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Earlier this month, a side remark in a comment of mine over at the G+ Glorantha-group resulted in a discussion about the nature of Tolat: https://plus.google.com/+GianniVacca/posts/VvnBKKFcEso?fscid=z13rjt2xqozljby5g04cftuzltqpt3oirls0k.1489396121390843 Like uncounted times before, the discussion quickly veered off, and Peter @metcalph suggested to carry the discussion over to this forum rather than cramping the G+ comments. Let's examine the sources. The series of Gods and Goddesses of Glorantha articles in Wyrm's Footnotes remains silent about Umath's struggle with the sky gods and the cause of the tilt other than Umath pushing Ga and Aether apart. The article goes on to tell us how Umath was born, but nothing about his demise or chaining. Peter @metcalph wrote in the comment's to Gianni's G-thread about Lightbringers in the East: Not the most accurate description of the deity, either. Uleria in her role as fertility-bringer and provider of sexual ecstasy, I suppose - uxorial ecstasy is mentioned in the Trowjang or Amazon context, too - and Humakt in his role as a sword- and deathgod. There are also first published mentions of other related topics in the Genertela box. Alkoth was presented as one of the three Dara Happan metropolises in Genertela:Crucible of the Hero Wars, and mentions Alkor as the city god (keeping company with Raiba and Yuthu, IIRC). We also get the Thunder Delta as the location where Umath was dismembered. The Glorantha Book detailing the history of Glorantha was the first time I recall to have read about the Loper People, but since I got access to the unabridged Wyrm's Footnotes only a lot later, I cannot say for sure whether these guys weren't mentioned in some of those sources. Then there was the star and planets lore in Elder Secrets of Glorantha. That source presented the planet as Tolat and gave the Loper People connection. The planets presented in that essay had been part of the Gloranthan lore since long before that publication - we get the Twin Stars as a Lunar spirit in the Dragon Pass board game. (Nomad Gods offered a few more stars, but the Bronze Treasure among the Lunar spirits in the French edition of Nomad Gods was a later addition, IIRC. The Red Planet as a Lunar spirit doesn't fit Shargash at all, but it works for the brother of the Blue Moon of the Veldang.) Other early texts about western heroes mention other planets like Artia the Bat, but those aren't accessible to the public. Just to get this thread running, I am cutting off here.