Ducks or Durulz in Glorantha

[Viktor]

I wanted and have always wanted to play a Humakti duck and become a hero as that character, to show his viability as a character. To play him totally seriously. They are an interesting race.

[soltakss]

In my second RQ group there was a deadly serious Duck Humakti, called Pektok. He was little but very strong and very healthy and wielded a mean Greatsword. Once his player and another player joined a different RQ group for an all day session and they brought their PCs, Pektok and Derak the Dark Troll, but each played the other's PC, then halfway through the game they switched PCs and played their own PCs, but the other players couldn't tell which PC belonged to which player. In that session, a centaur PC laughed at the "lidde-widdle duck" until the liddle-widdle duck calmly walked between his legs and proceeded to gut him from front to back.

 

[Kim]

I hate those who hate Ducks.

The RPG genre is dependent on racial and ethnic hatred. That's what it's about. That's what excites and feeds it. That's the juice Tolkien was running on.

Glorantha was the gameworld that, even back in the dawn of the genre, made conflict about politics. About ontology, if you like, later on.

The ducks are a litmus test. In terms of gameworld criticism, those who hate ducks are those who hate foreigners and minorities and are made to feel daffy.

[Patrick]

4 hours ago, Kim said:

I hate those who hate Ducks.

Well, some don't like Runes, and some don't like Ducks ;-)

 

I personnally like both, but Glorantha is big enough for all variants.

And I wouldn't infer any prejudice from anti-Durulz opinions: they are not "real", this is fiction, and I can understand people want different things in their fiction - not necessarily comic relief.

[Joerg]

5 hours ago, Kim said:

I hate those who hate Ducks.

The RPG genre is dependent on racial and ethnic hatred. That's what it's about. That's what excites and feeds it. That's the juice Tolkien was running on.

It isn't all about hatred - hatred is just the easy cop-out stereotype players and narrators use when they don't want to take time to immerse in the themes the background offers.

Tolkien's juice was the inhuman terror that he experienced in the Trench War of France, which he projected on the heroic traditions of the Anglo-Saxons and Icelanders, creating his own mythology, but his world started as three great romances of mortal men with immortal women in the face of an overwhelming threat and powerful enemies.

I'm just reading a story about the Ring War from the perspective of the Mordor industrial and technological (ok, dark steampunk) civilisation and its conflict with ancient and outmoded magic. An interesting read.

 

5 hours ago, Kim said:

Glorantha was the gameworld that, even back in the dawn of the genre, made conflict about politics. About ontology, if you like, later on.

The ducks are a litmus test. In terms of gameworld criticism, those who hate ducks are those who hate foreigners and minorities and are made to feel daffy.

That's a fair bit of over-interpreting the role of the ducks. Ducks (and Grotarons, Jelmre, and to an extent Trollkin) simply are part of the weird. Look at me working to define their mythic origin or placing them in a shanty-town next to my version of Karse when I wouldn't approach them in my games or stories.

 

 

[Corvantir]

Ducks ruin my suspension of disbelief. I don't want Howard the Duck, Donald or Daffy to erupt in the middle of a game. There is nothing in Ducks that makes me laugh, they simply don't exist, period.

But I don't hate people who like them. Should I?

Edited May 24, 2016 by Corvantir

[Ali the Helering]

I ran a campaign where the central character was a Humakti durulz and, trust me, there is nothing faintly amusing about his heroism.  While the focus of the campaign has moved on, he still appears occasionally, and is as devoted to the destruction of the undead as ever.  He is regarded as a special foe by an entire Shargashi regiment.

Suspension of disbelief?  Given Aldryami, Mostali, and the Uz, why does a Durulz go amiss?  The only thing he is likely to suspend is an enemy, by their intestines. 

When a Durulz Humakti is played well (as he was), they can make the RW Norse berserkers look a little bit too gentle. 

[Corvantir]

56 minutes ago, Ali the Helering said:

Suspension of disbelief?  Given Aldryami, Mostali, and the Uz, why does a Durulz go amiss?  The only thing he is likely to suspend is an enemy, by their intestines.

To my eyes, a Duck is like a cartoon character in the middle of a movie. Not my cup of tea when it isn't "Who framed Roger Rabbit". This is just a matter of "look" and of personal preferences actually. As far as I am concerned a Duck always sounds out of place. I feel the same about talking animals in RPGs or movies though, whatever the setting.

Some like them, some don't. I don't.  

[Michael Hopcroft]

Glorantha will always have room for Ducks. Of course, so do Broos....

Incidentally, if you're a durulz and walk into an eating place to find them serving normal, non-sapient ducks roasted upon spits, are you offended? What do the diners think when they see you? (I wouldn't think the existence of Broos would make people give up on hunting antelope or deer for food, even though Broos are distinctly inedible!)

[Ali the Helering]

On ‎11‎/‎05‎/‎2016 at 3:44 PM, Tindalos said:

IMG ultimately, the Durulz aren't that related to ducks. Their bills have lips, rather than a plate of hardened tissue. They have true teeth rather than serrated edges, solid bones, etc. They're closer to Hadrosaurs than actual birds.

If the idea of a duck offends your sensibilities, you can always follow Tindalos' suggestion for anatomical differences, and be rigorous in using the term Durulz rather than duck.

I cannot say that I find the idea of talking animals enticing myself, but eliminating the Morokanthi would surely be a loss.  Come to that, highly mobile plants sharing in a semi-psychic Song link appear a bit odd.  All in all, this is a fantasy construction brought about by Greg's genius and elaborated upon by ourselves.  YGWV, so there is no need to include anything you dislike, albeit with a loss to the created whole.

 

 

 

[Tindalos]

12 hours ago, Michael Hopcroft said:

Incidentally, if you're a durulz and walk into an eating place to find them serving normal, non-sapient ducks roasted upon spits, are you offended? What do the diners think when they see you? (I wouldn't think the existence of Broos would make people give up on hunting antelope or deer for food, even though Broos are distinctly inedible!)

Personally, the durulz would be looking forward to a good meal. S:KoH mentions them hunting, so they're not herbivorous, and I imagine their diet is filled with wading birds of many varieties (much as monkeys are found as bushmeat in many cultures.)

I would actually base their cuisine on creole and cajun cuisines; a lot of seafood, poultry, and other game meats; found boiled, barbecued, and stewed.

 

Of course, since intelligent animals are part of Glorantha anyway, you could have a durulz and sentient talking duck as partners. With the duck assuming all comments about ducks refer only to itself, and not its companion.

[Joerg]

13 minutes ago, Tindalos said:

Personally, the durulz would be looking forward to a good meal. S:KoH mentions them hunting, so they're not herbivorous, and I imagine their diet is filled with wading birds of many varieties (much as monkeys are found as bushmeat in many cultures.)

I would actually base their cuisine on creole and cajun cuisines; a lot of seafood, poultry, and other game meats; found boiled, barbecued, and stewed.

I would restrict durulz hunting to their watery neighborhood, probably using trident spears to hunt amphibians, snapper turtles, bisam, and whatever vertebrates happen to think of their semi-floating gardens as pasture or which breaks the water surface when snorkeling in ambush. I suppose Durulz going after adult catfish would be regarded as hunters rather than fishers, too.

I agree on Durulz meat and "fish" being opportunistic, containing everything from the dreaded snapper turtles to snails, frogs, tadpoles, and those fish that arranged with the ecological changes Delecti wrought. No idea whether the Upland Marsh has alligators - I guess neither the Durulz nor Delecti will tolerate specimen big enough to cause body losses of their respective communities. Snapper turtles aren't much of a problem to Delecti's undead, but would be feared by the Durulz.

Re: Durulz floating gardens: In addition to the Aztec cultivation of Lake Tenochtitlan, I recently watched a documentary about the Tonle Sap lake people in Cambodia whose garden paddies do float.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonl%C3%A9_Sap

 

[Tindalos]

32 minutes ago, Joerg said:

I would restrict durulz hunting to their watery neighborhood, probably using trident spears to hunt amphibians, snapper turtles, bisam, and whatever vertebrates happen to think of their semi-floating gardens as pasture or which breaks the water surface when snorkeling in ambush. I suppose Durulz going after adult catfish would be regarded as hunters rather than fishers, too.

I agree on Durulz meat and "fish" being opportunistic, containing everything from the dreaded snapper turtles to snails, frogs, tadpoles, and those fish that arranged with the ecological changes Delecti wrought. No idea whether the Upland Marsh has alligators - I guess neither the Durulz nor Delecti will tolerate specimen big enough to cause body losses of their respective communities. Snapper turtles aren't much of a problem to Delecti's undead, but would be feared by the Durulz.

Oh certainly, I can't imagine durulz bringdown deer or similar, just the sort of thing you'd find by riversides.

And while alligators aren't mentioned specifically, the Sartar Companion does have wild predators showing up in the Upland Marsh, and of those mentioned in their section, River Dragons (Crocodiles) are one of the more likely to appear in the marsh.

[g33k]

Note that there are Marsh Deer, and that our North American Moose (aka Elk in Europe -- FYI to Europeans, when we USAians say "Elk" you should think of the bigger deer varieties!) often wade for food.  So yeah:  Durulz eat Venison, I would think!

 

[Corvantir]

On 26/05/2016 at 9:11 AM, Ali the Helering said:

I cannot say that I find the idea of talking animals enticing myself, but eliminating the Morokanthi would surely be a loss.

Curiously, don't ask me why because I don't know the answer, I don't consider Morokanthi to be talking animals and I don't have any problem with them. They have their place in my Glorantha. The Durulz also have their place but not as cartoon characters. Their history is interesting IMO... but I can't stand the discrepancy between them and the way I imagine the rest of Glorantha.

Instead of humanoid birds, my Ducks are birds given the appearance of humans because of Yelm's curse. After many wanderings they finally settled at the Creek-Stream-River confluence where they found a Wyter, a spirit able to take the shape of a duck. They were spared by the Dragonkill War because they are tied to the Beast Rune, but they greatly suffered because of Delecti and his Upland Marsh. The name Ducks was given to them by the first Hendriki explorers because of the totems dedicated to their Wyter, Durulz. They hunt but don't hunt nor eat ducks.

Edited May 29, 2016 by Corvantir

[Ali the Helering]

Since IRW ducks devour arthropods and worms, I should imagine that the Durulz would very happily send hunting parties to the edge of Uz lands. 

The Gorakiki and Swems priestesses might be used to providing anti-Durulz charms to the herders.

[g33k]

1 hour ago, Ali the Helering said:

Since IRW ducks devour arthropods and worms, I should imagine that the Durulz would very happily send hunting parties to the edge of Uz lands. 

The Gorakiki and Swems priestesses might be used to providing anti-Durulz charms to the herders.

Or maybe there's a thriving trade... even recipe exchanges!

 

[TRose]

 Fact is many fantasy races take a huge suspension of disbelief.  How about a gnome warrior in other games who is about the size of a three year old yet can fight off a human? Or the fact Elves some how don't reach adulthood until a 100+ years. Are they slow learners or just major slackers?

[Noita]

Meanwhile in the Big Rubble where they don't give a quack....

[Joerg]

The Duck hero? Or is Antikiin the Finnish name for Donald?

[TRose]

And is  Sankari Finnish for Skywalker?

[Joerg]

Sankari is Finnish for hero, and apparently has linguistic roots in the Germanic "singer" (or "Sänger"). Now if you look at Väinämöinen as the primary Finnish hero, he was a singer magician, so there seems to be a shared meaning, too - something like a rune singer.

[Noita]

Ancient hero.

[Michael Hopcroft]

I wonder if there are any Durulz in any of the cities who had become phenomenally rich (and what people of other species would think about him if there was).

Carl Barks references aside, large cities in the sense of a Rome or Athens don;t really exist in Glorantha, do they? And I doubt they would ne nearly as cosmopolitan or welcoming. This is not a nice world. Durulz outside their own areas face degrees of racism that would astound modern sensibilities. Even the name Ducks can be viewed as a racial slur. So a Durulz making a name for himself or herself in the general area faces a struggle, is often resented, and might well be threatened more often than a person of another species in a similar situation.

Edited May 29, 2016 by Michael Hopcroft
Expanded

[Joerg]

54 minutes ago, Michael Hopcroft said:

I wonder if there are any Durulz in any of the cities who had become phenomenally rich (and what people of other species would think about him if there was).

The (once) filthy rich entrepeneur had a durulz assistant, but bought the (tax) farm. Known as Apple Lane.

 

54 minutes ago, Michael Hopcroft said:

Carl Barks references aside, large cities in the sense of a Rome or Athens don;t really exist in Glorantha, do they?

Nochet is one of several such cities, and probably the one most likely to have a durulz population of several hundred. Cities the size of Athens aren't that uncommon - Furthest probably already qualifies.

 

54 minutes ago, Michael Hopcroft said:

And I doubt they would ne nearly as cosmopolitan or welcoming. This is not a nice world. Durulz outside their own areas face degrees of racism that would astound modern sensibilities. Even the name Ducks can be viewed as a racial slur. So a Durulz making a name for himself or herself in the general area faces a struggle, is often resented, and might well be threatened more often than a person of another species in a similar situation.

Who knows whether Gringle is the genuine article, or whether Quackjohn uses him as his public front.