Do Ostrich riders still exist officially?

[Zozotroll]

I have not noticed them lately, have they become one of the minor tribes, or have they totally disappeared?  Bolo lizards where pain enough to collect, ostrich riders look more challenging

[Kloster]

29 minutes ago, Zozotroll said:

I have not noticed them lately, have they become one of the minor tribes, or have they totally disappeared?  Bolo lizards where pain enough to collect, ostrich riders look more challenging

According to Heroes (Avalon Hill official magazine), yes, at least in RQIII. They always (=since that article) have been part of the minor tribes since that time.

Kloster

Edited January 6, 2019 by Kloster

[Jeff]

36 minutes ago, Kloster said:

According to Heroes (Avalon Hill official magazine), yes, at least in RQIII. They always (=since that article) have been part of the minor tribes since that time.

Kloster

Yes. They are a minor tribe and always have been.

[Zozotroll]

Yay!  Now to find some in 28mm

[MOB]

Wa-ha! 

 

[Kloster]

A bit more than 28mm (at least on my screen), but nice. Perhaps is it a giant ostrich, but this could not be 'stealthy'!

Kloster

[g33k]

Wait... is this a new aspect, or have the Ostrich Tribe been notably "stealthy" (even compared to other Beast Riders) in prior canon???

[g33k]

On 1/6/2019 at 9:10 AM, Jeff said:

Yes. They are a minor tribe and always have been.

I met Prax in RQ2 and of course in Cults of Prax.  I understand that WBRM & NG wargames are "prior canon."  I'm just curious... has there (ever, not just in the nuChaosium reign) been any substantive revision to the Praxian Beast-riders since those early days?  Have tribes been added, or removed?  Great Tribes become minor ones, or minor ones become Great?

I mean, I realize that canon itself describes things like the Ostrich and Bolo being added to the Covenant; the extinction of a few Tribes; the Zebras and the Unicorns and even the Pol-Joni; but the oldest sources have those events as canonical events.  I'm wondering about revision to the canon.

Offhand, I can only recall only 2 items...

1.  Who "won" the lotteries with Waha?  Did the Eaters win (who now must serve as herdsmen & protectors for the Eaten... waitWHAT winning made them servants?) ?   Did the Eaten win, who themselves eat directly from the provender of Divine Eiritha (waitWHAT winning made them food) ?   I have seen both perspectives presented, and honestly don't know if there *IS* a canonical "God Learner Right" right answer, OR if the answer has changed, OR if canon is explicitly & intentionally obscure on this.

2.  the very-recent heresy of the Vegetarian Morokanth, which isn't "substantive" in that it doesn't elevate/deprecate minor/majors or introduce/eliminate Tribes at all... just heinously bowdlerizes one of the great pieces of Gloranthan weirdness and creepiness (YGMV (thinking of including "Vegetarianism" as an explicit (and shameful) heresy amongst the Morokanth)).

 

[MOB]

8 hours ago, g33k said:

Wait... is this a new aspect, or have the Ostrich Tribe been notably "stealthy" (even compared to other Beast Riders) in prior canon???

"The Ostrich Tribe might be one of the smallest in terms of numbers, but take great advantage of their mounts’ stealth, speed and viciousness to make lightning raids on weakly defended targets." The blow gun is a stealthy weapon.

7 hours ago, g33k said:

2.  the very-recent heresy of the Vegetarian Morokanth, which isn't "substantive" in that it doesn't elevate/deprecate minor/majors or introduce/eliminate Tribes at all... just heinously bowdlerizes one of the great pieces of Gloranthan weirdness and creepiness (YGMV (thinking of including "Vegetarianism" as an explicit (and shameful) heresy amongst the Morokanth)).

The Morokanth are vegetarians. Their bodies are naturally suited to eating vegetable matter. But they eat meat to demonstrate they won in Waha's Survival Covenant. Usually their meat consumption is restricted to ritual obligations, commemorating their status as among the Eaters, not the Eaten. The fact that they have to grimly pretend they're enjoying meat when feasting with other Praxians, and that it clearly doesn't agree with their digestions, is a big part of why other Praxians say they cheated in the Contest.

(If the Morokanth are the hosts, they'll cheerfully serve the visiting Bison Khan and his band sizzling 20 ounce steaks, but if you look carefully, the Morokanths' own "steaks" are artfully made of chopped up grass etc.)

[Roko Joko]

15 hours ago, Kloster said:

Perhaps is it a giant ostrich, but this could not be 'stealthy'!

They hide their heads in the sand, and if they can't see you...

[womble]

4 hours ago, MOB said:

The blow gun is a stealthy weapon.

More so than the bow? When you're riding an Ostrich? Stealthy, as in "You wouldn't even know you'd been hit if it hit your clothes"? Fiddling poisoned darts into a blowgun while at the run doesn't seem a very good idea, either.

[Jeff]

3 hours ago, Roko Joko said:

They hide their heads in the sand, and if they can't see you...

A raiding party of Ostrich Riders is much stealthier than a bunch of bison or high llamas. It is all a matter of context.

[Byll]

Where does RQG stand in the great and contentious boomerang - blowpipe controversy?

Or has the blowpipe always been a boomerang really, just one that some people believe fires a dart around corners? 

[MOB]

4 hours ago, womble said:

More so than the bow? When you're riding an Ostrich? Stealthy, as in "You wouldn't even know you'd been hit if it hit your clothes"? Fiddling poisoned darts into a blowgun while at the run doesn't seem a very good idea, either.

The poisoned darts are to disable choice herd animals rather than riders. The riders might not even know they've been and gone.

[womble]

11 minutes ago, MOB said:

The poisoned darts are to disable choice herd animals rather than riders. The riders might not even know they've been and gone.

Erm... so they disable the pride of the herd, then start a stampede and when the herd guardians dither about protecting the fleeing majority or protecting the prize bull and cow, they make off with the 'second best'... Cos if you disable the ones you actually want, you're not getting away with them any time soon, with only an ostrich's load capacity to carry the staggering prize...

 

[MOB]

2 minutes ago, womble said:

Erm... so they disable the pride of the herd, then start a stampede and when the herd guardians dither about protecting the fleeing majority or protecting the prize bull and cow, they make off with the 'second best'... Cos if you disable the ones you actually want, you're not getting away with them any time soon, with only an ostrich's load capacity to carry the staggering prize...

 

They don't need to go for the pride of the hard, any tasty beast will do. If they've caused a stampede, the Ostrich folk can probably butcher the disabled animal on the spot, cheerfully loping off with choice cuts before anyone notices.

[David Scott]

1 hour ago, Byll said:

Where does RQG stand in the great and contentious boomerang - blowpipe controversy?

Or has the blowpipe always been a boomerang really, just one that some people believe fires a dart around corners? 

They have very different functions. A boomerang is a hunting weapon designed to break the legs of small animals, if you miss, it returns (I’ve practiced a lot with boomerangs they are nasty). War boomangs are different and don’t have to return, they are heavier as well. The spin gives them a better range, but ultimately they are thrown clubs. Blowpipes are a delivery system for some kind of poison, it doesn't have to kill the target, as causing it to go berserk, or spooked is just as good. Spooking the herd guards mounts is a good distraction. 

Most Praxians raid by capturing the animals alive, normally riding off with them at speed or hiding them. Contrary to popular belief, only khans are not allowed to ride other herd beasts. Most clan herds have other herd animals in them, except for captured Herd men, who always go straight into the pot, except if needed for a dowry (due to their dietary requirements). Raiding is rarely charge in and fight. Most of it is stealth based. Except if you are doing a diversionary tactic, but everyone knows that trick, and the herd guard is skilled at stopping this. Some times are better for raiding others herds. For some tribes, Rutting season is particularly dangerous as the milk herd (and mother’s with young) is normally separated form the main herd, making an easier target. This is normally when clans come together to spread the guarding out as they are slower to move with young. Likewise tribes with bachelor herds are a popular target as they are kept separate. Tribes that have lone bulls, would seem to be a good target, but driving off an old bull is always difficult, the meat’s not so good and often young boys are the guards (11-16) and it’s really not a good idea to harm them. Killing herd beasts is avoided, as that’s a waste (except in camp), likewise killing other Praxians is avoided, although injury isn’t. War is rare as it serves no one. 

[womble]

1 hour ago, MOB said:

They don't need to go for the pride of the hard, any tasty beast will do. If they've caused a stampede, the Ostrich folk can probably butcher the disabled animal on the spot, cheerfully loping off with choice cuts before anyone notices.

I read 'choice' in your 'disable choice herd animals' to read 'prime', aka, the 'pride of the herd'. Same meaning you've assigned to the butchery product above.

I would have thought it would be unusual for no herd guardians to remain to look after the 'mysteriously unexcited' non-stampede-participants, meaning they would need to be overcome. Obviously, this would be easier since most of the guards are off trying to get the herd majority under control, but hardly beneath anyone's notice.

How good is ostrich night vision compared to other herd beasts? Cos trying to sneak up in the daylight to get into blowpipe range isn't going to be practicable very often on such a tall bird.

[soltakss]

15 hours ago, MOB said:

The Morokanth are vegetarians. Their bodies are naturally suited to eating vegetable matter.

Nu-Glorantha, hmmm, MGDV.

6 hours ago, Byll said:

Where does RQG stand in the great and contentious boomerang - blowpipe controversy?

I forgot that Ostrich Riders use a fancy boomerang. From memory, it was shaped a bit like a Movement Rune, wasn't it?

4 hours ago, womble said:

How good is ostrich night vision compared to other herd beasts? Cos trying to sneak up in the daylight to get into blowpipe range isn't going to be practicable very often on such a tall bird.

You know, they might, perhaps, get off the Ostrich while sneaking up to use a blowpipe.

[womble]

3 hours ago, soltakss said:

Nu-Glorantha, hmmm, MGDV.

I forgot that Ostrich Riders use a fancy boomerang. From memory, it was shaped a bit like a Movement Rune, wasn't it?

You know, they might, perhaps, get off the Ostrich while sneaking up to use a blowpipe.

It's a damn long stalk on chapparal. And they have to have the Ostrich come out from whatever defilade they were hiding in for the time it took to get among the target herd to spirit the successful raider(s) and their putative load(s) of "choice [speed-butchered] cuts" before any of the other more competent tribes catch the dismounted pygmies and take them prisoner. Operating dismounted robs them of their speed advantage.

[styopa]

On 1/8/2019 at 12:12 PM, g33k said:

Wait... is this a new aspect, or have the Ostrich Tribe been notably "stealthy" (even compared to other Beast Riders) in prior canon???

Well, Ostriches pretty much run around on their tippy-toes.

[styopa]

On 1/9/2019 at 7:12 AM, MOB said:

The poisoned darts are to disable choice herd animals rather than riders. The riders might not even know they've been and gone.

Except that poison darts in RQ mechanics are pretty sucky - basically, they do so little damage with no particular method of aiming for anything more granular than a whole hit location zone, even something with trivial armor is essentially immune (attackers HAVE to crit to do anything).

I mean, IRL poison darts suck badly enough that nobody above stone age tribes use them aside from "fantasy" ninjas.  IRL blowguns have a limited range and their light dart means the slightest puff of wind makes hitting beyond 1m impossible.

[MOB]

2 hours ago, styopa said:

Except that poison darts in RQ mechanics are pretty sucky - basically, they do so little damage with no particular method of aiming for anything more granular than a whole hit location zone, even something with trivial armor is essentially immune (attackers HAVE to crit to do anything).

I mean, IRL poison darts suck badly enough that nobody above stone age tribes use them aside from "fantasy" ninjas.  IRL blowguns have a limited range and their light dart means the slightest puff of wind makes hitting beyond 1m impossible.

Yeah, other more successful Praxian tribes frequently tell the Ostrich Folk their time-honored hunting methods are rubbish, but they just stick their heads in the sand...

[Orlanthatemyhamster]

On 1/9/2019 at 10:49 PM, womble said:

It's a damn long stalk on chapparal. And they have to have the Ostrich come out from whatever defilade they were hiding in for the time it took to get among the target herd to spirit the successful raider(s) and their putative load(s) of "choice [speed-butchered] cuts" before any of the other more competent tribes catch the dismounted pygmies and take them prisoner. Operating dismounted robs them of their speed advantage.

Let's start at the beginning. It's spelt chaparral, and Prax is not, 'chaparral' anyway. But that's by the by.

They have a substantive number of Yelmalio initiates in the tribe, so Catseye and Farsee become a great ambush combination. Speeddart can deal with the 'thickest' nomad armour [use your common] and surprise attacking from the rear at night could give you a pretty good chance of an aimed blow [heh, sic] and if you miss, no one is going to notice anyway. Have others create a diversion then overwhelm the guards that are left.

So yeah, pretty good at night attacks me thinks.

[g33k]

Warning, warning!  Necro, Will Robinson!
😁

36 minutes ago, Orlanthatemyhamster said:

Let's start at the beginning. It's spelt chaparral, and Prax is not, 'chaparral' anyway ...

Prax is a bit mixed.  There's some rocky/sandy areas, some badlands, some outright deserts; but there's plenty of chaparral, too... in fact, it's the dominant ecology.
It couldn't support the herds it does, if there were not.

YGWV, but that's what canon says!
 

Quote

Prax

These barbarian nomads reside in the chaparral plains east of Dragon Pass.

-- https://rqwiki.chaosium.com/glorantha/dragon-pass.html#the-homelands-of-dragon-pass

 

36 minutes ago, Orlanthatemyhamster said:

...
They have a substantive number of Yelmalio initiates in the tribe, so Catseye and Farsee ...
So yeah, pretty good at night attacks me thinks.

This is a decent outline of some Ostrich-riders' tactical advantages (note that the Morokanth's inherent Darkness affiliation likely makes them a MUCH riskier target for such tactics).

Edited August 25, 2023 by g33k