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Piracy and Slavery!

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2 hours ago, Jeff said:

Some current notes on the premier pirates of the Third Age.

Many thanks! I was about to make a thread to ask more about Yggites and Wolf Pirates, but your post answered most of the questions I had :). Few still remain. What is Yggites' appearance like, Rathorish, Sartarish? What kind of names they have, Old Norseish? Do they have clans, tribes, things, monarchs? Do they practice shamanism?

Edited by Brootse

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4 hours ago, Jeff said:

There are about 60 captains, which means that is the approximate number of important people. Harrek is a captain as well as Sea-King, as is Gold Gotti

Errr, Gold Gotti among the pirates? Well that's a surprise! 😲

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2 hours ago, Brootse said:

Many thanks! I was about to make a thread to ask more about Yggites and Wolf Pirates, but your post answered most of the questions I had :). Few still remain. What is Yggites' appearance like, Rathorish, Sartarish? What kind of names they have, Old Norseish? Do they have clans, tribes, things, monarchs? Do they practice shamanism?

Do you mean Wolf Pirates or Yggites? The Yggites have names like Orstando, Gotti, etc. Not particularly Norse. They had clans when they lived on the Yggs Islands, but for the Wolf Pirates their social order is structured around their ships.

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3 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Do you mean Wolf Pirates or Yggites? The Yggites have names like Orstando, Gotti, etc. Not particularly Norse. They had clans when they lived on the Yggs Islands, but for the Wolf Pirates their social order is structured around their ships.

Thanks! I meant Yggites specifically.

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On 8/22/2019 at 9:04 AM, Jeff said:

1. He was "chosen" by Ygg. That probably means that the priests of Ygg all recognised him as the incarnation of Vadrus and backed him strongly. They continue to do so as long as he continues to bring destruction and war to the world.

Wait whaaaaaat?

EDIT: Seems weird that they would consider him the incarnation of a god everyone agrees is completely gone. Unless, of course, the Vadrudi branch of Storm peoples (Yggites, Valindings, etc.) disagree, and believe that there is something left of Vadrus to actually incarnate.

Edited by Sir_Godspeed

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Jeff, you speak about the 2 brothers (gods that are worshiped by the Wolf Pirates). never hear of them...

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On 8/23/2019 at 7:42 PM, Manu said:

you speak about the 2 brothers (gods that are worshiped by the Wolf Pirates). never hear of them...

That’s probably 

Hanjethulut (like Zorak Zoran, but not associated with trolls) and Orjethulut (like Humakt), two Fonritian war gods that fought everyone else, but then made peace. They are fierce rivals, but do not attach other unless their numbers are unequal (a strict census ensures their numbers are equal by sacrificing the excess). 

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It's odd that we've never heard much of Pelaskite or Hendrikilander pirates, consider the myriad of places to hide, and the relatively rough terrain of their homelands.

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2 minutes ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

It's odd that we've never heard much of Pelaskite or Hendrikilander pirates, consider the myriad of places to hide, and the relatively rough terrain of their homelands.

The Pelaskites aren't pirates, they are the navy. That's one degree better than a letter of marque...

There are a number of independent "pirate hunter" vessels based in the major ports of Kethaela which may also target vessels of business rivals of their sponsors. Certain cargo may leave a port more than once.

 

As to pirate coves: Seriously, most of the Pelaskite territory is coastal flats. There are a few volcanic domes sticking out, but most of the place is mudflats. The Poison Shore isn't named thus for nothing, volcanic fumes can turn any hideout there into death traps.

The Hendrikilander coastal folk are Pelaskites, too, as are a majority of the Esrolian seagoing folk (and possibly even some of the river folk, at least in the tidal influence zones of the estuaries, which may reach inland quite a bit).

The Heortland plateau has its deep river gorges before turning into coastal flats.

There may be some beach robbery going on on the Pelaskite shores - at least foreign ships running aground on sand banks may see some Pelaskite salvage efforts that make short thrift with protesting occupators of the helpless "wrecks". However, the rhythm of the Gloranthan tides makes running aground on a sandbar not much of a threat if the hull didn't take leaking damage. The slowly rising flood will take the ship awash sooner or later, provided it survives the wave action of the Solkathi Sea.

More problematic are Sea Troll boarders or Ludoch pirates (who guide the ships onto sharp reefs, then harvest the underwater bounty). Ludoch pirates may enlist local Pelaskites as auxiliary troops for action above the water line.

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Weren't the Vadeli Pirates who engaged in slavery? Seems like the sort of thing they would do. Being pirates to preserve their monopoly on sea travel sounds eminently reasonable.

Edited by soltakss

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You'd think the sand bars in the Rightarm isles would make for good pirate escape locations, if you they assault with smaller ships (ie. the enemy can't pursue you over a shallow, but you can cross it, and continue on your merry way) - however, if it's assumed that the native Ludoch and inhabitants are anti-piracy to an overwhelming degree, I guess that's a no-go.

Edited by Sir_Godspeed

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On 8/22/2019 at 10:04 AM, Jeff said:

History

 

In 1610, the Wolf Pirates settle on Three Step Isles, barren islands south of Kethaela that had been abandoned since the Dawn.

I was browsing the guide today to check the timeline for one of the PCs in my campaign, and then re-read this thread for more info. I found some conflicting material:

Volume 1, p. 239: Further troubles came with a huge fleet of Wolf Pirates who took residence on the Three Step Islands in 1605 and raided the whole south coast.

Volume 2 p. 472: Three Step Islands are a small archipelago south of Kethaela. It is a pleasant place suitable for crops and sheep.

Were the Three Step islands canonically settled in 1605 or 1610, and are they barren or pleasant and suitable for agriculture?

And is Orstando Black Wolf still the person who established the Wolf Pirates?

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24 minutes ago, Brootse said:

I was browsing the guide today to check the timeline for one of the PCs in my campaign, and then re-read this thread for more info. I found some conflicting material:

Volume 1, p. 239: Further troubles came with a huge fleet of Wolf Pirates who took residence on the Three Step Islands in 1605 and raided the whole south coast.

Volume 2 p. 472: Three Step Islands are a small archipelago south of Kethaela. It is a pleasant place suitable for crops and sheep.

Were the Three Step islands canonically settled in 1605 or 1610, and are they barren or pleasant and suitable for agriculture?

And is Orstando Black Wolf still the person who established the Wolf Pirates?

As Jeff isn't going to do any arbitrary changes to published canon, I think it is safe to assume that the date of 1605 as per Guide still is valid.

The Threestep Isles probably are barren in the eyes of Esrolians or Pelaskites, but for Ygg Islanders they may be pleasant and suitable for crops (which doesn't automatically mean agriculture - you can have crops by horticulture, too).

Malta has already been used for Alatan, as far as my real world parallels go, so the Threestep Isles might be similar to the Aran Islands in Galway Bay, Ireland. Pretty barren without some backbreaking work put in, but able to sustain a hardy islander population that braves the sea and persists by planting crops in specially prepared areas of crushed rock mixed with sea weed. Or perhaps the rock-enclosed plots of the Easter Island after its deforestation.

For an Ygg Islander (the equivalent of a Greenland settler), the Threestep Isles are wondrously warm and fertile. And they don't have to do the backbreaking work in cultivating the crops, they have plenty slaves for that kind of work.

 

Orstando founded the Wolf Pirates, sailed for the Vadeli, and (IMO now) established the Ginorth colony off Old Seshnela. All of that happened by the aftermath of the Batlle of Oenriko Rocks which crushed the Vadeli naval superiority and released the Wolf Pirates from their obligations to the Vadeli. So say 1595.

10 years later, the Wolf Pirates take possession of the Threestep Isles as one of their colonies. Further 10 years later, Harrek establishes himself here, then starts his circumnavigation. Nine years later he is given access to the City of Wonders.

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Joerg is correct - Threestep Isles is pleasant by Yggs Islander standards (and honestly, what isn't?), but is barren and bleak by the standards of folk from southern Genertela. In 1621, the only folk likely to visit the Threestep Isles are Wolf Pirates (who were still majority Yggsites). In 1625, Three Step Isles is a player in the politics of the Holy Country and most Wolf Pirates are not from the Yggs Isles.

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On 9/9/2019 at 9:48 PM, Joerg said:

As Jeff isn't going to do any arbitrary changes to published canon

Watch this space. I am sure that the upcoming super-campaign will adjust things from old sources, such as King of Sartar. Doesn't bother me, though.

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Just now, soltakss said:

Watch this space. I am sure that the upcoming super-campaign will adjust things from old sources, such as King of Sartar. Doesn't bother me, though.

Oh, there will be changes to older material. But they won't be arbitrary, but considered. I won't agree with all of those changes or interpretations, but then the same will have to be said in the opposite direction. And unless I manage to sit down and produce an epic campaign for RQG or some other system to rival the Great Argrath Campaign, I won't be in a position to demand changes in my direction.

But yes, watch this space.

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20 hours ago, Joerg said:

Oh, there will be changes to older material. But they won't be arbitrary, but considered. I won't agree with all of those changes or interpretations, but then the same will have to be said in the opposite direction. And unless I manage to sit down and produce an epic campaign for RQG or some other system to rival the Great Argrath Campaign, I won't be in a position to demand changes in my direction.

But yes, watch this space.

The only thing I wish Chaosium would do is hire a linguist. There's such beautiful opportunity in Stafford's work...

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