Praxian History

[David Scott]

I'm fleshing out a bit more of the prehistory before I continue on in time. I've chopped up Eric Vanel's mythological maps from the Guide (digitally!) and am going to overlay them just to see if anything interesting pops up. Tadafall and then Earthfall are the defining battles of the Great Darkness, the later likely shattering the Garden and causing it's pieces to start drifting off. Waha tied them together ready for the Dawn. So the Wastes are a mixed up version of the original area, with only the Krjalki Bog being anchored in the correct place. Prax never separated due to Eiritha's presence and that's why it retained it's fertility. The border is clearly Zola Fel who clung on while leaping to fill the Chaos Void where the Spike was.

The Battlefield of Tadafall is likely not in its original place and my candidate is now Greydust:

Quote

This area is where the forces of Genert initially met the Chaos hordes; their blood has mingled with the Chaos of the victors to produce a poisonous grey dust.

Looking at how the chaos army entered the Garden, this also likely all that is left of Tada's land. Although Tada's Loincloth is lost, there is a touch of fertility left here with grazing every 4 years. 

The Tunnelled Hills are likely the remains of a fallen god - I'd say Yamsur. Star Crystal Mountain is where Pole Star fought the Chaos gods Tien and Thed. I'd suggest at the side of Yamsur, his blood spilling on his dying body. There's no trace of Yamsur there now except as an adventure hook.

The Vast Teeth Hills, Toothstone grassland and some of the 5 eyes area are likely parts of All Eyes Open But One.

[metcalph]

Umm, where is Greydust?  I see it in the text but can't see it on the map.

More importantly, there's a bit of a problem in the material in that being killed by chaos, his supporters manage to inter him in the elaborate (for the period) Tada's High Tumulus.  

[David Scott]

53 minutes ago, metcalph said:

Umm, where is Greydust?  I see it in the text but can't see it on the map.

Just to the North of the Tunnelled Hills:

You can also see Greydust at the top of page 30 in the AAA, but it suffers from being on a page cut.

Quote

More importantly, there's a bit of a problem in the material in that being killed by chaos, his supporters manage to inter him in the elaborate (for the period) Tada's High Tumulus.  

For me there's a difference between being killed by chaos and being destroyed by chaos. There's also a spectrum between. Gods destroyed completely by chaos are consumed by it - no trace, even the name is gone, like some of Genert's sons. The next "level" is a bit remains, so we know their names, like Seolinthur and Yamsur. Genert and Tada were killed but not consumed completely, hence the Grisly Portions and the whole Hyena thing.

As for Tada's burial - he's buried in his tent! 

 

Quote

(Earth Rune) Tada's Tent

Outside of the Wide Plains can often be seen a huge tent, the shape of a tumulus. This is the home of the great warrior Tada, defender of Genert’s Garden. Tada’s Tent sits in the Green Age, Storm Age and the Great Darkness.

In the Green Age his tent is striking in its colors, upon its sides are rich scenes and symbols of the world around. Goddesses lounge outside ready to experience the fertility of the land. Tada is inside, and no one would disturb him in his business.

In the Storm Age Tada and his people are often away from his tent fighting with his those who would disturb the peace of Genert’s Garden. Sometimes powerful heroes, priestesses and shaman who are able visit can meet him. Tada always welcomes them in and always shows them his most important weapon and how he uses it. Many birth or sire great Khans after this visit. Lesser visitors may meet his warriors camped around his tent and befriend one of them.

In the Great Darkness his tent is empty. The ragged tent is torn and dirty, the pictures and symbols on the side are scorched and faint. The tent flaps are ragged, open and blowing in a foul wind, monsters now live inside and await the unwary. Visitors who are diligent may meet one of his warriors, beaten and dying who tell of Tadafall and that his Grisly Portions have been secretly hidden.

By the end of the Great Darkness, Tada’s survivors recovered as much as they could of his body. They placed his dismembered pieces inside his tent and covered it with great rocks and stones. The bodies of his fallen warriors were laid nearby to defend the cairn. The survivors moved away, disguising themselves and hiding in unlikely places. In the Underworld, no one recognised them and the secret of the Grisly Portions was safe. 

 

Visible in the distance

Genert’s Garden, the Greener, the Spike.

 

At the Edges

Genert’s Garden.

 

Who can be met there?

Tada, Warriors, Goddesses in the Green Age.

 

Middle World connections

Tada's Tumulus is Tada's burial mound, but it provides no access to his tent. Only when the Grisly Portion prophesy is fulfilled can the connection be remade.

 

Associated societies

None

 

 

Edited August 28, 2016 by David Scott

[Noita]

Tada's tent! wow I love this. 

I have crystals made of Yamsur's blood in my game and the Tunnelled Hills are his body like you suggested. I too have a hook where a part of him survived and is what Lasseter's reef (From Sun County book) is.

 

Who was All Eyes Open But One?

[jajagappa]

3 hours ago, David Scott said:

As for Tada's burial - he's buried in his tent! 

Agree with Iskallor - love it!

[David Scott]

3 hours ago, Iskallor said:

Who was All Eyes Open But One?

He's hidden on page 70 of the Guide - in the Dragonewts section...

[David Scott]

Here's the corrected grazing map for Prax with water features turned on. The corrections are mainly moving grazing borders to match rivers.

I've also done a catchment layer that was helpful in aligning the grazing and borders of prax. If you are not familiar with catchment basins - this basically shows where rainfall in a particular area goes or stays. In Prax there is clearly a link with the oases and one catchment is associated with the Copper Caves.

Afterthought: All water courses are shown solid even if seasonal.

Edited August 30, 2016 by David Scott
corrected autocorrect and added afterthought

[M Helsdon]

2 hours ago, David Scott said:

All water courses are shown solid even if seasonal.

How stable are the Serpents, Dave? Do they always follow the same beds?

[David Scott]

14 minutes ago, M Helsdon said:

How stable are the Serpents, Dave? Do they always follow the same beds?

I've looked at flash floods quite extensively. At it's simplest level rain water gets channelled by differences in ground level - it always travels to the lowest point possible. If the surface is hard and it has a natural direction (dip) it goes that way. If a softer surface - it starts to carve a course. It's the latter that has more effect in the Wastes - there are dry river beds (Wadis) that may contain multiple channels in their flood plain. Material can get moved about, vegetation grows and deflects the water a bit - a new channel is carved. So the answer is most of the time, but over time can change. In the Wastes it's Waha fighting the serpents thats normally causes them to change course to protect the grazing and herds.

[M Helsdon]

3 hours ago, David Scott said:

In the Wastes it's Waha fighting the serpents thats normally causes them to change course to protect the grazing and herds.

Especially the Wicked Writher?

[David Scott]

The wicked writher is a sort of mythic event. I'm not sure of its exact mechanism at the moment. Fighting the wicked writher is different as the water goes the other way. My feeling is that it's a positive thing returning water to the wastes.  

[M Helsdon]

1 hour ago, David Scott said:

The wicked writher is a sort of mythic event. I'm not sure of its exact mechanism at the moment. Fighting the wicked writher is different as the water goes the other way. My feeling is that it's a positive thing returning water to the wastes.  

The Writher does seem to be a good spirit in that it is forcing water out of Dead Bottom where it would otherwise be lost, but why does Waha fight it? The fight seems to be ongoing, with Bison Khans travelling to the Bison Khan and Rainman Grasslands to prove themselves khans.

[Noita]

Waha fights for possession of the water for his people and the Writher is defending it. The Khans in my game if they win ensure plentiful water and feed for a whole year. The event was the start of my current campaign.

[davecake]

I have quite a bit of experience travelling through the dry arid parts of central Australia, and the river beds are very stable and distinct, even if they are entirely made of sand and rock and might run only every few years. 

[Noita]

7 hours ago, davecake said:

I have quite a bit of experience travelling through the dry arid parts of central Australia, and the river beds are very stable and distinct, even if they are entirely made of sand and rock and might run only every few years. 

I use this area to fuel my imagination when describing parts of the Wastes.

[Darius West]

In Australia their "rivers" are essentially trench-like depressions in the ground filled with rocks, as you would find in a Japanese ornamental garden without water.  These rocky trails could easily be mistaken for paths, and were very evident when I last visited Adelaide a couple of years ago.  However they all exploded into life last week with the heavy rains and brought the city to a standstill.  My father had the questionable fortune of being caught in the action during an interstate meeting. 

[Darius West]

Now, who was Hender and what are his ruins all about?

[Noita]

A ghost place. I'd love to know too.

[7Tigers]

On 10/7/2016 at 5:18 AM, Darius West said:

Now, who was Hender and what are his ruins all about?

Some info here:
https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/wp-content/uploads/www.glorantha.com-forums/www.glorantha.com/forums/topic/henders-ruins-myth-and-history/

Edited November 8, 2020 by 7Tigers
Link edited

[David Scott]

The link that @7Tigers posted above has the info you are looking for. As for Hender, I'm sure you know it was named for Steve Henderson, some of the other names involved are mentioned here:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/224590870/runequest-classic-edition/posts/1442570?cursor=12051828

The ruins were known to the Praxians just after the Dawn as a few of the tribes started their migration to their ancestral grazings of the Bison Plains (Bison) and the Good (Sable) and Better (High Llama) Places. Although the grazing is good there, it's likely that they would have gone round the rise rather than herded over it. Hender was likely one of the first council "missionaries" that entered Prax from Dragon Pass in 35. It's likely they had some meaningful encounter there that caused the name to stick. It's not a Praxian name, as Praxians call the ruins Jaldon's Ease. You can see a picture of the ruins in Guide or in the banner of my profile page here.

Edited October 7, 2016 by David Scott

[g33k]

On 8/21/2016 at 9:20 AM, pachristian said:

I, for one, have always rejected "it works that way because it's magic" argument. Ecosystems work in the real world for a reason, and when you override a variable for convenience sake, saying "it's magic" you risk throwing the whole system into disarray. And players are very quick to exploit that disarray. 

Generally, the "because it's magic" hand-wave is unsatisfying, I agree.

The thing with Prax and the Wastes is that "because it's magic" happens all the way back at the issue of how/why it's so un-fertile.  It is an artificially-hostile environment (from a real-world ecosystems perspective).  "It's Magic" isn't just a dose of handwavium used to conveniently explain Random Gloranthan Wierdness -- it's woven into the fabric of this ecosystem.

And thus, so too is the solution -- beginning with the Compact, and presumably various Gods&Goddesses & Spirits & Heroes and so-forth working to heal things further, with the ambition I think to utterly restore  Genert's Garden (however much a hazia-dream that might be).

It's Glorantha -- of course it's magic!

 

Edited October 7, 2016 by g33k
fixed grammar, edit for consistent usage.

[Mankcam]

2 hours ago, g33k said:

It's Glorantha -- of course it's magic!

This!

Reality is magic in Glorantha. Where one starts and finishes is irrelevant and illogical, as it's all one and the same. Magic is woven so much into the ecosystem to such a point that it IS the ecosystem. It's all magic. It's all reality. Some elements are just more fantastical than others.

Yes it's the ultimate 'handwavium', but it's also the ultimate Rationale as well!

 

Edited October 7, 2016 by Mankcam

[pachristian]

Reality in our world is magic as well.

Go ahead, prove to me that the desertification of the north Sahara was not caused by humans failing to properly respect the land spirits.

Prove to me that hurricane Matthew is not being caused by angry wind spirits.

[David Scott]

Next installment of Praxians history coming soon. I'll start a new thread as this one has gone a bit off track.

[kalidor]

On 24/8/2016 at 10:25 PM, Darius West said:

Rainfall has no effect on fertility?  None?  What about the fact that Rhinos need to drink then?  Personally I think magic potentially provides a huge edge, but there are basic laws of life that are pretty unalterable.  On the other hand I would definitely reduce the effectiveness of Orlanth's rain spells by half in the wastes as it is not his land.

As for Waha not allowing things... Tell that to Unicorn Tribe, the Zebra Tribe, and the Pol Joni.  Does Waha allow Sable Riders to go join the Antelope Lancers and follow the Lunar Way?  Or allow Storm Bulls to team up with Orlanthi via Uroxi middlemen?  I am sure Waha isn't overjoyed at how the Ostrich Tribes and the Unicorn Tribes have ties to the Yelm Pantheon either, or how there are Agimori and Basmoli wandering Prax.  Also, where do the Oasis people fit in things?  In short, I am sure that deities don't smite their worshippers for cutting deals with people who give them a survival edge.  If a few families devote themselves to another deity or spirit that benefits the tribe, nobody will care provided their first loyalty ultimately remains to the tribe, and the tribe's first loyalty remains to Waha's Pantheon.  It is a bit like having a shaman of thunderbird in the tribe.

I also remember a reference to Wind Khans of Orlanth at Pairing Stone. 

Forget about rain fertility effects in our planet. Earth powers to sustain life have being badly damaged. It is not a question i think about "matter" is about energy and myth.