creativehum

Reprinting the RuneQuest Classic Books

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Note that that the "Runequest Classic" line is the recently-Kickstarted line of old 2nd-edition Chaosium books, reprinted from the very-late-70s through very-early-80s.

But you appear to be asking about the MoonDesign-originated "Gloranthan Classics" series, which is a different thing (I was recently tripped up by making that same mistake).  I don't know that they have firmly stated the intent to keep those in print, or have firmly stated otherwise (they HAVE said they don't plan to do any more in that vein, so don't expect a "Vol. V" in the series).

 

 

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Posted (edited)

I am sure I remember reading that there are no plans to do any more print versions of Moon Design's compiled Gloranthan Classics books, although the pdf versions will remain available (unsure for how long)

It sounds like the plan for the print run will be to release all those original RQ2 titles as reprints of their original publications, under the RQ Classic line. I suspect they will all be in pdf version as well. 

Its a shame, as I was waiting for a compiled volume of Trollpak in the Gloranthan Classics line. I also missed the compiled Pavis & Big Rubble hardcover. No worries, I will just have to wait for the RQ Classic versions now.

Edited by Mankcam
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1 hour ago, Mankcam said:

I am sure I remember reading that there are no plans to do any more print versions of Moon Design's compiled Gloranthan Classics books, although the pdf versions will remain available (unsure for how long)

I know they said they weren't going to extend the line with more volumes; but they also said (separately) that nothing has to stay out of print, as POD-tech improves.  I don't recall (but could have missed) a statement that they definitively would not reprint the "Gloranthan Classics" line as they ran out.  So I'm unclear if the "Gloranthan Classics" will slowly go OOP to PDF-only, or if reprints/POD ate planned (or just considered).  I suspect they haven't taken the time for a considered definitive answer, as a low-priority item given all their ambitious projects on the table...

2 hours ago, Mankcam said:

It sounds like the plan for the print run will be to release all those original RQ2 titles as reprints of their original publications, under the RQ Classic line. I suspect they will all be in pdf version as well. 

Yes, the PDF's will be released to KS-backers (and go through "Tribal Editing"); I'm not sure where in that process the general availability comes, but I know that it does happen  Once all of the PDFs are done, they plan to get the whole lot done up in a massive print order.  

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/224590870/runequest-classic-edition/posts/1849154

2 hours ago, Mankcam said:

Its a shame, as I was waiting for a compiled volume of Trollpak in the Gloranthan Classics line. I also missed the compiled Pavis & Big Rubble hardcover. No worries, I will just have to wait for the RQ Classic versions now.

I added those specific volumes to my KS pledge -- Pavis, Trollpak, Big Rubble.  What I really want is the physical volumes.  The only one I REALLY REALLY think is better in the Gloranthan Classics all-under-one-cover format is Cult Compendium -- CoP + CoT + several other sources... F'ing brilliant, that book.  If he ever makes it out to the SF Bay Area, I owe @Rick Meints a beer or something for that alone.  I dunno... maybe if I'd gotten P&BR while it was still in-print, I'd owe him two.

 

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3 hours ago, Mankcam said:

I am sure I remember reading that there are no plans to do any more print versions of Moon Design's compiled Gloranthan Classics books, although the pdf versions will remain available (unsure for how long)

It sounds like the plan for the print run will be to release all those original RQ2 titles as reprints of their original publications, under the RQ Classic line. I suspect they will all be in pdf version as well. 

Its a shame, as I was waiting for a compiled volume of Trollpak in the Gloranthan Classics line. I also missed the compiled Pavis & Big Rubble hardcover. No worries, I will just have to wait for the RQ Classic versions now.

That'd be too bad.  I never bought the RQ3/AH version because their money-grubbing splitting of Trollpak into what, 3 different products? always bugged me.

Trollpak was magnificent.  I would have loved a comparable treatment of Aldryami and Mostali to complete the set.  What we got in Elder Secrets was so abbreviated & pretty weak - hell, the Dobyski illustrations alone still haunt me.

I ran a very short interstitial campaign that was all Elves with people that had been pretty experienced Gloranthan players (so they tried not to just play them like humans with elf-masks on), so I'd had to drum up a much more substantial treatment of elves that kept them relatively alien, not to mention fearsome in their home woods.

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Posted (edited)

47 minutes ago, styopa said:

That'd be too bad.  I never bought the RQ3/AH version because their money-grubbing splitting of Trollpak into what, 3 different products? always bugged me.

Trollpak was magnificent.  I would have loved a comparable treatment of Aldryami and Mostali to complete the set.  What we got in Elder Secrets was so abbreviated & pretty weak - hell, the Dobyski illustrations alone still haunt me.

I ran a very short interstitial campaign that was all Elves with people that had been pretty experienced Gloranthan players (so they tried not to just play them like humans with elf-masks on), so I'd had to drum up a much more substantial treatment of elves that kept them relatively alien, not to mention fearsome in their home woods.

The Aldyrami are a race that I would like still like a trollpack style approach to.

Currently we have the Cult of Aldyra from CoPrax, The elder races from RQ3 stuff that is thin, and MRQ book that is more developed but possibly completely off point.

Limited stuff from elsewhere.

The guide again is a view from 20,000 meters.

Any other sources which i have missed?

Edited by Jon Hunter

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The other useful source is the Belintars Book excerpt about the Aldryami http://www.glorantha.com/docs/aldryas-own-story/

in particular, this helps bridge the Guide (very god learnerised - e.g. All the gods are given their generic human name) with the version given in the MRQ book (elven deity names, etc)

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1 hour ago, davecake said:

The other useful source is the Belintars Book excerpt about the Aldryami http://www.glorantha.com/docs/aldryas-own-story/

in particular, this helps bridge the Guide (very god learnerised - e.g. All the gods are given their generic human name) with the version given in the MRQ book (elven deity names, etc)

Never saw that, that's really good.  Thanks!

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20 hours ago, g33k said:

I know they said they weren't going to extend the line with more volumes; but they also said (separately) that nothing has to stay out of print, as POD-tech improves.  I don't recall (but could have missed) a statement that they definitively would not reprint the "Gloranthan Classics" line as they ran out.  So I'm unclear if the "Gloranthan Classics" will slowly go OOP to PDF-only, or if reprints/POD ate planned (or just considered).  I suspect they haven't taken the time for a considered definitive answer, as a low-priority item given all their ambitious projects on the table...

Agreed. I'm sure it was just the hardback versions of the Glorantha Classics that Rick said they didn't plan to reprint, and that they would consider reprinting the softbacks.

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On 4/18/2017 at 9:06 PM, creativehum said:

Two of the RuneQuest Classics seem to be only available in PDF. (Griffin Mountain, Pavis & Big Rubble)

Are there plans to reprint them?

I have answered this question a few times on other forum threads, but here it is in more detail:

There are 4 volumes in the Moon Design Publications "Gloranthan Classics" series: Pavis & Big Rubble (1999), Griffin Mountain (2001), Cult Compendium (2002), and Borderlands & Beyond (2005). There are no plans to do any more volumes in that series. Could we do more volumes, sure. Will we do more volumes, probably not. I don't like to say "never", but that is very very very likely to be the case. PDFs of all 4 volumes will remain available. Printed versions of the last two volumes are still available for sale on Chaosium.com and both have a decent stock of books left, so I would be surprised if they don't last a while. 

Will you reprint the first two volumes of the Gloranthan Classics?
It is extremely unlikely that we will do another regular print run of them. Not in hardcover or in softcover. As I have said several times, we do NOT have a good "printer ready" version of Pavis & Big Rubble any more. That book was produced from FILM, not a PDF. Yes, back in the stone age books were made "camera ready" and produced from film. I didn't create a great PDF of that book for the printer, because they did a lot of the pre-press work for me. Yes, a PDF of Pavis & Big Rubble obviously exists (and we sell it), but a lot of the graphics in it would have to be redone in Photoshop before it could be used to print out a great looking copy of the book. The PDF looks ok on a computer screen, but not so great when professionally printed. Some day all 4 volumes of the Gloranthan Classics will be available as POD, probably via Lulu or DTRPG, but I regret to announce that it isn't a high priority for us. In the end, wonderful as the printed Gloranthan Classics are, the number of people who haven't already bought them, but still will actually buy them isn't as big a number as you would think. For example, the Cult Compendium is brilliant, but we sell maybe 1 or 2 hardcover or softcovers of it per month.

Why not do more new volumes of Gloranthan Classics?
In a way, we will be doing a lot of what you want via the RuneQuest Classics line of books. The Gloranthan Classics line of books was only called that because Moon Design could not use the RuneQuest Trademark, which was still controlled by Avalon Hill. That isn't an issue any more. Pavis, Big Rubble, Griffin Mountain, Troll Pak, the SoloQuest Collection, the RQ Companion, and Rune Masters are all in the works. Those are all well on the way to being reprinted this year. All the RuneQuest Classics will be available in printed form as well as PDF. Once the initial print runs have sold out we may reprint them again, or they WILL become POD titles on Lulu and/or DTRPG. The only real differences between a Gloranthan Classic and a RuneQuest Classic book are: RQ Classics use the original covers, no new art is being commissioned (which saves a lot of time), and each book is a single title.

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On 4/19/2017 at 8:40 AM, styopa said:

I would have loved a comparable treatment of Aldryami

There was a book by Shannon Appelcline called 'Oak and Thorn' i believe, anyway, it never saw print. I would love to see this one released. His material on the Aldryami is dead on, insightful and detailed.

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Posted (edited)

In order to see if I will buy them **yet** another time :):
does the RuneQuest Classics contain the updates done for Glorantha Classics?
I know that it is the case for Plunder for example but it is the case for all (Griffin Mountain for example)?
Will they be available in hardback cover?
Thank you!

Edited by 7Tigers

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2 hours ago, Rick Meints said:

I have answered this question a few times on other forum threads, but here it is in more detail:

Thank you!
I knew I had seen much of this, but the added & confirming detail is welcome; also, I didn't find it on my quick search (to link here for everyone's FYI), so having it in-thread is excellent.

Looking forward to the RQ Classic Line hitting completion!

 

2 hours ago, 7Tigers said:

does the RuneQuest Classics contain the updates done for Glorantha Classics?

I think you will have to define "updates."  I'm betting they plan ti roll-in any known errata...  Is that what you mean?

 

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I have never been able to lay my hands on a hardback of Pavis/Big Rubble or Griffin Mountain, and would pay quite a bit for those, even though I have the softbacks and PDF's.  Hopefully they come out in some form in hardback in the new line.

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12 hours ago, g33k said:

I think you will have to define "updates."  I'm betting they plan ti roll-in any known errata...  Is that what you mean?

Griffin Mountain book includes additional design notes as well as relevant parts of Griffin Island additional material.

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17 hours ago, 10baseT said:

There was a book by Shannon Appelcline called 'Oak and Thorn' i believe, anyway, it never saw print. I would love to see this one released. His material on the Aldryami is dead on, insightful and detailed.

I see he also wrote the MRQ Aldyrami book, is this considered better than most MRQ works?

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5 hours ago, 7Tigers said:

Griffin Mountain book includes additional design notes as well as relevant parts of Griffin Island additional material.

It's worth noting that some of the Griffin Island material added to the Gloranthan Classic Griffin Mountain wasn't always a naturally fit as they are slightly different gaming systems. 

It remains to been seen what's added to each of the rest of the RuneQuest Classic series, but so far these reprints have kept better to the feel of the era (i.e. by not importing RQ3 material; less retrospective comments on what went before, not updating Gloranthan lore to fit current canon, and only using art from the era etc.). 

As much as I value the Gloranthan Classics I'm glad the RuneQuest focus falls completely onto RQG as the RQ Classic series reprints is completed. This provides Chaosium with a clean and clear linear RPG product line. 

At the right time, and if it doesn't disrupt the RQG production line, a RQ3 Gloranthan scenarios Kickstarter might be of value to bridge the Gloranthan scenario timeline gap between RQ Classic and RQG. However adding in a third (slightly different) system doesn't feel right. Changing RQ3 scenarios over to RQG might work, and might be something that fits better with a Kickstarter business model. Chaosium might be able pay an author upfront to change one or two RQ3 supplements to RQG then let the Stretch Goals decide how far it can be taken. 

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1 hour ago, jongjom said:

As much as I value the Gloranthan Classics I'm glad the RuneQuest focus falls completely onto RQG as the RQ Classic series reprints is completed. This provides Chaosium with a clean and clear linear RPG product line. 

For all that I'd love a P&BR in hardcopy... I agree 100% !

1 hour ago, jongjom said:

At the right time, and if it doesn't disrupt the RQG production line, a RQ3 Gloranthan scenarios Kickstarter might be of value to bridge the Gloranthan scenario timeline gap between RQ Classic and RQG. However adding in a third (slightly different) system doesn't feel right. Changing RQ3 scenarios over to RQG might work, and might be something that fits better with a Kickstarter business model. Chaosium might be able pay an author upfront to change one or two RQ3 supplements to RQG then let the Stretch Goals decide how far it can be taken. 

This is an interesting thought... VERY much so!

Cherry-pick the "best" RQ3 supplement(s) to upgrade to RQG, with stretchier goals at higher-$ targets for those in need of more work ...

 

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2 hours ago, Jon Hunter said:

I see he also wrote the MRQ Aldyrami book, is this considered better than most MRQ works?

Having read said MRQ Aldryami book, it is good at creating a plant-man culture. I didn't quite feel the inspiration to play Aldryami in-culture, though.

Shannon's ideas about the origin of the Brown Elves are interesting. I am not so sure whether they are canonical, though. I found those "evergreen oaks" for Tastolar a stretch, and a few other items as well.

It isn't easy to get players into the mindset of a mobile plant more concerned with the welfare of the forest than with personal affairs, which is why I think that this race is better left for mixed parties of elf-friends and aldryami, or to have aldryami as patrons and/or adversaries.

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22 minutes ago, Joerg said:

Having read said MRQ Aldryami book, it is good at creating a plant-man culture. I didn't quite feel the inspiration to play Aldryami in-culture, though.

Shannon's ideas about the origin of the Brown Elves are interesting. I am not so sure whether they are canonical, though. I found those "evergreen oaks" for Tastolar a stretch, and a few other items as well.

It isn't easy to get players into the mindset of a mobile plant more concerned with the welfare of the forest than with personal affairs, which is why I think that this race is better left for mixed parties of elf-friends and aldryami, or to have aldryami as patrons and/or adversaries.

Exactly what I feel about mostali.  Fascinating, but their worldview (curious that my phone auto corrected that to 'worksite) is so alien I can't see them as enjoyable pc's.

Face it, the main charm of Glorantha is a combination of credibility and non-Tolkienesqueness...which means that if we take it reasonably seriously, the first thing to go is the trope of the mixed party of adventurers including the obligatory elf, dwarf, human, etc.  

Sure, it's not inconceivable in Glorantha, but in a Gloranthan context you even more risk jumping the shark before your party has even find adventuring...

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13 minutes ago, styopa said:

Exactly what I feel about mostali.  Fascinating, but their worldview (curious that my phone auto corrected that to 'worksite) is so alien I can't see them as enjoyable pc's.

I think that in order to get slight empathy for the characters you'd have to play Greatway individualist dwarves having to deal with Nidan or worse orthodoxy, possibly in service of a True Mostali like Isidilian, and with those irritating surface dwellers and the abominations of growth and hunger. You don't have to be open-handists - in fact, playing an anti-openhandist task force might be a good commando-style concept for a series of games.

Basically, you could do cyberpunk-style scenarios in Glorantha - insert your party, distribute your dwarf constructs for preparation of the strike, then go in with a precision strike and exit again. This could be mundane insertions, or even insertions into heroquests or deeper myths.

A Slon expedition into Umathela for dwarven diplomacy prior to the land-raising might be another remotely interesting concept for a Mostali mission, especially with humans of the eleventh caste.

13 minutes ago, styopa said:

Face it, the main charm of Glorantha is a combination of credibility and non-Tolkienesqueness...which means that if we take it reasonably seriously, the first thing to go is the trope of the mixed party of adventurers including the obligatory elf, dwarf, human, etc.  

Instead, you have a duck, a troll or trollkin, possibly a beastman or bachelor newtling and two or three humans of vastly incompatible cults in your stereotypical Gloranthan mixed party.

13 minutes ago, styopa said:

Sure, it's not inconceivable in Glorantha, but in a Gloranthan context you even more risk jumping the shark before your party has even find adventuring...

Silver Age or early Dawn Age gaming might actually have multi-racial party of Awakeners/Lightbringer missionaries. The only other occasion where you get this level of inter-racial cooperation is the fight against the God Learners, and even then you didn't mix all three of the major elder races. Jrustela works only because the elder races don't mix.

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On 21/04/2017 at 1:23 PM, Jon Hunter said:

I see he also wrote the MRQ Aldyrami book, is this considered better than most MRQ works?

Given what it is "officially" available on the subject, yes, even is there is a certain lack of depth sometimes (to not cannibalize the ElfPak).
So a bit under Mostali & Dragonnewts books.
Several add-on were published in free S&P Mongoose zine. List is here:
https://index.rpg.net/display-entry.phtml?mainid=8710

For info, in "Hearts in Gloranha" #2 zine, there are ElfPak Designer Notes:
5 pages by Shannon Appelcline about "The Oak and Thorn" HQ book and the "Elfs: A Guide to the Aldryami" MRQ book.

Beware: these notes are not in the "Hearts in Glorantha Volume 1 issues 1-5 Collected" book.

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I much prefer the "remastered" Gloranthan Classics range to the facsimile reprints produced as part of the RuneQuest Classic Kickstarter. I prefer the layout and artwork and the GC books also added in material from later RQ3 products where appropriate. For me, the GC version of Griffin Mountain is the definitive version.

However, I can understand the economic decisions behind not reprinting the books.

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1 hour ago, yojimbo said:

I much prefer the "remastered" Gloranthan Classics range to the facsimile reprints produced as part of the RuneQuest Classic Kickstarter. I prefer the layout and artwork and the GC books also added in material from later RQ3 products where appropriate. For me, the GC version of Griffin Mountain is the definitive version.

However, I can understand the economic decisions behind not reprinting the books.

I also understand the best sue of design time and budget argument, one of the issues with RQ3 is it rehashed to much old stuff.

If MRG spend its design time on new material that would be much better than another rehash or reprint of stuff available in 1983 -1987.

This is what there doing I think its a great call.

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