Starting runes

[mikuel]

In Sartar Kingdom of Heroes, players start with 3 runes, one automatically being the storm(?) rune.  I'm starting a Balazar campaign.  Would I do the same with giving my players the storm rune, or would it be a different rune?

 

[Richard S.]

Players begin with one elemental rune of their choice. Orlanthi males will most often have the storm rune, and women earth, but it's not mandatory.

[David Scott]

You might find this previous post of mine useful

http://www.glorantha.com/docs/balazar-hq2-keywords-and-magic/

im sure I did another character example as well

[David Scott]

Here's the other example character I did (unsure if I put it up so here it is). They should work in line with HeroQuest Glorantha as I did these to check that the Praxian spirit magic was correct.

Enchanting Voiced Ororia the Spirit-talker

Earth 15

Harmony 15

Spirit 6W

Balazaring tradition (life)

    (fire) Light Bush Grass +1, taboo is Light a Fire Every Day.

Hearthmother spirit society (Life & Harmony)

    (life) Bless fruit tree +1, taboo is always tend the saplings.

    (harmony) Find good roots +1, taboo is no gathering on Darkday. 

Brother Dog spirit society (Beast)

    (beast) Bless Mother +1, taboo is have a litter every year.

    (beast) Dance of the Dogs +1 (ritual), taboo never harm a dog.

Black Dog Clan (Citadel Clan of Elkoi) 15

 

Spirit-talker 1W

    Touched by Hearthmother +1

    I saw what you just did +1

Gatherer 13

Enchanting Voiced 15

 

Flaws

Thinks like a dog 7W

Surrounded by a pack of dogs 7W

Retainers, Pack of Fighting Dog Pups and Mothers 7W

 

Other Magic

(Water) Fill Skin with water (spell) 13

(Harmony) Calm down (talent) 13

(Earth) Fast Digger (talent) 13

[mikuel]

Thanks. 

[jajagappa]

3 hours ago, Richard S. said:

Players begin with one elemental rune of their choice.

As Balazar has neither a system of pastoralism (linked commonly to the Air rune) nor of agriculture (linked commonly to the Earth rune), I'd expect both genders to have a fair mix of elemental runes perhaps mostly reflective of personality.  Fire may be most common given hunter-gatherer nature and the need to maintain the hearth fire, and might create some natural antipathy with the more settled 'Orlanthi' clans of Imther, Holay, and Tarsh.  Maybe the least likely elemental rune would be Darkness as that is the elemental of the fearsome and hungry trolls who come from the Elder Wilds to eat the Balazarings' dogs and children.

Edited May 25, 2017 by jajagappa

[Joerg]

According to Dara Happans and others, the Votanki are supposed to be related to the Zarkos yelmalio-worshipping goat breeders. The citadel dwellers have adopted Mralota for their "urban" pig breeding.

Pastoralism is as much linked to the fire rune and the earth rune. The Dara Happans bred gazzam, then cattle and horses, the Kestinliddi flightless birds, the Pentans horses and cattle. Sheep are as much linked to the water rune of Heler as they are to the storm rune of Orlanth and Sons.

The Balazaring Votanki ended up as non-herding hunters of wild beasts, including potential Praxian mounts (Bison, Sable).

[jajagappa]

2 hours ago, Joerg said:

the Votanki are supposed to be related to the Zarkos yelmalio-worshipping goat breeders

I think that's just because that's the only folk left in the SE direction where the Zarkos folk were supposed to have been who aren't Orlanthi (and thus clearly not Zarkosites).

[soltakss]

I'd give Citadel dwellers the Light Rune and Votanki the Earth Rune as a default. Others would depend on individual variations. It might be nice to list the Balazar clans and put a recommended Rune against each.

In my Glorantha, the Citadel dwellers worship Mralota as the Pig Goddess, who teaches them how to farm pigs, the other Votaki worship her as Boar Mother, who provides wild pigs for them to hunt.

[David Scott]

On 26/05/2017 at 0:30 AM, jajagappa said:

I think that's just because that's the only folk left in the SE direction where the Zarkos folk were supposed to have been who aren't Orlanthi (and thus clearly not Zarkosites).

Looking at the map in Appendix G in the Guide, you can see that the Votanki people survived at Arun at the Dawn. I believe that this grove is the Holy spot for Foundchild. The Votanki are the descendants of Votank, identified as form of Daka Fal, but basically Ancestor worshippers. Foundchild, along with Brother Dog clearly helped them survive in the Great Darkness, hence their location at his sacred grove.

According to the Gods Wall section, Votank was a child of Durbaddath, but the Votanki don't know this. Although History of the Heortling Peoples does say:

Quote

Durbaddath (Father Lion), Uryarda (Mother Goat) and Zarkos (their human child, mistakenly called Votank in GRoY 

I don't think Votank was their child as the Votanki have no lion/goat type stuff in their culture, but the link could have been lost in the Great Darkness, when they were blasted back to the stone age. I think the Votanki are descendants of Grandfather mortal himself.

In the Balazar section of the Guide, the big change happened in 1082 with the arrival of Yelmalio worshipping Balazar. This effectively changed their culture towards a more solar bent hence my primary elemental rune suggestion of fire.

[soltakss]

1 hour ago, David Scott said:

Looking at the map in Appendix G in the Guide, you can see that the Votanki people survived at Arun at the Dawn. I believe that this grove is the Holy spot for Foundchild. The Votanki are the descendants of Votank, identified as form of Daka Fal, but basically Ancestor worshippers. Foundchild, along with Brother Dog clearly helped them survive in the Great Darkness, hence their location at his sacred grove.

According to the Gods Wall section, Votank was a child of Durbaddath, but the Votanki don't know this. Although History of the Heortling Peoples does say:

I don't think Votank was their child as the Votanki have no lion/goat type stuff in their culture, but the link could have been lost in the Great Darkness, when they were blasted back to the stone age. I think the Votanki are descendants of Grandfather mortal himself.

In the Balazar section of the Guide, the big change happened in 1082 with the arrival of Yelmalio worshipping Balazar. This effectively changed their culture towards a more solar bent hence my primary elemental rune suggestion of fire.

In my Balazar, Votank was the son of Durbaddath, but was Abandoned as a baby. Hearth Mother found Votank and raised him as Foundchild the Hunter. I like the Griffin Island version of Votank as a Hunter/Ancestor. Perhaps Votank was abandoned because he had no obvious lion/goat features.

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, David Scott said:

I don't think Votank was their child as the Votanki have no lion/goat type stuff in their culture, but the link could have been lost in the Great Darkness, when they were blasted back to the stone age. I think the Votanki are descendants of Grandfather mortal himself.

I agree.  The 'association' of Zarkos and Votank is incorrect.  The Zarkosites end up in the Arcos Valley (Garsting and Jarst) and likely form an underlying/fragmentary bit beneath the subsequent culture of the horse riders (Starlight Ancestors).

2 hours ago, David Scott said:

worshipping Balazar. This effectively changed their culture towards a more solar bent hence my primary elemental rune suggestion of fire

Certainly in the citadels.  Perhaps it grows in the clans as well as a way to push back the trolls and other terrors of the night.

[metcalph]

My view of the Votanki/Zarkosite situation.

• Gods Wall:  There are three deities dressed in the same clothing - Ergesh, Durbaddath and Uryarda.  Ergesh in the Glorious ReAscent was called Votank but in the Guide, this identification is not made (indicating that it's no longer valid).  Durbaddath is still associated with Balazar because Plentonius in his (Dawn Age) text calls him the father of Ergesh and Votank (indicating the two were brothers) and Iverlanthus in his Seventh Wane text mentions Durbaddath cultists in Balazar.The clothing style of the trio is also shared by three star deities which are identified as Polaris, Ourania and Oropum and the Glorious ReAscent calls it hides and furs.
• In the First Muster myth (Glorious ReAscent appendix), troops from those regions are described as being barefooted, wearing goat hides, armed with leather slings and glowing rocks.  
• When Eskarlavus the Exile performs a similar ritual (Entekosiad; Gartemirus section), the help from the southeast is described as a naked man bearing only sticks and stones.  
• The Arming of Khordavu frieze on the front of the Glorious ReAscent shows the troops from the Southeast wearing kilts of different furs and armed with slings.  There are eleven of them, ten of whom are bearded (one of which is braided), all have ponytails and all are barefooted.  There are no lions among them.  
• At the Battle of Night and Day (History of the Heortling Peoples), the slingers are described as coming from Vanch and led by Periades, they are wearing bronze hauberks in the Darjiinian fashion with helmets and bronze swords and spears.  This doesn't fit the ritual but Periades worships Daysenerus and has faith in modern weaponry rather than ancient ritual.  Again there are no lions.
• In the Ancestors of the Lenshi Kings (which I consider to be apocryphal these days), the Ancient Tribe (from which the Starlight Ancestors of the Gamatae came from) moves north to the land of Unstevos where they fight with the Kalrius and in the resulting battle the Elf Sea is made.  Since the Elf Sea lies north of Balazar, the Ancient Tribe came from there.
• There is a further section from the Ancestor of the Lenshi Kings (which is doubly apocryphal since the section I'm referring to is left out of the section that was once on the issaries section).  This says that after the first division the south tribe of the Starlight Tribe (now riding horses) went back to their ancestral home where the Aldryami had overgrown everything.  They were destroyed by the Elves when they slept under the tree.  

Now to make sense of all this.

I think Zarkos was a large cultural region that ranged from Vanch to Balazar in the Golden Age.  Lion hunters and goat herders were found among them but many (most) were ordinary hunter/gatherers   Their core religion was a worship of three star gods.  The star goddess identified as Ourania may be known as FerNa (Entekosiad: Hunter Tales) in which case Zarkosites migrated to other places such as Arir or Eol in mythical times.  The Lion (Durbaddath) and Goat (Uryarda, Sidar, Miapora) gods were ancestral to some Zarkosites but not all (especially in Balazar)

The Goat Worshipping Zarkosites will become ancestral to the people of Vanch and Imther and there will be some goat-herders among them today.  

So where are the Lion worshippers?  The earliest historical Lion Worshippers are found in Zulox which is now in Tork.  Although Iverlanthus describes Lion Worshippers in Balazar, we all know having flipped lovingly through the pages of Griffin Mountain that there are no Lion Worshippers there.  My best guess is that the land around Soldiers Ferry (being close to Zulox) has Lion worshipping Hunter/Gatherers and which could conceivably be considered to be within Balazar/Votankiland.  This also has the virtue that Soldiers Ferry is not well described in the sources.

 

 

 

 

[jajagappa]

9 hours ago, metcalph said:

I think Zarkos was a large cultural region that ranged from Vanch to Balazar in the Golden Age.

I think the answer is embedded in the name zArkos.  It's the Arcos River Valley + tributaries - the lands east of the Jord/Imther Mountains and extending down to Balazar.  The Gap of Tork and the Dog Hills are the intersection points with DH and other cultures.  In modern days it largely amounts to Garsting and Jarst north of the Elf Sea. 

 

9 hours ago, metcalph said:

So where are the Lion worshippers?  The earliest historical Lion Worshippers are found in Zulox which is now in Tork.

Probably ranging over the Jord Mountains, either side, including the Tork Gap (until that is closed).  On the DH side they are probably subsumed into Vanchite and Sankenite cultures.  On the Arcos Valley side, they may remain hunters across the Garsting and Jarst lands.  Selkow's Hills and Soldier's Ferry largely fall under the domain of the Orlanthi folk of Imther, but could be some intermixing of hunters.

[metcalph]

7 hours ago, jajagappa said:

[the Lion worshippers are] Probably ranging over the Jord Mountains, either side, including the Tork Gap (until that is closed).  On the DH side they are probably subsumed into Vanchite and Sankenite cultures.  On the Arcos Valley side, they may remain hunters across the Garsting and Jarst lands.

None of those places however are Balazar where Iverlanthus said they would be found.  If the Lion worshippers were in those places then surely he would have said Jarst and Garsting rather than Balazar?

 

[jajagappa]

21 minutes ago, metcalph said:

None of those places however are Balazar where Iverlanthus said they would be found.  If the Lion worshippers were in those places then surely he would have said Jarst and Garsting rather than Balazar?

As an in-world reference, it's not possible to reconstruct whether Iverlanthus knew anything about this area or not.  It suggests that he had talked with hunters of Votankiland/Balazar, but that they did not know the Durbadath story.  Maybe because they were not really Durbadath cultists?