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Tigerwomble

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First of all, apologies if this is an old subject.

CoC had a new edition, on average, every 3-4 years up until 6th edition. Then 10 years until 7e.

I'm about to spend on a suite of 7th edition books, which has been out for 6 years.

I understand that Chaosium has been under new management for a few years now

and that their edition updates will be different from those of 1e to 6e.

But we are now at roughly half way between the two. That is an average of 3-4 years and 10 years.

Whilst reassurances are for the birds and you are unlikely to announce a new edition too soon

and so affect the sales of the present edition. But are we not getting to a point where people will

begin to get nervous about buying. I certainly am. It feels like an uncertain time to commit to what is an

 expensive endeavour.

Are there any indications of the periods between edition releases?

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We are not currently working on a new edition, but of course in the future (talking years) a new edition is likely to come out. All I can say on the matter, is that a new edition would not be major rewrite of 7th edition, and would be more like a 7.5 edition with a few streamlining tweaks where necessary, but would be continue to be fully compatible with 7e and older editions. 

In other words, if you purchase the current edition you will be fine. The biggest change in the game's history was the release of 7e, and even that was compatible with all older material.

So, hope I have put your concerns to rest.

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I can use all of my back catalogue with Coc 7E no worries - for the opponent/NPC stat blocks, just multiply the core charactersitics by 5%, and that's pretty much it.

Nothing has been superceeded to an extent that it is obsolete, which is really cool.😎

Edited by Mankcam
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" Sure it's fun, but it is also well known that a D20 roll and an AC is no match against a hefty swing of a D100% and a D20 Hit Location Table!"

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Call of Cthulhu is different from many other role-playing games. As Mankcam points out, the conversion differences between even 1st Edition stuff and 7th edition take minutes. CoC has always been one of the easiest games to convert and that doesn't seem likely to change. 

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That's really good to hear. I've recently gotten back into playing after a lengthy break (last edition I played was 5.5). My experience with 7th edition thus far has been extremely positive - though I'd be lying if I said I hadn't been eyeballing some of the older material, wondering how difficult the conversion might be.

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30 minutes ago, Defile959 said:

That's really good to hear. I've recently gotten back into playing after a lengthy break (last edition I played was 5.5). My experience with 7th edition thus far has been extremely positive - though I'd be lying if I said I hadn't been eyeballing some of the older material, wondering how difficult the conversion might be.

I started in a "new editions invalidate old editions" mindset, having come from DND. I started thinking I would only invest in 7th edition. I quickly realized (because I remained open-minded) that there was this unbelievable back catalog of materials to draw from and started collecting it all. Remember that, as an investigative game, the power of scenarios is in their clues and characters, not the stats. Heck, many monster's stat blocks can be replaced with "You have no chance unless you prepare in these X ways" and it honestly wouldn't change preparation or execution for the Keeper. Call of Cthulhu teaches us to get more from role-playing games than "There is a monster there. We assume you fight it." If you like that, that's great. I like it on occasion. But it barely scratches the surface of sophistication of the kinds of stories you can tell.

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43 minutes ago, 4Acrossisemu said:

I'm actually interested to see if The Dreaming Stone makes it on the makeover list. We know Dreamlands is in full swing, and Ross is back writing Old West Stuff...  I guess we can dream. 

I like The Dreaming Stone, but on release there were some who didn't like it for various reasons. Is there a consensus to see it redeveloped and republished?

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56 minutes ago, Pseudodog said:

Personally, I don't think we need new edition, instead we need more big campaigns like Masks (old and new). Please bring new editions of Mountains, Innsmouth and Tatters )))

The problem with big campaigns is getting them played. I suspect that they just sit on the shelves of most buyers, or get started with good intentions but peter out and ultimately get abandoned. I’d like to see something that I don’t think we’ve seen before: a scenario book where the individual scenarios work as stand-alone or can be strung together into a campaign with a provided framework. Not just a bunch of scenarios that the Keeper has to tenuously link into a campaign, but explicitly having an over-arching theme and progression. Also, created in such a way that it would be possible to drop a scenario or two without breaking the campaign. This would, of course need considerable planning and co-operation on the part of the writers, but hopefully they would see it as a new challenge worth rising to.

You can, of course, argue that creating the campaign plot is the Keeper’s job, but not everyone has the time or ability to do that well. My own tactic is to have a list of scenarios I fancy running and when one is finished pick another off the list as suits. This occasionally leads to, “Damn, if only I’d introduced that NPC back then they would have a far better hook and motivation for getting involved in this scenario.”  Now, if that NPC hook was given explicitly as an option in a preceding scenario it’d add to the campaign experience. That’s one example of how it could help the busy/creatively challenged Keeper. Another is players becoming aware of a recurring, shady NPC who seems to be operating behind the scenes.

I admit this hasn’t been well thought through, I’m kinda dropping it here as the idea pops into my head,  but I think it might better suit the way many of us run our campaigns. Anyway, that’s the moon-on-a-stick I’d like :)

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Here is a question for @Mike M if he cares to answer it. We have a recent, updated version of the Masks of Nyarlathotep campaign and a new 7th edition version of Horror on the Orient Express in the works, but how many of the other classic Call of Cthulhu campaigns are being considered for a 7th edition release?

Both Shadows of Yog-Sothoth and Beyond the Mountains of Madness have been mentioned, but is there any consideration of a new release for Fungi from Yuggoth and/or Spawn of Azathoth? I believe there are six major campaigns in total from CoC's previous editions, all of which were initially released during the 1980s or 1990s.

Call of Cthulhu Supplement Campaigns Release Schedule

Shadows of Yog-Sothoth (1982)
Fungi from Yuggoth (1984)
Masks of Nyarlathotep (1984)
Spawn of Azathoth (1986)
Horror on the Orient Express (1991)
Beyond the Mountains of Madness (1999)

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All of Chaosium's Call of Cthulhu back catalogue remains under consideration for redevelopment. But, I'm not just about doing greatest hits and nothing else. Thus, we put out Masks, OE as redevelopments, but also new campaigns like Two-Headed Serpent, A Cold Fire Within, Shadows Over Stillwater.  Were possible, I try to combine the old and new, see the new Mansions of Madness.

Older campaigns, such as Shadows of Y-S and Beyond the Mountains, are certainly on the to do list, as are brand new campaigns for Gaslight and so on. In fact, we have Lynne's campaign - The Children of Fear - in final editorial at the moment.

There's some great older books we will revisit and there's plenty of new material to come as well. 

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I appreciate that course. If Call of Cthulhu is to survive, it must reinvent and grow. That means attracting new players while simultaneously offering something fresh to veterans. Anyone who wants Call of Cthulhu to freeze in time is fighting a losing gaming battle. I've been following the community for several years now as a relative newcomer compared to those in the old guard. I'm a veteran of gaming in general.  And man, are there some epically bitter people in the old guard of this game. The typical very loud small number. They work to either prevent new people from playing the game or, more passive-aggressively, telling players that they aren't playing it "the right way." Heck, I've seen it in a post from today. The point is that whenever game designers follow the desires of the loud and bitter, it usually spells doom for the game. I've seen it many times. Gamers simply don't see their lack of PR support as a player as a liability. But it totally is. So, the editors get it, and aren't bowing to this group, and I salute them for that. Heck, there aren't many games of this size where the Director of the Flippin' Line™ comes onto the forums and asks what people want.

And to that end, for me personally, I'd rather see something new or one of the classics mentioned by ColoradoCthulhu (BTMOM) than The Dreaming Stone. No offense intended to anyone who wants that. Heck, if we got that, I'd be happy for you. :) Just throwing in my two cents.

Edited by klecser
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What I'd love to see are shorter campaigns. Something we can run in say 6-12 sessions, or 20-40 hours instead of 90+. For a lot of groups, I suspect this may be more achievable then some of the awesome-looking but difficult-to-actually-run mega-campaigns. 

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2 minutes ago, twofeet said:

What I'd love to see are shorter campaigns. Something we can run in say 6-12 sessions, or 20-40 hours instead of 90+. For a lot of groups, I suspect this may be more achievable then some of the awesome-looking but difficult-to-actually-run mega-campaigns. 

This is a really good point. Diversify, diversify, diversify. All of the existing shorter campaigns are for specific settings or Pulp (Shadows, Cold Fire). I'm certain that the team knows this and is working on it. I am very eager to see The Children of Fear.

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9 minutes ago, twofeet said:

What I'd love to see are shorter campaigns. Something we can run in say 6-12 sessions, or 20-40 hours instead of 90+. For a lot of groups, I suspect this may be more achievable then some of the awesome-looking but difficult-to-actually-run mega-campaigns. 

I agree. Shorter campaigns that take several months of play are preferable to the year-long campaigns. We have Masks and Orient Express (and hopefully the other lengthy classic campaigns mentioned above at some point), so new Call of Cthulhu campaigns should be written with this shorter time frame in mind. A campaign that takes three months is much more likely to be played to the last act than one that requires a huge investment of time.

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59 minutes ago, twofeet said:

What I'd love to see are shorter campaigns. Something we can run in say 6-12 sessions, or 20-40 hours instead of 90+. For a lot of groups, I suspect this may be more achievable then some of the awesome-looking but difficult-to-actually-run mega-campaigns. 

I agree with this totally. Scenarios that last six to ten sessions would be perfect for us.

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No reason for Ars Magica players to have all the fun!

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1 hour ago, ColoradoCthulhu said:

I agree. Shorter campaigns that take several months of play are preferable to the year-long campaigns. We have Masks and Orient Express (and hopefully the other lengthy classic campaigns mentioned above at some point), so new Call of Cthulhu campaigns should be written with this shorter time frame in mind. A campaign that takes three months is much more likely to be played to the last act than one that requires a huge investment of time.

Your point is very well taken and I agree. I do want to pitch to everyone in the audience that you do not have to think of any campaign as a self-contained entity. Many campaigns have sandbox-y, "interim" scenarios that can be easily lifted and put into other campaigns. Granted, this does take a little bit of work and not all scenarios are good candidates. I actually think a big part of the work is simply accepting a different perspective and having the courage to make the change. The key thing for all of us to remember: these are our games. We define how to use the products. Not everyone has the time or desire to "cut and paste" scenarios, of course, and it is overall less work to run from self-contained.

An example: Anyone in the audience who has Masks, check out The Derbyshire Horror as a candidate for a "cut-and-paste" campaign mentality.  It is well-suited, in my opinion, for four reasons: 1) The characters and situations are compelling and do not need any prior setup. The situation is easily connected into or out. 2) There is the prospect of gaining an ally from the scenario, further strengthening it's connection to the latter parts of a campaign. 3) Mam Tor is a locale located nearby that can be made into anything you want it to be. It became a key location for me. It became the holding place of a three-volume Necronomicon, each volume possessed by a different Spirit. It also contained the "prophecy" that is a huge continual source of dread and anxiety for my play group. Tee hee hee. ;) 4) I don't think it's very difficult to shift the location from England to New England or another locale.

Edited by klecser
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45 minutes ago, Mike M said:

Shadows Over Stillwater is exactly that type of shorter campaign, each scenario is pretty much stand alone but builds on the others. 

In terms of form, yes. But it is Down Darker Trails. I think what people are really saying is that that they want a short campaign for 1920s. Personally, I believe Shadows Over Stillwater is easily adapted to 1920s.

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Isn't the plan to "retire" the Organized-Play campaigns, sequentially, and re-develop them for commercial release?  This will add to the "short campaign" stable for all players & keepers...

That is, the first one (ATtH) is still in somewhat-rough form only for the OP program, but a new OP campaign is coming out (first session or two already out?), and ATtH is getting polished for publication...  And then, in time, this newer campaign will in turn be "retired" from OP, and re-done for publication (when a new OP campaign comes out)...

Or have I misunderstood?

 

Edited by g33k
clarity
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