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  2. Greg sometimes said that there are no "good guys" or "bad guys" in this struggle. As @jajagappa said. "We are all us".
  3. That;s enough for right now, but I need to work out more about how inheritance of titles & property works. Anything else in there make sense or seem like a bad idea?
  4. lordabdul

    Gods of stone

    No problem in the gaming context -- just trying to figure out how practical it is in-world. But mainly, I forgot that Sanctify was a Common Rune Magic spell in RQG so yeah I guess anybody can do that. In terms of game mechanics, the only thing you can justify is that your little shrine gives your 1 Rune Point once in a while I think?
  5. jajagappa

    Glenn

    To my knowledge neither has ever been written up as a cult as they were both Pamaltelan and outside of primary focus. You can find the following on Seseine in the Guide p.704 Seseine Seduction Submission to higher powers often brings unexpected rewards. The goddess wields her great powers with temptations which trouble both Life and Chaos alike, and her powers take equally from both. And also on p.704-5, the artwork reference Seseine Seseine Priestess: The Seseine priestess is a beautiful woman. She is mostly nude, but wears a diaphanous skirt and jewelry to enhance her attractiveness; she is aware of her near nudity and using it to inflame the desire of her cultists (and thereby gain magical power for herself). She is dancing with a cruel ecstasy and has visible contempt for her cultists, knowing that they are mere tools that would do anything she commanded. Cultists: Her cultists are largely in the darkness. One is presenting the priestess with a human head, recently taken from one of her rivals or enemies. The cultists have skin colors that range from dark black to blue. They include the rulers and priests of this Fonritian city, all gathered in secret worship. Statue of the Goddess: The statue of Seseine is dimly visible in the background. It depicts a beautiful woman, painted blue and wearing jewelry made of human heads and a black moon crowned above her head. Also in Fonrit (p.553) there is also a reference to the following individual: Seseine Kallig: This demigod sorceress was originally a blue slave. She claims to be the incarnation of the Chaos goddess Seseine and to have seduced a god of Death into servitude. She is served by an all-female band of assassins, all blues and all fanatically loyal. For magic, think Uleria transformed into powers of seduction, addiction, etc. I'd expect she'd have Charisma. Probably has magic to Arouse/Inspire (Lust/Loyalty) as passions in a target. Wouldn't surprise me if she has an equivalent to Bless Champion, except that it adds a Chaos Taint. Might have something like Hallucinate, but a version that is directed at a target instead of the self. As for Vovisibor Filth-that-Walks, also on p.704 Vovisibor The Filth-Which-Walks This entity invaded Pamaltela in the Chaos War, melting its way through the mountain wall and defeating all who opposed it. It was finally thrown down by Pamalt when he assembled all the gods of the South and together they destroyed it. also a reference on p.576 Hunralki: This shaman encountered Vovisibor in the Spirit World and survived, although the Filth-that-Walks escaped from the Scorched Earth. and p.691 The Artmali were corrupted by Vovisibor, so that they bred with monsters and beasts, and worshiped Gods of Evil. Pamalt had the Old Gods tip the Sky and pour its fire upon Vovisibor, destroying him. Based on those references, I think Vovisibor is like Wakboth - destroyed/defeated during the Great Darkness, so not actively worshipped. But, Hunralki's encounter suggests that Vovisibor's spirit exists and may be returning. I'd probably start from the perspective that it's now a chaotic spirit (much like the Bad Man) - it can be summoned, but will possess the summoner. Maybe transforms the target into something like a Cacodemon fiend, but with a fetch and access to some of the same spells as Pocharngo and Primal Chaos.
  6. In FS p81, against the title 'Low Dara Happan Religion' Greg noted "I'd sure like to have this myself." It has always struck me as significant.
  7. I have suddenly realized the most-prized LM spell... spells, actually. There's a Spirit Magic version, and a Rune Magic version. They have the same name, serve the same purpose. "Find Text" Spirit magic (1 pt) -- This spell lets you find any and all instances of a snippet of textual information (up to 10 words' length) in a scroll, book, or other document you are touching. Extra MP's may be spent to search any and all documents you are physically touching, holding, carrying, etc. For reasons they refuse to explain, LM Runelevels all refer to this spell as "Control Eff" (rather than its proper name), despite the fact they aren't "controlling" anything. Rune magic (1 pt) -- This spell similarly finds a snippet of textual information, but it finds all documents in a room, containing the matching snippet. In larger documents, the use of the Spirit Magic version is later used, per-document, to find the desired passages. Extra RP's may be spent to search more rooms within the building. You cannot search within a room of which you are unaware, such as a hidden chamber, or in a new building you haven't previously visited.
  8. I haven't really thought systematically about the areas beyond the Trader Princes yet, but I agree that Smelch is an enemy, as is Fay Jee. I'm assuming Ramalia will eventually get angry at it, but that's not as immediate. As for can Handra take Highwater.... it'd be hard. If that happened, it would require Bastis imploding for one reason or another, and Handra would need to hire a lot of Pralori mercenaries and promise a larger toll for a while. (Also, I really need to spend time on the Pralori, aka, the REAL human rulers of Maniria.)
  9. A major change since 10-odd years ago is that the Mongoose 2nd Age material has been de-canonised. That doesn't mean that everything in it is wrong (and a lot of it actually isn't), but it does mean that current and future Chaosium material takes priority over it in the event of contradictions.
  10. I want to get back to Castelein & Asharan philosophy, but I need to prep for my game tomorrow night, so here are my current thoughts about Manirian cities. The Manirian city is treated as the territory of a "special clan," a Trader Prince clan. It is neutral ground for clan and tribe business, and foreigners are granted a degree of freedom and acceptance within the city and along the road (in the clan lands, well... you best have a reason, a GOOD reason, that you can explain quickly). Generally, TP Cities are organized into 3 wards called "Thirds": The Princely Third, the Manirian Third, and the Welcoming Third. The Manirian Third Each clan maintains a longhouse in the city, headed by a Matriarch. The City Matriarchs are the clan representatives to the Trader Princes, and they offer a safe lodging to any clan members visiting the city. There are almost always some clanspeople in a city, either working semi-permanently in a city, engaging in trade, or something else. Generally, the Manirian Third within the walls has the longhouses and key temples. Outside the walls would be secondary markets, farmlands, etc. The Trader Princes In most cities, the Trader Princes are an extended family comprising 1-5 distinct households. There are intricate rules identifying personal wealth and city wealth. Nominally, these laws are to prevent corruption, but they are often subverted easily. While the head Wizard of the city's Ashara College is usually a member of the ruling family, the priests of the various Orlanthi and local gods and spirits are a mix of clansmen and Trader Princes. One of the reasons for the cities being hotbeds of politics is that any adult Trader Prince, male or female, could be elected the next king or queen of the tribe. As a result, personal patronage of individuals to the outer clans is constant and often blunt. The Trader Princes work off a variant of the Manirian model, where women own the property, and men are administrators and judges. Thus, one generation you will have a Trader Prince King who is a famous lawspeaker, and next you will have a Trader Princess Queen famous for her vineyard. The Princely Third This is the portion of the city directly under control of the Trader Prince. It's often the highest portion of the city, often with artificial terraces and mounds for various people and functions. These are sometimes of stone, and sometimes of perishable materials. There is usually a court, elite residences, guest residences for dignitaries, and a complex for the city's standing army (a grandiose term for usually a few dozen mercenaries and thanes on loan from clans). (BTW, given the environment, my visual inspiration for a lot of the Manirian culture are the Missippian culture from pre-columbian North America:) The Welcoming Third This is the portion of the city for trade and travellers. This is where one finds markets, caravanserai, warehouses, etc. Rules vary, but generally strangers to a city are only allowed into the other Thirds if they have an invitation from someone who lives there. This has created a small business for "city guides" who sell their invitations and help travellers navigate the city geographically and socially. Guides range from expert ambassadors to manipulative con-men. The Walls Almost all Trader Prince cities have strong, impressive city walls, though their style ranges from Ralian to Esrolian, depending on geographic location. The main exception is Highwater, which still has most of its Slontan fortifications. Though not a Trader Prince city, the walls of Kaxtorplose are worth mentioning, as they are the strongest, most alien walls in the region, as they were built by Kaxtor using earth sorcery. Beyond the Wall Outside the walls of the city are the Trader Prince "estates," the agricultural lands directly controlled by the Trader Princes. They are worked by a combination of thralls, Manirian cottars, and even some foreign indentured servants.
  11. Yes, but could Handra take it? Its population is around 10 000. How many of these are citizens and how many of these are resident merchants exempt from military service? In cases of total and absolute war (ww2) a country can mobilize around 1/3 of its population. Lets assume Handra would go all in , Thats around 3 000 militiamen +mercs against combined power of trader princes. Lets assume 15 000 spears in total. Yup, they cannot really do that. Princes also cannot attack Handra, since they lack fleets, and even if they did Handra has bigger one , and , looking at the size in AAA, they can probably even have farms on some of Handras islands, making it impossible to blockade at sea and starve it out . The worst princes can do is hamper trade on the river, but then Handra still is a midway point between Seshnela and Holy Kingdom. Handra is in pretty damn great position. The only forces able to touch it are naval superpowers, like returned Waertegi or Wolf Pirates. I think that the biggest enemy for Handra, at least at the start, would be the pirate kingdom of Smelch, as it directly threatens the way to Seshnela, and losing it would mean quick death if trader princes did what I said higher up. This might be a really high priority if Khorst is Manirian colony (it seems so.) . It might be a free port, but that does not mean that it isnt a personal project of a Handran higher up, or that the leaders of the Khorsty merchant guild do not also have seats in Handra. If this is true, then it opens up another route of attack for trader princes: capturing Khorst as Handran colony. It sits dangerously close to Ramalian capital, and they probably wouldnt be hard to convince to attack it.
  12. Joerg

    Gods of stone

    No idea what you're talking about... 😇 While all the things you said there may be true, where is the problem in the gaming context? Accessing the resource takes a travel, so you and your friends go there, things happen, and you may get what you need. There is nothing to stop anybody to purchase some votive images, cast Sanctify and perform a sacrifice. In Apple Lane, you even have a dedicated building for that. The list of Dawn survival sites (around Dragon Pass) does mention Karse and Nochet and their wall status in the appendices of the Guide, and there is a draft version in History of the Heortling Peoples. Info on Nochet's fortifications throughout the ages is in Esrolia: Land of 10k Goddesses. Giants or unspecified others as contract buildes (Aedin from Aedin's Wall, for instance, or the giant who connected the Storm Mountains with the Quivin peaks according to Dragon Pass:Land of Thunder, the Gazetteer for Kerofinela, or just boring Mostali) are a possibility. Are there any places where Lodril was not subdued in some form or another (by some name or another) and perform some great feat of construction? If herds can have a wyter, then a sufficiently high number of germs or viruses to cause symptoms or to infect others can have a spirit of disease... Personally, I can do without microbes, and I am fine with miasmas, humours, chi balance and similar concepts from historical and traditional healing lore. Putrefaction is a Darkness power - a transformation through partial or complete consumption of the educt. Most info you will find on them will likely be me blathering about them here or on the digests. But I recall that there were community resource rules in HQ1, and I think those were what Jeff revisited when we played that Melib game at Kraken. Greg did it somewhat differently, he had us assign the tribal abilities to the tasks at hand. Feeding the tribe was always one of the top priorities, but there were other priorities, too, like digging up an ancient artifact. At one time I gamed the system, letting my Mistress Race (equivalent) grandmother quest to keep the tribe fed while sending all the other tribal abilities to chip away at an extended contest about digging IIRC. I wish I could remember who sat in on that game with the Blue Moon trolls. I can name many of the players in the Melib game. When it comes to metals, knowing where and how a deity died or lost a limb will point you towards a motherlode of godsbone... and if a deposit is depleted, you might quest to add another limb torn off in a certain battle, and may find that second deposit afterwards. Or you might rescue the body of a slain deity and deprive a rival or enemy of the resources mined from that deity's remains. As far as I can tell, most of northeastern Sartar has limestone as bedrock, which would be available at canyons or cliffsides for quarrying. Or you could mine for the rock - IIRC the Romans did mine for tuff rock, in some places under the cities.
  13. Today
  14. Have you read the pseudo historical novel Queen's Heir? Although presented as taking place in the lands of the Hittites, it is obviously Glorantha and it is the stroy of the heir of the Maboder devoted to Humakt. First volume is quite good, the second less so.
  15. M Helsdon

    Gods of stone

    There's a fair bit about architecture in... https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/296535/The-Armies-and-Enemies-of-Dragon-Pass?src=hottest_filtered https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/297497/Temples--Towers?src=by_author_of_product Armies and Enemies includes material on mining, both military, and to a lesser degree for materials
  16. lordabdul

    Gods of stone

    Are we keeping track of Joerg's walls of text? I mean, this one might break the all-time records, no? Yeah there's potentially a bunch of spirit cults/hero cults/ancestor cults that let you do small offerings and prayers to a figure that is known to have some authority/specialty on some niche activity, and that might work well for worldbuilding and general roleplay fluff... but I'm not sure it works well in a gaming context, especially, say, RQG. This type of secondary figure doesn't have much presence, so the nearest shrine might be several days away from your stead. You might be a lay member because you visited that shrine several years ago while learning about your trade, but since then it's pretty much you by yourself in a corner of your stead in front of a homemade shrine or something, no? More importantly, these practices wouldn't give out any game mechanics advantages? (except for having given you skill bonuses at character creation/when you visited that shrine years ago) Good point. I always figured these types of buildings dated back either to the God Time (i.e. it was really gods and giants helping build these things, and people never really knew how to do that themselves), or to things like the Unity Council or EWF (similar situation: it's lost knowledge because it was split among various factions and elder races). I should look back in the Guide to see if there's any information about these Holy Country cities and their walls... I assume that the upcoming Starter Set is aimed at new RQG GMs, but not necessarily just at newbie GMs that are new to the hobby (although it should address that kind of audience too, of course). Even a newbie GMs might still want to know who's going to repair all that stuff after their player group has made a mess of everything One way handle that is to handle the Cult of Wilms as more of a guild wyter/spirit cult... (I think he's already a city wyter for Wilmskirk, but I'm talking about a craft guild wyter in addition to that). Many people might be interested in helping build and maintain cities and roads: Ernaldan priestesses who want to improve travels and transport to nearby fields or between Earth temples, Orlanth initiates who want to improve the defences of their community, Lhankor Mhy sages who are fascinated by architecture or engineering, etc... Wyters and spirit cults are orthogonal to Rune cults and allow diverse people to come together, and make it easier to separate people's activities from people's faiths and traditions. I guess this goes back to your other comments regarding how cult initiates are not (should not be) all stereotypes. I wonder if a certain podcast could explore all this in more depth... I haven't thought about it for very long (as in: I haven't thought about this for more than a decade, like you might have ), but I think my current take on this is that you can have both: viruses and bacteria exist and do their thing, but they can also be manipulated through Mallia worship and spirit magic. This is similar to how taking care of your crops using the usual things (manure, water, sun, etc.) works both because of "Science!", but also because that's what the Earth goddess wants in order to help things grow from the soil. The same way quantum entities are both particles and waves in the real world, I guess. Yay, another topic to discuss. As if we didn't have a giant list of possible topics already... It's a problem in RQG where a sub-cult needs a write-up and spell lists and stuff, but it's a lot less of a problem in HW/HQ where it's really just a name, basically. You're still free to pick whatever appropriate traits fit the character concept, and after that it's all roleplay. Saying you're an initiate of Destor doesn't sound any more as a "problem" as saying you're an initiate of Vinga -- they're all subcults. This is potentially where the rule system may have an effect on the world or, at least, on YGMV. I'm not familiar with those, I'll check them out, thanks! I didn't quite say that you can't retrofit resource management into Glorantha though... there's still enough wiggle room (even after more than 40 years!) to fit a giant quarry somewhere, with a decent-sized mining settlement, political alliances, and a small detour from some Lunar armies in this or that season of this or that year to attack it and do whatever... all without making your Glorantha vary much. I'm just saying that the absence of this type of story from the metaplot or the published books shows that this isn't something the authors thought was interesting to tackle. Resource management warfare in Glorantha is primarily about the gods, their magic, and the reality-altering powers of the God Time. While real-world spycraft has to do with securing access to oil or whatever, spycraft in Glorantha has to do with access to Rune Magic. In some ways, propaganda operations and cultural overtaking is even more important in Glorantha, too -- trying to export rock'n'roll and Hollywood movies might have helped during the Cold War, but it's nowhere near as effective as when Lunars retrofit maize and solar deities into someone's culture through heroquesting. Mmmh... now I want to run a spy thriller in Glorantha... It really varies based on the local weather and landscape. Up around Alone, with the mountains nearby, there might be suitable places to build a quarry, but with the Indigo troll tribes nearby, it's not as easy and maybe not worth it.
  17. As I said elsewhere, this is what I expect a Pralori to look like Also, I like the Mastery within Spirit rune tattoo or body paint.
  18. My friends like how, since I'm a creature from beyond, wearing the Elder Sign on my face will shut me up indefinitely.
  19. My thought process has, loosely, been Rune points based on age, and 1 RP = 1 Rune spell known. That said, I do imagine that the Lawspeaker, Storm Voice, and Ernalda Priestess are slightly beyond "simple," since each clan typically has one temple in which the Rune Masters would reside—though I suspect the Lawspeaker has to travel for his holy days, or maybe has a shrine in the Orlanth temple? Anyway, that's beyond my scope. The point being, they're useful figures which pop up a lot, so I hoped they'd be useful for GMs even if they're slightly outside my focus of "simple generic NPCs". I've tried giving them small touches of character (like Detect Cow) because, well, I couldn't help myself.
  20. rsanford

    Glenn

    I don't know the answer but Welcome!
  21. I can't remember Greg definitively saying whether he liked the Lunars better than the Orlanthi, or vice versa. I do know this. He definitely preferred playing a Lunar character in live action freeforms. I have a feeling he personally related more to the Lunar way than the Orlanthi way. Greg's RQ RPG campaigns were pretty much just based in Sartar, although he did play a bit in Prax and with the Malkioni. Most of his "unfinished works" tended to be Lunar centric, so he wrote about the Lunars more.
  22. I like how you can wear the Yellow Sign mask with the design either side up and still be right (technically).
  23. Nothing is outdated, IMO. The Glorantha in your campaign can include or exclude whatever you want. Canon-shmanon.
  24. "We are all us" 😉 I don't think I ever saw anything expressing a preference by Greg. It always seemed to me that he worked to ensure that it all "fit". If anything was a favorite, I might venture to say it might be individuals, not cultures, such as "Snodal" who started it all, and "Harmast", upon who's saga Greg spent many years writing.
  25. Glenn

    Glenn

    didn't mean to name the thread after myself...d'oh
  26. Also remember that Esrola's Throne sits atop the Shadow Plateau. And Esrola is also at times called "Black Esrola" (probably has good rich black soil - much like you'd find in the US in Minnesota/Wisconsin or up in Manitoba). Nope, they just are an existing subcult. Sounds like there would be some ancient quest to dedicate oneself to AA.
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