rogerd Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 (edited) BRP & CoC Critters Okay is it me folks or has anyone else noticed that in the BRP Core book, CoC Dark Ages & Malleus Monstrorum & Runequest - we have different stats for: elementals, vampires to name but two. Is there a reason for this? Edited May 24, 2012 by rogerd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmitchell Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 RuneQuest, CoC, and what would become BRP diverged early in their histories. So, for example, RuneQuest elementals have a SIZ measured in cubic meters and a few characteristics based on that "size", while other games simplified matters by making elementals more like other creatures. Likewise, each game adapted "vampires" in their own particular way: RuneQuest vampires started as creations (priests?) of the Gloranthan god Vivamort, while CoC vampires developed to emulate gothic literature. Stats for all imaginary creatures will always differ depending on the game's concept of how dragons, corporeal undead, ghosts, vampires, elementals, robots, etc. "work". Even real creatures might differ depending on how a particular variant interprets STR, SIZ, DEX, etc. In the downloads section I have a short document presenting robots without CON or POW to reflect that they typically lack self-healing abilities and psychic/magical presences; in the comments someone asked me to work them up with CON and POW apparently because he/she thought CON and POW didn't imply biological mechanisms or supernatural power. The same document presents golems which differ from those in OpenQuest, Age of Treason, Merrie England, Jelmre of RuneQuest, Abominations from The Bronze Grimoire, etc. So, short answer, there's no real "official" version across all lines. Each line, sometimes each book, stats out creatures depending on the authors' interpretation of each creature. Pick whichever version you like best, or whip up your own; it's not hard. Quote Frank "Welcome to the hottest and fastest-growing hobby of, er, 1977." -- The Laundry RPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rust Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 When I use a creature in one of my settings I usually modify its stats and skills according to its specific background and role in the setting, which often results in a creature which is significantly different from the generic version or the ver- sions of other settings. An obvious example are horses, my Thule setting needs a smaller, but more hardy version of horses than most other settings - less STR and SIZ, but a comparatively higher CON. I think that the authors of official ma- terial will also adapt the creatures to the setting, which leads to the differences you mentioned. Quote "Mind like parachute, function only when open." (Charlie Chan) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerd Posted May 25, 2012 Author Share Posted May 25, 2012 Thanks folks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seneschal Posted May 26, 2012 Share Posted May 26, 2012 Although I think I've got it down now, critter stats were one thing that really threw me when I started delving into BRP. They're so darn arbitrary, particularly when it comes to SIZ and STR and damage. In other systems I've played, a horse is a horse, of course, of course (which the GM can beef up if he wants a mutant or something). In BRP, a horse is whatever the GM and the dice are feeling like today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rust Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 Although I think I've got it down now, critter stats were one thing that really threw me when I started delving into BRP. They're so darn arbitrary, particularly when it comes to SIZ and STR and damage. In other systems I've played, a horse is a horse, of course, of course (which the GM can beef up if he wants a mutant or something). In BRP, a horse is whatever the GM and the dice are feeling like today. I usually avoid this problem by narrowing the range of possible stats, using the creature's average stats and rolling the die only for a small bonus or malus to these values (max. +2 /-2). Creatures with stats significantly above or below the average values are designed for a specific role or situation in the setting, never randomly created. Quote "Mind like parachute, function only when open." (Charlie Chan) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soltakss Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 Although I think I've got it down now, critter stats were one thing that really threw me when I started delving into BRP. They're so darn arbitrary, particularly when it comes to SIZ and STR and damage. In other systems I've played, a horse is a horse, of course, of course (which the GM can beef up if he wants a mutant or something). In BRP, a horse is whatever the GM and the dice are feeling like today. A big horse is bigger than a small horse, in the same way that a big man is bigger than a small man. A horse is a horse is a horse, but a Shire horse should not have the same stats as a Shetland pony ... Quote Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. www.soltakss.com/index.html Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soltakss Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 Okay is it me folks or has anyone else noticed that in the BRP Core book, CoC Dark Ages & Malleus Monstrorum & Runequest - we have different stats for: elementals, vampires to name but two. Is there a reason for this? Elementals are interesting because they are very setting-specific. Moocokian elementals are not the same as Gloranthan ones and these aren't the same as medieval European elementals. Vampires are more likely to be generic, apart from their vulnerabilities. Gloranthan vampires, for example, can walk in the daytime and do not have to be invited into a house. I would say that most creatures should be tweaked for a particular setting. Quote Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. www.soltakss.com/index.html Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerd Posted May 27, 2012 Author Share Posted May 27, 2012 A big horse is bigger than a small horse, in the same way that a big man is bigger than a small man. A horse is a horse is a horse, but a Shire horse should not have the same stats as a Shetland pony ... How do people vary the move rate as to be honest all humans having 4m is a bit ludicrous, Usain Bolt is a darn site faster that's for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJealousy Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 all humans having 4m is a bit ludicrous Thats very true and one of the minor weirdnesses in the BRP system. Move should be a stat like Str or Con (or at least based on something) rather than a fixed number for every type of critter. But I guess it saves on the math... Quote Mr Jealousy has returned to reality! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerd Posted May 27, 2012 Author Share Posted May 27, 2012 Thats very true and one of the minor weirdnesses in the BRP system. Move should be a stat like Str or Con (or at least based on something) rather than a fixed number for every type of critter. But I guess it saves on the math... A while ago I was having a discussion in the nWOD forums and someone passed this link my way: Speed conversion online. I'd probably need to find the RQ table with speed rates on, but it may be easier to have siz + str then divide by 5 to get move per second. So 10 + 10 = 20 / 5 = 4m every second which is about 8 mph. Which sounds about right for an average person.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJealousy Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 10 + 10 = 20 / 5 = 4m every second which is about 8 mph. Which sounds about right for an average person.. Actually, thats pretty close. In the BRP Movement Rates Table a sprinting man moves at 50 meters a Combat Round. 4 m per second equates to 48m a Combat Round getting you almost exactly the 'average' sprint. I'd probably want to mix in CON as well as STR and SIZ but that does look like it works. Quote Mr Jealousy has returned to reality! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerd Posted May 27, 2012 Author Share Posted May 27, 2012 Actually, thats pretty close. In the BRP Movement Rates Table a sprinting man moves at 50 meters a Combat Round. 4 m per second equates to 48m a Combat Round getting you almost exactly the 'average' sprint. I'd probably want to mix in CON as well as STR and SIZ but that does look like it works. Good point, perhaps take out the fatigue table, and maybe players have derived stat equal to CON which they burn during furious activity? Not sure how you'd make that work or write up to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJealousy Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 Lets Stat up Usain Bolt! At 6'5" (77" or 1.96m) his SIZ is going to be 16 (ignoring his weight of 200lbs SIZ 12!) His personal best 100 m: 9.58 (according to wikipedia) using that Speed conversion link makes 23.55 mph! or 10.5 m per second So STR ?? + SIZ 16 = 52.5/5 = 10.5 Oh! I think I would have to create a Running skill for Mr Bolt because I dont think his STR is 36.5 Quote Mr Jealousy has returned to reality! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerd Posted May 27, 2012 Author Share Posted May 27, 2012 (edited) Lets Stat up Usain Bolt! At 6'5" (77" or 1.96m) his SIZ is going to be 16 (ignoring his weight of 200lbs SIZ 12!) His personal best 100 m: 9.58 (according to wikipedia) using that Speed conversion link makes 23.55 mph! or 10.5 m per second So STR ?? + SIZ 16 = 52.5/5 = 10.5 Oh! I think I would have to create a Running skill for Mr Bolt because I dont think his STR is 36.5 I knew there would be a flaw somewhere Although not sure quite how to fix that...unless.....he could have a heroic / legendary ability that would bump speed? EDIT: So for Usain he can run 44 mph - shit that's fast Which equates to 19.67. Edited May 27, 2012 by rogerd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJealousy Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 If you're going to muck around with MOV. The best I can come up with is STR+SIZ+CON /6, without going into bell curves or other mathematical weirdness. In my opinion Mr Bolt should be disqualified from appearing in the Olympics because he is obviously a mutant/super with an unfair advantage over normal people! Quote Mr Jealousy has returned to reality! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerd Posted May 27, 2012 Author Share Posted May 27, 2012 If you're going to muck around with MOV. The best I can come up with is STR+SIZ+CON /6, without going into bell curves or other mathematical weirdness. I think your method would work better, and any kind of progression curves would be excessively complicated for an RPG. In my opinion Mr Bolt should be disqualified from appearing in the Olympics because he is obviously a mutant/super with an unfair advantage over normal people! Or doing a very bad job from hiding from the MiB. I agree he makes us normal folk seem sub-normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seneschal Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 Well, there's always Super Movement from the Powers section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conrad Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Moocokian elementals "Moocokian" elementals are part bovine part parrot? Quote http://www.basicrps.com/core/BRP_quick_start.pdf A sense of humour and an imagination go a long way in roleplaying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerd Posted May 30, 2012 Author Share Posted May 30, 2012 (edited) Actually, thats pretty close. In the BRP Movement Rates Table a sprinting man moves at 50 meters a Combat Round. 4 m per second equates to 48m a Combat Round getting you almost exactly the 'average' sprint. I'd probably want to mix in CON as well as STR and SIZ but that does look like it works. You what I just thought of a really simple way of working this out, in fact I cannot believe i didn't think about it. Siz + Str (dex if you prefer) = miles per hour. So Usain bolt would have stats of 20, or so. Anyhow, as this is a CoC Critter thread I'm thinking about if we stat some up. Highlander Flint-like / Man From Earth Immortals Vorlons and Shadows Some beasties from Who Does anyone else feel like doing any others? Edited May 30, 2012 by rogerd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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