So when is "Title" coming out?

[g33k]

Over in the RQ subforum, the recent thread about the GM's book has been closed.
Unsurprising to most of us, I expect, as Chaosium's policy (on setting release dates in advance) is pretty well known... 😏

Also well known to most of us, I expect, is the fan-collected "Upcoming Glorantha publications" thread in this forum:
https://basicroleplaying.org/topic/16076-upcoming-glorantha-publications/

This is a plea to Chaosium, really:
(maybe specifically to @David Scott?)
Please don't put this on the fans, and random drops on whatever social media a particular Chaosium team-member "happens" to be logged into when the mood strikes.

This info -- at least for the projects that are well-advanced into the pipeline -- should really be managed by Chaosium, and placed on the Chaosium.com website, on a "Coming Soon" page or the like.

Fans who don't have Facebook, or Twitter, or don't visit BRPC... 1st-timers, new-to-RQ folks, etc...  these are people who really want to know this stuff -- and Chaosium wants them to know it! -- but they are thwarted by the scattershot approach... sometimes on this channel, sometimes on that channel, sometimes as an "announcement" OP, sometimes buried deep in a thread (replying-to-a-reply), sometimes at a 'Con event, etc etc etc.

Title the page "It'll be done when it's done."
Put in bold at the top:
Due to many factors outside our control, these products -- although very close to production, in Chaosium's grand scheme of things -- are nevertheless not yet ready to for us to announce a release date:
Then put a thumbnail of art, or a cover-image, or what-have-you.  A working title, maybe a microblurb,

AND THE STATUS ...

e.g. (and please note, I am only guessing as these statuses) ...

Quote

Dragon Pass Atlas/Gazetteer
1st draft in editing.  Acquiring art.

Slipcase set: The Cults of Glorantha
(two volumes, hardback, 96 long cult write-ups plus another 40 or so minor cults); RuneQuest Prosopaedia (systemless overview of the deities, 128 pages)
Text Complete.  Art almost complete.  In layout.

Gamemaster Book (including heroquesting rules)
1st draft almost complete

Sartar Book
1st draft almost complete

Chaosium Classics Volume I : The Stafford House Campaign

(A collection of Greg Stafford's RuneQuest Campaign Essays 1978-1981)
Draft complete.  In editing.  Acquiring art.

MIG III (The Meints Index to Glorantha publications, fully revised and updated)
Draft almost complete.  Acquiring rarities.  Upgrading to "cleaner" copies where possible.  In Layout.

Then, update the status whenever these change, and as people ask "When...." point them to this page.

 

Edited August 11, 2022 by g33k

[Scotty]

We are more than happy for a fan-maintained list to exist, but for info on upcoming releases, please subscribe to Ab Chaos, The Tome, and/or keep an eye on our news feed on Chaosium.com (it supports RSS too).

• To get Ab Chaos now, simply sign up to the newsletter with your email address, at the bottom of the Chaosium homepage!
• To get the Tome, click here http://eepurl.com/h6m3Ff (and receive a coupon for 10% off store-wide on your next purchase at Chaosium.com)
• Here's our news feed: https://www.chaosium.com/blog/
• Here's the RSS link: https://www.chaosium.com/rss.php?action=newblogs&type=atom

You are welcome to add any info you have gleaned from the many places across web and in real life to the fan thread: https://basicroleplaying.org/topic/16076-upcoming-glorantha-publications/ thread. @Steve does a great job maintaining this. 

19 hours ago, g33k said:

e.g. (and please note, I am only guessing as these statuses) ...

Then, update the status whenever these change, and as people ask "When...." point them to this page.

I really don't know the statuses of these projects. It's not practically possible for me to maintain such a list as I don't know what was said at an event, or didn't see the post. For example, Jason went through 20+ projects at a convention last Saturday (to 12 people), he'll likely do the same at a convention this weekend that I'm not attending, and I wasn't at Gen Con. I don't take notes as I already know about them, and usually have no idea of their actual status (and it's not my job to announce whatever it is). I'm sure you can understand why I don't want to be hassling team members for info or for them to be updating me. For an overview check our news feed.

As Rick Meint's says:

We at the Chaosium usually announce a book's definitive premier in the product lineup when layout of the final manuscript has begun. We have numerous books in the writing or editing stage, but we don't like to say "when" they will be done. We used to estimate "when" and ultimately ended up disappointing people when inevitable delays happened. We also spent a lot of effort providing "no update" on the status of these future publications, which then led to lots of "why" questions.

Please use the following table to understand why Chaosium isn't telling you when a future book will be ready:

1D10  Result
01    Author is late on finishing the manuscript
02    Editor is late on editing the manuscript
03    Artist(s) are late on delivering art
04    Art direction is taking longer than expected
05    Manuscript requires extensive rewrites
06    Art requires extensive revision or was rejected
07    Author gives up and a new author must be found
08    Artist disappears and art must be reassigned
09    Roll twice on table and combine delays sequentially
10    Roll thrice on table and combine delays sequentially

[M Helsdon]

RPGQuest

Enter a world of fearsome perils and challenges.

Take on the role of Line Editor, Editor, Art Director, Layout Artist, Author or Artist, faced with deadlines, rogue authors and artists, conventions, printers, distributors, and shippers.

Scenarios include: Global Pandemic, Logistics Nightmare, The Book with No Name.

Uses the BRP system with the addition of SAN.

Release date: To be confirmed.

Edited August 12, 2022 by M Helsdon

[Wheel Shield]

@g33k Thank you for drawing my attention to the closed thread.

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, M Helsdon said:

Scenarios include: Global Pandemic, Logistics Nightmare, The Book with No Name.

Don't forget Regular and Special Encounters such as:  Mallia Strikes!, Trapped in the Other World (aka Real Life), Gremlins in the Machine, Companions Fall from Quest, etc. 

[Erol of Backford]

Can't wait for these.

I'd drive to Michigan to pick them up if there were a few copies in the office somewhere!

Sartar Book
1st draft almost complete

Chaosium Classics Volume I : The Stafford House Campaign

(A collection of Greg Stafford's RuneQuest Campaign Essays 1978-1981)
Draft complete.  In editing.  Acquiring art.

[Shiningbrow]

Firstly, thank you @g33k for starting this thread after the other was closed. Personally, I think/feel it was more politically (personally) motivated, along the lines of "we don't like to have people complaining about this, so lock it down". Living in China, I'm sort of used to this.

On 8/12/2022 at 4:47 AM, g33k said:

Please don't put this on the fans, and random drops on whatever social media a particular Chaosium team-member "happens" to be logged into when the mood strikes.

Absolutely! And I'm somewhat shocked that someone hasn't been appointed to do this! It's Public Relations (or Intro to Marketing) 101... Lesson 1 - never leave your customer base in the dark!

Once a week/fortnight/month, said person can just shoot of an email to the relevant people, and then quickly update the list (especially with the date!). Most of the time, there won't be any change. Occasionally there will be. (alternatively, a spreadsheet can be created which all relevant people can edit with their particular products. As a change occurs, the public list can be updated. However, the appointed staffy still needs to go in and adjust the "As of XXX date", just so fans know it's not being ignored.)

Jeff was at a few cons and discussed multiple things. Great! So, said staffer should then contact Jeff and ask what was discussed... simple! This ain't rock science!

@Scotty You seem to be completely missing the point. None of the 4 things you mentioned Chaosium doing actually address the issue that was stated in the OP. And while @Steve may be good at keeping up the list, AFAIK he's not on Chaosium's payroll, and has this as part of his job. And that's precisely the point @g33k was making. It shouldn't have to be fan maintained. (BTW, I'm not saying it should be your job, but it should be someone's).

And again addressing those 4 things: none of them are a definitive list of what's in the works, let alone their statuses. And since I'd never heard of the Tome until you mentioned it, I would presume that most newcomers to RQ won't know the others either. Expecting the fans (especially new-comers) to do all the searching (for something that may not even exist) - is very bad PR.

I'll give an example. The RQ specific "video game" (in inverted commas, because I'm fairly certain I'll not see it come to be in my lifetime, as per the announcement made a couple of years ago). There's been about literally zero updates on this. Nothing at all. Not even the company supposedly doing the game has said anything. I take this to mean, as said before, that it's dead in the water and won't ever come out. Those of us who like our video games and have seen lots of titles announced and then scrapped think the same. New-comers to RQ wouldn't even know this thing (theoretically) exists. They'd have to wade through so many pages of this forum, or get lucky on a search hit (which would say absolutely nothing useful).

 

To put it bluntly - relying on the fans to keep the rest of us fans in the loop of what's happening with RQG publications is quite simply unprofessional! (literally and metaphorically)

[Nick Brooke]

The last thread was closed after bored people wandered way off the reservation and started posting Monty Python clips, random emojis, and recollections of their favourite Traveller campaigns. It got tedious for the mod team to clean it up, so we shuttered it. Like any good Chinese state censor, I've provided a link.

[Steve]

2 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

Once a week/fortnight/month, said person can just shoot of an email to the relevant people, and then quickly update the list (especially with the date!).

How many (which?) other RPG publishers provide a publicly-available, constantly updated, list of upcoming products with dates? Genuine question.

[Shiningbrow]

2 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

The last thread was closed after bored people wandered way off the reservation and started posting Monty Python clips, random emojis, and recollections of their favourite Traveller campaigns. It got tedious for the mod team to clean it up, so we shuttered it. Like any good Chinese state censor, I've provided a link.

Right... so, instead of a message asking people to keep posts directly on topic, the iron fist just locked it, stopping any and all actual relevant discussion (which was actually on-going)....

 

1 hour ago, Steve said:

How many (which?) other RPG publishers provide a publicly-available, constantly updated, list of upcoming products with dates? Genuine question.

I don't know. I don't follow any other RPGs (or basically anything) with the passion that I follow RQ.

However, that's not actually the question that should be asked! The question should be - how many other publishers (or producers for public consumption of any type) rely on unpaid 'fans'* to provide that service to the public? Especially one that point blank refuses to give release dates anyway...

Please, @Steve , don't get me wrong! I (and I imagine most others here) really, really, really (should I ALL CAPS it too??) appreciate the time and effort you put in to maintaining the list!!! The only thing that's being suggested is a) it should be an official, paid (hint hint) person doing it, who b) has prioritised direct access to accurate information sources. I'm totally sure you actually love doing the job, and feel it as part of doing your bit (amongst whatever else you do) for the game. (it's why we volunteer our time and services, after all). But - not the point.

 

(* I'm not sure that 'fans' applies to all products and publications, hence the ' ')

[Scotty]

27 minutes ago, Shiningbrow said:

Right... so, instead of a message asking people to keep posts directly on topic, the iron fist just locked it, stopping any and all actual relevant discussion (which was actually on-going)....

Yes, the trolling, OT posts were removed and appropriate actions taken. As I said, Please start a new one with a relevant title, which was done. As a part-timer, I really don't have the time to micromanage BRP threads and message individuals. 

[soltakss]

1 hour ago, Shiningbrow said:

Right... so, instead of a message asking people to keep posts directly on topic, the iron fist just locked it, stopping any and all actual relevant discussion (which was actually on-going)....

People generally ignore such messages.

 

[Nick Brooke]

We know. That's why we locked the thread.

[Jeff]

There is another solution to this. I can stop posting in forums or otherwise commenting on what I am working on or provide sneak previews of art or other materials, if that causes so much consternation. We can promote and market these books the normal way - don't market it until we know when it is going to go to the printers (as we do with our sell sheets for distributors). 

I post stuff here because I enjoy doing it (and because I think most people on this forum enjoy that as well)- but I do not enjoy or appreciate demands for more information about publication schedules than any of our licensees or distributors ask for. 

[DucksMustDie]

Please continue posting 🙂

[soltakss]

1 hour ago, Jeff said:

I post stuff here because I enjoy doing it (and because I think most people on this forum enjoy that as well)

Indeed we do, so thanks for posting.

You enjoy, we enjoy it, everyone's a winner.

1 hour ago, Jeff said:

I do not enjoy or appreciate demands for more information about publication schedules than any of our licensees or distributors ask for. 

I am patient, I can wait.

However, I was flamed for saying that recently, though, so there are a lot of people who can't wait.

[M Helsdon]

I’m not a Chaosium staffer, but have some experience in publishing, and providing updating information about product release dates is not really practical until the product leaves the printer, and even then there can be delays. Creating a Jonstown Compendium project of any size gives you some perspective on the complexities…

It’s a no win situation: if Chaosium don’t provide frequent scheduling updates some people will be unhappy; if Chaosium provides scheduling updates and fails to achieve them some people will be unhappy.

There are internal and external factors.

The external are easiest to describe:

Printer queues – until recently there was a world shortage of paper and ink, and it is still ongoing to a degree. Some printers have gone bust, some have raised prices.

Shipping – the price of moving product has increased enormously, and there are still delays. These include the shipments from the printer, and from the distribution sites.

Internal – many factors I am unaware of, but the obvious ones are line editor time to review material, writing the material, interacting with authors, checking and playtesting it, getting the art direction done, getting the art from artists, layout, dealing with the printer etc.

All this takes a variable amount of time – some projects may not survive the process. Many places along the development path where things can be delayed. Bear in mind that even for novelists there can be a year between handling the manuscript in, and the book appearing on shelves. Add in playtesting and artwork….

Which brings me to art direction. I was pleased to contribute some pieces of art direction to a recent book; most of the pieces of art are a page or less in size, but each piece of art direction took six to eight hours to do. This often involved finding six or more pages of reference material, because most artists aren’t overly familiar with the look and feel of the Bronze Age (or early Iron Age) and the more material you can offer, the easier the artist’s life is, the happier they’ll be, and the greater the chance of what you get back will be what you wanted.

Multiply this for an RQ book, which is usually full of art….

So an updating status list looks to me to be impractical, and potentially misleading.

The safest thing is to wait on the next product on the line – which I believe is the Cults book.

[jajagappa]

2 hours ago, Jeff said:

I post stuff here because I enjoy doing it (and because I think most people on this forum enjoy that as well)

And I think many/most of us enjoy and appreciate this as well, and hope you continue doing so! 

[M Helsdon]

2 hours ago, Jeff said:

I post stuff here because I enjoy doing it (and because I think most people on this forum enjoy that as well)

And it's valuable and informative, and often sends me off on a tangent on something I'm working on. Please continue!

Edited August 13, 2022 by M Helsdon

[Rick Meints]

I made some updates to the glorantha publications thread.

[Bill the barbarian]

On 8/12/2022 at 10:08 AM, M Helsdon said:

Take on the role of Line Editor, Editor, Art Director, Layout Artist, Author or Artist, faced with deadlines, rogue authors and artists, conventions, printers, distributors, and shippers.

 

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt covered in printer’s ink!

[g33k]

1 hour ago, Rick Meints said:

I made some updates to the glorantha publications thread.

Oh, wow...  
@Rick MeintsTYVM!
This is exactly the content I was requesting/suggesting!!!
https://basicroleplaying.org/topic/16076-upcoming-glorantha-publications/

Amazing stuff, people!  Go check it out to see exactly where those projects sit!

I'm not sure how long it took you to collect that info & put it up online...  Hopefully, not too long?  I encourage you, or someone at Chaosium, to streamline & formalize the process, to make it as easy for Chaosium as possible, but also to be a "regular(ish)" sort of thing.

Maybe that "current-status statement" could be appended to every issue of The Tome?

 

Edited August 13, 2022 by g33k
spacing

[g33k]

1 hour ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt covered in printer’s ink!

I note you don't mention the screaming nightmares, the flashbacks...

The OCD'ish urges to take some of the longer & more loreful BRPC posts into your edit/layout workstream...  🤡


 

[Bill the barbarian]

Correct!

I did not!

[ffilz]

13 hours ago, Jeff said:

There is another solution to this. I can stop posting in forums or otherwise commenting on what I am working on or provide sneak previews of art or other materials, if that causes so much consternation. We can promote and market these books the normal way - don't market it until we know when it is going to go to the printers (as we do with our sell sheets for distributors). 

I post stuff here because I enjoy doing it (and because I think most people on this forum enjoy that as well)- but I do not enjoy or appreciate demands for more information about publication schedules than any of our licensees or distributors ask for. 

Your posts are much appreciated and as impatient as I sometimes get, you folks do a good job of communicating what you are willing to share, and sharing to those standards when the time comes.

The new status post that Rick updated is awesome. I don't know how I'll afford all that's in that pipeline when it comes out...