Solar Campaign

[None]

12 hours ago, None said:

What is the Dara Happan view on tricksters? I'd assume they really dislike them and was unsure if it was really worth asking but at the same time weirder things have happened than the Dara Happans actually tllerating tricksters.

11 hours ago, soltakss said:

Tricksters violate the Harmony of the Solar Court, so Dara Happans don't like them one bit.

• Arkat/Gbaji was a Trickster and look how that turned out.
• The God Learners were taught by a Trickster and nothing good came of them.
• The EWF Dragons ate Tricksters and were consumed from within.

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

Really dislike them sums it up nicely. Unlike the Orlanthi, the Dara Happans don't have a native cult protecting Tricksters.

That's about what I expected, that should also mean that they typical Dara Happans doesn't really know that much about tricksters or what they're capable of though.

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

Best thing that ever happened within history, alas, it didn't last.

Wasn't this also when the Trollkin curse was cast on the trolls by someone? At least that should have been something everyone (except the trols) approved of.

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

They even received tame Storm worshipers in their neighborhood

Now that must have been great.

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

and their Iron Vrok

Their what now? Has it something to do with the Iron Ram somehow?

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

The emperor was forced to abdicate, an upstart barbarian with a weak lineage from Lodril became Overseer of Dara Happa

Yes, I can see the Dara Happans, their nobility in particular, practically frothing over this.

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

only the wisdom of the Great Advisor led Dara Happa out of this darkest period of its history.

Which I assume is Buserain so his cult should have gotten increased appresiation in the aftermath.

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

Dara Happa out of this darkest period of its history

(bolding mine)

Wait, am I just overthinking this or did the Dara Happans consider this worse than the Great Darkness?

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

and Gbaji and his Storm rebel followers marched against the Bright Empire

And on top of all of the above everyone else was tricked into beliveing Nysalor was Gbaji when he oviously wasn't.

10 hours ago, Joerg said:

The Dara Happans came to the inevitable conclusion that they had been too mild towards the Storm rebels.

Only the closest major event with the Olanthi (that I know of) was the Empire of Wyrm Friends so clearly even that concusion was to forgiving.

Actually, are there a lot of contact betwen the Orlanthi and the Dara Happans? They live a fair bit away from each other and they don't seem to have much incentive to travel to each others teritories.

----

I've been thinking about one thing Joerg said:

If the Sunstop warped time that much and even brought back the Golden Age for a while doesn't that mean the barrier between the Godworld and the world of time was really weak or even non-existent there for an eternal moment?

Because if so shouldn't that mean you cuold travel to the Sunstop from inside the Godtime and accidentaly stumble out at when the Sunstop ended?

Potentially allowing people who were born during the Golden Age to to suddenly find themselves in the First Age?

Of course, that does beg the question what the Dara Happans of the time would feel about ancestors that where born during Murharzarm's, or even Yelm's direct, reign suddenly appering among them?

Actually, did people speak Dara Happan or Firespeech back then?

[Qizilbashwoman]

14 minutes ago, None said:

Wasn't this also when the Trollkin curse was cast on the trolls by someone? At least that should have been something everyone (except the trols) approved of.

The god Nysalor struck the god Kyger Liter's womb with horrid radiation, making uz unable to procreate properly ever since on a species-wide level. (This applies apparently to uz connected to her; hot trolls don't seem to be affected as they have their own mother goddess and weren't involved in this battle.)

I am unclear how people in Genertela feel about genocide in general, and also 20 fast-breeding trollkin births are not an improvement on one slow-breeding uz birth. And trollkin are bigger and meaner than humans and like to eat them, while uz are, dare I say it, more likely to have a conversation with you. They also are man-eaters but they're not dumb, vicious, and desperate.

Edited April 19, 2021 by Qizilbashwoman

[None]

7 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

I am unclear how people in Genertela feel about genocide in general, and also 20 fast-breeding trollkin births are not an improvement on one slow-breeding uz birth.

I'm pretty sure the trolls bore litters of Uz before the curse and were only able to birth the occasional sole Uz after (usually they only get litters of Trollkin).

At least that's what I've heard.

Edited April 19, 2021 by None

[Qizilbashwoman]

21 minutes ago, None said:

I'm pretty sure the trolls bore litters of Uz before the curse and were only able to birth the occasional sole Uz after (usually they only get litters of Trollkin).

At least that's what I've heard.

Uz litters were small. Uz have six nipples. Trollkin litters are ginormous, and they are driven out, whereupon they breed like rabbits in the wild - like 7' tall cannibalistic ogre rabbits with a lot of cunning and desperation

Edited April 19, 2021 by Qizilbashwoman

[Qizilbashwoman]

On 4/4/2021 at 11:20 AM, Eff said:

Gorgorma is probably most similar to Maran Gor, but they are more distinct than Dendara and Ernalda or Oria and Ernalda/Esrola are.

I need nothing in my life more than a cult of Gorgorma the Welcomed Unwelcome One, who operates within Yelmic society as an all-female Great Executioner. Maybe she's your maid. Maybe she's the queen's sister. Maybe she's a beggar. You won't know until you are alone and she steps out of the shadow with a grinding of teeth and the sound of a club being dragged behind her

[Joerg]

22 minutes ago, None said:

Wasn't this also when the Trollkin curse was cast on the trolls by someone? At least that should have been something everyone (except the trols) approved of.

Yes, "digijelm" is the Dara Happan name for Uz.

 

22 minutes ago, None said:

Their what now? Has it something to do with the Iron Ram somehow?

Palangio the Iron Vrok, the foremost hero from Dara Happa in the Bright Empire, who brought Daysenerus (Lightfore/Yelmalio) to the Battle of Night and Day (breaking the Compromise) and who conquered all the Storm Barbarians for Nysalor. He even sent Arkat to Hell.

22 minutes ago, None said:

Which I assume is Buserain so his cult should have gotten increased appresiation in the aftermath.

Actually it was a kinsman of the previous emperor who the Theyalans planned to announce as a puppet emperor, but he declined. He still averted the worst of an interregnum and helped the next emperor (his nephew, IIRC) to the Ten Tests, and remained the power behind the throne for quite a while.

22 minutes ago, None said:

Wait, am I just overthinking this or did the Dara Happans consider this worse than the Great Darkness?

Yes, that was bad, as they had no emperor, but now they had no emperor, and they had to pay tribute!

 

 

 

22 minutes ago, None said:

If the Sunstop warped time that much and even brought back the Golden Age for a while doesn't that mean the barrier between the Godworld and the world of time was really weak or even non-existent there for an eternal moment?

Not the Godworld, but Godtime. Basically all of Glorantha was in a Heroplane situation. The Heroplane is the (echo of the) Middle World in Godtime. While the gods walked this place in Godtime, the Godworld is still beyond these places, where the gods have their domains.

Time was wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey while Other Side rules took hold of the Surface World.

 

22 minutes ago, None said:

Because if so shouldn't that mean you cuold travel to the Sunstop from inside the Godtime and accidentaly stumble out at when the Sunstop ended?

Generally, no. If you enter the Other Side from within Time, that (plus an unknown amount of time) is when you return. 

Same with the Surface World entering the Sunstop, really.

 

22 minutes ago, None said:

Potentially allowing people who were born during the Golden Age to to suddenly find themselves in the First Age?

Neither, really. While it is possible to summon heroes from the Other Side into rituals or even battles, it takes Surface World effort to do so. Granted, the Sunstop was lots of Surface World effort, and the births of Nysalor and Arkat were among the results.

 

22 minutes ago, None said:

Of course, that does beg the question what the Dara Happans of the time would feel about ancestors that where born during Murharzarm's, or even Yelm's direct, reign suddenly appering among them?

A time of great omen etc., but quite a lot of magical effort needs to be dedicated to contact a Godtime entity - usually by the Surface World entity entering the Other Side. Palangio incarnating Daysenerus at the Battle of Night and Day was a big thing. The trolls collectively embodying the Black Eater in response was bigger, and Nysalor allowing himself to be eaten and then searing its womb was yet bigger.

I am not aware of a Dara Happan procession of the dead like Esrolia has. No idea what happens inside Shargashi enclosures.

 

[None]

34 minutes ago, Joerg said:

Palangio the Iron Vrok, the foremost hero from Dara Happa in the Bright Empire, who brought Daysenerus (Lightfore/Yelmalio) to the Battle of Night and Day (breaking the Compromise

I thought breaking the Compromise usually meant that a lot of other gods appeared to express their displeasure.

So how  did he get away with that?

49 minutes ago, Joerg said:

Quote

Wait, am I just overthinking this or did the Dara Happans consider this worse than the Great Darkness?

Yes, that was bad, as they had no emperor, but now they had no emperor, and they had to pay tribute!

Ah, of course. I should have learned by that the Draa Happans judge the  situation much more based on their Emperor and if everyone follows their place in the Yelmic order, rather than how the rest of the world is dong.

Of course having no Emperor in a ruined world is better than having a false Emperor in a mostly not ruined world.

Silly me. 😄

 

36 minutes ago, Joerg said:

Neither, really. While it is possible to summon heroes from the Other Side into rituals or even battles, it takes Surface World effort to do so. Granted, the Sunstop was lots of Surface World effort, and the births of Nysalor and Arkat were among the results.

The way you put this makes it sound like a much more likely scenario would be Ancestors originally born during the Golden Age being (re)born the normal way during/at the end of the Sunstop.

Which would still be quite a thing I belive. You'd suddenly have a few children with realy interesting magical potential and possibly even direct links to several myths and heroquests.

 

----

Could someone please explain the Sunstop in greater detail? I feel like there should be a lot of potential to do something with it. That much of magical efort should easily have a chance to cause a lot of unintended side-effects.

 

43 minutes ago, Joerg said:

Palangio incarnating Daysenerus at the Battle of Night and Day was a big thing.

Are we talking about what is called Heroforming in Hero Quest?

Where an Initiate (of probbly Rune level) temporarily bcomes a very specific instace of their deity?

As an example, an Humakti can becomes the instance of Humakt where 'Humakt Kills Everyone'. Giving you absurd amounts of ability when it comes to killing everyone but also forces you to do just that untilll Orlanth appears and stops you (or you forcefully shut the Heroform down injuring your affinity in the proccess).

That wouldn't break the Compromise though so I assume you mean something greater and more involved.

[Sir_Godspeed]

2 hours ago, None said:

Actually, are there a lot of contact betwen the Orlanthi and the Dara Happans? They live a fair bit away from each other and they don't seem to have much incentive to travel to each others teritories.

 

Contrary to what we often think, there are quite a lot of Orlanthi living north of the Rockwood Mountains, in Peloria. 

There's obviously the Talastari, Aggari and the Brolians along the western periphery, but regions like Vanch, Holay and Sylila are also, in principle at least, Orlanthi lands. Or syncretic in nature. Imther's religions is also Storm-based, I believe, or a mixture of Storm and Sun. This brings the Orlanthi (or local equivalents) right up to the doorstep of Alkoth, basically.

[Joerg]

33 minutes ago, None said:

I thought breaking the Compromise usually meant that a lot of other gods appeared to express their displeasure.

So how  did he get away with that?

Well, the trolls showed their displeasure by summoning/embodying the Hungry Eater, an aspect of their goddess which went at Daysenerus.

Palangio got away with that by having Nysalor on his team, who pulled the Yelmalio stunt of letting himself be eaten, then added the searing of the womb of Korasting while down and out. Voila, Curse of Kin.

 

33 minutes ago, None said:

Ah, of course. I should have learned by that the Draa Happans judge the  situation much more based on their Emperor and if everyone follows their place in the Yelmic order, rather than how the rest of the world is dong.

Of course having no Emperor in a ruined world is better than having a false Emperor in a mostly not ruined world.

Silly me. 😄

Those guys had forced their emperor to step down! Unheard of!

The Rebels usurped authority! Justice can only be dealt from above, but that son of Quivin?

Ordanestyu, the Yelmic noble who had been put forward, decided to go the way of Arraz the celestial servant and minister rather than attempting the Ten Tests. Only when the tribute-taking rebels had been pushed out, the next emperor could undergo the Ten Tests.

The next emperor Erzanestyu (and at least one successor, writing this from memory) kept Ordanestyu as their advisor.

 

33 minutes ago, None said:

The way you put this makes it sound like a much more likely scenario would be Ancestors originally born during the Golden Age being (re)born the normal way during/at the end of the Sunstop.

Which would still be quite a thing I belive. You'd suddenly have a few children with realy interesting magical potential and possibly even direct links to several myths and heroquests.

Something like that could be done, but then actually seeing Time stop was more than most of the various magicians causing that effect all over the Surface world had expected. Participants included Fronelan wizards impressing beast barbarians, the Kralori dragon emperor, and the Dara Happan Emperor alongside the Theyalan Council supporting the birth of Osentalka, the Perfect God.

All of the Dara Happan and Theyalan magical energies had been poured into this project, so leeching some off to incanate an ancestor might have been regarded as sabotage.

33 minutes ago, None said:

Could someone please explain the Sunstop in greater detail? I feel like there should be a lot of potential to do something with it. That much of magical efort should easily have a chance to cause a lot of unintended side-effects.

Such as Arkat?

 

33 minutes ago, None said:

Are we talking about what is called Heroforming in Hero Quest?

Yes, only a lot more so.

The Black Eater can be summoned as a Great Spirit in the game Nomad Gods. Such a summoning is slightly below the threshold of breaking the Compromise. What Palangio did was more powerful.

 

33 minutes ago, None said:

Where an Initiate (of probbly Rune level) temporarily bcomes a very specific instace of their deity?

Palangio was beyond rune lord/priest, and an illuminate. He had been part of the God Project, and had handled exotic and powerful magics in that function.

 

33 minutes ago, None said:

As an example, an Humakti can becomes the instance of Humakt where 'Humakt Kills Everyone'. Giving you absurd amounts of ability when it comes to killing everyone but also forces you to do just that untilll Orlanth appears and stops you (or you forcefully shut the Heroform down injuring your affinity in the proccess).

You can also end this state by dying and joining Humakt's eternal Warriors in his Other Side, waiting to fight to avert a total end of the world.

33 minutes ago, None said:

That wouldn't break the Compromise though so I assume you mean something greater and more involved.

Yes, greater than calling in the Founders or the Great Spirits of Prax through a summoning.

But then, manifesting a spirit is what spirits are supposed to do on occasion.

[None]

2 hours ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

Contrary to what we often think, there are quite a lot of Orlanthi living north of the Rockwood Mountains, in Peloria. 

There's obviously the Talastari, Aggari and the Brolians along the western periphery, but regions like Vanch, Holay and Sylila are also, in principle at least, Orlanthi lands. Or syncretic in nature. Imther's religions is also Storm-based, I believe, or a mixture of Storm and Sun. This brings the Orlanthi (or local equivalents) right up to the doorstep of Alkoth, basically.

So basically. The focus on Sartar strikes again.

However, seeing as none of the above are (presumably) Sartarites, how much do they have in common with the Sartarites and how much have they been influenced by Dara Happa and other Pelorian civiliations?

Their relationship with Dara Happa ought to be more complex than the one the Sartarites have at the very least.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

Well, the trolls showed their displeasure by summoning/embodying the Hungry Eater, an aspect of their goddess which went at Daysenerus.

Ah, so things were escalating.

Any idea why trolls dislike Solars so much?

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

Palangio got away with that by having Nysalor on his team

Come to think of it. Isn't Nysalor a god? Shouldn't he be a violation of the Compromise in and by himself.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

who pulled the Yelmalio stunt of letting himself be eaten, then added the searing of the womb of Korasting while down and out. Voila, Curse of Kin.

This is one of the things I like about Glorantha. How by doing the right (or wrong thing) to a peoples gods or myths you can suddenly lave a permanent effect or change on an entire people.

In this cse the trolls brought it upon themselves too. They really shouldn't have eatn Nysalor.

Not that they could have known.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

The next emperor Erzanestyu (and at least one successor, writing this from memory) kept Ordanestyu as their advisor.

Making him into a Grey Eminence (that is the term, right?) in the Dara Happan imperial court. That's actually realy interestig, especially from a roleplaying perspective.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

Osentalka

I'm assuming this is another name for Nysalor?

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

All of the Dara Happan and Theyalan magical energies had been poured into this project, so leeching some off to incanate an ancestor might have been regarded as sabotage.

Assuming anyone noticed, or that it was even intentional. Whith so much magic going around there could very well be a little bit of spill.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

Such as Arkat?

Uh, yeees? I wasn't thinking about him specifically but If he could be born without (presumably) anyone intending it then having a few Golden Age ancestors accidentally be born shuoldn't be unfeasable.

------
I'm basically playing around with the idea of having player characters from the Golden Age transfered to an interesting period inside Time in a way that doesn't feel too convulted or leave them overpowerd. While at the same time not taking away everything from them, and allowing for some interesting leverage or things to be drawn from their past.

I was concidering having them just stmble over into Time due to getting caught up in the Sunstop but I might actually like the idea of having them incarnate into time more.

That way they can forget bits and pieces of the Golden Age and it allows for the players to redesign their charactes a bit (or a lot) if they want.
------

2 hours ago, Joerg said:

Yes, only a lot more so.

The Black Eater can be summoned as a Great Spirit in the game Nomad Gods. Such a summoning is slightly below the threshold of breaking the Compromise. What Palangio did was more powerful.

 

Quote

Where an Initiate (of probbly Rune level) temporarily bcomes a very specific instace of their deity?

Palangio was beyond rune lord/priest, and an illuminate. He had been part of the God Project, and had handled exotic and powerful magics in that function.

Ah. I don't know if there actually are rules forr Heroforming in Runequest yet so I'm unsure about what you mean by summoned as a Great Spirit as it sounds a lot ilike it'd work the same way as the summon elemental spell while rather than the character taking on an aspect of their deity and literly becoming said god in a limitided way.

I do understand what you mean by it beeing a matter of scale and the sheer amount of powerused  when it comes to breaking the Compromise though.

2 hours ago, Joerg said:

Quote

As an example, an Humakti can becomes the instance of Humakt where 'Humakt Kills Everyone'. Giving you absurd amounts of ability when it comes to killing everyone but also forces you to do just that untilll Orlanth appears and stops you (or you forcefully shut the Heroform down injuring your affinity in the proccess).

You can also end this state by dying and joining Humakt's eternal Warriors in his Other Side, waiting to fight to avert a total end of the world.

That isn't a solution most players would find aggreable though.

Heroforming isn't exactly rare (from a mechanicl standpoint) in Hero Quest once you've gained the ability. The only reall limiting factor is the constrains put on your actions and the fact that attaining the exit point could be a bit tricky.

Entering a Heroform isusually a lot easier to my memory (although there was one instance wit Ernalda that required you to be pregnant during the entire Heroform, including at the entry point).

[Sir_Godspeed]

1 hour ago, None said:

So basically. The focus on Sartar strikes again.

However, seeing as none of the above are (presumably) Sartarites, how much do they have in common with the Sartarites and how much have they been influenced by Dara Happa and other Pelorian civiliations?

Their relationship with Dara Happa ought to be more complex than the one the Sartarites have at the very least.

Simply put, yes. The Guide, writing with focus on the Third Age and the influence of the Lunar Empire, points out that fashions and artstyles for the Orlanthi take a lot from lowland Peloria (including Dara Happa). A high-ranking Orlanthi chief and a Solar noble might not look all that different.

[jajagappa]

2 hours ago, None said:

However, seeing as none of the above are (presumably) Sartarites, how much do they have in common with the Sartarites and how much have they been influenced by Dara Happa and other Pelorian civiliations?

Their relationship with Dara Happa ought to be more complex than the one the Sartarites have at the very least.

You need to go back to late 2nd Age and subsequent Dragonkill to understand more of the Orlanthi interactions.

The EWF ruled from Dragon Pass up through southern Peloria. These were draconic Orlanthi.  However, a traditionalist movement arose among the Orlanthi, spearheaded by the hero Alakoring who came from Ralios.

Alakoring's influence (which included development of the Orlanth Rex subcult) spread throughout southern Peloria.  At the same time, another kingdom arose in Saird which had a broad mix of Orlanthi, DH, Ernaldan, Yelmalion, and native influences.  These were allied with Alakoring in the drive to defeat the EWF.

The EWF fell in 1042 to internal betrayal.  In 1120, a united force of Orlanthi, Sairdites, Sun Domes, and DH marched as the True Golden Horde against Dragon Pass.  This prompted the True Dragons to respond and resulted in the Dragonkill. 

The result of that was that Dragon Pass was off-limits to humans for two centuries.  That separated the Orlanthi cultures - the northern was centered in Tarsh with an Alakoring-based tradition around the Rex kings.  The southern was pushed to Heortland, which had a mix of approaches to kingship.  All of southern Peloria has a strong Orlanthi tradition, though, with Saird as the primary mixing ground of Orlanthi and DH traditions.  This is one of the areas where the blending of mythic traditions occurs.

[Joerg]

48 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

The EWF fell in 1042 to internal betrayal. 

I call it an enforced mass utuma - ending the dragon dream experiment by ascending all dragonspeakers however far they may have come.

48 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

In 1120, a united force of Orlanthi, Sairdites, Sun Domes, and DH marched as the True Golden Horde against Dragon Pass.  This prompted the True Dragons to respond and resulted in the Dragonkill. 

Orlanthi (from Saird) will have contributed to the Horde, or have come as raiders from Maniria, but you forgot the Carmanian Empire (which actually led the invasion of 1042, and was one of the major contributors to the Horde in 1120). Praxians came as raiders, too.

Both the Only Old One and the Hendriki king sent forces as defenders (the Hendriki king went himself), but the Horde was invincible because of its immense numerical advantage.

 

[Nevermet]

14 hours ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Which Turos? Every city has their own team.

The thing about Lodril/Turos is that he is ever-replicating. There's never only one. It's always "never talk to me and my son, who is also me, ever again". I once tried to count the self-emanations of Turos in the Entekosiad once and it was like four generations that were all just Lodril again.

That's pretty much my thinking.  Just as Yelm can be broken into a myriad of component deities, so can Lodril / Turos.  There's Turos, ChekTuros, ErskiTuros, DedaddiTuros, HerraTuros, KetTuros... and GanesTuros,

 

GanestTuros is the Turos of the Gan Hills that create the Northern border of Spol.  He is the Turos who is the Shadow of Idovanus.  He is the Turos who Gives and Takes, the completely bitter bastard left over after being imprisoned and enslaved by apparently half the cosmos, who eventually just goes Fuck It and tries to take over after becoming an illuminated black dragon.

 

This is me, btw, at my most absurd and unhinged.  I will make no attempt to defend this silliness.

[Joerg]

3 hours ago, Nevermet said:

That's pretty much my thinking.  Just as Yelm can be broken into a myriad of component deities, so can Lodril / Turos.  There's Turos, ChekTuros, ErskiTuros, DedaddiTuros, HerraTuros, KetTuros... and GanesTuros,

 

GanestTuros is the Turos of the Gan Hills that create the Northern border of Spol.  He is the Turos who is the Shadow of Idovanus.  He is the Turos who Gives and Takes, the completely bitter bastard left over after being imprisoned and enslaved by apparently half the cosmos, who eventually just goes Fuck It and tries to take over after becoming an illuminated black dragon.

Wow. Just wow.

@scott-martin some fodder for your mountain musings.

 

3 hours ago, Nevermet said:

This is me, btw, at my most absurd and unhinged.  I will make no attempt to defend this silliness.

In other words, a new path to enlightenment. Lead onwards, sensei.

[Nevermet]

2 minutes ago, Joerg said:

In other words, a new path to enlightenment. Lead onwards, sensei.

Ha!

 

A few years back, I had to make a choice between doing Manirian Scratchpads or Carmanian (especially Spolite) scratchpads.  I don't regret the choice, but I'm still deeply fascinated by western Peloria.

[Sir_Godspeed]

I don't think the etymology quite works out (Estoro from GanEstoro versus Turos,) but as you said, this is more of a neat idea than anything else.

[Nevermet]

5 hours ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

I don't think the etymology quite works out (Estoro from GanEstoro versus Turos,) but as you said, this is more of a neat idea than anything else.

 

I know I said I wouldn't defend my silliness, but that is not the Silly Way! 🤪

...I will have something over in the Dumb Theory thread soon.

[davecake]

On 4/19/2021 at 3:51 PM, Qizilbashwoman said:

I need nothing in my life more than a cult of Gorgorma the Welcomed Unwelcome One, who operates within Yelmic society as an all-female Great Executioner. Maybe she's your maid. Maybe she's the queen's sister. Maybe she's a beggar. You won't know until you are alone and she steps out of the shadow with a grinding of teeth and the sound of a club being dragged behind her

Yes. And overt, like suicidal vengeance from a berserker at your elegant party, and some servant has locked the doors when you try to flee. And often less overt than a club, but a quiet poisoning, a noble found with his throat slit in a gutter after a night out, a body eaten by dogs or wild bears with no evidence of human agency. And subtler influences, includes lesser transgressors sweating through their nightmares knowing that those things could befall them at any time, or detailed blackmail material appearing on their desk. 

They also have ghosts at their command - vengeance can last beyond the grave, and sometimes a ghost is left to share its own story.

[Joerg]

On 4/19/2021 at 9:51 AM, Qizilbashwoman said:

I need nothing in my life more than a cult of Gorgorma the Welcomed Unwelcome One, who operates within Yelmic society as an all-female Great Executioner. Maybe she's your maid. Maybe she's the queen's sister. Maybe she's a beggar. You won't know until you are alone and she steps out of the shadow with a grinding of teeth and the sound of a club being dragged behind her

There might be subtle portents or visitations, akin to leaving a horse head in the bed. It would be a waste if the terror only lasts for the last few breaths of a perp.

[davecake]

10 minutes ago, Joerg said:

There might be subtle portents or visitations, akin to leaving a horse head in the bed. It would be a waste if the terror only lasts for the last few breaths of a perp.

Gorgorma has the power of nightmare, but her worshippers also quite enough practical possibilities for stealthy and mysterious threats. 

[Sir_Godspeed]

I could imagine this pushing certain noblemen to making generous donations to the temples of Dendara, to prostrate themselves before her various images and in general desperately paying their respect. Useful tool, in the absence of overt political power.

[None]

Actually, as Great Spirits, or summoning aspects of gods as Great Spirits was mentioned earlier that made me wonder.

Where does the line between spirits and gods go, and how shamans approach and view spirits and how theists do the same? Are there even anything resebling shamans in Dara Happa for that matter.

Do they even have a god that resembles the Orlanthi's Kolat? Or do you have to go to the Pentan version of Yelm for that?

 

Also, Joerg mentiond sumoning Great Spirits in a way that sounded as if he was speaking about Heroforming, only that doesn't really mech with how I understand it?

It also raises the question. Does anything like Heroforming exist in Runequest or if that is solely a Hero Quest thing?

Edited April 23, 2021 by None

[soltakss]

On 4/22/2021 at 7:59 AM, None said:

Actually, as Great Spirits, or summoning aspects of gods as Great Spirits was mentioned earlier that made me wonder.

Where does the line between spirits and gods go, and how shamans approach and view spirits and how theists do the same?

Spirits are often dead Deities or Demigods, sometimes they are not even dead.

In my Glorantha, there is no difference between a Deity and a Spirit.

The only difference is in how they are normally worshipped.

Shamans can access a deity's powers, through personal contact, a spirit Cult or through a Tradition.

Theists can access a Spirit's powers through direct worship by setting up a cult to worship the spirit, in which case it looks like a normal, minor cult.

On 4/22/2021 at 7:59 AM, None said:

Are there even anything resebling shamans in Dara Happa for that matter.

Maybe among the peasants, probably not in the cities. Don't forget that the Dara Happans got rid of the horse folk who ruled them in the First Age.

More generally, in Peloria, the Beast Riders of the Hungry Plateau might have shamans, as might some descendants of Spolites.

On 4/22/2021 at 7:59 AM, None said:

It also rises the question are anything like Heroforming in Runequest or if that is solely a Hero Quest thing.

Yes, there is even a HeroForming spell in the RQG Rulebook, Call Founder. 

 

[French Desperate WindChild]

37 minutes ago, soltakss said:

In my Glorantha, there is no difference between a Deity and a Spirit.

I thought like you, but I faced a big issue: the great compromise:

In my Glorantha, Gods may (rarely but they can, and with the "help" or at least the "gate" of initiates eyes) act in the mundane world.

 

But what about spirits? they don't need worshipers to understand the "now" situation. They can act easely in mundane world (compared to gods)

 

So what could be a Yelm-great spirit ? a mask of Yelm? the "autonomous" part of the full God Yelm?

Edited April 23, 2021 by French Desperate WindChild