Yelmalio again or Why I Ruined Your Glorantha Redux.

[Qizilbashwoman]

Just now, Bill the barbarian said:

 

Nice picture... but I believe that there are 366 days in 2020 so I am not sure it is as much a DATE as a OFFICIAL YEAR. As the good doctors might say, your year might vary...

i think we just learnt that gloranthan days are longer but they have fewer days, I'm going to live on that planet

[Bill the barbarian]

1 minute ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Quote

Vega is a Light Son and commander of the Sun Dome Militia. The only woman devotee [emph. mine] in Sun County, Vega Goldbreath rose to authority despite prejudice, derision, and chauvinism on the way to the top. Once married to Invictus, they were compelled to divorce as he achieved high cult rank. Invictus later married Vega’s twin sister, something she has never forgiven him for. She is intelligent and quick-witted, and hardly orthodox Sun County in her outlook.

 

Seems like chauvinism (or a smoking gun at least) to me. lordabdul and myself could easily be accused of male privilege here and not recognizing a truth that you point out. 

So from me,

 cheers.

[Qizilbashwoman]

Just now, Bill the barbarian said:

Seems like chauvinism (or a smoking gun at least) to me. lordabdul and myself could easily be accused of male privilege here and not recognizing a truth that you point out. 

So from me,

 cheers.

I mean, it might just be Mo Baustra?

[Bill the barbarian]

24 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

As the good doctors might say, your year might vary...

22 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

i think we just learnt that gloranthan days are longer but they have fewer days, I'm going to live on that planet

The good doctor has obviously visited Glorantha (closed world, indeed, just try to stop a time lord with Handwavium in his or her deep pockets).

Edited December 14, 2019 by Bill the barbarian

[Austin]

1 hour ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

So while the commander of the militia is a woman, she's also literally the only female devotee in Sun Country.

On the one hand, only devotee =/= only initiate; on the other, it's still a fair point. However, I likewise wonder what proportion of Orlanth devotees—Wind Lords & Storm Voices—are female. If Yelmalio fulfills the role of "men's god" in Praxian Sun County in a similar way that Orlanth is the general Sartarite "men's god," perhaps it's not unexpected that, proportionally, only one female worshiper of Yelmalio would be a devotee.

However, I do think in that context that it's worth noting the dynamic between Yelmalions & Ernaldans in Sun County seems quite different from that in Sartar, from what I've been following on this thread (I don't have much of the Sun County material myself).

[Joerg]

Each of the two Yelmalio settings that have been described in some greater RuneQuest detail have their alibi light lady of Yelmalio, although in case of Starnia Stormrender, she has rather few male rivals.

"Devotee" translates as rune level. I wonder how many templars will be (biologically) female.

Or is Vega just the only biologically female rune level in the Sun County hierarchy that openly identifies as female-gendered (i.e. taking on the female role in a marriage, risking or even welcoming motherhood - or at least a successful pregnancy)? What is the proportion of "covert females" in the ranks (including male-plumbed templars strongly identifying otherwise)?

The templars are likely to have "sacred brotherhood" relationships with fellow templars. No idea whether these are monogamous or polyamory in nature...

[Jeff]

5 hours ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

I mean, it might just be Mo Baustra?

It is just Mob of Australia.

[Tindalos]

3 hours ago, Jeff said:

It is just Mob of Australia.

There needs to be some reaction option halfway between laughing and crying, specifically for when you find out the origin of a Gloranthan name.

[Bill the barbarian]

2 hours ago, Tindalos said:

There needs to be some reaction option halfway between laughing and crying, specifically for when you find out the origin of a Gloranthan name.

Oh my time to resurrect “Puns we know and love” is it?

[Joerg]

31 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Oh my time to resurrect “Puns we know and love” is it?

That word after "and" is correctly spelled with "ath" rather than "v"...

[Bill the barbarian]

37 minutes ago, Joerg said:

That word after "and" is correctly spelled with "ath" rather than "v"...

ThOU doest not like Gloranthan puns, burn him!
with Yelm’s holy fire, of course!

Edited December 14, 2019 by Bill the barbarian

[soltakss]

12 hours ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Quote

Vega is a Light Son and commander of the Sun Dome Militia. The only woman devotee [emph. mine] in Sun County, Vega Goldbreath rose to authority despite prejudice, derision, and chauvinism on the way to the top. Once married to Invictus, they were compelled to divorce as he achieved high cult rank. Invictus later married Vega’s twin sister, something she has never forgiven him for. She is intelligent and quick-witted, and hardly orthodox Sun County in her outlook.

So while the commander of the militia is a woman, she's also literally the only female devotee in Sun Country

She is a female devotee, so females can become devotees. How many devotees are there in Sun County? 

In Sun County, women are normally Ernaldans, so it is unusual for them to join Yelmalio, but they can. Vega is a Light Son, so is important in the cult. This shows that women can become Rune Levels in Yelmalio. 

I am not sure why that says that Yemlaio is misogynistic.

[g33k]

2 hours ago, soltakss said:

She is a female devotee, so females can become devotees. How many devotees are there in Sun County? 

In Sun County, women are normally Ernaldans, so it is unusual for them to join Yelmalio, but they can. Vega is a Light Son, so is important in the cult. This shows that women can become Rune Levels in Yelmalio. 

I am not sure why that says that Yemlaio is misogynistic.

Of course this bit you're arguing does NOT say misogyny! 

But (a) you're ignoring how much she's an exceptional case, and (b) there's that bit you didn't quote... "prejudice, derision, and chauvinism on the way"... That kinda DOES say misogyny.  Luckily, we have Jeff telling us that the one temple is a bit of an outlier...

[Qizilbashwoman]

14 hours ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

@Qizilbashwoman Since Jeff described the upcoming  Yelmalio cult write-up as "remarkably similar" to that from Cults of Prax, not Sun Country, you can breathe easier.  They are certainly "old fashioned" in attitude, women shouldn't  show bare arms and legs and such, but no talk of veils or the malicious predjudice faced by Vega.

Yay

16 hours ago, Crel said:

I do think in that context that it's worth noting the dynamic between Yelmalions & Ernaldans in Sun County seems quite different from that in Sartar

Well, Ernalda and Elmal do have year-marriages in Sartar. Without King Orlanth monopolising Her time, Yelmalio has a different relationship.

I wonder why Ernalda in particular is popular in Sun County; I'm surprised there's not more Eirithans. Yes, I know She's the queen, but still.

Do the Sun Domers have a better relationship with Zola Fel and the Blue People than the Wahans?

[Tindalos]

20 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Do the Sun Domers have a better relationship with Zola Fel and the Blue People than the Wahans?

In the Sun County book, there was a special heroquest that the counts underwent to gain the river's favour, recreating Yelm's protection of the Oslir River.

[g33k]

32 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Yay

Well, Ernalda and Elmal do have year-marriages in Sartar. Without King Orlanth monopolising Her time, Yelmalio has a different relationship.

I wonder why Ernalda in particular is popular in Sun County; I'm surprised there's not more Eirithans. Yes, I know She's the queen, but still.

Do the Sun Domers have a better relationship with Zola Fel and the Blue People than the Wahans?

I think it follows from Yelmalio having a substantive place in Lightbringer myth cycles, not so much in the Survival Covenant myth cycles.

Yelmalio had a key role in survival through the Darkness, for the LBQ folk.

For the Praxians, wasn't it more "Star Captain" action from the sky?  And Yelorna, IIRC, has both Sun and Star-Captain associations...

Edit:  then there's the purely socio-political, with their whole "superiority" fetish & purity taboos, vs. the "commoner" aspect of Eiritha.  Might if have behooved them to make some overtures, maybe even some alliances?  Absolutely!  Was it in keeping with the mindset?  Absolutely not!

Edited December 15, 2019 by g33k
Eiritha

[Jeff]

7 hours ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Yay

Well, Ernalda and Elmal do have year-marriages in Sartar. Without King Orlanth monopolising Her time, Yelmalio has a different relationship.

I wonder why Ernalda in particular is popular in Sun County; I'm surprised there's not more Eirithans. Yes, I know She's the queen, but still.

Do the Sun Domers have a better relationship with Zola Fel and the Blue People than the Wahans?

Ernalda is the main goddess in Sun County because they are farmers, not herders.

[Jeff]

7 hours ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Yay

Well, Ernalda and Elmal do have year-marriages in Sartar. Without King Orlanth monopolising Her time, Yelmalio has a different relationship.

I wonder why Ernalda in particular is popular in Sun County; I'm surprised there's not more Eirithans. Yes, I know She's the queen, but still.

Do the Sun Domers have a better relationship with Zola Fel and the Blue People than the Wahans?

The Orlanthi acknowledge that Ernalda took many gods as consorts and husbands. Orlanth, Yelm, Flamal, Yelmalio, Storm Bull, Magasta, Lodril, etc. She's the Earth Mother. Some husband-protectors are universally acknowledged (Orlanth, Flamal), others nearly universally acknowledged (Yelm, Yelmalio, Magasta), and others just locally recognised (Storm Bull, Lodril, etc.). 

[MOB]

9 hours ago, Tindalos said:

In the Sun County book, there was a special heroquest that the counts underwent to gain the river's favour, recreating Yelm's protection of the Oslir River.

And continue to enact every year. The reigning Count is expected to perform it at the beginning of his reign, and then may delegate the role to a proxy (usually a Light Son) in subsequent years.

In the recriminations after the Cradle episode, it was clear that Zola Fel was angry with the Sun Folk for siding with the Lunars. Tremendous magical and physical resources had been diverted to the failed Cradle venture, and agriculture across all of Sun County duly suffered; compounding this, irrigation channels would burst, clog or divert at inopportune times, and waterways were frequently plagued with stinging botflies. 

At Count Solanthos' command, Lord Invictus had the River Ritual reenacted, seeking at least to make amends with the river. But the chosen participant, the popular rune lord Wulf*, was later found drowned despite a full suite of chanting priests supporting him and hundreds of farmfolk fervently praying along the riverbanks. Clearly the river god remained unappeased. It was only after the Great Winter that amends were made, conclusively healing the rift with Zola Fel and guaranteeing that the hungry land at last would enjoy a bountiful harvest.

*yeah, from Rune Masters

[Byll]

22 hours ago, Jeff said:

On 12/14/2019 at 7:15 AM, Qizilbashwoman said:

I mean, it might just be Mo Baustra?

It is just Mob of Australia.

Is this the time to confess I've been spelling it Mo Bastura for twenty five years?

[MOB]

50 minutes ago, Byll said:

Is this the time to confess I've been spelling it Mo Bastura for twenty five years?

How they say it Sartar...

[Joerg]

1 hour ago, MOB said:

And continue to enact every year. The reigning Count is expected to perform it at the beginning of his reign, and then may delegate the role to a proxy (usually a Light Son) in subsequent years.

In the recriminations after the Cradle episode, it was clear that Zola Fel was angry with the Sun Folk for siding with the Lunars. Tremendous magical and physical resources had been diverted to the failed Cradle venture, and agriculture across all of Sun County duly suffered; compounding this, irrigation channels would burst, clog or divert at inopportune times, and waterways were frequently plagued with stinging botflies. 

Isn't the River Ritual a Sea Season rite?

The 1622 Sea Season is additionally hampered by the Windstop, so did they perform the rite in the same season the Cradle floated by?

 

[MOB]

15 minutes ago, Joerg said:

Isn't the River Ritual a Sea Season rite?

The 1622 Sea Season is additionally hampered by the Windstop, so did they perform the rite in the same season the Cradle floated by?

The River Ritual for 1621 had been already been successfully enacted at the start of Sea Season 1621, before the coming of the Cradle took everyone by surprise. But the Sun Domers then choosing to side with Lunars abrogated the compact with Zola Fel, who unsurprisingly viewed this as a great act of betrayal. The Count tried to enact the River Ritual again to make amends, but the Light Son Wulf failed, turning up drowned.

By the start of the new year 1622 the Zola Fel should have been back to full flow from the spring melt. But instead due to the Windstop the river had slowed to little more than a trickle, and it proved impossible even to commence the River Ritual in the few stagnant pools that remained. Daga’s drought had a terrible grip on the land: parched fields that were once thick with golden corn lay dry and hard, and withered corpses of farm animals lay clustered around empty canals and wells.

Zola Fel assumes the role of Heler in the Sun Dome version of Daga’s Banishment, and following a heroquest path taken by the Counts of old, the Light Captain Invictus sought the aid of the river. The Cradle affair still rankled Zola Fel, but Invictus helped make amends by rescuing the ancient catfish priest Brighteye. It was trapped in the dwindling dregs of a pond, deep in the parched mudflats of the New Bog. Through stinking mud, Invictus dragged the great fish over the riverbed to the safety of a deeper pool, all the while fighting off a swarm of leechlike broo.

In gratitude, Brighteye brought Invictus to Zola Fel, who had withdrawn in alarm to a secret shrine as the waters dried up around him. The river god was still angry with the Sun Domers and Invictus in particular as the leader of the assault on the Cradle. Nevertheless, he was grudgingly thankful that the Light Captain had saved his oldest devotee, and listened to the promises the Yelmalian made to heal the rift between the River and the Sun lands.

Invictus ventured back into the parched countryside, stalking the drought god through scenes of devastation, death and suffering. Daga himself eluded him, until early one morning before the dawn a piercing golden light appeared on the horizon. Taking it as a sign, the Light Captain headed north. Several days later, in the dry bed of the Zola Fel just below the now-mockingly named hamlet of Highwater, he once again faced Daga. He found the drought god standing contemptuously over the wilted form of Kinope, the gentle daughter of Zola Fel. As Daga laughed, the poor water spirit was attempting to drag herself through the dry sand to a last puddle, visibly drying up in front of her.

Stepping between her and the leering specter, Invictus invoked the bond between land and river, calling out for Zola Fel.. The river god’s response was immediate and emphatic, as a tremendous wall of furious water suddenly surged down through the dry gorge towards the combatants...

...For several weeks, a great sheet of water spread far over the flatlands of Pavis County and the breadbasket of Sun County, causing further misery for the people. But when the floodwaters finally receded, they saw that Zola Fel had left them with a gift: the fields were now covered in a thick layer of fertile silt. It was too late in the year for planting, so the hungry times continued, though the farmers all agreed that the next planting season offered incredible promise. 

(When the waters abated, there was much to be done to take advantage of the precious soil deposited by the flood. Vega Goldbreath as Guardian led the efforts to repair the damage in the Lands of the Sun. Using an ancient tattered scroll from the temple archives depicting the fabled Gods Wall in distant Dara Happa, Vega evoked the story of the Ten Sons and Servants. The entire population was mobilized into a Great Corvée, with even Light Sons and priests putting their hands to mattock and spade. Although initially scandalized to see the Light Lady taking on the role of Morkatos the Foreman, clad only in a kilt, in a remarkably short time the people cleared away tremendous quantities of debris, dug out irrigation channels and repaired the riverbanks.)

In Sea Season 1623 Lord Belvani duly completed the river ritual as a proxy for the count, conclusively healing the rift with Zola Fel and guaranteeing that the hungry land at last would enjoy a bountiful harvest.

(the above abridged from 'The Great Winter and Time of Two Counts')

[soltakss]

6 hours ago, MOB said:

15 hours ago, Tindalos said:

In the Sun County book, there was a special heroquest that the counts underwent to gain the river's favour, recreating Yelm's protection of the Oslir River.

And continue to enact every year. The reigning Count is expected to perform it at the beginning of his reign, and then may delegate the role to a proxy (usually a Light Son) in subsequent years.

In our last Gloranthan Campaign, this was massively important to the PCs. They were River Voices, so decided to perform the Yelm-Oslir HeroQuest themselves, with one PC becoming a Year-Husband of Zola Fel. then, when the Count performed the HeroQuest, they opposed him, thus retaining the status of Year-Husband and allowing Sun County to be irrigated. When it happened again the next year, the Count was very angry and the year afterwards, the Red Emperor himself appeared to bind the Zola Fel to his service. It didn't work out quite how anyone expected, with a 7 year grace period before the Zola Fel became his wife.

So, it should be possible to use this HeroQuest in unusual ways.

[scott-martin]

2 hours ago, MOB said:

Lord Belvani

Haha! YES.

You want to make the river happy, this is how it works.