What is the difference between RuneQuest Classic and Mythras Core Rules?

[styopa]

57 minutes ago, Zit said:

Just keep in mind that surrender or run away comes much more often as the best option in Runequest (and in general in D100 games) than in AD&D. Well prepared tactics can save the day. This brings true adrenaline to the game, as Pentallion noticed.

This x1000.  Doesn't matter which version of RQ you play.

I'd strongly recommend reading the RQ6 quickstart rules (http://thedesignmechanism.com/resources/RuneQuest Essentials.pdf) to get a feel for the flavor of them.  They appeal very strongly to some players.  It's not a long read.

[g33k]

5 hours ago, styopa said:

I'd strongly recommend reading the RQ6 quickstart rules (http://thedesignmechanism.com/resources/RuneQuest Essentials.pdf) to get a feel for the flavor of them.  They appeal very strongly to some players.  It's not a long read.

Or an even shorter read, the "Mythras Imperative" rules...  http://thedesignmechanism.com/resources/TDM110 Mythras Imperative.pdf

 

[Nick J.]

I'll just throw in my own experiences as another one of those AD&D lifers who finally stumbled onto D100 gaming somewhat recently. Magic World was the first system to really 'click' for me. YMMV, but I found it to be the most approachable and digestible of the d100 fantasy games I tried to grapple with (the first being RuneQuest 6 (now Mythras) then OpenQuest2, then Legend, then Magic World.).

Lots of a flavors to choose from. Good luck!

[MOB]

On 9/26/2016 at 6:27 PM, groovyclam said:

Just to help Raven with the pedigree of the game and editions...

Hope this helps.

Nice summary Groovyclam!

And Geek and Sundry just published an article giving reasons why a game that came out ""when bell-bottoms were cool" is still so popular: http://geekandsundry.com/4-reasons-you-need-to-play-this-38-year-old-rpg-now/ 

[Raven Shadowz]

1 hour ago, MOB said:

Nice summary Groovyclam!

And Geek and Sundry just published an article giving reasons why a game that came out ""when bell-bottoms were cool" is still so popular: http://geekandsundry.com/4-reasons-you-need-to-play-this-38-year-old-rpg-now/ 

Thank you very much, I enjoyed the article very much

[groovyclam]

@Raven

If you do go for RuneQuest 2nd Edition ( a.k.a. "RuneQuest Classic" ) and set your games in Glorantha then I recommend the "Glorantha Classics" line of PDFs/books available from Chaosium here:

http://www.chaosium.com/glorantha-classics/

These are facelifted versions of original Chaosium Glorantha supplements from the late-70s/early-80s designed for RuneQuest 2nd Edition.

All but "Griffin Mountain" amalgamate 2 or more supplements into one PDF.

All of them incorporate error corrections and some new material here and there as well as being facelifted by modern methods of page layout and typesetting.

[jux]

On 9/25/2016 at 10:48 PM, Raven Shadowz said:

RuneQuest Classic is the system I prefer. 

If you prefer RQ Classic for the simplicity and if you have D&D background - which would mean you want a generic fantasy system - without built in Glorantha stuff.

Then choose OpenQuest - the best steppingstone to d100 fantasy gaming. The system is free:
http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/127007/OpenQuest-2-Basic-Edition

[TrippyHippy]

I have only actually played RQ6/Mythras but I did get Classic RuneQuest when the Kickstarter came out. 

While some people could argue about differences in play, to me a lot of the differences in Mythras are essentially extrapolations on stuff that existed in Classic RuneQuest. The special effects, for example, builds on what you had already with 'impales' - but just adds more colourful options. 

The main difference between the two, however, was in character generation. In Mythras, it takes the package build model, so that you choose a Culture & Career as a package that defines your initial skill sets as well as your identity to a degree. Base skills are calculated directly from Characteristics and things like background events can be randomly rolled or chosen. You have an extra set of skill points at the end to spend as you like, but it is a pretty standardised and simple process. Characters can then, optionally albeit prudently, be developed through memberships of cults and guilds who can provide them with certain skills and magic. 

In Classic RuneQuest, though, you roll your characteristics and then you have to make choices about who is going to train you to have any skills at all. You basically have to go in debt in order to train in skills, via cults and guilds which means consequently you really have to be indebted to one in order to have a halfway decent character at the start of the game. Skills can also be developed through prior experience, although this is only really developed as an idea in the appendixes. As such, the cults are more instrumental in the development of characters because there not just a carrot for more powers - but you actually have to pay them off first, and as such you need to adventure in order to make enough money! It is reminiscent of the mortgages you have to pay off for Traveller's starships which seems to have been written at a similar period of game development. 

[Mankcam]

I greatly prefer the Character Generation from RQ6/Mythras to that of RQ2, as it feels a logical step from where things were heading in RQ3 where Culture, Social Class, and Profession are taken into consideration.

I hope CRQ4 does not return to the more rudimentary char gen of RQ2 which mainly took Social Class into background consideration.

RQ2 also encouraged  the option of having higher starting skills which were dependent upon whichever teachers were chosen. It was an interesting approach to start off already in debt to a guild or cult, although I don't remember it being all that appealing to start off like that every time.

The RQ2 approach does have flavour, although I prefer the versatility of char gen from other BRP games ( CoC, SB, RQ6/Mythras), so I hope CRQ4 is not too much like RQ2 in this respect.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Mankcam

[Jeff]

RQ4 chargen uses the following steps:

1. Homeland and family background (figure out your past history and a quick crash course in the setting). This will affect some skills, passions, etc. This is the longest, but also most entertaining/interesting part of chargen (and quite reminiscent of creating your clan in KoDP).

2. Pick your Runes. 

3. Determine your characteristics.

4. Pick your occupation - each occupation comes with a skill package.

5. Pick your cult - each cult comes with a skill and magic package.

6. Add personal interest points.

7. Determine your Family Gift (magical item, special gear, etc.) and Reputation (based on family background, occupation, and potentially Family Gift).

Done. 

[Mankcam]

Sounds great Jeff. 

The Homeland/Family Background, Runes, Family Gifts, and Reputation all sound like great facets to add to RQ character generation.

Looking forward to seeing how this works out!

Edited October 6, 2016 by Mankcam

[Jeff]

The various skill packages are set packages (e.g., primary weapon +25%, underwater basket-weaving +20%, etc, all as part of a package). Even the personal interest skills are written as "raise four different skills +25% and raise other five skills +10%." I'm not a fan of having to spend time and thought trying to figure out how many of my 150 (or however many) points that could go to occupational skills *should* go there - especially since if I am new to the system I don't necessarily have a good idea what mix makes rules sense. And I found RQ3's approach of multiplying the age over 15 by the skill multiplier was both tedious and meant that a minimaxing player should always play a 27 year old character.

[Mankcam]

The concept of cultures was good in RQ3, but the career experience was extremely fiddly and tedious, and really needs to be left back in 1984.

I do prefer the simple notion of adding a set of meaningful amounts to skills during the char gen process. This was an area that I think the char gen from Magic World was very good at, it really made things simple and it quickly defined where the character's strengths were.

I'm glad  you are putting a similar notion in place for the various skill packages, I think it's sensible, quick, and should work very well.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Mankcam

[styopa]

4 hours ago, Mankcam said:

The concept of cultures was good in RQ3, but the career experience was extremely fiddly and tedious, and really needs to be left back in 1984.

I do prefer the simple notion of adding a set of meaningful amounts to skills during the char gen process. This was an area that I think the char gen from Magic World was very good at, it really made things simple and it quickly defined where the character's strengths were.

I'm glad  you are putting a similar notion in place for the various skill packages, I think it's sensible, quick, and should work very well.

I think that  cumulative "packets" of skills could be based on every stage of character development:

Occupation: has a skill packet

Cult: has a skill packet

Homeland, Culture, history - each could also result in skill packets.

Hell, you could even say that there are skills that result from picking/favoring certain runes at character generation, rationalizing that they represent the personality of the individual up to that point.

[RosenMcStern]

1 hour ago, styopa said:

Hell, you could even say that there are skills that result from picking/favoring certain runes at character generation, rationalizing that they represent the personality of the individual up to that point.

Also known as "Step six" of the BGB.

[soltakss]

On 10/6/2016 at 9:05 AM, Mankcam said:

I greatly prefer the Character Generation from RQ6/Mythras to that of RQ2, as it feels a logical step from where things were heading in RQ3 where Culture, Social Class, and Profession are taken into consideration.

Mythras' Character Generation is the best that I have seen in a RuneQuest-Family product.

[DreadDomain]

On ‎6‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 9:59 PM, Jeff said:

The various skill packages are set packages (e.g., primary weapon +25%, underwater basket-weaving +20%, etc, all as part of a package). Even the personal interest skills are written as "raise four different skills +25% and raise other five skills +10%." I'm not a fan of having to spend time and thought trying to figure out how many of my 150 (or however many) points that could go to occupational skills *should* go there - especially since if I am new to the system I don't necessarily have a good idea what mix makes rules sense. And I found RQ3's approach of multiplying the age over 15 by the skill multiplier was both tedious and meant that a minimaxing player should always play a 27 year old character.

It never was an issue for us in RQ3 as we did choose age based on concept rather than minmax. I thought generation in RQ2 was more tedious than in RQ3 and in fact loved how age directly impacted skills in RQ3. It felt very organic. However...

On ‎6‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 9:17 PM, Jeff said:

RQ4 chargen uses the following steps:

1. Homeland and family background (figure out your past history and a quick crash course in the setting). This will affect some skills, passions, etc. This is the longest, but also most entertaining/interesting part of chargen (and quite reminiscent of creating your clan in KoDP).

2. Pick your Runes. 

3. Determine your characteristics.

4. Pick your occupation - each occupation comes with a skill package.

5. Pick your cult - each cult comes with a skill and magic package.

6. Add personal interest points.

7. Determine your Family Gift (magical item, special gear, etc.) and Reputation (based on family background, occupation, and potentially Family Gift).

Done. 

...looks like an even better approach. RQ was the game to hardcode in my brain that the best chargen was all about choosing race, culture, homeland, occupation and so on instead of race/class and level. That background will be so ingrained in the process is a definite plus.

1) How will characteristics be determine? Assign points? Roll dice? Different options?

2) Will there be options to start older/younger or less or more powerful (having more skill points to distribute, a generation method that drives the characteristics up)?

3) Will age influence skills at all?

4) A stated goal was to make this edition a true % system (as opposed to RQ2 who only had skills in 5% increment). From what I understand, skill bases will be in 5% increments, skill packs will be in 5% increments, skill distribution will be in 5% increments, skill bonuses from characteristics will be in 5% increments so am I correct to say that starting characters will have all of their skills in 5% increments? What makes the skill system %based then? Experience can be gain in 1% increments? Critical/special/fumble values can have none 5% increment values?

So far the chargen of the new edition sounds very promising.

Thanks,

DD

[styopa]

FWIW and parallel to the subject of the thread, were there any rules-changes from RQ6 to Mythras?  /curious

Edited October 10, 2016 by styopa

[Mugen]

13 hours ago, styopa said:

FWIW and parallel to the subject of the thread, were there any rules-changes from RQ6 to Mythras?  /curious

I did not check it myself, but, AFAIK, there were no change at all.

[Mankcam]

I only have Mythras Imperative, and from the outset I cannot see any major changes in character generation or game mechanics. Mythras Imperative is obviously a trimmed down version of the full rules, so there may be some changes in the full rules.  

I think the only things I have come across so far in Mythras Imperative is that the term 'Strike Rank' is now 'Initiative'; and the RQ3-style Hit Location figure on the character sheet has been replaced by a Hit Location list (I preferred how it looked in RQ6)

I cannot justify buying the full edition of Mythras, considering I already have RQ6. I thought I'ld support the authors by at least getting the smaller version, and perhaps I'll get the next full edition if I suspect there are significant rules changes. 

AFAIK there hasn't been sweeping changes other than the re-branding of the system, and I presume that the actual text itself may been consolidated and rewritten in some places.

At least the RQ6 supplements are fully compatible with Mythras, and vice versa; that was a good move.

Edited October 11, 2016 by Mankcam

[lawrence.whitaker]

This is a comparison Groovyclam posted on the TDM forums.

http://designmechanism.freeforums.org/mythras-core-rulebook-differences-to-rq6-rulebook-t1690.html

[styopa]

1 hour ago, lawrence.whitaker said:

This is a comparison Groovyclam posted on the TDM forums.

http://designmechanism.freeforums.org/mythras-core-rulebook-differences-to-rq6-rulebook-t1690.html

Thanks, perfect.