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Orlanthatemyhamster

God(s) of Dreams?

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I have been wondering for a long time why there is no god for dreams in general, or for each pantheon. Was this ever touched on in any communications with Greg or at any Convention or meet?

I would have thought that it might be an area that the Moon (present or otherwise) would associated with.

It always felt like a big hole. But maybe that's just MGV'ing.

We know that there are creatures associated with bad dreams, are there ones associated with good?

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The East Isles has Thella, the Goddess of Dreams. They also have Avanapdur, an anti-god (a divine being seen as a dangerous, basically) who managed to create an empire that turned out be an illusion, a sort of dreamlike influence of the middle world. 

Dreams is a pretty major theme in the East Isles, with different philosophers taking different views on whether they are beneficial or distractions for mystics, for example. 

 

Not so much in Genertela though, to my knowledge, though dreams in and of themselves are pretty important for several deities.

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Yeah, heaps of interesting stuff about dreams for the East Isles, not much about them for anyone else. There is a whole myth cycle about it, and whether dreams are illusions and lies, or can communicate mythic truth, including a whole separate form of dream magic. 

In Peloria, Gorgorma has the power of nightmares. While I've not heard it mentioned, that might speculatively make Dendara a good candidate for goddess associated with more pleasant dreams? 

Waha's spirit of retribution, Borabo Nightmare, often attacks during sleep. Thed is supposed to communicate with her worshippers during nightmares. I suspect dreams might be 'adjacent' to the spirit plane. 

 

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Thanks for the replies so far (keep em coming! :D ).

Can either of you point me to the Eastern Isles stuff on dreams, please? Is it in the Guide? Mine is stored away and I never got to read it all, and it's not likely to come out for a while.
 

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One kind of has to point to the "Dream Dragon" phenomenon, and the "Dragonewts Dream" event.

It's possible (not afaik "canonical" ... but don't let that stop you!) that any "god of dreams" in the vicinity of Dragon Pass may be unable to reach the Middle World because of some Draconic Wierdness...  Or just getting eaten...

 

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1 hour ago, Orlanthatemyhamster said:

Thanks for the replies so far (keep em coming! :D ).

Can either of you point me to the Eastern Isles stuff on dreams, please? Is it in the Guide? Mine is stored away and I never got to read it all, and it's not likely to come out for a while.
 

It's in Revealed Mythologies. It's not super expansive, but there's a decent bit there.

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Dreams and the spirit world do interact on occasions, and one ability of shamans can be to send dreams. Otherworld entities like deities or greater spirits definitely can send dreams. Sometimes prophetic ones.

Illusion magic comes in two varieties - one that alters reality temporarily, and another one that only alters your perceptions. Both can induce dream-like experiences while awake. In a dream-environment, illusion magic is extremely powerful, as the less solid dream reality responds way more readily than the munndane reality.

There is no Gloranthan dream realm like in Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time, but the layered mythic realities of the hero planes are a form of dream-like state too. Gloranthan dreams will touch on Godtine, and myths will intrude into people's dreams. Including the nightmare reality of the Greater Darkness.

Can you dream your way into a heroquest? Currently, no such method is known.

Can your heroquesting impact other people's dreams? Definitely yes.

Can you meditate your way into dream-like states? IMO yes.

Can you physically cross over into the dream world, or can you develop a constant dream realm presence similar to a fetch? Would that be different from having a fetch?

 

What Gloranthan myths are there about sleeping?

The Aldryami that do sleep spend their sleep resting in s peaceful Underworld, among the spirits of the departed.

Humans and uz don't appear to have that access, at least not guaranteed.

 

There used to be the model of "short worlds", otherworldly realms created only from the energies of the middle world, and those were said to include dream realms. The concept hasn't been pursued a lot recently.

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7 hours ago, Joerg said:

Illusion magic comes in two varieties - one that alters reality temporarily, and another one that only alters your perceptions. Both can induce dream-like experiences while awake. In a dream-environment, illusion magic is extremely powerful, as the less solid dream reality responds way more readily than the munndane reality.

 

I was about to mention the Lunar magics (I forget what they're called, specifically), and how they wax and wane and seem to be sort of illusory in a way?

Edited by Sir_Godspeed

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The now non-canon ILH2 "Under the red moon" supplement for HQ1 had a lunar goddess of dreams named "Merasedenya". It featured feats, spells and sprits (in ILH2 lunar magic was described as a kind of fusion between the spirit, theistic and sorcery types of magic), all related to dreams.

ILH2 had many weird lunar gods (including one for the stay-at-home good husband) and also rules for lunar illumination (called "sevening").

 

Edited by Manimati

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On 5/6/2020 at 6:02 PM, Orlanthatemyhamster said:

Why/when did it become non-cannon? 

All I can tell is this quote from the HeroQuest and Glorantha Vault page on the Chaosium website: "Be warned! These books are not be considered to be canonical Gloranthan references and may differ from the views presented in the Guide to Glorantha.  "

One the other hand YGWV ! Canon is only important if you are planning to write an official supplement for Chaosium.

Edited by Manimati
typo in cannon vs canon

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2 hours ago, Orlanthatemyhamster said:

Why/when did it become non-cannon? 

Because many of the Lunar Cults weren't very good and of the others, the shortform writeup was subpar. 

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