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deleriad

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deleriad last won the day on December 2 2017

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About deleriad

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  • RPG Biography
    Started with RQII back in 1982. Ran and played in Call of Cthulhu, Ringworld and Stormbringer. Have since run many campaigns in RQ3, DC Heroes/(MEGS as now is) & CoC. Currently running MRQ. Have played in Champions, Star Trek (FASA), V & V, Cthulhutech. Played D&D just twice in my life, Traveller once. <br />
    <br />
    Contributed to early issues of Dagon, Tales of the Reaching Moon and had an article printed in Heroes, right next to one by Jonathan Tweet.
  • Current games
    Mythras - a bit of Luther Akwright. The One Ring.
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    Edinburgh, UK
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    Blurbidy blubidy blurb.

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  1. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    The DEX rank approach in Big Gold Book etc is much closer to a standard initiative system than the SR system in RQG. To generalise: With an initiative system, each character performs its action(s) on its initiative number. (There may be sub-phases in which all movement, all ranged attacks etc happen.) With an impulse system, a character performs its first action on impulse X, then each subsequent action happens y impulses later. Y is variable and depends on "how long" the action takes. Roughly speaking, an impulse system is action-based while initiative is character-based. DEX ranks are a bit more complex because sometimes you end up performing additional actions with 5 DEX ranks between each one. So they have some impulse-like elements. RQ SRs are much closer to an impulse system in that you perform your first action on a certain SR then any subsequent actions after a variable number of SRs based on how long it takes. Unlike a pure impulse system, your impulse count resets at 12 (unless you're casting spells). The authors have tried to make SRs act more like an initiative system but it is still, in my eyes, a hybrid that is further down the impulse line than DEX ranks. Historically speaking, Ringworld was a pure impulse system that was virtually un-managable. The earliest BRP book and CoC was basically a pure initiative system. Mythras is an unusual kind of initiative system where you act once on your initiative and if you have any actions left you act again when your initiative cycles back round. Because I had a spare hour and I'm a bit of a game mechanic geek, I did have a look at whether it was possible to make SRs into a pure initiative system. Didn't look like it was going to work and you end up with a lot of numbers and overhead simply to figure out who goes first.
  2. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    In pure game mechanics terms that is precisely the issue. If you can attack and parry with a shield in the same melee round while still being able to attack with your main weapon then you always will providing you have the SRs. Failing that you will attack with shield and weapon then parry with your weapon, remembering that your chance to attack with a shield is the same as parrying. If you can attack with a cestus while wielding a 1-h weapon you will. It won't take long for the experience rolls to stack up. (I realise that there is a risk to so-doing which is a failed attack vs a successful parry.)
  3. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    That is only in reference to a knockback attempt in Jason's post not a normal shield attack. (My bad because I think I managed to confuse the two rules.) Though it does of course depend on what is meant by dual wielding. If I have a cestus on my left hand I can attack with weapon and cestus but what about punching someone if (for argument's sake) my cestus fell off? Or sword plus chair-leg etc.? What this reminds me of is MRQ1 where a late change in the combat system wasn't properly reflected in the rulebook leading to all sorts of confusion. I suspect there has been some crossed wires somewhere.
  4. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    Historically the answer to that is "yes." If you invest in a lot of off-hand training, your off-hand skill will eventually be better than simply using half your normal hand skill. (Technically you also need 1.5 times the normal DEX requirement but that is only DEX 10 (after multiplication) for Broadsword so not really a big deal.
  5. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    This is the biggest change to RQ2/RQ3 SRs since, well 1977. As a summary, providing you are wielding two weapons and have the SRs to use them you can attack with both them while still being able to parry/dodge. Shields are now considered to be a "weapon" for this purpose. The sentence in the rulebook page 219: "It is possible to attack with a shield, giving up the chance of parrying that round" is no longer true? At the risk of being philosophical - what else counts as a weapon? Something like a cestus? Presumably yes. A natural weapon something like a scorpion folk stinger or Broo headbutt? (In past RQ these were counted as additional attacks that could be made so would conform to the ruling.) Another natural weapon like fist, kick or headbutt. The result of this ruling is that any character with a Melee SR of 3 or less (i.e. DEX SR 1, SIZ SR 2) will always be able to attack twice each round with different "weapons" without needing to split attacks while parrying/dodging normally. I don't know if that's how RQG was played during playtesting but it is massively different to how RQ2/RQ3 worked. In the example of combat on page 206, Vasana drops her sword in order to make a shield attack.
  6. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    So just to be clear on this: If I am wielding two weapons then I can attack twice in a round without needing to split my attacks and can still parry? OR If I am wielding two weapons then I can attack twice in a round without needing to split my attacks but I cannot parry (or dodge) if I do this. I presume the latter. I also presume that this refers to attacking with two different weapons. i.e. I cannot wield sword and parrying dagger then attack twice with a sword (unless splitting.) Overriding the text in the rulebook, this is allowed with weapon and shield. Does this also apply to using natural weapons (e.g. kick and sword)? According to the rulebook a shield attack occurs on SR12 and prevents you from parrying (either at all or with the shield, it is unclear but presumably the latter.) Does your email override that?
  7. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    Literally, and again I don't know if this is *meant* to be the case, attacking with a shield prevents you from parrying at all during that round. I presume it is meant to mean that you can't parry with the shield you're using for the attack but presumably can still parry with something else (and/or replace the parry with a dodge.)
  8. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    Thanks for the clarification. The problem is this bullet point on page 224 Any adventurer using a weapon in each hand may use them for two attacks, two parries, or one attack and one parry. The "two parries" bit is really confusing. Bearing in mind this doesn't apply to weapon+shield. Say I am fighting with shortsword and parrying dagger. If parry with one of them does that prevent me from using it to attack? If for example I parry one enemy with my shortsword then another with a dagger at -20% does that mean I have performed "two parries" and cannot now attack? That would be strange because, for example, using just a shortsword I can attack and parry with it as frequently as I wish but if I use a 2-weapon style I can't. The other thing that is opaque (to me at least) is the relationship between parry and dodge. In a standard melee situation in which I wish to attack and defend, if I state that I will parry does that prevent me from dodging and vice-versa? Or can I just switch between parrying and dodging as I see fit during a melee round? I think it's the latter though the former is more common in BRP. If parry and dodge can be interchanged freely does the dodge restriction that prevents you from dodging multiple attacks on the same SR also apply to combining dodging and parrying. E.g. if I parry someone at SR 7 then their big brother attacks also on SR 7 can I dodge that person (at -20)? What about in reverse - can I dodge then parry on the same SR? These are pedantic questions but one of the oldest tricks in the book in RQ3 was to delay an attack so that you and a friend could attack the same enemy on the same SR, so that only one could be parried.
  9. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    Indeed it does say that. Reading the rules as written: If you are using two weapons and parrying with both of them then it is possible that you can parry the same attack with both of them. I highly doubt it because 40 years of precedence say that "no you can't" but I'm trying to the read the book as written. If you can parry the same attack with multiple weapons (it is quite cinematic to parry a blow with two swords for example) then ipso facto you can replace one of the parries with a dodge.* Again, I really doubt this is meant to be the case but I don't actually know. The example of play shows someone planning to parry an attack against a friend and then parrying an attack against himself. The subsequent parry rule indicates that he could do both on the same SR if needed. This means for example you and your friend can parry attacks against each other and yourself using the subsequent parry/dodge rule. Again this is purely reading the rules as written. As a GM I would regard players actually doing this to be gaming the system and not allow it. *Only one because dodge specifies no subsequent dodges on the same SR. I would actually interpret the rules to say that you can't dodge on the same SR you parried but the rules only refer to not dodging twice on the same SR and are silent on, for example, whether you can dodge on the same SR that you have already parried on.
  10. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    That is really unlikely. In all the years of RQ where this option has existed it has never been allowed. You have also never previously been able to parry and dodge the same attack. Note that I *think* in RQG you are not allowed to parry and dodge in the same melee round: the text on dodge refers to using it instead of parrying. I do think the designers need to explain in informal English how this is all meant to work because i suspect that various bits of copy and paste when merging RQ3 dodge with RQ2 has caused some breakages. For the record, taking the rules as written, it seems to me that the following is what happens. Statement of intent. does not have to specify targets or actions or, basically, anything. e.g. from the rulebook "(“I’ll wait here for them to do something,and have my shield and sword at the ready if someone gets close” is enough detail). So a generic statement of intent would be: "I'll attack someone on my SR and parry the most dangerous looking opponent to attack me." It *looks* like you can substitute dodge for any given parry but, per statement of intent, you don't need to be that specific until it happens. So you could replace "parry the most dangerous..." with "defend against the most dangerous...." if you want to be pedantic. Note one important difference. Under subsequent dodges it refers to only being able to do subsequent dodges on subsequent SRs. This does not appear under parries. So you could parry multiple opponents on the same SR but not dodge them. (E.g. if two trollkin wait until SR12 to do headshots you can try to parry them both but only dodge one of them.) Because dodge replaces a parry you cannot parry and dodge the same attack. Really then statement of intent is for specifying things like aimed blows or casting a spell while in melee etc. Two weapons. Per the rulebook two weapons does not refer to sword and shield and *probably* does not refer to sword and natural weapons (e.g. no sword and kick.) If using two weapons you can attack with both (giving up any defence), parry with both (giving up any attack) or attack with one and parry with the other. From the looks of it, you cannot attack and parry with the same weapon if you are using two weapons. (Technically that is the same with weapon and shield because if you attack with a shield you cannot parry with it.) Now the rulebook never explicitly rules out (or in) using two weapons to parry the same attack. (Or even two different people parrying the same attack, see below.) So it is possible that @Paid a bod yn dwp is correct and this is an innovation in RQG. Likewise, if dodge replaces a parry and you can parry the same attack with different weapons then you can, theoretically, parry and dodge the same attack. (Can't do multiple dodges on the same SR though.) I think it's most likely that this isn't ruled out (or in) simply because the authors have been playing RQ for 35 years and this is the way it has always worked. Other notable things It looks like you can perform an unlimited number of subsequent parries each MR. "An adventurer may make a subsequent parry ...If the chance is reduced to 0% or below, the chance of success becomes the default 5% minimum chance of success." (This is different to traditional BRP where you can't make a subsequent parry if your chance is reduced to 0% or below.) Look at the example of combat on page 206. Joshfar, ... announces that he’s going to parry any attacks that come [Vasana's] way. The broo recognizes Joshfar as the greater threat, and decides to attack him first. Joshfar rolls a dismal 00 on his Medium Shield parry roll: a fumble! Technically he does something not in his statement of intent but it doesn't seem to matter. i.e. statement of intents in RQG don't really need to specify targets etc. It's for this reason that I *think* the idea is that statement of intent is really only about what weapons you are using and if you are doing anything that might change your SR (like casting Bladesharp.) So a statement might be "i'll be attacking with my sword and defending with my shield" or "I'll be attacking with both my sword and my axe." Bear in mind that you can always substitute a dodge for a parry but not on the same SR you have already dodged or (presumably) parried. This reading may or may not be what the designers intended. It seems to be a hybrid of RQ2, RQ3 and BRP (multiple dodges/parries).
  11. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    Except that the rulebook explicitly states that "The adventurer must then make an attack with the weapon, shield, or part of their body they are intending use for the knockback attempt.... the knockback attempt always happens on strike rank 12. The attacker may not attack in any other way, but may parry or Dodge normally during this round." To be less pedantic, it looks like legacy rules and wordings have slipped through in different places so until RAW is clarified it's going to be a case of using your favourite interpretation. Personally I would just use the RQ3 formulation where a person dodging can do so instead of an attack or a parry. If you decided to forgo the attack in order to parry and dodge then the first parry and the first dodge would be at full value. I would also treat shields (and natural weapons) just like any other weapon - again as is done in RQ3.
  12. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    I managed to skip right over that. That's pretty ludicrous. So no bashing one enemy with your shield while kicking another in unmentionables I guess. I presume giving up parry under shield attacks refers to just parrying with the shield. But maybe not. The implication seems to be that you can't parry at all if you're attacking with a shield because two-weapon rules don't apply to weapon and shield. So, according to the rules you can parry with a shield while doing a knockback attack with a shield but not while doing a normal attack with a shield.
  13. deleriad

    Two weapons and multiple parries

    Based on how I used to play it in RQ2 and bearing in mind that the RQG rulebook seems very opaque. Each round, if you are in melee you can make: 1 attack and 1 parry - this can be with the same weapon 1 attack and 1 dodge (clearly the dodge option didn't exist in RQ2.) 2 attacks - but this must be with two different melee weapons 2 parries - with different weapons 1 parry and 1 dodge I interpret the subsequent parry rule as pertaining to the weapon being used. So if using two weapons to parry I could parry once with a shield at full value, then use the subsequent parry rule again at -20%, then parry with a different weapon (e.g. a sword) at full value and so on. Again, back in RQ2 days there was nothing stopping you using a natural weapon (head butt, kick etc) as your second attack but you often wouldn't have enough SRs for it. I don't see any reason why you can't do this in RQG. The rulebook does seem to forget that fighting with two weapons is pretty much the default in RQ: weapon and shield.
  14. deleriad

    Calculating Strike Ranks for S/MR missle weapons

    Yes, that's correct. If you have an unprepared weapon then it would be: DEX SR 0: SR 5, 10 DEX SR 1: SR 6, 12 DEX SR 2: SR 7, prep. Next round: SR 2, 9 DEX SR 3: SR 8. DEX SR 4: SR 9 DEX SR 5: SR 10 Clearly in some cases you would be better off preparing a shot but not actually firing in order to get into a better rhythm. As I say I don't know if this is what is intended but it seems to be the literal reading of the rules that treats SRs as initiative rather than time intervals.
  15. deleriad

    Calculating Strike Ranks for S/MR missle weapons

    I think though I'm not sure that the intent is slightly different. If you look at the SR table there are two kinds of figures: SRs with absolute values and SR modifiers that add a certain amount to a SR (e.g. attack with an unprepared weapon). So for example DEX 19+ is SR 0. To fire a prepared weapon (assuming it fires at S/MR) takes 0 SRs. To fire an unprepared weapon takes DEX SR +5 = 5 SRs. Bear in mind that nothing happens before SR 1. If you have a DEX SR of 0, you will attack on SR 1, 6 and 11. If you have a DEX SR of 1 you will attack on 1 and 7. If you have DEX SR of 2 you will attack on 2 and 9 Dex SR 3 - attack on 3 and 11 DEX SR 4 - attack on 4, prep an arrow DEX SR 5 - attack on 5, prep an arrow I'm not convinced that this is either correct (or meant to be correct) but there is an attempt in RQG to word it as an initiative system rather than an impulse one. Taking that literally would give the break down above.
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