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MoonRightRomantic

Just uploaded most of the yahoo groups files to here

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Since Yahoo Groups is unstable, I copied over most of the files to here (except, as of this writing, the photos and desktop wallpapers). There wasn't a nephilim section, so I used the tagging system to keep the files organized. Hopefully this doesn't cause any problems. If the mods have anything to say, I will defer to their judgment. Thanks!

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2 hours ago, MoonRightRomantic said:

Since Yahoo Groups is unstable, I copied over most of the files to here (except, as of this writing, the photos and desktop wallpapers). There wasn't a nephilim section, so I used the tagging system to keep the files organized. Hopefully this doesn't cause any problems. If the mods have anything to say, I will defer to their judgment. Thanks!

Many thanks!

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Really useful, thanks, even though I had to go through what seemed like hundreds of new posts!

Do you have a Zip File with everything in one file? That would be really useful.

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Wow.  I uploaded a scan of the entire raw Selenim translation with editorial?  What was I thinking?

Oh, yeah, I was thinking that it was never going to see the light of day.  And, besides, the French books were always available to the polyliterate.  That upload was, what, 2005?  Fortunes were very uncertain at that point.  Dim, even.

But look what's happened in the decade since!

!i!

Edited by Ian Absentia

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On 8/16/2019 at 12:50 PM, soltakss said:

Really useful, thanks, even though I had to go through what seemed like hundreds of new posts!

Do you have a Zip File with everything in one file? That would be really useful.

There were about 90 files I uploaded from four different yahoo groups archives. I could zip them up, sure, but I don't know whether everything would be particularly useful to you. At least here, the files may be sorted fairly easily with the tagging system. And you can put comments on them. And stuff.

I didn't upload the Nephilim redux/rewrite files or the unofficial translation of the selenim books since those were specified to be private by the sharers. I also saved an archive of some ancient fansites from decades ago, which might have some useful ideas.

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On 8/17/2019 at 12:55 PM, Ian Absentia said:

Wow.  I uploaded a scan of the entire raw Selenim translation with editorial?  What was I thinking?

Oh, yeah, I was thinking that it was never going to see the light of day.  And, besides, the French books were always available to the polyliterate.  That upload was, what, 2005?  Fortunes were very uncertain at that point.  Dim, even.

But look what's happened in the decade since!

!i!

I had plenty of ideas for revising the selenim rules, beyond what was originally planned for the English adaptation (according to the notes, selenim were going to have invented the precursor of stasis objects, meaning they would have their own equivalent that was absent in the French original). Among other things, it might make more sense to introduce the black moon spells for the existing occult sciences rather than introduce new black moon skills. The sorcery and alchemy rules were revised extensively in Enlightened Magic (unfortunately summoning never got a similar treatment) and Saturnian magic was introduced in the Secret Societies book, so it makes sense from that perspective. Unless we intend to overhaul the magic system again to take into account all eight elements.

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On 9/26/2019 at 2:47 AM, ThaisMunk said:

I'm glad that Nephilim gets to live on in this way.

"That which is not dead..."

More cross-title pollination. 👉🐱👈

!i!

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On 8/19/2019 at 6:44 AM, MoonRightRomantic said:

...to take into account all eight elements.

Whoa, hey.  This slipped past me a couple of months ago.  I'm curious -- considering that only six elements were noted in the original edition (seven, if you count the unpublished Selenim book), which eight elements would you identify?

  1. Solar
  2. Air
  3. Earth
  4. Fire
  5. Water
  6. Moon
  7. (Black Moon)
  8. (???)

There are actually several different directions I might take this, including the apparent overlap of elements identified in Western occult/philosophical traditions (which aren't always in perfect alignment) with those in Asian traditions (which are also not always in alignment), and reconciliation of the deviations between the two.

!i!

[Edit:  Right, I missed your reference to Saturnian magic from Secret Societies, which is kind of an inverted Solar element rather like how Black Moon is sort of an inverted Moon element.]

Edited by Ian Absentia

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6 minutes ago, Ian Absentia said:

Whoa, hey.  This slipped past me a couple of months ago.  I'm curious -- considering that only six elements were noted in the original edition (seven, if you count the unpublished Selenim book), which eight elements would you identify?

  1. Solar
  2. Air
  3. Earth
  4. Fire
  5. Water
  6. Moon
  7. (Black Moon)
  8. (???)

There are actually several different directions I might take this, including the apparent overlap of elements identified in Western occult/philosophical traditions (which aren't always in perfect alignment) with those in Asian traditions (which are also not always in alignment), and reconciliation of the deviations between the two.

Aether?

SDLeary

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5 hours ago, Ian Absentia said:

But is Aether an actual element or a medium?  Hah!

!i!

According to the Greeks, Hindi, Buddhists, Japanese, and Tibetans it is.. was... whatever. The Chinese were odd in their elemental representation... they though wood was an element. Medieval Europe (alchemists anyway), in addition to Aether, had Sulpher, Mercury, and Salt.

SDLeary

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17 hours ago, SDLeary said:

they though wood was an element

FLAMAL HAS A FEELING RIGHT NOW

also wood represents "life" so it's not as odd as it might seem

Edited by Qizilbashwoman
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Yahoo Groups is shutting down in December, with uploads being disabled next week. I'm glad I saved all the important files. Sadly I didn't think to save the photos and desktops, and the yahoo server is now having outages that prevent a last minute backup. There's so much else I wanted to save that I may not get a chance to, but I've resigned myself to the loss of years of history.

If anybody wants to help pay for the transfer to groups.io, then ask Shannon for details.

On a more positive note, here are two links to Nephilim-related websites:

  • https://nephilim.obsidianportal.com/ This is somebody's campaign site, but it does include some neat ideas on cosmology like "evolving ka" and "residual ka" that I find quite useful for explanation. (Their info on Selenim is pure homebrew with no relation to the French original.)
  • http://bmo.altervista.org/Nephilim/index.htm This is where I archived a bunch of old nephilim websites for posterity. There are a bunch of interesting ideas for mechanics hidden there.

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1 hour ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

also wood represents "life" so it's not as odd as it might seem

Also, Taoist "elements" is kind of a translational misnomer.  They're seen more as influences than physical substances.  So it's not a matter of being made of wood, but being like unto or affected by the nature of wood.

!i!

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On 10/16/2019 at 7:22 PM, Ian Absentia said:

I'm curious -- considering that only six elements were noted in the original edition (seven, if you count the unpublished Selenim book), which eight elements would you identify?

As well as Orichalka/Black Sun, Major Arcana had the Star Arcanum believing they'd detected a Stellar Ka, although they couldn't do anything much with it

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On 10/26/2019 at 7:27 PM, SunlessNick said:

As well as Orichalka/Black Sun, Major Arcana had the Star Arcanum believing they'd detected a Stellar Ka, although they couldn't do anything much with it

The rulebook mentioned eight elements, not six or seven. Sun/Solar, Air, Earth, Fire, Water, Moon/Lunar, Black Moon/Lunar, and Black Sun/Saturnian/Orichalka.

Alien Ka is such a fascinating concept given Nephilim’s cosmology.

 

On 10/17/2019 at 2:42 PM, Ian Absentia said:

Also, Taoist "elements" is kind of a translational misnomer.  They're seen more as influences than physical substances.  So it's not a matter of being made of wood, but being like unto or affected by the nature of wood.

!i!

In the French, the “shen” (Chinese nephilim, called “xian-ren” on the English mailing list) purified their Air Ka and Lunar Ka to create Wood Ka and Metal Ka (or Qi). Nephilim’s pentacle is identical to the Wu Xing pentacle except for that rename (Air=Wood, Lunar=Metal).

IIRC from the archives of the old 90s mailing list discussions, you guys were considering that non-Western nephilim would have different elements (the French version had vaguely similar ideas in its Exiles supplement, like the historical Ghost Dance disabling orichalka in North America). Nowadays, I personally find that unnecessary (and like a lot of 90s RPG material concerning foreign cultures, often extremely ignorant and unintentionally offensive) since Nephilim’s default cosmology already owes plenty to taoist alchemy and other non-Western occultism.

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