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[g33k]

4 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

... I wanna play a duck!

A rich one!

uhhhh....   You want to play a duck served with hollandaise sauce???

Dude, that's just wrong.

[Bill the barbarian]

sigh

[Old Man Henerson]

So does all this mean that we will be able to produce our own sub systems for Chaosium and make money from it?

[Richard S.]

Just now, Old Man Henerson said:

So does all this mean that we will be able to produce our own sub systems for Chaosium and make money from it?

I'd assume so, assuming that it works similarly to other OGLs.

[Old Man Henerson]

1 minute ago, Richard S. said:

I'd assume so, assuming that it works similarly to other OGLs.

Sweet, time to work on my Night Land setting.

I wonder if I would have to make my own pictures.🤔

[g33k]

Just now, Old Man Henerson said:

So does all this mean that we will be able to produce our own sub systems for Chaosium and make money from it?

Presumably; but I guess we'll have to see the specific terms of the license when Chaosium releases it.

[Richard S.]

1 minute ago, Old Man Henerson said:

Sweet, time to work on my Night Land setting.

I wonder if I would have to make my own pictures.🤔

That's a book, right? I think you'd have to get permission from the author if you wanted to make money off of a BRP hack for playing in it.

[Old Man Henerson]

Just now, Richard S. said:

That's a book, right? I think you'd have to get permission from the author if you wanted to make money off of a BRP hack for playing in it.

Yeah it is a book, but it is in the public domain so it is free to use right?

[g33k]

4 minutes ago, Old Man Henerson said:

...

I wonder if I would have to make my own pictures.🤔

There's cheap "stock" and even public-domain art available, but the search for just-the-right-image could be l-o-n-g (and may even prove fruitless in the end).

How much is your own time worth to you?

If you actually plan to bring it to market, you may want to hire (at least some) freelance artists... and maybe a layout person too.

 

[Richard S.]

3 minutes ago, Old Man Henerson said:

Yeah it is a book, but it is in the public domain so it is free to use right?

Ah, yeah, if that's the case then it should be. I'm no expert though.

[Richard S.]

3 minutes ago, Old Man Henerson said:

Yeah it is a book, but it is in the public domain so it is free to use right?

Ah, yeah, if that's the case then it should be. I'm no expert though.

[Bill the barbarian]

10 minutes ago, Old Man Henerson said:

I wonder if I would have to make my own pictures.🤔

@ochoa is advertising his work around here that he has mad skills (okay, those are my words but I like what I have seen). I have chatted with him and found him very approachable, yet to work with him but maybe one day...

[Ian Absentia]

16 minutes ago, Old Man Henerson said:

So does all this mean that we will be able to produce our own sub systems for Chaosium and make money from it?

Emphasis mine.  That's an ambitious leap from A to Z.

!i!

[Old Man Henerson]

7 minutes ago, g33k said:

There's cheap "stock" and even public-domain art available, but the search for just-the-right-image could be l-o-n-g (and may even prove fruitless in the end).

How much is your own time worth to you?

If you actually plan to bring it to market, you may want to hire (at least some) freelance artists... and maybe a layout person too.

1 minute ago, Bill the barbarian said:

@ochoa is advertising his work around here that he has mad skills (okay, those are my words but I like what I have seen). I have chatted with him and found him very approachable, yet to work with him but maybe one day...

 

Yeah. I would have to look into all that. I will definately keep this in mind for the future. Thanks a lot.

[Old Man Henerson]

13 minutes ago, Richard S. said:

Ah, yeah, if that's the case then it should be. I'm no expert though.

I assumed that it was how Chaosium and everyone else got their hands on the Cthulhu franchise. I will have to look into it though.

6 minutes ago, Ian Absentia said:

Emphasis mine.  That's an ambitious leap from A to Z.

!i!

Yeah, we will have to see what offer in the program.

Edited December 3, 2019 by Old Man Henerson
Spelling

[Bill the barbarian]

14 minutes ago, g33k said:

If you actually plan to bring it to market, you may want to hire (at least some) freelance artists... and maybe a layout person too.

 

Hmm, time to audition new layout programs (am I old fashioned for hating Adobe ’s subscription model?).

[g33k]

53 minutes ago, Ian Absentia said:

Emphasis mine.  That's an ambitious leap from A to Z.

True enough!

That said, there's a fair number of passion-projects and labors-of-love in the gaming-world.  I doubt that (for example) @M Helsdon's "Armies and Enemies of Dragon Pass" was guaranteed ANY available market when he began the project...   Sometimes -- for amateurs, for new initiatives, etc -- the creator's cost of creating isn't really part of the equation when they consider the question of "making money."

This obviously isn't a sustainable business model, or a way for a creative type to keep food on the table & a roof overhead.

But the number of really good passion-projects in the gaming world is, frankly, both astounding and dismaying*.

 

 

 

* The dismay comes when you realize how much being a creator becomes a "rich person hobby." **   If a bunch of (economically secure) people create works of extremely-high quality, and count their cost of creation at or near zero (because they self-subsidized it via their "real job")...  how can someone else, not economically secure, ever hope to make a living at it?  That is, why would a customer buy an expensive product from someone making a living wage, vs a cheap (but equally good) product from someone whose living is assured with zero gaming-income?  Cents-per-word payments are notoriously poor in gaming (with some notable exceptions), and some publishers have failed to pay, resisted paying, tried to renegotiate downward after the fact, been abominably late, etc etc etc.  Some publishers are known to offer first-timers even worse rates.  "Take it or leave it" for inadequate pay OFTEN gets "taken" by those same folk who are subsidizing their creative writing with that "real job," and don't really care if they get "paid" a pittance ... or less.

 

 

** I still wonder if the cash-infusions that the Moon Design folk (Rick/Jeff/Neil/Michael) brought to Chaosium have ever actually been repaid to them.  Despite their undoubted skills and talents that saw the nuChaosium resurrection... there was some cold hard cash that ALSO contributed to the success of the turnaround!  None of my business, of course!  If any or all of them just regard it as gone in a good cause, or if they're on some "repayment" plan, or if they've long-since been repaid (by the evergreen fountains of Cthulhu and Glorantha) and are now planning their wealthy Scrooge McDuck retirements on tropical beaches with gold-plated lawnchairs... None of it makes any difference in my life.

 

Edited December 3, 2019 by g33k

[foolcat]

18 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Hmm, time to audition new layout programs (am I old fashioned for hating Adobe ’s subscription model?).

Nope, not at all. Still looking for my sweet spot as well, preferably macOS based—as long as “rudimentary, but quick and costing next to nothing because it’s already there” suffices, there’s always page layout mode of Pages. But pretty, it is not.

 

[Ian Absentia]

10 minutes ago, g33k said:

True enough!

That said, there's a fair number of passion-projects and labors-of-love in the gaming-world. 

I actually wasn't trying to be a doubting Thomas, but as you point out, there are many other very fulfilling letters that occur earlier in the alphabet.  "Profit" and roleplaying games are infrequent and often uncomfortable bedfellows.

!i!

[Bill the barbarian]

5 minutes ago, foolcat said:

Nope, not at all. Still looking for my sweet spot as well, preferably macOS based—as long as “rudimentary, but quick and costing next to nothing because it’s already there” suffices, there’s always page layout mode of Pages. But pretty, it is not.

 

I think it might rank a little better than Ready, Set, Go from the eighties but it does work, My rogues gallery sits at 500 pages in Pages... If we keep this up... we might have. to. start. a ...hobbist forum for the DIY hobbyist...  Check the tavern soon I will get on this...

Edited December 3, 2019 by Bill the barbarian

[SDLeary]

1 hour ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Hmm, time to audition new layout programs (am I old fashioned for hating Adobe ’s subscription model?).

Affinity Publisher. New, and still has some issues, but its serviceable and inexpensive; and they are actively working to fix the issues, and add more features.

In addition, it  has sister apps for photos and vector drawing.

SDLeary

Edited December 3, 2019 by SDLeary

[lawrence.whitaker]

1 hour ago, SDLeary said:

Affinity Publisher. New, and still has some issues, but its serviceable and inexpensive; and they are actively working to fix the issues, and add more features.

In addition, it  has sister apps for photos and vector drawing.

SDLeary

TDM is migratingits output to Affinity. We've produced about four titles with it, and the intergration with its vector and photo apps is superb and seamless.

It's giving InDesign a serious run for its money, and the price is terrific.

[Bill the barbarian]

48 minutes ago, lawrence.whitaker said:

TDM is migratingits output to Affinity. We've produced about four titles with it, and the intergration with its vector and photo apps is superb and seamless.

It's giving InDesign a serious run for its money, and the price is terrific.

Got a ton of geek questions for you but I think we might be accused of thread squatting, If you were to take this comment over to

DIY your way to OLG or even BRP bliss

I will ambush you there (way to go Bill, scare him off so there is no way he’ll go and help out, sigh)

cheers

Edited December 4, 2019 by Bill the barbarian

[Rick Meints]

5 hours ago, g33k said:

But the number of really good passion-projects in the gaming world is, frankly, both astounding and dismaying*.

* The dismay comes when you realize how much being a creator becomes a "rich person hobby." **   If a bunch of (economically secure) people create works of extremely-high quality, and count their cost of creation at or near zero (because they self-subsidized it via their "real job")...  how can someone else, not economically secure, ever hope to make a living at it?  That is, why would a customer buy an expensive product from someone making a living wage, vs a cheap (but equally good) product from someone whose living is assured with zero gaming-income?  Cents-per-word payments are notoriously poor in gaming (with some notable exceptions), and some publishers have failed to pay, resisted paying, tried to renegotiate downward after the fact, been abominably late, etc etc etc.  Some publishers are known to offer first-timers even worse rates.  "Take it or leave it" for inadequate pay OFTEN gets "taken" by those same folk who are subsidizing their creative writing with that "real job," and don't really care if they get "paid" a pittance ... or less.

** I still wonder if the cash-infusions that the Moon Design folk (Rick/Jeff/Neil/Michael) brought to Chaosium have ever actually been repaid to them.  Despite their undoubted skills and talents that saw the nuChaosium resurrection... there was some cold hard cash that ALSO contributed to the success of the turnaround!  None of my business, of course!  If any or all of them just regard it as gone in a good cause, or if they're on some "repayment" plan, or if they've long-since been repaid (by the evergreen fountains of Cthulhu and Glorantha) and are now planning their wealthy Scrooge McDuck retirements on tropical beaches with gold-plated lawnchairs... None of it makes any difference in my life.

Since you mention Uncle Scrooge I shall say a few things, since he is one of my all time favorite comic book characters.

*I don't necessarily see the RPG business as being or becoming a rich person's hobby. Yes, absolutely, there are a number of people who have a day job that pays the bills and they create material regardless of the bottom line. That said, between PDF and POD publishing, and Crowdfunding, I feel there is more opportunity now to make money via starting as a small independent publisher and then growing from there. In the end, great product is great product. If you want any chance at making a living, or a part of your income, from RPGs you have to create and publish things. We at Chaosium have tried to make that easier for newcomers via the Miskatonic Repository and the Jonstown Compendium platforms we get up on DTRPG. I wouldn't at all be surprised if we set up another such platform for BRP as well in the not too distant future.

** I'm on the fence about the label of "nuChaosium". I don't mind having the current management team specifically called out or compared to the previous team. That said, I've also seen it used in the pejorative a bit too often to immediately see it as a positive term. I know g33k is using it in a positive way, as do a number of others. I prefer people simply call us The Chaosium. I grew up with the company, am hopelessly biased and in love with all that it is, and want this to be my career for the rest of my working life, and I have no plans for any sort of early retirement. The dollars are taking care of themselves. We have professionals with decades of business experience, budgets, finance, and similar skills minding the store. We focus on getting new product out on a regular basis. Product that gamers will love. We watch the money. Nuff said on that.

[g33k]

5 hours ago, lawrence.whitaker said:

TDM is migratingits output to Affinity ... 

Well... geez!   Given how often I see Mythras praised for layout & clarity (except for the smaller fonts vs aging eyes), TDM's choice is a pretty glowing endorsement.

All except for "migratingits" which seems to be some sort of migration-disease.

I hope you can get a shot for that, Loz...