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If Gloranthan ostriches are most effective in battle with only light (pygmy) human riders, Augners must be that much stronger / larger. Does that make the big 'terror birds' Phorusrhacidae a terran analogue?

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Demibirds are said to have solid bones so there's no need for them to be significantly larger than an ostrich.

As for the Augners, I think they are true birds and so any avilry would be limited (skirmishers etc).  There's a good reason why the horses became the steed of choice.

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On 10/08/2016 at 0:31 PM, M Helsdon said:

Anaxial's Rooster includes several horse breeds, but I am uncertain how canonical they are now.

["Roger Irrelevant" warning]

I once tried to cook up some stats for Anaxial's Rooster. "Crow fit to wake the Dead 3W". Never quite got there on the details. Oddly enough, I got the idea when I did the self-same typo myself. :-)

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3 hours ago, Byll said:

If Gloranthan ostriches are most effective in battle with only light (pygmy) human riders, Augners must be that much stronger / larger. Does that make the big 'terror birds' Phorusrhacidae a terran analogue?

Anaxial's Roster gives them the Godlearner name of Phorusrhacus gigantea which is similar enough, and the art given there certainly resembles Phorusrhacidae. In the absence of any contradiction or more recent sources, I'd say they're similar enough.

 

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On ‎8‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 1:50 PM, M Helsdon said:

All very true. I'll keep with my earlier assessment. Thank you.

For the same reason I'm ignoring dinosaur mounts because they aren't something you'll find for sale at a market, and if they were to appear in an army, they are probably equivalent to a cavalry regiment. If horse units can be repelled by camels in the real world, the effect of a large dinosaur ought to be even more dramatic. Dinosaurs appear in the Dragon Pass boardgame (as individuals? herds?) but they aren't recorded anywhere yet as being of military use by either the Lunars or the Sartar Free Army.

 Think I read that the Empire of Wyrm Friends used Dinosaurs in combat and there was an Old adventure where some Dragon newts where delivering a triceratops to a wild tribe .

 Might mention the Dragon Pass dinosaurs  pieces where all vegetarians except the Pteranodon, so they would not be trying to eat people around them.

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4 hours ago, TRose said:

 Think I read that the Empire of Wyrm Friends used Dinosaurs in combat and there was an Old adventure where some Dragon newts where delivering a triceratops to a wild tribe .

I'm mostly looking at human cultures, but yes, perhaps the triceratops might be mentioned. I believe there are a very few references to humans using them.

 

18 hours ago, Freddie said:

["Roger Irrelevant" warning]

Mea cupla.

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Riding Animals

Several species of riding animals are present in central Genertela.

 

Some are only ridden by particular tribes, whilst others, such as sables and horses are common riding animals. A rhino or bison born under the Covenant can be ridden by anyone with sufficient riding skill (and bravery).

 

Use of Praxian beasts as mounts by non-Praxians is fairly common in Dragon Pass.

 

Some mounts can be trained to carry their owner into a conflict, but do not fight themselves. Cavalry mounts are trained to stay calm in battle and carry their rider where they want to go amidst the noise and hubbub of a battle. They are not trained to fight in battle and because of this, they cost less to train.

 

War mounts are trained to respond absolutely to the demands of the rider and ignore outside influences. Some can be trained to enter a battle and fight for their rider, using their natural weapons: kicking, trampling, biting, goring. This requires expensive training so that the mount can coordinate its attacks with its rider.

 

The Praxians share a powerful relationship between rider and mount, and a member of a Praxian tribe can ride any herd beast with ease, in peace and war, for they ride almost before they can walk. They will only ride another animal if they have no choice but the Animal Nomads would never touch a horse, not even to eat it.

 

Khans are limited to only riding their tribal herd beast. This includes all Khans as a social, not cult prohibition – so Wind Khans, Storm Khans, and Light Khans are all restricted to their tribal animal. Pol-Joni Waha Khans ride horses, even though they are not within the Covenant, but do not eat their horses as they herd cattle.

 

Augner: an extinct species of giant flightless bird.

Bison: heavy and slow animals, which eat green, moist grasses. Its thick skin gives it some protection and its basic attack is the charge.

Bolo Lizard: large vegetarian dinosaur-like creatures which run on their two hind legs, bearing a small rider.

Demi-Bird: flightless carnivorous birds, they are feathered, bipedal, beaked, and lay eggs, but their bones are solid and they have vestigial arms, not wings.

Demon Horse: also called Black Horses, they have glowing eyes, snort smoke and have a taste for meat and particularly human flesh.

High Llama: of great height, they give their riders an edge in combat by allowing them to strike down at opponents. They are also noted as being the fastest mounts in all of Prax. High llamas eat leaves from bushes and scrub.

Horse: numerous different breeds, varying in size, strength and stamina. Horses graze on good-quality forage from hay or pasture.

Impala: Small deer ridden by small riders, impala eat brown, dry grasses.

Mule: the offspring of a male donkey and a female horse. These beasts can be claimed to be not-horses among horse-haters, and as horse-kin among horse-lovers.

Ostrich: large flightless birds capable of carrying a small rider. They mainly feed on seeds, shrubs, grass, fruit and flowers.

Rhino: relatively slow moving but strong.

Sable: large antelopes also known as ‘Lunar Deer’ for the shape of their horns. They eat almost any vegetation.

Tusker: fierce and ill-tempered giant boar. They are highly versatile omnivores.

Unicorn: white horse-like creatures with a long spiral horn. All unicorns are male. They eat wildflowers, fruit and tree leaves.

Zebra: horse-like but bearing stripes. Zebras feed almost entirely on grasses, but may occasionally eat shrubs, herbs, twigs, leaves and bark.

 

The different diets of riding animals means that each have a distinct habitat and requirements. Maintaining a regiment of cavalry of any species requires significant logistical support. Without proper food, a cavalry regiment will rapidly lose effectiveness.

 

Riding Animal

Maximum Training

Restrictions

Augner

War

Extinct, save on the Red Moon.

Bison

War

Surly and intractable.

Bolo Lizard

War

Ridden only by Praxian pygmies.

Demi-Bird

War

Ridden only by Dragonewts.

Demon Horse

War

Black Horse Troop only. The mounts control the riders.

High Llama

War

 

Horse

War

 

Impala

Cavalry

Ridden only by Praxian pygmies.

Mule

Riding

 

Ostrich

Cavalry

Ridden only by Praxian pygmies.

Rhino

War

Vicious and unpredictable.

Sable

War

 

Tusker

War

Ridden only by Tusk Riders.

Unicorn

War

Ridden only by female virgins.

Zebra

War

 

 

Demon Horses and Unicorns (and other riding animals awakened or inhabited by a spirit) are intelligent. However, the Demon Horses command and control their riders, whilst Unicorns and others tend to have a symbiotic relationship with their rider.

 

A few other more obscure riding animals may be encountered, but rarely in sufficient numbers to mount an entire regiment. For example, three horned darvan (triceratops), one of the ‘thunder beasts’ can be tamed and ridden, though supplying such a beast with sufficient food is challenging.

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3 hours ago, Iskallor said:

I have donkeys in my Glorantha. Used by worshippers of Lodril amongst others.

As there are mules in Glorantha, there must be donkeys. However, although the Sumerians in our world used a related animal to pull their chariots (more: slow box carts), donkeys aren't very useful as riding animals. I don't doubt they are used as beasts of burden, though mules are better caravan animals being stronger and more resilient.

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48 minutes ago, M Helsdon said:

As there are mules in Glorantha, there must be donkeys. However, although the Sumerians in our world used a related animal to pull their chariots (more: slow box carts), donkeys aren't very useful as riding animals. I don't doubt they are used as beasts of burden, though mules are better caravan animals being stronger and more resilient.

YGMV: They are used by Pelorian farmers as beasts of burden and for riding about their farms. Lots in the Grantlands along the Zola Fel for example.

I've seen and ridden donkeys (I luuurve them) many places. We grew up with them everywhere.

 

Great for mountainous regions.

 

And a mount of choice for Humakti ducks :)

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18 hours ago, M Helsdon said:

Demon Horses and Unicorns (and other riding animals awakened or inhabited by a spirit) are intelligent. However, the Demon Horses command and control their riders, whilst Unicorns and others tend to have a symbiotic relationship with their rider.

I think you've misunderstood (and I wasn't clear enough) about what I was trying to say about these two. They  both have to be symbiotic in the way they work, for they are intelligent and have an intelligent rider. For the purpose of a war-game it has to be subsumed into one or they'd argue:-) My real world example would be those dogs who are out with their owners tugging their owners along - who is walking who?

Edited by David Scott
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2 hours ago, David Scott said:

I think you've misunderstood (and I wasn't clear enough) about what I was trying to say about these two. They  both have to be symbiotic in the way they work, for they are intelligent and have an intelligent rider. For the purpose of a war-game it has to be subsumed into one or they'd argue:-) My real world example would be those dogs who are out with their owners tugging their owners along - who is walking who?

Regarding the Demon Horses, the Sartar Companion states the demons control the riders, whilst the Guide states the demons are subject only to the will of Ethilrist. Their relationship to their rider is the opposite of a cavalryman riding a trained war horse, which is trained to fight for the rider. The riders of demon horses, it seems, are trained to fight for their mount.

Unicorns and other intelligent mounts work in partnership with their riders in a mutually beneficial way.

I suspect a demon horse doesn't particularly care about their rider's wellbeing save for the inconvenience if they get killed.

They are demons, and bound only by their bond with Ethilrist.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Iskallor said:

I've seen and ridden donkeys (I luuurve them) many places. We grew up with them everywhere.

Great for supply trains; not so great if ridden into combat.

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On ‎14‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 10:08 AM, Iskallor said:

 

and you want one for war or to fit in Prax? Don't forget the Zonkey!

 

zedonk-1.jpg

...so the Natyrsa healer says to the Stormkhan "Are you looking at my ass?"

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Attempting to assess the logistics requirements of different riding animals, real world animals require the following (the numbers for horses varies wildly). The High Llama numbers are fudged as this animal is extinct in our world.

I suspect that the Praxian equivalents are going to deviate from this - rhino in our world eat a very great deal, for example, but they only have to drink (a lot) every five days or so.

 

 

Food

lbs. per day

Water

Gallons per day

Bison

24

5

High Llama

15-30

3-5

Horse

25-30

5-10

Impala

2-4

0.5-1

Rhino

120

20 in a five day period

Sable

20

2

Unicorn

20

5-10

Zebra

20

5-10

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 One thing I noticed in this discussion is that Ducks have no riding animals or even any domesticated ones.

 Although not canonical, Im going to suggest we give them another member of the duck family to ride .

 Here is the Bullockornis the perfect riding animal for ducks.

http://www.prehistoric-wildlife.com/species/b/bullockornis.html

 Its nickname alone should allow it in most games.

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5 hours ago, TRose said:

 One thing I noticed in this discussion is that Ducks have no riding animals or even any domesticated ones.

Ducks probably use donkeys as riding animals, and for cavalry, probably ponies or one of the smaller Praxian beasts.

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33 minutes ago, Iskallor said:

Ducks on Ostriches will now appear in my Prax game.

Some ostrich-rider children ride captive ducks, to learn the ropes.

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5 hours ago, Jeff said:

Ducks do not ride. Not ostriches, not donkeys, not ponies.

Can't say I'm surprised.

Now someone will suggest duck war carts. 9-)

 

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