What's going on with RQG & Chaosium

[Dissolv]

12 hours ago, M Helsdon said:

19 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

(oddly, compare that to Arms & Armies of DP.... which is treated as virtually canon by Chaosium)

This is news to me.🙂

Take heart!  I certainly treat it that way, especially when miniatures purchasing and painting for Glorantha.

[RandomNumber]

13 hours ago, g33k said:

n.b. you seem to be conflating the set of rules for the Heroquest RPG (now called QuestWorlds, SRD-complete and approaching publication) with the Gloranthan in-character activity called "heroquesting" (for which no canonical rules have yet been published, only JC and other fan/unofficial content).

We are expecting heroquesting rules for RQG in the upcoming GMs' book; these will not be rules for the HQ/QW RPG.

I do not think the prior material in this thread was intended to reference the HQ/QW RPG, but the in-character activity.

Not at all actually. I intend no reference to the separate RPG or boardgame.  My reference was to the rules for Heroquesting as an extension of RQG. An earlier poster in this thread suggested that there might be publications that have scenarios for regular RQG and heroquesting together and what a great thing that would be.  My observation was that a scenario book that requires the purchaser to have both the RQG rules and (I assumed) the RQG heroquesting rules book will have a smaller target market than one that requires the purchaser to have only the RQG rules.  No more, no less than that.

Someone then pointed out that the heroquest rules will be a chapter in the GM book.  Which was in turn clarified by @Steve referring to a post showing that heroquest rules were at one point intended to be a standalone publication and a chapter in the GM's book. Either way, my original point remains, albeit it was a very small one - the more prerequisites there are to make full use of a product, the smaller the addressable market for the product.

The swing factor will likely be many of the people in this forum, like myself, who will buy all Chaosium's RQG output anyway because we have huge admiration for the love and care Chaosium are showing for Glorantha and RQ. 

[Joerg]

25 minutes ago, RandomNumber said:

My observation was that a scenario book that requires the purchaser to have both the RQG rules and (I assumed) the RQG heroquesting rules book will have a smaller target market than one that requires the purchaser to have only the RQG rules. 

This is possibly the fiirst time I see this discussion applied to roleplaying games (it is a quite common complaint with boardgames that come with modula expansions).

However, this isn't the first time RuneQuest has been running into that problem. When the 3rd edition was sold to Avalon Hill, a decision was made to divide the rules into a standard edition and a GM box as well as a "DeLuxe" edition that had all the content from those boxes. The subsequent scenario releases then included sections which explained spells and possibly other elements that weren't covered by the standard rules box.

In a way, RQG  might be seen as in a similar situation now, with the Starter Set rules providng only a selection of the full rules, but I doubt that we are going to see extra pages of rules explanations to users of the Starter Set in future releases. I won't exclude the possibility of add-on pdfs with such info if there is a significant target audience with the Starter Set only, but who would produces those?

And, in a way there already is a budget version of the  Cults Book with the Red Book of Magic.offering all the rulesy bits.

 

[Kloster]

On 6/17/2022 at 8:57 PM, AndreJarosch said:

You would not include a HQ in your RQ game?
Or do you only not like to be part of a HQ when you are a PLAYER?

I'm not Bill, but my answer to your question would be: Both.

[Orlanthatemyhamster]

On 6/17/2022 at 12:00 AM, Jason Farrell said:

What's disingenuous is to misquote me.  I wrote that there has been no cults book for this edition.  And there hasn't been.  You really think players and GM's should have to find information in White Wolf and supplements from 40 years ago?  And then adapt it to the current rules?   I don't agree.

The rest of your response is just disrespectful, for no reason I can readily see.  If the short form write-ups and Orlanth is plenty for you, that's nice.  It's not for me, and I don't think it is for a lot of other Runequest fans.

I'm sorry, You are right. There Have been no long form for this edition, but Chaosium say [and pretty much everybody agrees] that the New edition was, by design, close enough so that the Old RQ2 and 3 cults needed little to no tweaking to be fully compatible with RQ:G

All you need do is to go to the Chaosium site and have a look at the products there. Almost all of the long form cults that have been produced By C over the years are available there. In PDF if nothing else. And a great collection it is.

Orlanth and his associate cults [just the spells they give him] provide everything you could ever want from a god, really, any of the blind spots could be filled in with skills. You can play a bookish Orlanth, a berserking Orlanthi, a thievish Orlanth, a charming Orlanthi, a steadfast Warrior Orlanth [in fact one character could play them all, in turn if they wanted, he's that bloody versatile] pick a character type he can do it.

Disrespectful to who? I'm sorry I said 'You' when I meant 'One', but I'm wondering why you got so annoyed about me insulting a made up god?
I was pointing out his all round singing and dancing ability, not the dirtiness/or not of your bum.  

With Cults of Prax, which doesn't just deal with Prax incidentally, you have a bucket load of Long Form, for what? $12.95.

The cults book is going to set you back probably $200+postage and is seasons away. So, y'know.

[Orlanthatemyhamster]

On 6/17/2022 at 7:27 PM, soltakss said:

 

They will contradict a lot of Jonstown Compendium material and, for me as a GM, that is also great. I'll have two sets of material to use and can pick good ideas from both.

For example, the HeroQuesting material will be very different from mine. If Chaosium redid Dorastor, it would be very different from mine.

HeroQuesting is different, it's not a place, but a rule system.

I doubt they will ever go back to Dorastor, they've shown absolutely no inclination so far, but if they did, you could always submit a manuscript. 🙂 

What is more likely [but still unlikely] is people covering stuff that Chaosium is going to/has already covered. Stuff like the timeline of the Hero Wars.

 

[svensson]

Folks, we're kind of beating the dead Sable here.

I posed a thread about this myself and so far @Jeff, @Nick Brooke, @Rick Meints and others have been clear and consistent:

- There is no rivalry between the Call of Cthulhu and RQG sides of the Chaosium 'house'. They Are All Us. CoC simply has a large backlog of artwork, handwaves, and text that they have to update... which is a lot easier than trying to write original material, as RQG is doing.

- The logjam is the Gods of Glorantha and Proserpaedia book set,

- Additional issues include artwork and converting Greg's concepts into a consistent mechanical form for play,

- Add to this the worldwide shipping and production issues.

Right now, Jonstown Compendium is carrying the torch while the RQ staff at Chaosium put in the crunch time. And what a good job they're doing of it, too! We do not lack for play materials. We have everything we need to keep a campaign, ANY campaign, going provided you keep things in Central Genertela. Sure, if you want to adventure in Ralios, Pamaltela, or Carmania, you're going to have to wait. These regions have always been 'outlier Glorantha' anyway, and there are greater priorities.

As I understand it, and I'm not guaranteeing that I'm 100% right, the upcoming projects for 2022-24 are:

- Gods of Glorantha /Proserpaedia

- Heroquesting 101

- An official Guide to the Lunar Empire.

In addition, there is long wish list of stuff that we fanboys have suggested, things like a Sorcery sourcebook.

But the at-the-end-of-the-day point is this: Chaosium is working on it. Hard. Some things are out of their control and they are doing their damnedest to manage those things that are in their control. Please be patient and have your money ready when you get to to the ticket booth 😉

Edited June 26, 2022 by svensson

[svensson]

So, @Jose what's confusing here?

I'm just a fan and customer like you are, but if I can explain anything I'd be happy to.

[jajagappa]

On 6/25/2022 at 9:45 AM, svensson said:

As I understand it, and I'm not guaranteeing that I'm 100% right, the upcoming projects for 2022-24 are:

- Gods of Glorantha /Proserpaedia

- Heroquesting 101

- An official Guide to the Lunar Empire.

You are missing the Dragon Pass Gazetteer, which was carved out of the Sartar set (now a book).

The Heroquesting material is planned for the GM Guide.

Steve's list here is, I believe, up-to-date based on Jason and/or Jeff's FB posts: 

 

[Jose]

On 6/26/2022 at 7:02 PM, svensson said:

So, @Jose what's confusing here?

I'm just a fan and customer like you are, but if I can explain anything I'd be happy to.

Nothing, is only that with the new policy of release pdf at the same time that physical copy this 2022 is going to be a blank year for RQ. Of course is Chaosium's problem not ours. I have just move to another game with my group, maybe in a couple of years we will give it another try. I am not an old timer so I am fine with that. 

[svensson]

41 minutes ago, Jose said:

Nothing, is only that with the new policy of release pdf at the same time that physical copy this 2022 is going to be a blank year for RQ. Of course is Chaosium's problem not ours. I have just move to another game with my group, maybe in a couple of years we will give it another try. I am not an old timer so I am fine with that. 

Well, there's plenty of Jonstown Compendium stuff for you to use as well.

And us old timers are fine with changing games, we're just a little more firm on the one we like 😉

[Soccercalle]

22 hours ago, Jose said:

Nothing, is only that with the new policy of release pdf at the same time that physical copy this 2022 is going to be a blank year for RQ. Of course is Chaosium's problem not ours. I have just move to another game with my group, maybe in a couple of years we will give it another try. I am not an old timer so I am fine with that. 

Well. My group is only playing RQG. So every yeat without new stuff is a lost year.

[soltakss]

51 minutes ago, Soccercalle said:

Well. My group is only playing RQG. So every yeat without new stuff is a lost year.

The last Gloranthan Campaign I ran lasted from 2002 to 2020. We didn't wait for new material, nor did we count any years as lost years. What I did was to write my own scenarios, use published scenarios or riff off what happened in sessions.

We started before Mongoose RQI came out, then had MRQI, MRQII, RQ6 and, finally, RuneQuest Glorantha come out. Of those, I used nothing for my scenarios, as they were either Second Age, which didn't fit, or had no scenarios. Had the Jonstown Compendium come out while I was running the campaign, I would have freely used things from it.

So, don't treat a year without a scenario or rules from Chaosium as a lost year, instead treat every year with new Jonstown Compendium or Chaosium supplements as a good year. Treat every year that you write and run a scenario as a good year. Treat every year that you play RuneQuest as a good year.

[Soccercalle]

3 hours ago, soltakss said:

The last Gloranthan Campaign I ran lasted from 2002 to 2020. We didn't wait for new material, nor did we count any years as lost years. What I did was to write my own scenarios, use published scenarios or riff off what happened in sessions.

We started before Mongoose RQI came out, then had MRQI, MRQII, RQ6 and, finally, RuneQuest Glorantha come out. Of those, I used nothing for my scenarios, as they were either Second Age, which didn't fit, or had no scenarios. Had the Jonstown Compendium come out while I was running the campaign, I would have freely used things from it.

So, don't treat a year without a scenario or rules from Chaosium as a lost year, instead treat every year with new Jonstown Compendium or Chaosium supplements as a good year. Treat every year that you write and run a scenario as a good year. Treat every year that you play RuneQuest as a good year.

You are of course right. There is a lot of good content out there. At the same time my campaign moves on with appr one game year every 3-4 ”real months”. That will take us to 1627 quite soon. We are playing a quite epic and political campaign and that makes it important to have source books about whats happening with Argrath and similar stuff. We can of course run 3-4 JC scenarios every game season (if there is not to much travel in them) but that will only slow down things a bit.

[Squaredeal Sten]

9 hours ago, Soccercalle said:

That will take us to 1627 quite soon. We are playing a quite epic and political campaign and that makes it important to have source books about whats happening with Argrath and similar stuff. ...

Buy King of Sartar.  No it isn't a book of playable scenarios, but it does tell what's going on with Argrath.

And while you're at it go to Jonstown Compendium and buy Black Spear.   It looks as though that will fit into your current period.

 

Edited July 3, 2022 by Squaredeal Sten
got rid of an unrelated screen shot

[svensson]

14 hours ago, Soccercalle said:

Well. My group is only playing RQG. So every yeat without new stuff is a lost year.

@Jose About 95% of the stuff on Jonstown IS RQG materials, and there's plenty to look at. Black Spear is good, so is @Nick Brooke's Sandheart series in Prax's Sun County. It's set earlier... about 1615 ST... but the rules are 100% RQG.

[Jeff]

17 hours ago, Soccercalle said:

Well. My group is only playing RQG. So every yeat without new stuff is a lost year.

Between the Guide to Glorantha, Glorantha Sourcebook, RQG, Bestiary, GM Pack, and Weapons and Equipment, you have much of the contours of the setting. The only two big missing pieces are Cults (in layout right now) and the RQ Campaign (Boy King equivalent, in writing - it took Greg over ten years to do it for Pendragon after all!). The Dragon Pass guide and Sartar Players Guide are both in late art, and then I pivot to get Prax, Big Rubble, and Pavis done. These are all big projects and nearing completion (the Cults Book is easily the biggest amount of new Gloranthan material since the Guide).

So there is an absolute ton of material. Meanwhile on FB I am regularly posting snippets of material. 

[Shiningbrow]

59 minutes ago, Jeff said:

The only two big missing pieces are...

I (and others) disagree.

The big "missing piece" (other than Cults) is Heroquesting rules. You know, the thing that's been talked about for more than 40 years.

I really only read this forum, and the Glorantha forum. I read regularly the call (demand) for HQ rules. I don't think I've ever read anyone demanding an RQ Campaign book (express support for - sure. But not complain because they don't have one).

[soltakss]

5 minutes ago, Shiningbrow said:

I really only read this forum, and the Glorantha forum. I read regularly the call (demand) for HQ rules. I don't think I've ever read anyone demanding an RQ Campaign book (express support for - sure. But not complain because they don't have one).

Unfortunately, we are a bit odd, on these forums, as a lot of people like HeroQuesting here.

Most people probably don't, which is something I can't really understand, so many GMs would prefer a big Campaign Pack.

Personally, I'd like both, now, with the Cults Book, now, but I understand why we can't have them all, now.

I have waited 40 years for HeroQuesting Rules and can wait another 40 years, if necessary. That sounds like a Proclaimers song: I can wait for 40 years and I can wait for 40 more ...

[Shiningbrow]

46 minutes ago, soltakss said:

Most people probably don't, which is something I can't really understand, so many GMs would prefer a big Campaign Pack.

I doubt that's actually true. I'd probably be more inclined to say that many people (especially new to the game and world) don't have much of a grip on it, and thus may be loathe to commit to it without some sort of easy introduction. Granted, HQs take a lot of work (both for the characters, and for the players and GM)  - lots of imagination and going outside the bounds of normal RPGs - because it does ramp up the power level a bit (some don't want that too fast), and because any rules are very basic frameworks, rather than full scenarios to run through.

But, given a good enough framework to work with, I think it's yet another thing that will set RQ apart from other games, and thus get in more people who are bored with the 3.5 encounters to level up model.

50 minutes ago, soltakss said:

Personally, I'd like both, now, with the Cults Book, now, but I understand why we can't have them all, now.

That goes without say 😛 And yes, I do understand that as well.

 

51 minutes ago, soltakss said:

I have waited 40 years for HeroQuesting Rules and can wait another 40 years, if necessary. That sounds like a Proclaimers song: I can wait for 40 years and I can wait for 40 more ...

I don't know about you, but I'll be dead long before then (40 years). And, given we have players who have hung on since their teens and 20s back in the 70s and 80s, quite possibly many of them won't be around then either.

Which takes me back to my original point - the priorities as they appear to be expressed. Putting HQ rules on the backburner yet again is somewhat of a slap in the face to the loyal and dedicated fans. (and before anyone jumps on my throat for that comment, it's purely in relation to the above posts. I am fully aware that these rules are being done and being put into a book (or 2) already, due for release within my lifetime... probably... maybe.... possibly....... even next year. But I'd be pissed to find out that the HQ rules have been de-prioritised for a campaign book).

[Nick Brooke]

5 hours ago, svensson said:

@Jose About 95% of the stuff on Jonstown IS RQG materials, and there's plenty to look at. Black Spear is good, so is @Nick Brooke's Sandheart series in Prax's Sun County. It's set earlier... about 1615 ST... but the rules are 100% RQG.

I'm just the layout guy: the Sandheart books are by @Incendiary Pig (Jonathan Webb) with @MOB (Michael O'Brien).

Happy to accept praise for Black Spear, although half of it should go to my brilliant artist Mike O'Connor.

[Agentorange]

1 hour ago, soltakss said:

: I can wait for 40 years and I can wait for 40 more ...

For the Heroquesting rules to be delivered to my door.......

[Agentorange]

On 7/2/2022 at 2:10 PM, Soccercalle said:

Well. My group is only playing RQG. So every yeat without new stuff is a lost year.

Well, remember YGMV, so make your own stuff up. So what if it gets contradicted by some official stuff later on - nick the bits you want ignore the rest, maybe your Glorantha wanders off in a different direction, who cares it's your game !

And inspiration lies everywhere I once ran a little RQ adventure that grew out of seeing a single Angus Mcbride illustration ( in all fairness it was non gloranthan ) but I'm sure you see my point.. There's some very evocative names on the map - make something up to explain if there isn't an explanation. As others have said the JC has some excellent stuff in there, from massive tomes to short PDF's loads of goodies to be snaffled. As to the illustration it was this one, i looked at it and thought what's going on here then....


 

Edited July 3, 2022 by Agentorange

[soltakss]

3 hours ago, Agentorange said:

Well, remember YGMV, so make your own stuff up. So what if it gets contradicted by some official stuff later on - nick the bits you want ignore the rest, maybe your Glorantha wanders of in a different direction, who cares it's your game !

This, for me, is important.

I typically have a third of my Campaigns using published scenarios, a third using my own scenarios and a third riffing off what has previously happened.

So, most of my Campaigns don't use published scenarios.

We play weekly, or at least we used to. So 52 weeks in a year means 17 weeks for published scenarios. At one per week, that is 17 scenarios per year, at two sessions per scenario that is 8 scenarios per year.

I can't remember how many Scenarios Chaosium have published over the last 2 years, but I am guessing it works out at nearly 8 per year.

Now, up to The Howling Tower, the Jonstown Compendium had published a massive 154 Scenarios. Even at one Scenario a week, that amounts to 3 years of gaming. Sure, some of it won't be in your gaming location and might not be suitable for every game, but it is still a huge amount to choose from.

I am always surprised when people don't buy Jonstown Compendium, or other material, because it isn't Chaosium. Of course it isn't, and that is good. It is not constrained by the things that constrain Chaosium, it has a lot more people writing for it, and doesn't always need to worry about producing print versions or shipping from across the world.