Cult of the Bloody Tusk - Initiation

[soltakss]

On 9/30/2019 at 8:44 PM, Ian Absentia said:

But what happens if the petitioner actually succeeds in subduing the Tusker?

For me, I would say they are accepted as an Initiate of the Bloody Tusk and the Tusker they subdued become their personal bound Tusker. After all, they have just emulated the Founder of the Bloody Tusk Cult in what is effectively an Initiation rite.

On 9/30/2019 at 8:44 PM, Ian Absentia said:

For a non-captive petitioner, the initiation will be technically honored, but an incessant string of personal challenges will continue until the non-Tusk Rider succeeds in subduing the tribe as well as the swine.

I doubt it. Anyone who can wrassle a Tusker to the ground is worthy of respect. They might mention the short Tusks, perhaps, but that's about all.

On 9/30/2019 at 8:44 PM, Ian Absentia said:

For a captive sacrifice, the Tusk Riders never promised acceptance into the tribe, but would keep them on as a slave instead.

Not for me. Slaves are not part of the Bloody Tusk Cult, that is reserved for Tusk Riders. If you belong to the cult then you are a Tusk Rider.

On 9/30/2019 at 8:44 PM, Ian Absentia said:

Riffing off No.2 above, the Tusk Riders never promised that initiation into the cult would provide protection against summary execution.  Maybe they give you a head start before chasing you down.*

I really can't see why they would do this. The new member has performed what is effectively an Initiation Rite and a very minor HeroQuest to become a member of the cult. That is not a little thing, for them that is a big thing. Why would they hunt down a member of their own cult?

 

On 9/30/2019 at 8:44 PM, Ian Absentia said:

As Glorantha's own orcs, I decline to accept the notion that they're looking for converts to the cause.  The results of initiation for outsiders is going to be consistently nasty and unwelcoming.

Why not? What is the point of having that as an Initiation Rite if it doesn't mean anything? That doesn't make sense to me.

[Ian Absentia]

8 hours ago, Joerg said:

Hmm. I mostly pulled this out of memory...

Thank you.  As it turns out, I have most of the sources you mentioned, save King of Sartar and the freeform support material you mentioned.  Most notably, I'm lacking the details of Aram's defeat of Gouger with the aid of the unnamed demon, and Gouger's role as the Earth avenger.  This is very helpful.

Even if just as a pet project, I still see a heroquest to redeem the Aramites as possible.  In case it isn't evident, I'm an opponent of static canon in gaming.  That's for novels.  Give me a starting point with an established background.  1610, 1615, 1621, 1625?  Fine.  But I'll break it after that.  As a GM I will encourage, even goad my players to change the world.  Include a provision for a player character to involuntarily and accidentally become a member of the Tusk Riders, I will see that through it its illogical and deeply heroic conclusion.

!i!

[Qizilbashwoman]

45 minutes ago, Ian Absentia said:

Thank you.  As it turns out, I have most of the sources you mentioned, save King of Sartar and the freeform support material you mentioned.  Most notably, I'm lacking the details of Aram's defeat of Gouger with the aid of the unnamed demon, and Gouger's role as the Earth avenger.  This is very helpful.

I haven't seen any details except I know his settlement at the Dawn was small: this is what my notes say (they are not cited, because they are personal notes). 13th Age Glorantha also has fun ideas about them.

Quote

At the Dawn, Parantikor Bel was a temple village home to a tribe of tusker-riding humans. They were hunter-gatherers led by the Hero Aram Ya Udram who worshiped Orlanth. They were members of the Unity Council. The population was approximately 400.

Aram Ya Udram used a Darkness demon he’d tamed to defeat a tusker god named Gouger that Ernalda had sent against him for ignoring her sacrifices and built an altar from its tusks at Parantikor Bel: the Ivory Plinth.

Much later, during the weird period when the EWF experimented with hybridizing creatures, the Aramites emerged from the shadows as the half-uz Tusk Riders.

The Tusk Riders ride tuskers, gigantic boars as big as buffalo, which are ridden only by tusk riders. These beasts are fierce and ill-tempered, but love their masters beyond all comprehension. They gore and trample. Gouger’s son, Redeye, continues to rampage through Kerofinela, followed by Tusk Rider cultists.

They fight with lance and spear as Heavy Cavalry and are willing to hire as mercenaries to any who meet their price of cash and blood.

The Ivory Plinth

The Cult of the Bloody Tusk (Earth Darkness Beast [Boar]) demands blood-drinking and further abominations.

Blood runs in streams from tortured victims at this ancient Temple of the Bloody Tusk in the Stinking Forest in Kerofinela.

It is a tall, ivory-colored tower some 400 feet tall and 25 yards around at the base, made from a single tusk of a gigantic boar and mounted atop stone buildings.

I am the War-teeth of Gouger, sacred god-child of Earth. Two cities I’ve smashed, leaving rubble for my children. Two peoples I’ve destroyed, flooding the Earth with blood. Mine was the mission to destroy, for the glory of Earth.

I am the trophy of Aram, the victor of the Battle of Larassa. Aram is he who fought me, led me wild over the hills here. Aram is he who tricked me, lured me to the arms of the demon. Aram is he who wrenched me from my jawbones in my dying agony.

I am the axis for the Riders, temple pillars and sacred home. Sacrifices gathered to feed me, ripe grain and fresh fruits. Sacrifices offered to appease me, hot blood and quick deaths. Rich deaths sanctify me and my children are deeply rewarded.

The Tusk Riders exploit the Great Winter as an opportunity to cruelly oppress the humans of Kerofinela. Led by the Half-Troll King, an army of Tusk Riders raided deep into Tarsh in 1622. Fazzur Wideread, forcibly retired by the Red Emperor, organizes the defense of Old Tarsh without any Imperial support and with minimal support from his own king.

Despite this, Fazzur is once again victorious and his son Onjur achieves great fame by killing the Half-Troll King in single combat.

 

Edited October 4, 2019 by Qizilbashwoman

[M Helsdon]

A human becoming an initiate of the Bloody Tusk will have to do, and endure some nasty rites. One would probably involve them killing a tusker and having its lower canine teeth embedded in their own jaw (after their own canines and a few other teeth have been ripped out to make room). 

Such procedures are not without risk...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/5079632.stm

[Bill the barbarian]

5 minutes ago, M Helsdon said:

A human becoming an initiate of the Bloody Tusk will have to do, and endure some nasty rites. One would probably involve them killing a tusker and having its lower canine teeth embedded in their own jaw (after their own canines and a few other teeth have been ripped out to make room). 

 

Agreed, I like to use common sense and a touch of sympathy for the devil and all when it comes to RQ monsters, (love the uz) but they are after all monsters for a reason, mistaken or otherwise.

cheers

[Ian Absentia]

49 minutes ago, M Helsdon said:

A human becoming an initiate of the Bloody Tusk will have to do, and endure some nasty rites. One would probably involve them killing a tusker and having its lower canine teeth embedded in their own jaw...

Hmm.  Having just made friends with a pig, why not kill another Tusk Rider for his teeth?

On a related note, how did Arkat handle the dentition issue when he became a Troll?

!i!

[metcalph]

52 minutes ago, Ian Absentia said:

On a related note, how did Arkat handle the dentition issue when he became a Troll?

He had free dental care when he became a troll.  Without anesthetic.

Quote

These things are done to the person: his ears and nose are
ripped out, and bones from dead trolls are inserted into place. All
four canines are knocked out and troll incisors are driven into
the sockets to act as seeds for new teeth.

Trollpak PDF p74

 

[Joerg]

1 hour ago, Ian Absentia said:

Hmm.  Having just made friends with a pig, why not kill another Tusk Rider for his teeth?

A very graphic description of the "or" in "obey my commands, or...."

The rite of killing a boar in a magical way and to take its tusks for a trophy is at the heart of Aramite culture. These guys and gals aren't pork brothers in an Elfquest wolf rider sense.

There is even a good chance that something similar to Bind Death would be going on in slaying the beast and accepting its spirit-loaded teeth as part of the new tusk rider. The spirit of the slain beast gets added to that of the human initiee to become the new tusk rider.

 

1 hour ago, Ian Absentia said:

On a related note, how did Arkat handle the dentition issue when he became a Troll?

The Ritual of Rebirth has donations (presumably from dead relatives of the sponsors). Arkat very likely emerged with dentition originating in Garazaf Hyloring's clan.

[Ian Absentia]

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

The rite of killing a boar in a magical way and to take its tusks for a trophy is at the heart of Aramite culture.

Sure, the very structure of the Ivory Plinth and all, but I'm not seeing any reference to the average Aramite ritually killing a boar for it's tusks.  Mythologically it makes sense, yes, but where is it writ?

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

These guys and gals aren't pork brothers in an Elfquest wolf rider sense.

I dunno.  Maybe the affection isn't exactly tender or requited, but...

"These beasts are fierce and ill-tempered, but love their masters beyond all comprehension."
- Gloranthan Bestiary, Tuskers

"They are devoted to their riders; a tusk boar will not attack its own Aramite rider, and will even defend him by attacking other Aramites."
- Anaxial's Roster, Tusk Boar (Tusker)

I'm almost sure that I read somewhere that the Aramites share an affection for their steeds as well, but I may just be remembering the Tusker's affection in reverse.  I know they're raised with the pigs until they reach majority and join a warband.

!i!

Edited October 4, 2019 by Ian Absentia

[Joerg]

1 minute ago, Ian Absentia said:

Sure, the very structure of the Ivory Plinth and all, but I'm not seeing any reference to the average Aramite ritually killing a boar for it's tusks.  Mythologically it makes sense, yes, but where is it writ?

The average Aramite may have done so as part of his initiation into adulthood, re-living the core myth of his culture.

As to where it is writ, something that makes sense mythologically usually is true in Glorantha, and may just be waiting to be put into writing.

1 minute ago, Ian Absentia said:

I dunno.  Maybe the affection isn't exactly tender or requited, but...

"These beasts are fierce and ill-tempered, but love their masters beyond all comprehension"
- Gloranthan Bestiary, Tuskers

"They are devoted to their riders; a tusk boar will not attack its own Aramite rider, and will even defend him by attacking other Aramites."
- Anaxial's Roster, Tusk Boar (Tusker)

I'm almost sure that I read somewhere that the Aramites share an affection for their steeds as well, but I may just be remembering the Tusker's affection in reverse.  I know they're raised with the pigs until they reach majority and join a warband.

A person born as an Aramite will already have the kinship to the Tusker boars from their parentage, and in all likelihood don't require the transplantation of tusks.

The tusk implantation is part of the initiation rite for individuals not born as tusk riders, and giving them the magical essence of the tuskers.

It appears to be pretty consensus that the Aramite culture started out as human boar riders, and that some surgical magical alteration turned them into something sufficiently non-human to have been spared by the Dragonkill.

I challenge that they don't appear to have become very uz-like in the sense of descent from Kyger Litor. But then the Kitori - a sibling culture of humans turned into something tolerably non-human in the discernment of the Inhuman Occupation - are troll-like in shape, but only a fraction of them (if any) are trolls by descent.

 

[Qizilbashwoman]

47 minutes ago, Joerg said:

I challenge that they don't appear to have become very uz-like in the sense of descent from Kyger Litor. But then the Kitori - a sibling culture of humans turned into something tolerably non-human in the discernment of the Inhuman Occupation - are troll-like in shape, but only a fraction of them (if any) are trolls by descent.

Both Kitori and Tuskers are changed by exposure to Darkness spirits. I believe the physical change in Tuskers came after they had already turned into Bloody Tusk - we know Delecti did it, so the timeline tells us this happened after the Captain Sunshine Wars because Aram was a Theyalan representative on the Council. I agree it was almost certainly jamming humans and tuskers together, although how remains unclear to me. A heroquest for new converts seems likely, but would they kill a tusker? I think it would be a success in the heroquest, and the tusker they borrowed spirit from would be their first bound mount, which honestly seems to be a really clear thing. The process would be dangerous and failure would be... bad. As in they'd be sacrificed, most likely.

Despite being called "half-trolls", I don't know of any writings that show any actual trolls or trollkin inbreeding, and Tuskers are crusading religious fanatics, not rapists. We've not a single narrative of them breeding outside the tribe. Maybe they can breed with enlo, the most human of trolls IMHO (they bear a single child after almost a year in the womb, and extremely rarely twins), but this is speculation/YGWV.

The Kitori were affected by specifically uz-affiliated Darkness spirits and by the Only Old One, a demigod, directly. Their form, whatever it is - temporary spirit nimbus, ability to shift between human and uz, small fangs, whatever - is not Delecti mad science but Uz: The Uzening. Maybe they underwent a variety of Uz rebirth like Arkat did, but to become a new thing.

Whatever happened, it's clear they both were Darknessified hooman, but in verrrry different ways.

Edited October 5, 2019 by Qizilbashwoman

[soltakss]

17 hours ago, Joerg said:

A person born as an Aramite will already have the kinship to the Tusker boars from their parentage, and in all likelihood don't require the transplantation of tusks.

The tusk implantation is part of the initiation rite for individuals not born as tusk riders, and giving them the magical essence of the tuskers.

It appears to be pretty consensus that the Aramite culture started out as human boar riders, and that some surgical magical alteration turned them into something sufficiently non-human to have been spared by the Dragonkill.

I can't see them using the tusks of the Tusker they have defeated. Instead, the defeated Tusker could become the new mount and the temple could use stored tusks as replacement teeth, knocking the human ones out and putting the new ones in.

[Joerg]

1 hour ago, soltakss said:

I can't see them using the tusks of the Tusker they have defeated. Instead, the defeated Tusker could become the new mount and the temple could use stored tusks as replacement teeth, knocking the human ones out and putting the new ones in.

Are those tusks imbued with the spirit of their former owners (as per Bloody Cut)?

[Brootse]

Would the Tusk Riders be trolls enough that iron does extra damage to them?

[Kloster]

2 minutes ago, Brootse said:

Would the Tusk Riders be trolls enough that iron does extra damage to them?

They are not described as such.

[jajagappa]

On 10/9/2019 at 1:27 PM, Brootse said:

Would the Tusk Riders be trolls enough that iron does extra damage to them?

Nope! 

[Qizilbashwoman]

1 hour ago, jajagappa said:

Nope! 

yeah it's not clear they are trolls at all