The Laundry RPG
 
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If you want, I can help you with the split SIZ stuff. I've got some notes along those lines. Basically I can give you a SIZ (or MAS) for the weight/mass of the material and a modifier for VOLume based on the material used to show how big it would be. 

 

Since wood, metal and stone are denser than flesh, most constructs would actually be small for their weight - or hollow. 

Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself.

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Thanks for the offer, atgxtg, but I thinks I've got a handle on it.  Here's what I have in my notes so far.

 

 

The height and weight charts for SIZ presume living creatures. Constructs of stone, metal, or futuristic materials will weigh significantly more than living creatures of the same dimensions.

The SIZ listed for constructs represents the creature’s mass and density, used to calculate Hit Points and Damage Modifiers. Next to its SIZ is the creature’s SIZ by volume, used to calculate Strike Rank among other things. Thus a golem made of lead may have 100/15 SIZ: 100 SIZ in mass but only the volume and reach of a SIZ 15 human.

 

Assuming living beings are mostly water, it's trivial to create a density factor from the material's density, assuming the golem is solid.  Hollow constructs would probably not need split SIZ: they're roughly equivalent to a man wearing armor.

 

Likewise, high-tech constructs are composed of a lot of materials, so if they had a split SIZ at all the difference would probably only be a factor of 2 or 3.  Engineers would probably use lighter, cheaper materials or simply leave empty space to reduce power requirements and improve handling.

 

I might also borrow and refine the rule from CoC7 that MOV depends on the relationship between STR, DEX, and SIZ.  If I'm really ambitious, I might even whip up a Robot Construction Kit where SIZ and MOV depends on STR, DEX, shape, selected form of locomotion, armor, and ENC of built-in tools/weapons.  INT and EDU may also contribute to SIZ since (1) an electronic/photonic/quantum processor has some mass, (2) a large enough database will also weigh something, and (3) if the device is a shell for a full-conversion cyborg the brain and life support will definitely weigh something.  OTOH, I don't want to write a full book, so I'll try to keep the relationships simple.

Frank

"Welcome to the hottest and fastest-growing hobby of, er, 1977." -- The Laundry RPG
 
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Okay good luck.

 

Oh, I hope you don't really give that mansized Golem a SIZ of 100. That would put it up overt the 100 ton mark and would mean that it was over 1000 times as dense as a human! Something in the SIZ 42-43 range would be more like it for lead. 

Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself.

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SIZ 100 was a number off the top of my head.

 

That said, the density of lead is 11.34 g/cm^3; the density of water, which humans are mostly made of, is about 1.0 g/cm^3.  Average human weight is, let's say, 180 lbs.  Therefore, a statue (or golem) made of lead, taking up the same volume as that human would be 2041.2 lbs.  That's about the weight of a car, which p 277 of the BGB lists as SIZ 50.  So atgxtg is closer, and I was off by about a factor of two.

 

BTW, is there a formula for calculating SIZ based on weight?  Is SIZ logarithmic?  How does volume/height/reach factor in?  Is it all just guesstimates?

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Frank

"Welcome to the hottest and fastest-growing hobby of, er, 1977." -- The Laundry RPG
 
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BTW, is there a formula for calculating SIZ based on weight?  Is SIZ logarithmic?  How does volume/height/reach factor in?  Is it all just guesstimates?

 

1)Yes, several.

The one used in RQ3 (and similar to the one used in the Superworld Boxed set) has Mass= 2^(SIZ/8)*25 kg.

That can be reverse engineered and rounded off to:

 

SIZ= log(kg)*26.575-37.15

 

I can put that into pounds if you want.

 

2)Yes, at least in the 8-88 range that 99%+ of things wind up in.

 

 

3)Mostly it doesn't-SIZ is based off of mass. Split SIZ was an optional rule in the appendix of RQ2 that was never really used anyplace else. 

 

4) Yes and no. Most everyone else guesstimates. I don't.  What I do is pretty much exactly what you did when you compared density. If we assume a human has a density of 1 (or a specfic gravity of 1) and know that the SIZ table usi=es a doubling logarithmic progression with each doubling equal to +8 SIZ, you can get a constant add to SIZ by density. Like so:

 

 

x1.09 = +1 SIZ

x1.19 = +2 SIZ

x1.30 = +3 SIZ

x1.41 = +4 SIZ

x1.54 = +5 SIZ

x1.68 = +6 SIZ

x1.83 = +7 SIZ

x2.00 = +8 SIZ

x2.18 = +9 SIZ

x2.37 = +10 SIZ

x2.59 = +11 SIZ

x2.83 = +12 SIZ,

x3.08 = +13 SIZ

x3.36 = +14 SIZ 

x3.67 = +15 SIZ

x4.00 = +16 SIZ

 

 

And so forth.

 

The formula is log (density) *26.575

 

That means that if you have the specific gravity of a material you can turn it into a SIZ modifier. A few minutes with a spresheet and a table of spefic gravity for common substances and you can end up with this:

 

Oak (sg 0.75) = about -3 SIZ

Aluminum (sg 2.7) = +11 SIZ

Iron (sg 7.87) = +23 SIZ (but, like most metals sg varies by type of ion and purity, so you could simplify it to sg8 and +24 SIZ)

Brass (sq 8.5) = +24 SIZ

Copper (sq 8.96) = +25 SIZ

Silver (sg 10.49) = +27 SIZ

Lead (sg 11.35) =  +28 SIZ

Mercury (sg 13.56) =  +30

Gold (sg 19.3) = +34 SIZ

Platinum (sq 21.4) = +35 SIZ

 

 

So a man-sized (SIZ15) lead Golem would be SIZ 43 (mass or weight) and SIZ 15 by VOLume. RTHe nice thing about doing it this way is that it is a method that is reproducable for everybody that takes most of the guesswork out of it. 

 

Oh, btw, as an added perk,. STR and CON tend to change at rate of Mass^(2/3) which greatly simplfies in game terms as 2/3 SIZ. So if an iron Golem got +24 SIZ for mass it would also increase it STR by 16 points. 

 

 

 

Well, that's how I do it. 

 

 

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Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself.

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SIZ 100 was a number off the top of my head.

 

That said, the density of lead is 11.34 g/cm^3; the density of water, which humans are mostly made of, is about 1.0 g/cm^3.  Average human weight is, let's say, 180 lbs.  Therefore, a statue (or golem) made of lead, taking up the same volume as that human would be 2041.2 lbs.  That's about the weight of a car, which p 277 of the BGB lists as SIZ 50.  So atgxtg is closer, and I was off by about a factor of two.

 

BTW, is there a formula for calculating SIZ based on weight?  Is SIZ logarithmic?  How does volume/height/reach factor in?  Is it all just guesstimates?

 

 

1)Yes, several.

The one used in RQ3 (and similar to the one used in the Superworld Boxed set) has Mass= 2^(SIZ/8)*25 kg.

That can be reverse engineered and rounded off to:

 

SIZ= log(kg)*26.575-37.15

 

I can put that into pounds if you want.

 

2)Yes, at least in the 8-88 range that 99%+ of things wind up in.

 

 

3)Mostly it doesn't-SIZ is based off of mass. Split SIZ was an optional rule in the appendix of RQ2 that was never really used anyplace else. 

 

4) Yes and no. Most everyone else guesstimates. I don't.  What I do is pretty much exactly what you did when you compared density. If we assume a human has a density of 1 (or a specfic gravity of 1) and know that the SIZ table usi=es a doubling logarithmic progression with each doubling equal to +8 SIZ, you can get a constant add to SIZ by density. Like so:

 

 

x1.09 = +1 SIZ

x1.19 = +2 SIZ

x1.30 = +3 SIZ

x1.41 = +4 SIZ

x1.54 = +5 SIZ

x1.68 = +6 SIZ

x1.83 = +7 SIZ

x2.00 = +8 SIZ

x2.18 = +9 SIZ

x2.37 = +10 SIZ

x2.59 = +11 SIZ

x2.83 = +12 SIZ,

x3.08 = +13 SIZ

x3.36 = +14 SIZ 

x3.67 = +15 SIZ

x4.00 = +16 SIZ

 

 

And so forth.

 

The formula is log (density) *26.575

 

That means that if you have the specific gravity of a material you can turn it into a SIZ modifier. A few minutes with a spresheet and a table of spefic gravity for common substances and you can end up with this:

 

Oak (sg 0.75) = about -3 SIZ

Aluminum (sg 2.7) = +11 SIZ

Iron (sg 7.87) = +23 SIZ (but, like most metals sg varies by type of ion and purity, so you could simplify it to sg8 and +24 SIZ)

Brass (sq 8.5) = +24 SIZ

Copper (sq 8.96) = +25 SIZ

Silver (sg 10.49) = +27 SIZ

Lead (sg 11.35) =  +28 SIZ

Mercury (sg 13.56) =  +30

Gold (sg 19.3) = +34 SIZ

Platinum (sq 21.4) = +35 SIZ

 

 

So a man-sized (SIZ15) lead Golem would be SIZ 43 (mass or weight) and SIZ 15 by VOLume. RTHe nice thing about doing it this way is that it is a method that is reproducable for everybody that takes most of the guesswork out of it. 

 

Oh, btw, as an added perk,. STR and CON tend to change at rate of Mass^(2/3) which greatly simplfies in game terms as 2/3 SIZ. So if an iron Golem got +24 SIZ for mass it would also increase it STR by 16 points. 

 

 

 

Well, that's how I do it. 

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Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself.

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