Murder and Cannibalism in the Bronze Age

[Nozbat]

What creature(s) do you think might done this? 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crl3jn3elz3o

My first thought it was a bunch of homicidal players... but not even homicidal players eat their victims.. do they? 

[Ali the Helering]

Only if they live in Somerset...

[Nozbat]

True.. it might have been the Shepton Mallet that killed and ate them.. or possibly Chew Magna..or his brother Chew Minor?

Too much cider drinking isn’t good for the soul

[Nozbat]

'The Shepton Mallet' is a great nom de guerre or in modern parlance, Call sign for a GMC @Ian A. Thomson

[svensson]

In the US, there was a concerted attempt by a couple of Native American tribes to suppress archeological evidence that battle and cannibalism occurred in Chaco Canyon.

Given America's race issues, I can see why the tribes were so concerned - I would be too - but the historian in me was highly annoyed and vexed by the whole thing. To suppress science and evidence because it doesn't fit your advocacy or agenda is anathema to me. The 'inconvenient history' is exactly what we should be preserving.

[Ian A. Thomson]

20 minutes ago, Nozbat said:

'The Shepton Mallet' is a great nom de guerre or in modern parlance, Call sign for a GMC @Ian A. Thomson

I used to live near, and visit, Shepton Mallet

[svensson]

41 minutes ago, Ian A. Thomson said:

I used to live near, and visit, Shepton Mallet

If it helps any, I was raised and still live near the Green River in Washington State... where Gary Ridgeway, 'the Green River killer' hunted. And yeah, there's a certain creepiness to that.

[Nozbat]

2 hours ago, Ian A. Thomson said:

I used to live near, and visit, Shepton Mallet

My g/f of 35 yrs ago lived in Pilton and we used to meet at Shepton Mallet .. and it was there that was the last (and only time) I ever went to a cricket match.. one was enough for me

2 hours ago, svensson said:

In the US, there was a concerted attempt by a couple of Native American tribes to suppress archeological evidence that battle and cannibalism occurred in Chaco Canyon.

Given America's race issues, I can see why the tribes were so concerned - I would be too - but the historian in me was highly annoyed and vexed by the whole thing. To suppress science and evidence because it doesn't fit your advocacy or agenda is anathema to me. The 'inconvenient history' is exactly what we should be preserving.

There is a lot of documentation about our ancestors, particularly Celts, taking heads and eating hearts.. likely sympathetic magic of having captured knowledge, strength or the soul of the defeated foe.. unless it was a Greco-Roman conspiracy to justify imperialist expansion and destruction of Celtic tribes

http://celticheritage.co.uk/articles_headcult.cfm

There's lots more evidence here..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannibalism_in_Europe

and for a wider non-European view

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exocannibalism

 

[Ian A. Thomson]

ON TOPIC

Weirdly I actually studied Celtic-Romano Britain at UNI (only one module but an intensive one over several months which I really enjoyed so did a sh&t tonne of reading at the time)

Apparently it was common for Romans to use major propaganda against their enemies, and they really really hated the Celtic religion and did their best to wipe it out completely, declaring that the Celtic gods were in fact 'demons' and that anyone actively following key elements of the old religion would be put to death

Driving the druids underground for centuries. (They made it to early modern times as a secret society, but I forget when. 1700s?)

All are old memories from the course. Not recently researched facts

Not saying the Celts didn't eat their enemies, but the amount may have been grossly exaggerated by the Romans. (Who may not have eaten their enemies but were bl**dy brutal with them.)

OFF TOPIC

Last cricket match I ever played in was just outside Bath

Wow. Pilton

Why does that sound so familiar?

Glastonbury Festival?

I lived in Chapmanslade (beautiful), Temple Cloud (sounds lovely, but was awful) and Coleford (wonderful)

Edited December 16, 2024 by Ian A. Thomson

[Nozbat]

13 minutes ago, Ian A. Thomson said:

Apparently it was common for Romans to demonise their enemies, and they really really hated the Celtic religion and did their best to wipe it out completely, declaring that the Celtic gods were in fact 'demons' and that anyone actively following the old religion would be put to death

Along with (my hero) Hannibal Barca, the Gauls terrified the Romans. Roman Mothers scared their children with bogeyman tales of Hannibal coming to get them and Gallic brutality. They never forgot the sack of Rome by the Gauls in 390 BCE. It was possibly this terror that spurred future expansion in order to 'safeguard the borders'

We don't have the Gauls view of it and few primary sources and what we have is Roman-myth making about geese and stoic senators awaiting death in their finery.

As for the Druids, they were accused of inciting continental Gauls to rebellion from their hideouts, secret training camps, agent provocateurs, illegal selling of mistletoe at Yuletide and WMD stores in Briton and so the ultimate destruction of the Druids sanctuaries on Mõn was the logical end. Though I don't think they ever found the WMD despite Livy's dossier. It seems common that many cultures demonised the opposing pantheon as 'devils' rather than acceptance or forbearance (as we still do today, though maybe in a more secular way). I am reminded how Medieval Europe viewed Islam and Jews.

It is interesting that later Roman myth-making incorporated and 'romanised' Celtic deities.. so much of what we know of Druids and Celtic religion comes from then. Reminds me of the Lunars forcing marriage on Pavis 

[Ian A. Thomson]

Yes, there is a lot to mine here, and was something I was fascinated by for years. Feels like my ancestry

If I have one more RPG book in me after the Pavis series it will be a Crhulhu sourcebook and incorporate some of these ideas.

[Nozbat]

2 hours ago, Ian A. Thomson said:

OFF TOPIC

Last cricket match I ever played in was just outside Bath

Wow. Pilton

Why does that sound so familiar?

Glastonbury Festival?

Pilton is the village where Glastonbury is held... you can see the Tor across the flatlands .. and travel along the leylines.. 

Chapmanslade and Coleforth were probably way-points on the leyline whereas Temple Cloud was probably an invader deity temple and therefore an anathema .. and they probably ate babies too lol

Celts never worshipped clouds just feared that the clouds and sky might fall on them. It suddenly occurred to me about the Celtic response to Alexander the Great..

“At this point Alexander was visited by envoys from Syrmus, the King of the Triballians, and from the various other independent tribes along the Danube. The Celts from the Adriatic Sea also sent representatives - men of haughty demeanour and tall in proportion. All professed a desire for Alexander's friendship, and mutual pledges were given and received. Alexander asked the Celtic envoys what they were most afraid of in this world, hoping that the power of his own name had got as far as their country, or even further, and that they would answer, 'You, my lord.' However, he was disappointed; for the Celts, who lived a long way off in country not easy to penetrate, and could see that Alexander's expedition was directed elsewhere, replied that their worst fear was that the sky might fall on their heads. None the less, he concluded an alliance of friendship with them and sent them home, merely remarking under his breath that the Celts thought too much of themselves.”

― Arrian, The Campaigns of Alexander

Edited December 16, 2024 by Nozbat

[svensson]

I think I got your Shepton Mallet mixed up with both the 'Suffolk Strangler' and a mystery book I read this year where the antagonist killed with a 'masonry mallet'.

My sincere apologies.

[Nozbat]

No worries @svensson.. the way I was talking about a quaint Somerset town.. you'd be sure it was a sociopathic murderer... and IMO .. THE Shepton Mallet should be... if @Ian A. Thomson won't include it... I will as a mallet-wielding murderer.. possibly in the 1920s CoC