Pavis & Big Rubble Companion: The Directors' Cut Relaunch

[AndrewTBP]

I agree with Richard S. that you don’t need stats for QW. For example, see Killer-Branduan Hodirson in Sartar: Kingdom of Heroes p. 295:

He is always at least Very High difficulty in a fight.
 

[Ian A. Thomson]

Location of Robcradle?

My brain/memory says that Robcradle ruins were originally officially around Yelmalio Hill, but I am looking at a Chaosium map currently, and it clearly has them marked on Cradlesnatch Island (which makes sense)

Right now is a really good time for me to choose which of those is reality in the P&BRC version

What do others think/believe?

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, Ian Thomson said:

Looking at the notes on the Jonstown Compendium, it says that HeroQuest stats are permitted in Jonstown publications. I had thought that I heard the exact opposite. That they are not permitted.

"HeroQuest" can mean a couple different versions, e.g. the original Hero Wars, HeroQuest 1st ed, HeroQuest 2nd ed, or HeroQuest Glorantha (the last being referred to as QuestWorlds).

From the JC Guidelines:

What rules can I use in my product for the Jonstown Compendium?

Your work can use any rules and setting materials from the books and materials published by Chaosium:

• RuneQuest Roleplaying in Glorantha
• RuneQuest Classic
• HeroQuest Glorantha
• QuestWorlds SRD

And:

Can I create and sell content for previous editions of the RuneQuest or HeroQuest Roleplaying Games?

The Jonstown Compendium accepts content designed for RuneQuest Roleplaying in Glorantha, RuneQuest Classic (RuneQuest 2^nd Edition), HeroQuest Glorantha, and QuestWorlds. If you have created something for a different edition that you want to use with a Jonstown Compendium product, you must update it to one of these approved rulesets.

---------------------

So if you have stats from HW or HQ1, you will need to convert to HQG or the QuestWorlds SRD.  Which might not be a lot, but you have to assess that.

[jajagappa]

9 minutes ago, Ian Thomson said:

Location of Robcradle?

Ogre Island.  (Which is what's shown on the map in Pavis: Gateway to Adventure)

However, going back to the original Big Rubble map, that shows the Robcradle Walls as around Yelmalio Hill. 

Perhaps both were used?

Edited March 14, 2022 by jajagappa

[JRE]

Robcradle was a relatively big place, so both could be true. A cradle snatching set up on the river, and a cradle processing center in Yelmalio hill. Moving a cradle from one to the other would require something like Corfu's watchdog in the original size.

[Ian A. Thomson]

4 hours ago, JRE said:

Robcradle was a relatively big place, so both could be true. A cradle snatching set up on the river, and a cradle processing center in Yelmalio hill. Moving a cradle from one to the other would require something like Corfu's watchdog in the original size.

My understanding until today was that the settlement was on Yelmalio Hill and the Cradle processing facilities on Robcradle Island. But it suits my Glorantha to have it all on Cradle Island. So if there are two versions officially I may change mine to all be the one where Robcradle was on Cradle island. Makes sense defensively and all

[Ian A. Thomson]

On 3/12/2022 at 12:07 AM, svensson said:

OK, because I'm a little bit lazy and didn't read all 6 pages of this thread [Bad, svensson, BAD!], I'm gonna ask what is probably a dumb question...

Is this going to be an update of Prax to 1625, or updating the RQ2 material of 1610-15 to RQG rules?

Either way, I'm buying the product about 45 seconds after I'm aware that it's available.

There's the prequel Guide (Vol 01) and Campaign Backdrop/Scenario (Vol 02) both set in 894ST. Then we jump to 1619ST and start a campaign that runs until 1624ST, so good timing in connecting into the new official stuff. :) 

[svensson]

36 minutes ago, Ian Thomson said:

There's the prequel Guide (Vol 01) and Campaign Backdrop/Scenario (Vol 02) both set in 894ST. Then we jump to 1619ST and start a campaign that runs until 1624ST, so good timing in connecting into the new official stuff. 🙂

Sounds VERY good!

I'm looking forward to seeing the final product. Is there a possibility of it being available POD, or will it just be a pdf?

[Brian Duguid]

1 hour ago, svensson said:

I'm looking forward to seeing the final product. Is there a possibility of it being available POD, or will it just be a pdf?

As with anything on Jonstown Compendium, POD is only normally possible if each product passes 250 sales on PDF, and not guaranteed even then.

[Nick Brooke]

18 hours ago, Ian Thomson said:

There are extensive HQ rules across the Companion series as it stands now, and I am about to start the edit/delete process. For instance I have extensive HQ notes on how to run the troll contests, and wonder if I should just delete them.

If I were you, unless you’re familiar with HeroQuest 2e rules, I’d just delete them. QuestWorlds titles are among the site’s worst sellers (with one notable exception, now removed from sale), most of our customers are looking for RuneQuest material, and HQ2 works very differently to HW/HQ1 (which aren’t allowed on the Jonstown Compendium).

[g33k]

4 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

If I were you, unless you’re familiar with HeroQuest 2e rules, I’d just delete them. QuestWorlds titles are among the site’s worst sellers (with one notable exception, now removed from sale), most of our customers are looking for RuneQuest material, and HQ2 works very differently to HW/HQ1 (which aren’t allowed on the Jonstown Compendium).

Hey @Nick Brooke:  shouldn't HQ be removed as an "Approved" rule-set?  I mean, yes the HQG content can be used, but not by that name.  Right?  In particular, anything using "HQ" rules should be referred to as using QW rules...  Because Chaosium gives formal approval (and gets revenue from) the JC, and legal-BS IP somethingsomething Lawyers.

Or do I misunderstand?

[Ian A. Thomson]

4 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

If I were you, unless you’re familiar with HeroQuest 2e rules, I’d just delete them. QuestWorlds titles are among the site’s worst sellers (with one notable exception, now removed from sale), most of our customers are looking for RuneQuest material, and HQ2 works very differently to HW/HQ1 (which aren’t allowed on the Jonstown Compendium).

Thanks Nick. That clears it up for me then. Very grateful for the assistance of all on this discussion group. Really helps with the workload of things to manage!!! :)

[Ian A. Thomson]

4 minutes ago, g33k said:

Hey @Nick Brooke:  shouldn't HQ be removed as an "Approved" rule-set?  I mean, yes the HQG content can be used, but not by that name.  Right?  In particular, anything using "HQ" rules should be referred to as using QW rules...  Because Chaosium gives formal approval (and gets revenue from) the JC, and legal-BS IP somethingsomething Lawyers.

Or do I misunderstand?

For me also the languaging was confusing, so I second that it could possibly be clarified for people like me who are not fluent with what it all means

[g33k]

23 hours ago, Ian Thomson said:

OK, yes that's what I had heard about QW

There are extensive HQ rules across the Companion series as it stands now, and I am about to start the edit/delete process. For instance I have extensive HQ notes on how to run the troll contests, and wonder if I should just delete them

Mind you, probably the easiest answer is to delete them from the re-release series, and then just include them all as an optional-extra pdf per volume. Then anyone who wants them has that option

Thanks for the info

Chaosium has explicitly sold the "HeroQuest" name, (tm) rights, etc.

Instead, use "QuestWorlds."

If your existing HQ content is from HQ1e, there will be a bit of work updating it to QW; but not, IMHO, all *that* much.  OTOH, @Nick Brooke reports that there isn't currently all that much demand on the JC for HQ/QW content, so...

On the gripping hand, there may be a chicken-and-egg problem, where people aren't buying it because they aren't playing it because there's none to buy...

[Ian A. Thomson]

8 hours ago, Brian Duguid said:

As with anything on Jonstown Compendium, POD is only normally possible if each product passes 250 sales on PDF, and not guaranteed even then.

I am considering resetting the margins so that you can take the pdf to the local big stationery store (Officeworks in Australia), and have them print, and bind it with a nice card back cover and a transparent front cover. I've done this before with pdfs and it works excellently. Pretty much turns them into books. It's proving tricky though, as the template background keeps shifting and leaving blank areas when I try this, so if anyone is a Word guru out there and can help me with this please shout out! :)

[Ian A. Thomson]

3 minutes ago, g33k said:

Chaosium has explicitly sold the "HeroQuest" name, (tm) rights, etc.

Instead, use "QuestWorlds."

If your existing HQ content is from HQ1e, there will be a bit of work updating it to QW; but not, IMHO, all *that* much.  OTOH, @Nick Brooke reports that there isn't currently all that much demand on the JC for HQ/QW content, so...

On the gripping hand, there may be a chicken-and-egg problem, where people aren't buying it because they aren't playing it because there's none to buy...

I think as I delete it all from the main volumes, just creating a loosely formatted pdf of 'HeroQuest 01 Stats for the P&BR Companion series' is the way to go. Then at some point I make it available free, or have someone convert it all to QW and release it as an extra for the series at a small cost (since it will contain spoilers!)

Edited March 15, 2022 by Ian Thomson

[jajagappa]

2 hours ago, g33k said:

there isn't currently all that much demand on the JC for HQ/QW content, so...

If you have a RuneQuest-related module, converting it to HQG/QW is so trivial that there's no reason to do it.  I've translated scenarios such as the old RQ3 Sun County Harvest Bride into HQG/QW without having to do anything other than follow the storyline and figure out what resistance I wanted to use.

[Nick Brooke]

8 hours ago, g33k said:

Hey @Nick Brooke:  shouldn't HQ be removed as an "Approved" rule-set?  I mean, yes the HQG content can be used, but not by that name.  Right?  In particular, anything using "HQ" rules should be referred to as using QW rules...  Because Chaosium gives formal approval (and gets revenue from) the JC, and legal-BS IP somethingsomething Lawyers.

Or do I misunderstand?

In the unlikely event you’re writing for the-game-formerly-known-as-HeroQuest, just call it QuestWorlds. You can reference pages in the HeroQuest: Glorantha rulebook, and that’s the version of the game supported on the Jonstown Compendium (plus the QuestWorlds SRD, 🤷‍♂️). It’s not ideal, but it seems to be workable, and it’s not as if many people are writing for it.

The “legal BS” I leave to our lawyers. Don’t call your book a “HeroQuest” book, and we should all get along just fine without pissing off the boardgame folk.

If you cock up, we’ll advise you of what needs to be changed, and may remove your title from sale until necessary edits (e.g. “for HeroQuest read QuestWorlds throughout”) can be made to the title and its listing. If you cock up egregiously, we may have to remove you from the programme.

Please don’t hesitate to reach out with any specific concerns, examples, etc. My email address is below. I strongly recommend reading the Jonstown Compendium FAQ before wasting my time with niggling hypotheticals.

Edited March 16, 2022 by Nick Brooke

[davecake]

On 3/2/2022 at 4:54 PM, Kloster said:

IIRC, a human can not speak Auld Wyrmish higher than 25% (although I play the score can be higher, but only for understanding, not for speaking), but there is no limitation for humans on written form.

Yes, correct. The Auld Wyrmish spoken and written forms are very different! Not only do humans find spoken Auld Wyrmish impossible to learn above 25% without surgery, written Auld Wyrmish is not actually used by dragonnewts, just by other races with an interest in draconic thought (very rare outside the EWF).

so yes, Pavis (and other EWF ) sorcery will use Auld Wyrmish. 

[Ian A. Thomson]

On 3/17/2022 at 2:54 AM, davecake said:

Yes, correct. The Auld Wyrmish spoken and written forms are very different! Not only do humans find spoken Auld Wyrmish impossible to learn above 25% without surgery, written Auld Wyrmish is not actually used by dragonnewts, just by other races with an interest in draconic thought (very rare outside the EWF).

so yes, Pavis (and other EWF ) sorcery will use Auld Wyrmish. 

I remember discussions from way back when, about languages, and somebody (not me) came up with the excellent (I thought) idea that the EWF would have developed a whole new language based on Heortling of course, but with new concepts, and ideas, and continuing to unfold, and that this would have been known as 'New Wyrmish', and be the root language on which Pavic is based. (And has been utterly abandoned and forgotten everywhere else in the world.) So in my Glorantha the common language of the EWF and of Pavis City at that time is New Wyrmish.

And yes Auld Wyrmish (possibly just known as Wyrmish at that time don't forget, since it's not yet 'auld') would be reserved for sorcerers and mystics

[Ian A. Thomson]

Quick question. I'm a big hardcopy fan, especially when gaming. So much more relaxing for me to glance through a book rather than scroll through a pdf.

So in the companions I will have extensive references to the original material (it is a series of 'Companions' after all). And these will be to important information that I may very briefly summaries, but in many case all the juice and detail will be in the originals

I will be choosing a set of originals to give page references too, and just saw that the original boxed sets can be ordered as softback books. Whereas it seems as if the Moon Designs book is no longer available as POD or any other form of hardcopy? Can somebody please confirm that as I am about to select my source for the page references and start placing them in the series as I format it

[Edit: Now Confirmed]

Cheers

Edited March 19, 2022 by Ian Thomson

[Ian A. Thomson]

On 3/15/2022 at 10:47 AM, jajagappa said:

Ogre Island.  (Which is what's shown on the map in Pavis: Gateway to Adventure)

However, going back to the original Big Rubble map, that shows the Robcradle Walls as around Yelmalio Hill. 

Perhaps both were used?

I think I will go with the main settlement being on Yelmalio Hill (Middle and upper class) and a smaller (working class) residential area (where the workers lived and the stolen goods were stored) on Robcradle Island

Like all the scientists and big wigs lived in big mansions on Yelmalio Hill, and the hoi poloi lived in tenements in Robcradle island, south of the processing facilities around the basher

[g33k]

I had always presumed that the actual *equipment* (cranes, chains, etc (all enchanted; and other magical bits, too)) to stop the Cradles, and take them out of the river, were there on the island.  The name Robcradle is what the Giants said about that place, right? 

It makes good sense for there to be another site for looting the removed cradles, investigating what's found, VIP residences & laboratories, etc.

 

Edited March 18, 2022 by g33k

[Austin]

5 hours ago, Ian Thomson said:

I will be choosing a set of originals to give page references too, and just saw that the original boxed sets can be ordered as softback books. Whereas it seems as if the Moon Designs book is no longer available as POD or any other form of hardcopy?

As far as I know, this is accurate. The PDF of Moon Design's "Glorantha Classics" series is available, but the most accessible physical copies are the "RuneQuest Classics" softcovers. That's the editions I have on my own shelf.

[Brian Duguid]

1 hour ago, Crel said:

As far as I know, this is accurate. The PDF of Moon Design's "Glorantha Classics" series is available, but the most accessible physical copies are the "RuneQuest Classics" softcovers. That's the editions I have on my own shelf.

Yep. Rick has explained elsewhere the amount of work required to convert the Moon Design Classics series from screen-readable PDF to print-suitable PDF, and that they won't be doing it given that 99% of the material is available in the original RQ Classics anyway. So @Ian Thomson should definitely make references to the originals.

I'm not sure if Nick's Pavis books index will be of any assistance:

https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/299290/Tables-of-Contents--Pavis-Big-Rubble--River-of-Cradles&affiliate_id=1107865