trystero Posted June 29, 2018 Share Posted June 29, 2018 22 minutes ago, soltakss said: I know that Humakti cannot come back as Undead, but wasn't aware that they cannot be Resurrected. In RQ3's Gods of Glorantha, at least, it's noted in the Humakt cult description's Initiate Membership section on p. 41 of the Cults Book: "Note: cult members… may never be brought back from the dead by any means. Their corpses cannot be turned into undead." By comparison, Cults of Prax for RQ2 said (on p. 32, at least in the Classic Edition reprint): "Humakt worshippers are never Resurrected" and "The cult cares little what happens to the corpses of their dead, save that they are… not turned into undead." This sounds more like custom than limits on what's possible. So I guess it depends which version of Humakt you work with. Quote — “Self-discipline isn’t everything; look at Pol Pot.”—Helen Fielding, Bridget Jones: The Edge of Reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilHibbs Posted June 29, 2018 Share Posted June 29, 2018 (edited) 54 minutes ago, soltakss said: Does it? I know that Humakti cannot come back as Undead, but wasn't aware that they cannot be Resurrected. I may be technically wrong but that's how we always played it. Anyway the point still stands about religion having verifiable effects on magic. Edited June 29, 2018 by PhilHibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g33k Posted June 29, 2018 Share Posted June 29, 2018 2 hours ago, soltakss said: Does it? I know that Humakti cannot come back as Undead, but wasn't aware that they cannot be Resurrected. Humakti will never resurrect, nor seek resurrection for their own. I would be startled if Humakt -- the God himself -- oftsn allowed followers in his halls to leave again in response to a summons (e.g. if a Ch.Ar. healer attempted.a.resurrection on behalf of the dead Humakti)... But I think this is how, technically, it could be done, kinda-sorta-maybe-YGMV). Quote C'es ne pas un .sig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joerg Posted June 29, 2018 Share Posted June 29, 2018 (edited) 14 hours ago, g33k said: Humakti will never resurrect, nor seek resurrection for their own. I would be startled if Humakt -- the God himself -- oftsn allowed followers in his halls to leave again in response to a summons (e.g. if a Ch.Ar. healer attempted.a.resurrection on behalf of the dead Humakti)... But I think this is how, technically, it could be done, kinda-sorta-maybe-YGMV). There is a period of uncertainty between breath leaving the body and receiving the verdict at the Court of Silence where not even Humakti souls are completely within the domain of the deity. There are also other ways to enter and leave the domain of Humakt, and there are heroic return routes from the Underworld, neither of which compromise Humakt's ownership of Death. The Biturian encounter at Horngate includes Biturian's horror at Alain's tormented spirit remaining in this world. There also was a specific subcult which had the benefit of making resurrection impossible - IIRC the one tied to the Lead Cross heroquest which slaughters White Healers. Details in Tales of the Reaching Moon #5 (the only issue that ever was reprinted). Edit: IIRC the subcult was Ian Starcere, named after a Humakti player who felt that Humakti should be impossible to resurrect at all. Edited June 30, 2018 by Joerg remembered Ian Starcere Quote Telling how it is excessive verbis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soltakss Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 13 hours ago, Joerg said: There also was a specific subcult which had the benefit of making resurrection impossible - IIRC the one tied to the Lead Cross heroquest which slaughters White Healers. Details in Tales of the Reaching Moon #5 (the only issue that ever was reprinted). Which means it was possible for other Humakti. The same applies to Humakti geases and obligations. Some Humakti have the geas "Never participate in an ambush", which means that Humakti without that geas can participate in ambushes. Similarly, Humakti without the relevant geases can use poison, tell lies and so on. It always amazes me when people play Humakti as though they all have every geas going, even though they don't. Quote Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. www.soltakss.com/index.html Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yelm's Light Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, soltakss said: Which means it was possible for other Humakti. The same applies to Humakti geases and obligations. Some Humakti have the geas "Never participate in an ambush", which means that Humakti without that geas can participate in ambushes. Similarly, Humakti without the relevant geases can use poison, tell lies and so on. It always amazes me when people play Humakti as though they all have every geas going, even though they don't. That doesn't mean it would be approved of or encouraged by the higher-ups, especially in a cult that is very much militarily-oriented in attitude and organization. The Humakt cult has always been severe and uncompromising (unless, of course, you ask a ZZ). Quote Cult Compendium, p. 90 C. Restrictions [Rune Lord] There are very few restrictions on a Humakt Sword [Rune Lord] not already detailed. He must personify honor and fair combat in his every deed, upholding the meek and defending the oppressed. He must never turn his back on a fair fight in a good cause and never break a sworn vow. Any Sword betraying these restrictions will never be able to pick up a sword again without it shattering in his hand. And, to the specific point: Quote Cult Compendium, p. 90 C. Benefits [Initiate] ...A cult member will never be called back from the dead in any way. They are considered to have been called by the god and it would be sacrilegious to reverse the situation. If they are called back, they will singlemindedly try to kill their summoner even if made into a vampire. After slaying the wrong-doer, the Humakti spirit will again depart the body. Finally, Humakt Initiates or above cannot be turned into skeletons or zombies. (edited the text of the quotes for typos) Edited June 30, 2018 by Yelm's Light 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonh Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 (edited) 21 hours ago, soltakss said: Similarly, Humakti without the relevant geases can use poison, tell lies and so on. It always amazes me when people play Humakti as though they all have every geas going, even though they don't. Humakti aspire to certain standards of behaviour, and if you have the relevant geas that’s also backed up by a magically enforced pact. Lots of cults have standards of behaviour that aren’t enforced magically at all, so why do you think their followers bother paying attention to them? Edited July 1, 2018 by simonh Quote Check out the Runequest Glorantha Wiki for RQ links and resources. Any updates or contributions welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joerg Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 (edited) 45 minutes ago, simonh said: Humakti aspire to certain standards of behaviour, and if you have the relevant geas that’s also backed up by a magically enforced pact. Lots of cults have standards of behaviour that aren’t enforced magically at all, so why do you think their followers bother paying attention to them? There is still a difference between becoming an initiate and becoming a devotee. It is true that the cult of Humakt will attract mainly people who deal with the art of war or with swords, but there are numerous paths of life available to Humakti. There are dual cultists of Humakt and some other somewhat warlike deity, like e.g. Orlanth, Elmal, Yelmalio, Heler, with traits from both deities. There is the iron-working bladesmith or armorer. There is the Kethaelan lottery duelist. There is the legal champion, lawspeaker and duelist in one person. There is the Re-Life Sickness convert. There is the "Dead, not Alive" bounty hunter. There is the loving father/husband and zombie-hunter. There is your typical housecarl and oath-man. There is the sellsword murder hobo. There is the Arkati Humakti heroquest guardian. There is the Lead Cross fanatic. And then there was Onslaught. Here's an old short piece of mine to show how to both fulfill and break stereotypes (in this case of the Storm Bull cult) : http://www.sartar.de/glorantha/oldsite/npc-hrut.html Edited July 1, 2018 by Joerg unwanted smiley Quote Telling how it is excessive verbis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonh Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Joerg said: There is still a difference between becoming an initiate and becoming a devotee. Sure, and there a difference between simply being expected to and wanting to live up to the ideals of your religion, and making a magically binding pact to do so. I just don’t see why it’s so amazing that a Humakti without such a pact, and who is on the path to a higher status in the cult but not there yet, might still want to live up to those ideals. Edited July 1, 2018 by simonh Quote Check out the Runequest Glorantha Wiki for RQ links and resources. Any updates or contributions welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joerg Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Everybody who initiates to a cult identifies strongly with some set of traits and ideals of the cult, and goes along with the rest, possibly with some internal conflict. There are thousands of stick-in-the-mud conservative Orlanthi who don't really appreciate the Change aspect of their deity, and it gets worse among significant portions of the priesthood. There are Humakti who are extremely strong in Death but have a definition of Truth that leaves out more common interpretations of honor - see Onslaught. And there are other Humakti who come in via the Oathbinder concept, admittedly a minor concept of the cult, but enough to identify, without giving up entirely on Fertility. I regret to see the return to the RQ2 random geases for Humakt, rather than the directed geases that corresponded to the gift, but that's a change easily undone, and Humakt isn't a PC cult I favor much anyway. So I don't see any trouble with having an eloquent Humakti, or one who has accepted that his death is imminent while still pursuing fertility until the final severance. I see no point in a Praxian tribesman forbidden to ride if the character concept and the campaign consists of Praxian Beast Riders. And how do I play "Distrust X"? Is that a 100% passion? What if Londra had drawn "Distrust Aldryami", how would the Dissolution of the Temple of the Wooden Sword have played out? "Don't use poison" - this has never been much of an option in my games, anyway, but does this mean that you cannot use your iron sword which embodies your devoted Humakti soul on trolls or aldryami, not even that abominous Death Lord backed by his armada of undead? Quote Telling how it is excessive verbis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonh Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Ive really no problem with anything you’re say there Joerg. On the random table point, I think the general vibe I get from RQG is the tables are tools, not constraints. This is explicit in character generation background tables, but I’d never require a player to take a random geas they really objected to. As for poisons, and other edge cases isn’t having to deal with tricky issues part of the fun, and/or point? Quote Check out the Runequest Glorantha Wiki for RQ links and resources. Any updates or contributions welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GianniVacca Posted July 2, 2018 Share Posted July 2, 2018 On 6/29/2018 at 4:14 PM, Ian_W said: Under RQG rules, you get to augment once per session, ie when it's important. Page 144. You get to augment once per session WITH A GIVEN ABILITY. 1 Quote 「天朝大國」,https://rpggeek.com/rpgitem/92874/celestial-empire 很有意思: http://celestialempire.blogspot.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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