Who is using simpler combat rules?

[smiorgan]

2 hours ago, g33k said:

No, it's not missing.

It's just not where we'd expect (on the Attack) -- it's listed as a Defender result, "... with no armor protection."

Ok. I'm officially blind!

[smiorgan]

2 hours ago, g33k said:

Also page 203 box-text "Summary of Special Damage Results," and p. 206, "Critical Hit" -- the core location in the rules defining what a crit is!

Yes, it's everywhere.

[Grievous]

You know, I'm thinking of just tossing the combat system entirely and bolting on Pendragon's combat. Not a fan really and I'm not sure I want to go the extensive tweaking route. Utilizing parts of Mythras might work, but but. Pendragon is fine, though. There's a few issues to resolve because Pendragon uses d20s. That said, I might toss the d100 and go even more Pendragony... but that's beyond the scope of just combat.

[Kloster]

1 hour ago, Grievous said:

You know, I'm thinking of just tossing the combat system entirely and bolting on Pendragon's combat. Not a fan really and I'm not sure I want to go the extensive tweaking route. Utilizing parts of Mythras might work, but but. Pendragon is fine, though. There's a few issues to resolve because Pendragon uses d20s. That said, I might toss the d100 and go even more Pendragony... but that's beyond the scope of just combat.

Gargl. Blasphemy.

[David Scott]

2 hours ago, Grievous said:

and go even more Pendragony

Pendragon Pass was a great version of the game:

https://www.pensee.com/dunham/pdp.html

[soltakss]

16 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

I'm starting to lean towards "one action per round, spellcasting or attack, SR only for initiative".

One action per round? so, no double attacks then? that's a shame, as I remember reading the account of preparation for battle against chaos, in RQ2's Cults of Terror, where the Orlanthi put aside their spears and shields, taking up two Bastard Swords each, as they expected to be Berserk for the battle. Soltak Stormspear used to do that very often.

[Akhôrahil]

13 minutes ago, soltakss said:

One action per round? so, no double attacks then? that's a shame, as I remember reading the account of preparation for battle against chaos, in RQ2's Cults of Terror, where the Orlanthi put aside their spears and shields, taking up two Bastard Swords each, as they expected to be Berserk for the battle. Soltak Stormspear used to do that very often.

A double attack, or two attacks with two weapons, would count as one action.

Not that splitting attacks is all that useful anyway these days when we have skill reductions and multiple parries - it's rare that it's a good idea.

Edited April 12, 2020 by Akhôrahil

[smiorgan]

I am running the RQG pregens through Scorpion Hall solo to refresh my RQ combat rules.

Harmast was eaten by the chaos slug, while, surprisingly Vasana did not go past the the scorpionmen hunters in the forest.

Yanioth was able to destroy the hunter scorpionman with a mix of surprise, Earth inspiration for battleax and repeated befuddle. The poor scorp was not able to attack once.

Lessons learned.

1.RQG characters, despite their beefed-up percentages and magic are still challenged by the brutal and sometimes "unfair" solo.

2. I am relatively comfortable with the combat rules as written. Very few doubts. 

[smiorgan]

3 hours ago, Grievous said:

You know, I'm thinking of just tossing the combat system entirely and bolting on Pendragon's combat. Not a fan really and I'm not sure I want to go the extensive tweaking route. Utilizing parts of Mythras might work, but but. Pendragon is fine, though. There's a few issues to resolve because Pendragon uses d20s. That said, I might toss the d100 and go even more Pendragony... but that's beyond the scope of just combat.

Have a look at CoC7 combat. It is kind of a mix of BRP and Pendragon.

[soltakss]

14 minutes ago, Akhôrahil said:

Not that splitting attacks is all that useful anyway these days when we have skill reductions and multiple parries - it's rare that it's a good idea.

I wonder how Shergar Sunhoof, centaur extraordinaire, would work in RQG. As a centaur he gets an extra kick attack, with SIZ 40 DEX 25 he has SR1 and used a Pike (SR0) in combat, so attacked at SR1, he had Jakes Amulet (dibbledibbledibbbledum) which gave him an extra leg and free attack and he had a Spider Mask that allowed him to cast Transform Head once per day and attack at DEXx5% with a Free spider Bite, with poison. So, he had a Pike attack, two kicks and a bite, all independent and with their own SRs, so when he split them he could, in theory, attack about 8 people per round. When he used a Heroic Ability, he added 1D4 to his Characteristics for 10 rounds, so he got a 4D6 Damage Bonus, I think.

The rest of the party would attack very powerful foes and Shergar would go through the rest like a demented whirlwind.

Edited April 12, 2020 by soltakss

[Akhôrahil]

1 hour ago, soltakss said:

extra kick attack

Extra attacks are odd birds within the current combat design - the idea seems to be that you’re multitasking so that these attacks become ”free” (like when you dual-wield), but it’s not obvious which attacks become free and when. For instance, there’s no particular reason why a human’s kick wouldn’t be an extra attack but a centaur’s is, nor is it clear why this attack multitasking works. Or why it takes a pretty large number of strike ranks to do one attack, but when you split, the next attack comes almost instantaneously.

RQG combat is a strange and frequently incoherent patchwork of effects and rules. It would be an interesting exercise to rebuild it from first principles.

[soltakss]

2 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

For instance, there’s no particular reason why a human’s kick wouldn’t be an extra attack but a centaur’s is, nor is it clear why this attack multitasking works.

A centaur has an extra attack, as does a broo, these are free attacks. It is unclear which creatures have free attacks, a tiger used to have Claw/Claw/Bite but a Dragon only attacks with one physical attack per round.

Normally, a human's kick attack is not an extra one, but Jake's Amulet gives you an extra leg with a free attack.

Shergar was odd, as he had an extra extra attack, because one just isn't enough, and the Spider Bite because 2 extra attacks aren't enough.

Soltak Stormspear had a pair of Glass slippers that doubled DEX and gave an extra free kick attack that could impale. All the GMs and Players in our campaign wouldn't let Soltak sell them to Shergar for several reasons:

1. We frowned upon exchanging items if both PCs had the same Player
2. A Centaur in glass slippers was silly (Even though one GM grudgingly allowed Jake's Amulet to work, slippers were seen as a step too far)
3. Combat with a Pike attack, three independent kick attacks and a spider bite was deemed excessive

 

[Akhôrahil]

11 minutes ago, soltakss said:

A centaur has an extra attack, as does a broo, these are free attacks. It is unclear which creatures have free attacks, a tiger used to have Claw/Claw/Bite but a Dragon only attacks with one physical attack per round.

Say what you will about D&D 3-4, but they had a solid action economy and really thought about these kinds of things.

[Lordabdul]

15 hours ago, smiorgan said:

Have a look at CoC7 combat. It is kind of a mix of BRP and Pendragon.

Yep that's a strong basis for people who want very simple rules. But going only 80% of that route with what @Akhôrahil might do should also work well (just one move and one action each turn, no hit location, only simple critical hit rules, no special hit rules).

I'm fine with the RQG crunch level, but then again my players are the kind of people who ask me "so when are we using GURPS again?". I would however tweak the >100% skill rules and do a few adjustment for fighting big monsters.

11 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Say what you will about D&D 3-4, but they had a solid action economy and really thought about these kinds of things.

I think many people would reaaaaaaaaalllyyyyy benefit from taking a look at 13th Age: Glorantha as a great mid-point between HeroQuest and RuneQuest in terms of crunch, and as a great alternative designed by (and for) solid game mechanic nerds. I'd love to see more people using 13AG, actually.

Edited April 13, 2020 by lordabdul