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Return of Godtime?


Ironwall

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The land rises from the Oceans, the sky drops to the Earth, the spike is rebuilt and connects Sky and Earth, Magasta and the other Oceans depart to the edges of the world, Trolls depart to Wonderhome, Time ends, everyone lives happily ever after.

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Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. 

www.soltakss.com/index.html

Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here

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Well early on in the plan they would need to eliminate all the vermin and broken mechanisms wandering around the place, damaging everything even further. No point fixing it all if these annoying broken parts out of their place just mess it up again. They all need recycling and rebuilding, and put in their proper place anyway.

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The last time this was tried (in 375 ST) Time re-asserted itself and drew the stopping sun kicking and screaming back into its ordained cycles.

The dwarfs would prefer to bring back a Godtime before the World Machine got unhinged by the birth of Umath. It isn't quite clear whether the Lunar shenanigans fit in their ideal picture of how the world is meant to be stopped, either. (Or run in ever repeating cycles.)

Telling how it is excessive verbis

 

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6 hours ago, soltakss said:

The land rises from the Oceans, the sky drops to the Earth, the spike is rebuilt and connects Sky and Earth, Magasta and the other Oceans depart to the edges of the world, Trolls depart to Wonderhome, Time ends, everyone lives happily ever after.

So you think the Dwarves are the good guys huh?

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55 minutes ago, Darius West said:

So you think the Dwarves are the good guys huh?

Are those things good?

The Sky falls to the Earth, squeezing out the Air. That doesn't sound great to me.

The end of Time means that everyone is in the afterlife, essentially, so they probably all died.

Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. 

www.soltakss.com/index.html

Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here

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4 hours ago, soltakss said:

Are those things good?

The Sky falls to the Earth, squeezing out the Air. That doesn't sound great to me.

The end of Time means that everyone is in the afterlife, essentially, so they probably all died.

So what did people breathe back in the time before Umath?

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1 hour ago, Darius West said:

So what did people breathe back in the time before Umath?

I've heard people argue that Air was already around pre-Umath, but that it wasn't animated or embodied the way it later became. I have no idea. 

There's also the possibility that, indeed, no one really "breathed", or whatever other weirdness went on in those days.

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16 hours ago, soltakss said:

The land rises from the Oceans, the sky drops to the Earth, the spike is rebuilt and connects Sky and Earth, Magasta and the other Oceans depart to the edges of the world, Trolls depart to Wonderhome, Time ends, everyone lives happily ever after.

So...everything resolves in a singularity.  I approve!

!i!

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12 hours ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

I've heard people argue that Air was already around pre-Umath, but that it wasn't animated or embodied the way it later became. I have no idea. 

There's also the possibility that, indeed, no one really "breathed", or whatever other weirdness went on in those days.

Yeah, that's a sticky issue, isn't it? When the mythology doesn't mesh with how life-forms work so we need to retrofit an explanation.

I propose this as an answer: 

Back then, everyone was more holy and mystical and in closer to being gods and with the truth of the world, and so they were natural ascetics and mystics who didn't need to breathe.  As a result many people resented the arrival of Air, as it drew them away from the gods that existed before, but the powers of the air allowed people to draw on new powers, so some people started to imbibe the air and take its powers, and over time this became a common trait to most living creatures.  Thus the separation of Earth and Sky was also represented in the bodies of all living things.  While the Sky cultists would see this as a degeneration, others might see it as a valuable development (up until they are denied a source of fresh air).

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as I m not "dwarf-minded" I always had issue with this concept

 

as they want to repair the machine, that means they want to go "back / before" the machine was broken

but as the machine is the world, if you go back it was broken and "reset" what will happen ? the world machine will be broken again, and again and again

 

we have the cycle of ages and now a kind of meta-cycle of world machine ?

with only the hope that as chaos (neo?) may not be the same each time, one "god-day" the chaos event would fix for ever the issue ?

 

don't call me morpheus, please

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3 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

but as the machine is the world, if you go back it was broken and "reset" what will happen ? the world machine will be broken again, and again and again

Assuming a full and proper restoration of the Machine, the "breaking" of the Machine is effectively a simulation, a "what-if" scenario to collect data, and all the disparate "broken" parts sensory organs to perceive itself.

Yes, it's the Matrix.  It's also the kalpa and pralaya, and the Big Bang/Crunch.  One might almost surmise that Greg and the Wachowskis heard of this idea somewhere else.

!i!

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4 minutes ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

It's also thematically likely that the Mostali plans to return to the God Time are, in fact, utterly impossible.

That's certainly what all the Disorderly types are counting on.

!i!

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I love it - Chaos at the heart of dwarven society, as they work magic to cause a new sun stop.

What happens when one of them manifests a chaos feature? Consider it a radiation injury, allow them to continue working after they chop off the new tentacle?

Edited by EricW
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On 7/12/2021 at 8:31 AM, Akhôrahil said:

I love the naive interpretation the Orlanthi have, that before Sky and Earth were separated, they pushed against each other so that people could hardly move, and that this explains why things were so static.

Is that a "naive explanation" or a "useful metaphor?" The two aren't clear-cut when we're talking about myths of a "time before time."

I would posit that an educated, philosophical Orlanthi (and yes, those exist, and not just in a Lhankor Mhy temple, whatever those bearded fusspots might say to the contrary) takes the typical Orlanthi equivalence of one's "breath" with the concepts of both a "soul" and "freedom" to mean that before Umath separated Sky and Earth and filled the space between with Air, people in fact didn't need to breathe. But this also meant they were without what later people would imagine is a fully-formed human soul with all its component parts, and also (thus?) without true free will.

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Who did exist before Umath « revolution » ?

mortal ? No, the death came later 

so no need to breath as you can not die 

I don’t know if air existed before Umath or not but « breath » cannot be used to demonstrate something 🙂

I would say that in glorantha those who need to breath are mamals and mamals descend from Air gods (so after umath )

 

ok that exclude birds but are birds breathing in glorantha ?

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8 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

ok that exclude birds but are birds breathing in glorantha ?

Durulz do.

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Telling how it is excessive verbis

 

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