Damage to Limbs

[Ryan Kent]

 

If a character takes 2x a limbs hit points in damage from multiple blows, is the character functionally incapacitated in the same manner if it took 2x limb hit points in one blow?

Once a character takes 2x a limbs hit points do you keep track of further hits to that limb (that are not 3x the limbs hit points in one blow) or just deduct the hits from general hit points?

If a character takes 3x a limbs hit points from multiple blows is the limb maimed?

[ChrisJ]

Don't sweat it.  If they take 3xHP to limbs from multiple blows. They are likely dead!  (If their Leg HP=5 then their THP=13-15).

So yes damage from subsequent blows to the same location still count for THP damage.  This is why creatures lacking THP (Zombies/Skeletons etc) can be fearsome opponents.

Intelligent creatures should cry "Ransom" before letting the fight get this serious.

[Paid a bod yn dwp]

My understanding is that once a limb has reached its x2 limit,  then it will no longer take damage to itself, but any damage received through the limb can and will still be registered on total hitpoints. So you won’t need to track damage to limbs after they have reached  x2 their hitpoints, but you will still track any damage received through that limb on total hitpoints.

Each individual hit on a limb is capped by the x2 limit, meaning that damage passed on to THP from hits to limbs is also capped at x2.
 

Only x3 from a single blow will sever a limb, and the damage from that blow to THP (total hitpoints) will still be capped at the limbs x2 limit.  Which supports the narrative of just about survivable limb loss. 
 

edit: skirting through Jason’s official answers in the link below there is an exception mentioned to the limbs x2 damage limit, with falling being able to pass on the full raw damage total hit points, which makes sense.

Edited November 7, 2020 by Paid a bod yn dwp

[Anunnaki]

@Ryan Kent First, welcome to the forums.

There is a substantial RQG Official Corrections/Q&A site here (it's not obvious, but it is in the First Post in the RQ Core Rules Questions thread pinned on this site above):

https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/?s=Q%26A

There is a specific Q&A section related to damage on this page:

https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/home/catalogue/publishers/chaosium/runequest-roleplaying-in-glorantha-players-book-print/cha4028-runequest-roleplaying-in-glorantha-qa-by-chapter/cha4028-runequest-roleplaying-in-glorantha-chapter-06-game-system/

Hope this helps!

Kind regards, James

Edited November 7, 2020 by Anunnaki

[Lordabdul]

5 hours ago, Ryan Kent said:

If a character takes 2x a limbs hit points in damage from multiple blows, is the character functionally incapacitated in the same manner if it took 2x limb hit points in one blow?

I'd say no. The text only mentions being functionally incapacitated if the 2xHP wound is dealt in one blow. The incapacitation comes from the shock of receiving such a huge blow -- not from going over an arbitrary threshold after a paper cut.

5 hours ago, Ryan Kent said:

Once a character takes 2x a limbs hit points do you keep track of further hits to that limb (that are not 3x the limbs hit points in one blow) or just deduct the hits from general hit points?

I personally don't track injuries past that point. And I don't think the rules support it or need it either.

5 hours ago, Ryan Kent said:

If a character takes 3x a limbs hit points from multiple blows is the limb maimed?

I don't think so. As far as I understand, once the location's 2xHP has been reached, it can't take any further damage (except if it gets severed by a 3xHP blow.) All damage to that hit location just goes to the total HP.

[Ryan Kent]

If a 5 point limb takes more than 3x it’s hit points from a crushing blow and is maimed will a 6 point heal restore it although only with 1 hit point or does it take at least 10 points to bring it back to full hit points to cure the maiming?

[Anunnaki]

8 hours ago, Ryan Kent said:

If a 5 point limb takes more than 3x it’s hit points from a crushing blow and is maimed will a 6 point heal restore it although only with 1 hit point or does it take at least 10 points to bring it back to full hit points to cure the maiming?

So a 5 point limb that takes 15 points or more damage in a "single blow" (RQG, p.148) is severed/maimed. However, the character will have only taken 10 points of damage to total hit points, which is also the maximum damage that can be inflicted on the limb as "hit points." A 6-point Heal spell cast within 10 minutes will both restore the limb to function (RQG, p.149) and heal 6 hit points on that limb (it was a single 10-point wound -- the excess points are ignored from the single blow -- so all 6 points apply to the healing as well).

Now, if the 5 point limb took a 10 point "single blow" then the character and limb would be incapacitated (RQG, p.148), but the limb would not be severed/maimed . If the limb took another 5 points of damage, for example, those points go directly to the character's total hit points but the limb is still not severed/maimed because it reached three times the limit in multiple blows (not a single blow).

In either case, it is important to note that the Heal spirit magic spell heals hit points on the location touched, while the Heal Wound rune magic spell heals both locational and total hit points.

Greater minds that mine can confirm that the Heal spirit magic spell only heals locational damage, while Heal Wound handles both location and total damage, thus providing a distinction between the two spells other than magic points cost and intensity. That is how I play it, but others might see differently and I could well be wrong.

Hope this helps!

Kind regards, James

Edited November 7, 2020 by Anunnaki

[Ryan Kent]

Thanks everyone. That helped me greatly. This is a very helpful and welcoming community.

[Paid a bod yn dwp]

8 hours ago, Ryan Kent said:

If a 5 point limb takes more than 3x it’s hit points from a crushing blow and is maimed will a 6 point heal restore it although only with 1 hit point or does it take at least 10 points to bring it back to full hit points to cure the maiming?

Looking at the section on p149 Severed and Maimed limbs, the text makes a distinction between healing severed and maimed limbs. 

Severed limb
It’s says Only a 6-point heal spell or equivalent, applied within 10mins will restore a severed limb. 

Maimed limb
A maimed limb can only be restored if ALL hit points are cured within 10 mins. This can be done by any healing spell. 

[Anunnaki]

16 minutes ago, Paid a bod yn dwp said:

Looking at the section on p149 Severed and Maimed limbs, the text makes a distinction between healing severed and maimed limbs. 

Severed limb
It’s says Only a 6-point heal spell or equivalent, applied within 10mins will restore a severed limb. 

Maimed limb
A maimed limb can only be restored if ALL hit points are cured within 10 mins. This can be done by any healing spell. 

Heh. And this is why I don't play RQG any more (I've gone back to RQ2/Classic). Yeah, I probably incorrectly answered Ryan's question (which is a good one and worth clarifying). I (mis)interpreted that section to read "severing" and "maiming" as both the same thing, as that is the case in earlier editions of RQ. One is cut off, the other is just a mangled mess; both a bad.

Either way, yes it looks like this should be read as RAW as:

Severed: A 6-point healing spell will restore the limb. No mention of whether healing applies, but we can assume it does so 6 points healed as well and if that takes the limb back to positive, then all good (it would in the case of the 5 point limb earlier).

Maimed: A healing spell that cures all hit points to the location. So in this case, it will require a 10-point healing spell for a 5 point limb.

Point lesson: Crushing wounds are worse in RQG! Avoid trolls and giants!

Thanks for the extra info, @Paid a bod yn dwp! And thanks again for asking this question @Ryan Kent.

Time to go tend to the sheep (for real; we have a small flock).

 

Edited November 7, 2020 by Anunnaki

[Runeblogger]

19 minutes ago, Anunnaki said:

Maimed: A healing spell that cures all hit points to the location. So in this case, it will require a 10-point healing spell for a 5 point limb.

But I guess five successful castings of Heal-2 would work as well in this case, wouldn't it?

[Anunnaki]

7 minutes ago, Runeblogger said:

But I guess five successful castings of Heal-2 would work as well in this case, wouldn't it?

True that! Or ten Heal-1s over 10 minutes. Or a First Aid with some Heal spells to fill in the blanks as well.

So I guess being maimed isn't as bad as severing after all! Phew! Charge into those trolls and giants and don't worry about those crushed limbs -- kill 'em all quickly enough and you've got plenty of time to get those limbs working afterwards.

Edited November 7, 2020 by Anunnaki

[Paid a bod yn dwp]

17 minutes ago, Anunnaki said:

ime to go tend to the sheep (for real; we have a small flock).

Wa-ha! (As in the Gloranthan cattle raiding tradition). 

Slight digression comparing editions - Presumably the 6-point healing spell requirement for reattaching severed limbs in RQG is based in the original RQ2 rules where a limb was severed if it took 6pts more then it could in a single blow. In RQG the 6pt limit has been replaced by x3 but the healing requirements to reattach limbs is still 6pts. 

[Baron Wulfraed]

1 hour ago, Anunnaki said:

In either case, it is important to note that the Heal spirit magic spell heals hit points on the location touched, while the Heal Wound rune magic spell heals both locational and total hit points.

Greater minds that mine can confirm that the Heal spirit magic spell only heals locational damage, while Heal Wound handles both location and total damage, thus providing a distinction between the two spells other than magic points cost and intensity. That is how I play it, but others might see differently and I could well be wrong.

That leads to some absurdities... Character takes enough damage to limbs to reduce total hit points down to 1-3, say. Limbs are subsequently healed to full status. You now have a character with NO DAMAGED LOCATIONS, but with only 1-3 total hit points? Where one good blow to a limb (say 4hp limb, takes 3pt damage -> total HP goes to 0 or less) results in death? If true it leaves Heal with just two uses (in my mind): Heal 2pt to cauterize wounds to stop blood loss, and Heal 6pt to reattach a severed limb -- and then send the character home to spend a few weeks waiting for total HP to catch up.

I'd probably interpret the location specific part to limit how much healing is done -- no sense casting Heal 6 on a limb with 2pts of damage as the other 4pts of heal don't migrate to other damaged locations or total HP. Whereas Heal Wound allows the excess to migrate to total HP.

[Anunnaki]

2 minutes ago, Paid a bod yn dwp said:

Wa-ha! (As in the Gloranthan cattle raiding tradition). 

Slight digression comparing editions - Presumably the 6-point healing spell requirement for reattaching severed limbs in RQG is based in the original RQ2 rules where a limb was severed if it took 6pts more then it could in a single blow. In RQG the 6pt limit has been replaced by x3 but the healing requirements to reattach limbs is still 6pts. 

Tangent 1: Heh. Our neighbors have the cattle -- we are among the lonely voices of sanity for hair sheep in the area (registered St. Croix, a conservancy breed).

Yes, definitely on the RQ2 6-point reference. However, the maiming rules in RQG are similar to the RQ3 engine, which did have a distinction between sever and maim (though did not have slashes or crushes). RQ3 did not allow a 6-point Heal to attach a severed limb, but did allow a maimed limb to be recovered if you healed all damage within 10 melee rounds (not minutes). And that was for wounds twice or greater than limb hit points. So RQG is a hybrid, for sure. 

Tangent 2: Though character creation is definitely based on the RQ2 chassis, RQG is definitely more like RQ3 in the magic section (spell wording and use) and elsewhere like experience gains, dealing with severs/maims, some skills, et al. Plus the new stuff like Augments, Passions, Rune-based Sorcery, and so on.

[Anunnaki]

2 hours ago, Baron Wulfraed said:

That leads to some absurdities... Character takes enough damage to limbs to reduce total hit points down to 1-3, say. Limbs are subsequently healed to full status. You now have a character with NO DAMAGED LOCATIONS, but with only 1-3 total hit points? Where one good blow to a limb (say 4hp limb, takes 3pt damage -> total HP goes to 0 or less) results in death? If true it leaves Heal with just two uses (in my mind): Heal 2pt to cauterize wounds to stop blood loss, and Heal 6pt to reattach a severed limb -- and then send the character home to spend a few weeks waiting for total HP to catch up.

I'd probably interpret the location specific part to limit how much healing is done -- no sense casting Heal 6 on a limb with 2pts of damage as the other 4pts of heal don't migrate to other damaged locations or total HP. Whereas Heal Wound allows the excess to migrate to total HP.

Apologies, that's not what I meant -- I phrased my post poorly sorry. Heal heals both hit points in location and total hit points, but no more than the hit location. Heal Wound indicates it can also be used to heal damage to total hit points from other sources. Like, for example, if a limb that is at double hit points gets hit again, that goes straight to total hit points, not the limb. That damage is not hit location damage, correct? It's total hit points damage.

So, for a 2 point limb, which has taken a 6 point hit and is now severed, you apply a Heal 6, but only heal back 4 points (to location and total hit points). You need the 6 point spell to knit the flesh together, but it's a spindly limb and you only took 4 points in the first place.

My (questioning?) point was if you do in fact heal back the remaining 2 points to total hit points in my example above. I don't think you do from a Heal spell as you once the hit location is healed you are done. And does a Heal spell have the ability to heal damage to total hit points? I don't know that it does; Heal Wound seems to be the go to for that. Which everyone has, of course.

So, for another example using the 5 point limb (lets say leg, and lets say 14 hit points). Leg gets hit for 15 points of damage from a sword and is severed. Character takes 10 points on the location and 10 to total hit points. Then he gets hit in the same leg for 3 points of damage -- this goes straight to total hit points, leaving the adventurer on 1 hit point (leg is still at -5 though, 10 points of damage). Then he gets a Heal 6 on the leg -- this heals 6 on the location bringing it up to 1 point and now functional and 6 to total hit points, bringing that up to 7 points and conscious. If the character took another Heal 6 on the same leg, it would heal 4 more points and add 4 to total hit points, but the remainder would be wasted in this case. So the character would end up with a healed leg, but be sitting on 11 total hit points. Similar deal if maimed, but the character would need to be fully healed on the leg before it became usable.

Now, if the character had been healed with Heal Wound backed with 13 magic points , that would heal the severed limb completely (10 points) AND also heal the damage to total hit points (3 remaining points).

Edited November 7, 2020 by Anunnaki

[Runeblogger]

1 hour ago, Anunnaki said:

True that! Or ten Heal-1s over 10 minutes. Or a First Aid with some Heal spells to fill in the blanks as well.

So I guess being maimed isn't as bad as severing after all! Phew! Charge into those trolls and giants and don't worry about those crushed limbs -- kill 'em all quickly enough and you've got plenty of time to get those limbs working afterwards.

Well, not in the current campaign I'm playing though. My current GM has houseruled that you can only cast one single spell on every injury... 😰

[HreshtIronBorne]

2 hours ago, Anunnaki said:

True that! Or ten Heal-1s over 10 minutes. Or a First Aid with some Heal spells to fill in the blanks as well.

So I guess being maimed isn't as bad as severing after all! Phew! Charge into those trolls and giants and don't worry about those crushed limbs -- kill 'em all quickly enough and you've got plenty of time to get those limbs working afterwards.

I think this is the secret of How Stormbull Kicks Butts. Berserkers go in and wreck stuff til they fall over twitching, then Chalana Arroy strolls over and puts all his parts back on! She's even got a couple minutes to figure out which parts go where!