Tips for running exciting combat in RuneQuest

[smiorgan]

This is a thread for collecting ideas and best practices for planning and running combat scenes in RQG.

Some games such as 13th Age or, in a different way, Mythras are more explicit about building good combat scenes. RQ is a bit less focused but certainly has a lot of tools at its disposal.

Guidance for the thread: don't post complex house rules. Tips about creative use of existing mechanics or about "forgetting" rules for the sake of pace are ok though.

Let's start with something:

1. Roll Passions for enemy morale.

[David Scott]

1 hour ago, smiorgan said:

1. Roll Passions for enemy morale.

0. Decide motivations of enemy group, ascertain if they will: fight to the death, press the advantage, fall back, rout, surrender. when not obvious go to 1.

[Darius West]

3 hours ago, smiorgan said:

Let's start with something:

1.  Motivate the player characters.  Help the players invest emotionally in the conflict and play their characters and their place in the world.  Only in wars or very dangerous places do fights "just happen" because different groups are about in the same place.

2. Work out the motives of their enemies.  Why are they there?  What do they want?  Are they actually enemies?

3.  Work out the tactics and responses of the enemies.

4.  Terrain/Setting.  The environment itself needs to have character.  There is often advantage to choosing and keeping a certain piece of ground.  Winners generally know how to use the terrain, and Sun Tzu has much to say about it, both literally and metaphorically if you need a quick primer.

5. GM's need to help players set the scene in their minds and describe things somewhat cinematically.  The sights, the sounds, the smells, the effects of blows etc.  Their language shouldn't be overly flowery and their descriptions should aim for brevity, accuracy and emotional impact, a terse journalistic to-and-fro of battle narrative so that everything is said to adequately paint the picture without slowing down the flow of the fight.

6.  Where possible, train the players making an attack to roll 2d10+1d20+weapon damage dice+damage modifier die altogether so that you as GM only have to roll the defensive choice of the enemy.

[PhilHibbs]

Don't overdo enemy magic. In my opinion (and there are others available) magic should be one of the things that differentiates PCs from NPCs. This will help speed up the mechanics and give you less to think about.

By all means factor in a few points of Protection if you feel that they have had time to prepare before round 1, but beware of escalation whereby the only hit that can hurt is a crit that kills. Build their core stats to be the level of threat that you want, without having to change things on the fly with who-cast-what-when.

Incoming disruptions, demoralize, etc. should appear occasionally, and talk up the visuals and the danger.

Rune magic cast at PCs should be more rare than PCs casting at enemies - it's very tempting to think that as you are only going to use these NPCs once, then they might as well unload all their Rune Points. You might not have any further need for it after the encounter, but they might.

By keeping down the level of enemy magic, you can then occasionally use it for dramatic effect.

As I said, this is my personal style. Others doubtless run things differently so find your own comfort zone and build on it as you gain fluency with the system.

[PhilHibbs]

As to the permitted minimal mention of house rules: I'm seriously considering throwing out the over-100%-rule. I think I prefer the higher special and critical chances, and it involves less calculating (especially those chances) on the fly. On the other hand, it does mean that one of the participants has super easy crit and special calculations, being at exactly 100%...

[Kloster]

1 hour ago, PhilHibbs said:

As to the permitted minimal mention of house rules: I'm seriously considering throwing out the over-100%-rule. I think I prefer the higher special and critical chances, and it involves less calculating (especially those chances) on the fly.

Completely agree. This is what I do. Players love criticals (so do I), and very much dislike having their critical chances reduced to 5% or less.

[Shiningbrow]

3 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

As to the permitted minimal mention of house rules: I'm seriously considering throwing out the over-100%-rule. I think I prefer the higher special and critical chances, and it involves less calculating (especially those chances) on the fly. On the other hand, it does mean that one of the participants has super easy crit and special calculations, being at exactly 100%...

I've mentioned this previously, but I think this should be a choice, justified as -a) doing everything you can to ensure a really good hit (special or crit) and hope the opponent doesn't parry (keep over 100%, parry at normal), or b) do a lot of feinting, dodging, etc to draw the opponent's defences to get in any hit (reduce to 100%, reduce parry %).

[icebrand]

This is gonna be long, so stay a while and listen!

-----

1 - Scenery, scenery, scenery. (Where are you fighting?)

GET GOOD AT DESCRIBING LOCALES. This is accomplished by stealing from novels, but dont use Tolkien, he takes 25k words to describe a room. Burroughs, Howard and Salgari are my go-tos. 

So lets say you want the fight in a cave, but you already did that in muriahs revenge, and then in rainbow mounds, and then in that 5e starting adventure you adapted before finding out they shamelessly stole muriahs revenge map and you would have at least changed it a bit...

Now even a well-descript cave seems boring, we did that already!

In this case just add a (or a few) environmental mechanics (Aka make the players use STATx5 or a skill or even a rune or something)

Imagine the cave has an boiling stream you can knockback people into... 

But wait! The stream also has a geiser...

1st (and every) round he ground is slippery, DEX x5 to not fall down and make a fool of yourself.

On every 2nd round theres fumes and stuff that build up, giving some darkness penalty! Also if you fell down You can't clear the area you take 1d6 general HP due to searing steam.

3rd round(s) it erupts, launching boiling hot water (use a template in your map) that can be maneuvered / dodged / enemies thrown into it (otherwise you eat 2d6 boiling water damage to a location)

Oh, also you can have a boiling water elemental!!! NEAT!

OF COURSE you can always add some stalagmites for cover (and impaling enemies you grapple) and also stalactites you can attack so they fall on your enemies!!! 

Goes without saying you have unlimited rocks to throw...

I just came up with all these while writing, i just add stuff like this all the time (though this example is very loaded, only good for a boss fight or when the ambient mechanics are the highlight of the fight instead of enemies).

Advanced: change locales!!!

In our cave example, a floor section might have low HP and be destructible. Fighters that fall down are now in a caldera room with burning lava and fumes. They start rolling asphyxiation while fighting, plus theres a ton of maneuvers they can try now.

-----

So, now you have this amazing geotermal cave, or this canyon with sweeping condors, or this jungle with swarms of chaos bees and vines you can swing to places; we are just missing...

THE FIGHT ITSELF

Seriously dude, RQ is the easiest (and best) for this!!! Every attack and parry tells you a bit of the story, your job is to make it *AMAZING*

Here i just steal from salgari fights, which are savage and gritty. Tarzan is also SUPER good for unarmed since his combats are primal and beyond brutal!

Howard has excelent monster fights, but human v human combat is less exciting; Conan, who learnt how to (fight/climb/cook/skate/Javascript) before even walking usually effortlessly slaughters mostly everyone unless theres something ese going on.

Of course you can steal from any author you want!

-----

Well, hope it helps!

Edited May 4, 2022 by icebrand

[Rodney Dangerduck]

7 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

I'm seriously considering throwing out the over-100%-rule

It's worth considering.  One issue you run into is that a fighter with 100% parry skill and Earth shield becomes close to invulnerable.  (There are ways...)

Edited May 4, 2022 by Rodney Dangerduck

[DreadDomain]

On 5/5/2022 at 12:23 AM, Shiningbrow said:

I've mentioned this previously, but I think this should be a choice, justified as -a) doing everything you can to ensure a really good hit (special or crit) and hope the opponent doesn't parry (keep over 100%, parry at normal), or b) do a lot of feinting, dodging, etc to draw the opponent's defences to get in any hit (reduce to 100%, reduce parry %).

or c) try to overwhelm your opponent by splitting your attack and striking them multiple times.

a) strong, powerful offensive

b) mobile, feinting offensive

c) quick, multiple attacks 

Edited May 13, 2022 by DreadDomain

[Dr. Devici]

8 hours ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

It's worth considering.  One issue you run into is that a fighter with 100% parry skill and Earth shield becomes close to invulnerable.  (There are ways...)

I also scrapped the adjustments for skills over 100%, and also considered that it was a pretty big boost to earth shield. I settled on it being a feature, not a bug. I cannot say that it has bothered me.

15 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

Rune magic cast at PCs should be more rare than PCs casting at enemies - it's very tempting to think that as you are only going to use these NPCs once, then they might as well unload all their Rune Points. You might not have any further need for it after the encounter, but they might.

As an extension of this, it's worth keeping in mind that your NPCs are supposed to represent agents in the broader world who do not want to be hurt or killed, or needlessly expend resources. Forcing a rout or surrender resolves faster and feels better than dragging a combat to total annihilation.

[Darius West]

22 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

Don't overdo enemy magic. In my opinion (and there are others available) magic should be one of the things that differentiates PCs from NPCs. This will help speed up the mechanics and give you less to think about.

For my money it is crucial to have your NPCs use primarily the spirit spells that their cult teaches, with perhaps another few points of non-standard magic purchased from shamans etc.  This approach helps lend cults a certain series of regular responses which are in keeping with their place in the ecology, and makes them a bit predictable without making them utterly predictable.  As a rule of thumb, I suggest 1 point of Spirit magic per 10% weapon skill for an initiate, and Rune Levels have their whole CHA filled.

As to using RP, it is really all about the situation.  Most NPCs will use Heal Self if they aren't killed by a single blow, but most NPCs are low initiate level and will only have 3RP tops.  Rune Levels are supposed to be scary and should be scary to face in combat; they didn't get where they are by not recognizing a threat.

18 hours ago, icebrand said:

This is gonna be long, so stay a while and listen!

This was a good comment btw.  Long, but def the sort of thing I would point a new GM at.

[Darius West]

So... Here's an ugly question...

NPCs get Divine Intervention?  Yea or Nay?

I definitely fall in the Yea camp.  It creates a sense of continuity in the world when the players recognize an NPC they had fought previously, but who D.I.-ed out of the situation when it went bad for them.  Obviously this encounter doesn't happen the next session (unless it needs to), and might take any turn the GM needs it to.  IMO recurring NPCs and players' interactions with them are crucial to making any RPG setting work.

[Shiningbrow]

24 minutes ago, Darius West said:

So... Here's an ugly question...

NPCs get Divine Intervention?  Yea or Nay?

I definitely fall in the Yea camp.  It creates a sense of continuity in the world when the players recognize an NPC they had fought previously, but who D.I.-ed out of the situation when it went bad for them.  Obviously this encounter doesn't happen the next session (unless it needs to), and might take any turn the GM needs it to.  IMO recurring NPCs and players' interactions with them are crucial to making any RPG setting work.

As long as it's legit - sure!

[Shiningbrow]

13 hours ago, DreadDomain said:

or c) try to overwhelm your opponent by splitting your attack and striking they multiple times.

a) strong, powerful offensive

b) mobile, feinting offensive

c) quick, multiple attacks 

Good call!

How do you split yours? Down the middle? Or can the player choose any combination (like a feint)?

[PhilHibbs]

37 minutes ago, Darius West said:

So... Here's an ugly question...

NPCs get Divine Intervention?  Yea or Nay?

Only rune levels, and only if the alternative is death or the failure of a mission that they consider critical. Again, it's easy for the GM to treat the NPC's POW as being expendable as they are only going to use the NPC once. I don't want to use it as a way to just deny the players a win. I did that once and have regretted it ever since.

Edited May 5, 2022 by PhilHibbs

[icebrand]

1 hour ago, Darius West said:

So... Here's an ugly question...

NPCs get Divine Intervention?  Yea or Nay?

Yeah but...

In my glorantha *most* people arent initiates but lay members.

Initiates are actually chosen by the god (only they dont know it), usually have 1-5RP and wont DI unless they are a named chatacter.

RPs will DI with 10-100% chance (i make them use RP beforehand, 10%/point as per RQ2).

RLs will always DI, but if they are unnamed they only ask for GTFO or full heal (depending how the fight is going).

Named RLs have all the perks of an adventurer, and can ask their god for stuff as a PC would.

By the way i run DI like this: you roll, and if you fail nothing happens. If you succeed you remove the RP/POW, and then your god appears before you in all their might and asks you what is it that you want.

Time is stopped for everyone else (of course you can't move or anything, only your god is outside time, but you can petition and briefly interact with them)

The god will pretty much give you what you want (with the usual restriccions). They are your buddy but they can and will get offended if they consider the ID frivolous or the petition goes against their values

PS: CHAOS shouldn't get DI, change my mind

Edited May 5, 2022 by icebrand

[Kloster]

22 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

I've mentioned this previously, but I think this should be a choice, justified as -a) doing everything you can to ensure a really good hit (special or crit) and hope the opponent doesn't parry (keep over 100%, parry at normal), or b) do a lot of feinting, dodging, etc to draw the opponent's defences to get in any hit (reduce to 100%, reduce parry %).

I would do it by allowing the attacker to get a malus of his choice, whatever his original score, representing feints and maneuvers, and applying said malus to the defender. Of course, the defender could also do it and final malus is the sum of both. But this is not automatic, and not linked to the 100% score. Of course, you can not do it if you are below 5%, because in that case, any malus would not change your chance of success.

15 hours ago, DreadDomain said:

try to overwhelm your opponent by splitting your attack

RAW, if you split versus someone higher than 100%, you lower more your chances than his.

[French Desperate WindChild]

2 hours ago, Kloster said:

I would do it by allowing the attacker to get a malus of his choice, whatever his original score

i'm not and you are fencing expert (or anything you want) but my first reaction was

yes but no.

should a fighter have a good level to learn feint ? I mean you must know the basics before trying complex technics, etc..

that drives me to something like

under x0% (60% ?) you cannot do anything

between x0% et x1% (75% ? 80% ?) you can choose a malus with a maximum of 20% (you have learnt the first "special" technics)

between x1% et x2% (90% ? 100% ?) you can choose a malus with a maximum of 40% (you have learnt more complex technics)

more than x2%, you are a master and you can choose a malus of your choice

same for defense. After all you may choose some postures (hope it is the good word) to reduce your opponent attacks

does it make sense ?

 

another mathematical question...

did someone simulate / evaluate if a fight with the "over 100% rule" is faster than the same fight(opponents) without it (so more crit)

I m pretty sure that the "over 100% rule" is faster in most of cases (armor, weapon, skills) but that is just feeling, no proof

 

[Jason Farrell]

7 hours ago, Darius West said:

NPCs get Divine Intervention?  Yea or Nay?

 

I would say yes, but not by roll, but rather just as narrative needs dictate (like if a character who is meant to play a major role in future events is otherwise going to be killed, and the GM doesn't have or doesn't want to create a suitable replacement)

[Kloster]

4 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

i'm not and you are fencing expert (or anything you want) but my first reaction was

yes but no.

should a fighter have a good level to learn feint ? I mean you must know the basics before trying complex technics, etc..

that drives me to something like

under x0% (60% ?) you cannot do anything

between x0% et x1% (75% ? 80% ?) you can choose a malus with a maximum of 20% (you have learnt the first "special" technics)

between x1% et x2% (90% ? 100% ?) you can choose a malus with a maximum of 40% (you have learnt more complex technics)

more than x2%, you are a master and you can choose a malus of your choice

same for defense. After all you may choose some postures (hope it is the good word) to reduce your opponent attacks

does it make sense ?

If you want. It does make sense, I just feel it too cumbersome, but feel free to do it, it should work perfectly. I feel my rule simpler (but less good as yours).

4 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

I m pretty sure that the "over 100% rule" is faster in most of cases (armor, weapon, skills) but that is just feeling, no proof

Yes, of course, it is simpler and faster. But what I wanted to emphasized is the choice. What I don't like wit RAW is that it is automatic: You always reduce the highsest score to 100% and the lowest by the same score, lowering the crit to 5%. With my rule (and also with your proposal), you choose if you want to keep the high crit and special or if you want to reduce your opponent score.

By the way, even if I am (or more properly were) probably the best fencer here (considering the sheer low number of fencers worldwide, it is not very difficult with around 15 years of practice and competitions), that does not make me an expert on the matter, nor an expert in transfering techniques concepts in BRP concepts.

[French Desperate WindChild]

7 minutes ago, Kloster said:

Yes, of course, it is simpler and faster. But what I wanted to emphasized is the choice. What I don't like wit RAW is that it is automatic

i agree, so much that is not automatic 😛

 

8 minutes ago, Kloster said:

By the way, (...)

pas de fausse modestie, voyons

[Kloster]

4 minutes ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

pas de fausse modestie, voyons

No need. There is only 50 000 fencers in France (one of the largest world federations). That means 1 person in around 1500. With  than 3600 regular users on this forum, that means we are less than 3 fencers and 10 ex fencers here.

[icebrand]

6 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

should a fighter have a good level to learn feint ? I mean you must know the basics before trying complex technics, etc..

Judoka here. I have no clue about fencing but feinting in judo is a basic skill, not something complicated high level athletes do (and >100% should be Panam level at least)

Like, you start training renraku waza at white belt!

[DreadDomain]

10 hours ago, Kloster said:

I would do it by allowing the attacker to get a malus of his choice, whatever his original score, representing feints and maneuvers, and applying said malus to the defender. Of course, the defender could also do it and final malus is the sum of both. But this is not automatic, and not linked to the 100% score. Of course, you can not do it if you are below 5%, because in that case, any malus would not change your chance of success.

I would go one further and only allow reduction of 20% increment, so it's significant and meaningful and prevents people from playing the math. (for players who have their crit and special ranges noted on their sheet, it has the side benefit of neatly reducing your crit by 1% and special by 4% for each increment)

10 hours ago, Kloster said:

RAW, if you split versus someone higher than 100%, you lower more your chances than his.

Not all tactics are valid against all opponents for sure.