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Another sell me thread :)


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On 4/16/2017 at 5:27 AM, soltakss said:

I would think that it would be something similar to:

  • Storm Bull (17, Berserker, Face Chaos, Spirit of Law, Earthpower)

Casting Earthpower would use the Storm Bull Pool as Eiritha gives Earthpower to Storm Bull. 

A Storm Bull worshipper who also worships Waha might have:

  • Storm Bull (17, Berserker, Face Chaos, Summon Spirit of Law, Earthpower)
  • Waha (4, Speak to Beasts, Cremate Dead)

He could cast the Summon Spirit of Law using either the Storm Bull or Waha Pools, even though the spell is against the Storm Bull Pool.

Of course, until the rules come out, this is pure speculation.

 

Except, as I understand it, each pool is available to cast ANY spell that god provides, so wouldn't each line in that case be the full list of spells you could get from Storm Bull and Waha respectively?  Seems like that could end up being long lists.

 

7 hours ago, Jusmak said:

About cinematic aspect (which has nothing to do with realism) of RQ2/3 and Mythras, I like there is in both systems many possibilities to do with a character. But saying Mythras is more cinematic because of special effects, which are always read from piece of paper same way is cinematic? 

I think in this context 'cinematic' is used specifically to refer to combat that is less realistic, more demonstrative & flashy; part of that too is an improbable reduction in lethality.  Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon had very cinematic fights, for example. 

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16 hours ago, Jusmak said:

About cinematic aspect (which has nothing to do with realism) of RQ2/3 and Mythras, I like there is in both systems many possibilities to do with a character. But saying Mythras is more cinematic because of special effects, which are always read from piece of paper same way is cinematic? 

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I played rolemaster too long and I grew allergic reading same effects in every encounter, as player has nothing else to do than throw dice. Others think it is cinematic play. To me it is crap.

It is "cinematic" in that it offers storytelling/event style combat -- "oh no!  My leg is too injured to hold me up... I fall, desperately parrying from the ground, as blows rain down from above."

You don't have to "read from the paper" or even narrate it colorfully:  it is self-evident in the Special Effect, or the Critical Hit to the Leg, or what-have-you.  Yes, it's just a roll of the dice, but the outcome inherently has story, and is "cinematic."

This is understood to be in contrast to the "whittle down a log made of hitpoints" model of combat, where every blow (large or small) comes off the same pool of HPs and only carries as much interest as "oooo, a big hit!" or "awww, minimum damage... failsauce!"

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7 hours ago, g33k said:

It is "cinematic" in that it offers storytelling/event style combat -- "oh no!  My leg is too injured to hold me up... I fall, desperately parrying from the ground, as blows rain down from above."

You don't have to "read from the paper" or even narrate it colorfully:  it is self-evident in the Special Effect, or the Critical Hit to the Leg, or what-have-you.  Yes, it's just a roll of the dice, but the outcome inherently has story, and is "cinematic."

This is understood to be in contrast to the "whittle down a log made of hitpoints" model of combat, where every blow (large or small) comes off the same pool of HPs and only carries as much interest as "oooo, a big hit!" or "awww, minimum damage... failsauce!"

Just my experience, that reading from paper leads that kind of repetition, which  becomes eventually boring. While there lies possibilities to describe blows any way imaginable, if certain tables were not used at all. If there is no exitement and imagination in storytelling, why play at all...  Playsystem becomes then irrelevant. But some people can do more storytelling without tables.

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6 minutes ago, Jusmak said:

Just my experience, that reading from paper leads that kind of repetition, which  becomes eventually boring. While there lies possibilities to describe blows any way imaginable, if certain tables were not used at all. If there is no exitement and imagination in storytelling, why play at all...  Playsystem becomes then irrelevant. But some people can do more storytelling without tables.

My own experience is that nobody "reads from paper" (ymmv).  The GM asks which Special Effect(s) the player chooses; the player names them (or occasionally says "that one where you hit where you want" or other description); the GM reports the result (hopefully with narrative interest).

 

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55 minutes ago, g33k said:

My own experience is that nobody "reads from paper" (ymmv).  The GM asks which Special Effect(s) the player chooses; the player names them (or occasionally says "that one where you hit where you want" or other description); the GM reports the result (hopefully with narrative interest).

 

In rolemaster we had that kind of problem. Not saying, it automatically leads same end result in Mythras system. Playing became heavily oriented dicerolling and reading, without choosing part of player. It felt more like bookkeeping. Encounters was chosen usually randomly into extent, that those only disturbed actual adventuring goal. Players were constantly dying in encounters, which had no relations to anything meaningful. Only thing player could get was meaningless trinkets after some thrill of meaningless battle.

We shortly tried Mystras/RQ6, but it was new system and game itself did not change playing style. Even, that there are those ideas to encourage cinematic play, but were instead used like tactical and analytical way. Thinking and pondering aloud different possibilities, solutions, which effects to choose... and soon using every time only trip opponent. That playtime was worst ever, and made me abandon long time playing group. It became too clear, that any game can be made uninteresting. Pickering about houserules, but not actually playing... So, how much does it matter if simulation is made by free improvisation or some set of ready tables. If done fighting sports, those tables may prove unrealistic or partly even absurd and ridiculous as in rolemaster. As a practioner of combat sports (aikido, MMA, thai boxing), it is intriguing idea to improvise my own techniques in fantasy rolepalying game. Games with set tables do not allow it. 

Tables in Mythras however are not same way described like rolemaster tables. Whole rulesystem is represented more like options or suggestions to mechanically simulate what player wants to do. In that system it is more like how rigid or flexible way gm sees to use it. But problem is, that it's gone too heavily into "effects". Do I remember right, that person cannot stand by his own will up during combat, if he happens to fall? Does he need to roll SE? After all it is very easy to stand up, you just get probably hit.

 

 

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In my experience, RoleMaster (fondly (or not so fondly) nicknamed "ChartMaster") relied so-heavily on so many charts that were each so dense, that virtually nobody could actually remember most of the content.  You HAD to look up the meaning of most rolls (not 66, of course).

Mythras' "Special Effects" may need book-consultation at first, but most players become conversant with most of the choices after a while,and the lookup no longer is necessary.

YMMV

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On 4/18/2017 at 2:38 PM, styopa said:

Except, as I understand it, each pool is available to cast ANY spell that god provides, so wouldn't each line in that case be the full list of spells you could get from Storm Bull and Waha respectively?  Seems like that could end up being long lists. 

I don't know, the rules aren't out yet ;)

Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. 

www.soltakss.com/index.html

Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here

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On 19/04/2017 at 9:08 AM, Jusmak said:

Do I remember right, that person cannot stand by his own will up during combat, if he happens to fall? Does he need to roll SE? After all it is very easy to stand up, you just get probably hit.

Well, there is a "Regain footing" action, but it stipulates you must not be engaged with an opponent to perform it.

I must say that makes sense to me.

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1 hour ago, Mugen said:

Well, there is a "Regain footing" action, but it stipulates you must not be engaged with an opponent to perform it.

I must say that makes sense to me.

You're describing the RQ6 version.  Mythras modified it slightly to allow use of Regain Footing while engaged, but you must win an opposed Brawn or Athletics test or the action fails.

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14 hours ago, soltakss said:

I don't know, the rules aren't out yet ;)

You should read the designer notes, chap 14:

"...But with Rune points, you don't pre-buy specific Rune spells. Instead you can spend your Rune points to cast ANY spell known to your cult and subcult. ..."

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24 minutes ago, nDervish said:

You're describing the RQ6 version.  Mythras modified it slightly to allow use of Regain Footing while engaged, but you must win an opposed Brawn or Athletics test or the action fails.

Fine. That's how I would have houseruled it on the fly if a player asked to do it. :)

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