Chalana Arroy, a question or two.

[Rodney Dangerduck]

14 hours ago, Jeff said:

As an aside our newbie playing a CA initiate at GenCon quickly grasped how he was to operate in combat - simply walk in front of combatants and dare them to offend the Goddess of Healing by harming her peaceful devotee! Works with pretty any human, elf, and most others. Obviously a problem with Chaos or hateful cults like Zoran Zoran, Gagarth, or Wachaza, but that is a pretty short list.

When one of the PCs in melee fumbles, rolls hit nearest, kills her, and is cursed forever, I hope she feels guilty.

[simonh]

5 hours ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

When one of the PCs in melee fumbles, rolls hit nearest, kills her, and is cursed forever, I hope she feels guilty.

They chose to make the attack and risk a fumble. The point of walking into a combat like that is to try to stop the combat, not to just be an arbitrary obstacle.

Edited September 23, 2021 by simonh

[Bill the barbarian]

5 hours ago, Bren said:

Gently lift them up and set them down out of the way?

Had a series of combats in troll realms and the players hired a Xiola Umbar priestess. They were a bit surprised when told in no uncertain terms to allow enemies access to her skills as well as friends if they wished those skills to continue. I felt well within my rights to insist on this. This thread seems to agree as far as CAs are concerned.

[Alex]

1 hour ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Had a series of combats in troll realms and the players hired a Xiola Umbar priestess. They were a bit surprised when told in no uncertain terms to allow enemies access to her skills as well as friends if they wished those skills to continue. I felt well within my rights to insist on this. This thread seems to agree as far as CAs are concerned.

The two aren't identical in their magic or in their attitudes.  Or maybe they are, YGWV!  And of course even when they're generally different, particular priestesses may have their own...  foibles.  But unless this was a deliberate plot-twist, I'd maybe have made this clear to the PCs in advance.  Good luck with them trying to enforce modern understandings of contract law, mind you...

[Bill the barbarian]

On 9/23/2021 at 7:40 AM, Alex said:

The two aren't identical in their magic or in their attitudes. 

Well thanks for telling me, I would never have known, I am quite new to this RQ game.

Edited November 19, 2021 by Bill the barbarian

[Alex]

On 9/7/2021 at 7:00 PM, soltakss said:

I do have a little book that I am writing names in, though.

 

[Alex]

16 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Well thanks for telling me, I would never have known, I am quite new to this game.

You're welcome, I'm sure!  Other than "precedent" or "feasibility study and proof of concept", I don't see why "agree as far as CAs are concerned" is informative as far as XU cultists go.

[PhilHibbs]

15 hours ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

When one of the PCs in melee fumbles, rolls hit nearest, kills her, and is cursed forever, I hope she feels guilty.

10 hours ago, simonh said:

They chose to make the attack and risk a fumble. The point of walking into a combat like that is to try to stop the combat, not to just be an arbitrary obstacle.

Absolutely, you don't use her distraction as an opportunity to sneak attack. If it becomes apparent that violence actually cannot be avoided, well then either she got out safely, or she got attacked by the other side in which case you take the risk.

[soltakss]

On 9/23/2021 at 7:33 AM, Rodney Dangerduck said:

When one of the PCs in melee fumbles, rolls hit nearest, kills her, and is cursed forever, I hope she feels guilty.

Serves them right for fighting near a healer.

 

[WindSerpent]

Apologies for the minor thread necromancy, but I feel there is one exception to the CA pacifism. One exception so obvious that it's easy to miss. One exception that is an absolute necessity. A small exception, one that you may not even think of as an exception depending on your exact interpretations, but one that must be mentioned.

 

Disease spirits.

 

You can't tell me disease spirits don't *feel* the boss music when the CA priestess walks in.

Edited November 19, 2021 by WindSerpent

[Bill the barbarian]

8 minutes ago, WindSerpent said:

Apologies for the minor thread necromancy,

Lot of people apologizing for “thread necromancy”. I don’t get it. If it is good bring it back!

[WindSerpent]

1 minute ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Lot of people apologizing for “thread necromancy”. I don’t get it. If it is good bring it back!

It really bugs some people for some reason. Maybe they're Humakti?

[Akhôrahil]

2 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Lot of people apologizing for “thread necromancy”. I don’t get it. If it is good bring it back!

Let’s call it Thread-Reusable-Resurrection instead!

[Bill the barbarian]

I have been three Rs since the ‘70s so I think I will stay with that!

 

[WindSerpent]

Seriously, though, how do CA followers feel about disease spirits? I mean obviously they don't let them hang around, but has anyone seen a source address how they frame their interactions with them?

As much fun as it is to imagine them flipping on the switch marked 'DooM Music' for such occasions, it seems plausible that some/most of them look at it differently than that.

[Alex]

15 minutes ago, WindSerpent said:

As much fun as it is to imagine them flipping on the switch marked 'DooM Music' for such occasions, it seems plausible that some/most of them look at it differently than that.

Did you have a differently-from-that in mind?  Please do share!  If it's a little half-baked don't worry, we can workshop it!

[WindSerpent]

9 minutes ago, Alex said:

Did you have a differently-from-that in mind?  Please do share!  If it's a little half-baked don't worry, we can workshop it!

Well... I guess there are a few different possibilities. Like trying to rehabilitate disease spirits into something nicer? That seems weird to me though. Maybe more in terms of disease spirits as a 'wound' in the spirit world, which can be healed up and returned to raw healthy spirit-stuff, which is functionally identical to killing it but-we-don't-like-to-think-about-it-that-way.

(I'm definitely keeping the headcanon that there's at least one or two CA healers who take out their repressed rage issues on banishing them more roughly than strictly necessary though...)

Edited November 23, 2021 by WindSerpent

[French Desperate WindChild]

On 11/23/2021 at 7:59 PM, WindSerpent said:

Seriously, though, how do CA followers feel about disease spirits? I mean obviously they don't let them hang around, but has anyone seen a source address how they frame their interactions with them?

As much fun as it is to imagine them flipping on the switch marked 'DooM Music' for such occasions, it seems plausible that some/most of them look at it differently than that.

I think that :

- disease spirits is not a living creature, so a lot of taboos are not useful for them

- CA cultists must heal people, so they have to eject disease spirit, they don't need to destroy them

- if CA cultists are powerful enough to confine the disease spirit for ever, it is fine, event if it is not mandatory

- if CA cultists are powerful enough to "heal" disease spirit (as a INT spirit, POW spirit, what you want) that is a big deal and a holy result

[Ludo Bagman]

On 11/23/2021 at 7:59 PM, WindSerpent said:

Seriously, though, how do CA followers feel about disease spirits? I mean obviously they don't let them hang around, but has anyone seen a source address how they frame their interactions with them?

CA has special cult spirits, namely healing spirits whose number one priority (without Command Cult Spirits) is to attack disease spirits. If they win the spirit combat, the disease spirit is also "healed" and transformed into a normal disembodied spirit (and vice versa).

[Alex]

7 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

- CA cultists must heal people, so they have to eject disease spirit, they don't need to destroy them

I think this is in the realm of "can't kill 'em if they're already dead" (or were never alive).  If a spirit is a remnant Soul Part or Breath of a formerly embodied being, the Healer is doing the right thing by sending from from the Inner World to their final reward.  If they're just manifestations of the particular disease itself, then fighting and "killing" them is part of the mission statement.

[French Desperate WindChild]

10 minutes ago, Alex said:

I think this is in the realm of "can't kill 'em if they're already dead" (or were never alive).  If a spirit is a remnant Soul Part or Breath of a formerly embodied being, the Healer is doing the right thing by sending from from the Inner World to their final reward.  If they're just manifestations of the particular disease itself, then fighting and "killing" them is part of the mission statement.

what I m not sure is if there is any non chaotic possibility to destroy a spirit. you can reduce its pow, but is it able to destroy it for ever ?

I read somewhere (maybe not for glorantha, absolutly no idea) that when a spirit is at 0, it goes back to the "source" to replenish itself

 

[Alex]

3 minutes ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

what I m not sure is if there is any non chaotic possibility to destroy a spirit. you can reduce its pow, but is it able to destroy it for ever ?

I did wonder in what sense you meant "destroy".  I ended up you likely didn't mean "annihilate utterly", but I might be biased by living in Ireland, where "destroy" can mean "have rumpled those soft furnishings".  Yes, AFAIK you'd need chaos or some high-end mystical powers to do that.  (The former, that is.  I can manage the latter with a Casual use of my Slouch skill.)  So I'm assuming what they do is indeed to defeat it in spirit combat, then after that let it wend on its merry way, whatever that is.

6 hours ago, Ludo Bagman said:

CA has special cult spirits, namely healing spirits whose number one priority (without Command Cult Spirits) is to attack disease spirits. If they win the spirit combat, the disease spirit is also "healed" and transformed into a normal disembodied spirit (and vice versa).

Ah, there we go, that's a neater and more definitive resolution.  I couldn't find anything covering this in the RQGCB, is there more detail elsewhere?

[French Desperate WindChild]

16 minutes ago, Alex said:

I did wonder in what sense you meant "destroy".  I ended up you likely didn't mean "annihilate utterly", but I might be biased by living in Ireland, where "destroy" can mean "have rumpled those soft furnishings". 

yes my french english destroy (détruire in FR) = annihilate

I understand now that the stock shortage of my two favorite beers (kilkenny to drink, guiness to eat -in my homemade beef stew)have some impacts, not only on my stomach, but to share my thought with you !

[Squaredeal Sten]

On 11/23/2021 at 12:59 PM, WindSerpent said:

Seriously, though, how do CA followers feel about disease spirits? I mean obviously they don't let them hang around, but has anyone seen a source address how they frame their interactions with them?

As much fun as it is to imagine them flipping on the switch marked 'DooM Music' for such occasions, it seems plausible that some/most of them look at it differently than that.

Seems to me thar Chalana Arroy folks worry about beings with living bodies.  Spirits have no special claim to consideration.  Disease spirits are anathema because they harm bodies and do nothing else.  However they are also an opportunity to increase POW so the CA will actually gain by defeating them. 

 

[Dragon]

On 11/25/2021 at 10:45 AM, French Desperate WindChild said:

what I m not sure is if there is any non chaotic possibility to destroy a spirit. you can reduce its pow, but is it able to destroy it for ever ?

In old rules, Summon Spirit of Law stated that if the Law Spirit defeated the chaotic entity, it was destroyed or annihilated. The RBoM does not state the same in this version.

An interesting scenario could occur where a disease spirit is bound to an area. A Chalana Arroy initiate with decent POW and high Spirit Combat skill defeats it, and gains 1d3 POW, which reduces the POW of the spirit by the same amount. Now let's say the initiate's player decides to return every day and finds the disease spirit recovered in magic points. (Not to max the initiate's POW but to vanquish the spirit from threatening the community.) The initiate can hopefully defeat it again and again, driving it ever lower in POW. Once the spirit reaches zero POW, it is destroyed. Victory.

One interesting side note to how disease spirits work. A victim who gets some bad rolls and is infected but eventually defeats that same disease spirit becomes immune to all the diseases that spirit had. Thus, they can cure themselves. Of course, if the victim gets help and that helper defeats the spirit, the original victim needs some kind of cure (spell, shaman, CON roll, etc). Which means a knowledgeable Disease Master would be smart to command disease spirits to infect up to Serious (i.e. twice) and then move to another victim. Serious is tough enough, and reduces the opportunity the victim can defeat the spirit completely.

Of course, if someone else in the party helps; such as a Humakti who casts Truesword; and whacks the spirit to zero magic points, the helper gains the immunity and POW. Leaving the victim having to continue with the effects of those diseases.