What the heck... Check that out!

[Austin]

My biggest "What the heck?" moment thus far has probably been the existence of the "Craft (Magic Item)" skill in the Creating a Dwarf Adventurer section of the Bestiary, under the Silver Dwarf "occupation." P.58 of the print edition.

[Kloster]

3 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

How many of you know that Ride (___) 5% handles experience gain rolls in it's own unique way and did so back way in RQ 2 (I have not checked RQ 3)? Not me, but there it is in glorious colour in the RQ RiG book page 167 or b&w in RQ 2 page 52:

I don't have RQIII at hand to check, but from memory, this is the same rule in both versions.

[PhilHibbs]

1 hour ago, Kloster said:

I don't have RQIII at hand to check, but from memory, this is the same rule in both versions.

...and is a rule that nobody really bothered with back then either. You make a roll, you tick it, done. Then you do something fun.

Of course I'm talking about my personal experience, the groups that I have played in, as @Jeff points out below that is not universal.

Edited April 18, 2019 by PhilHibbs

[Jeff]

3 minutes ago, PhilHibbs said:

...and is a rule that nobody really bothered with back then either. You make a roll, you tick it, done. Then you do something fun.

Plenty of people used the special Ride experience rules - I did, Greg did, Dunham did, Sandy did, etc.  That's how characters who spent a long time in Prax got to be good riders even if they weren't making a lot of ride rolls. It could also be handled through Experience Between Adventures, but we thought it would be better to let folk who are spending a lot of time Riding to just get the experience rolls.

Jeff

[Runeblogger]

13 hours ago, styopa said:

Saying that POW can increase because something attacked you is like saying you actually get to be a better fighter because someone punches you ...provably not true.

But that's not the case, you only gain a POW roll if you successfully defend from a magical attack. 

I like this rule. Otherwise many munchkins would learn offensive spells just because that's the way to get POW-gain rolls, which makes no sense at all.

[Kloster]

3 minutes ago, Runeblogger said:

But that's not the case, you only gain a POW roll if you successfully defend from a magical attack. 

I like this rule. Otherwise many munchkins would learn offensive spells just because that's the way to get POW-gain rolls, which makes no sense at all.

Same for me. In fact, we houseruled this with RQIII exactly for this reason. And for the rationale, defending successfully is as good a teacher as attacking successfully, especially now that attack and parry skills are fused.

[PhilHibbs]

5 hours ago, Jeff said:

Plenty of people used the special Ride experience rules - I did, Greg did, Dunham did, Sandy did, etc.  That's how characters who spent a long time in Prax got to be good riders even if they weren't making a lot of ride rolls. It could also be handled through Experience Between Adventures, but we thought it would be better to let folk who are spending a lot of time Riding to just get the experience rolls.

Looks like I might have got the wrong end of the stick then. My reply was based on this:

Quote

An adventurer may attempt an experience increase roll for
Ride only when the gamemaster allows it.

We had no truck with GMs who denied skill ticks in legitimate circumstances where a skill roll was required. Sure, if it was obviously a no-risk no-stress situation, like "who gets to the pub first", no tick, but that applies to every skill! If that section is supposed to define extra situations where you gain, sure, we did that. We did that for a lot of skills, I've handed out sword skill ticks for people who witnessed a particularly exceptional display of marital prowess such as a duel between Humakti rune lords.

Edited April 18, 2019 by PhilHibbs

[Bill the barbarian]

13 hours ago, Jeff said:

Plenty of people used the special Ride experience rules - I did, Greg did, Dunham did, Sandy did, etc.  That's how characters who spent a long time in Prax got to be good riders even if they weren't making a lot of ride rolls. It could also be handled through Experience Between Adventures, but we thought it would be better to let folk who are spending a lot of time Riding to just get the experience rolls.

 

Interesting I always gave folk in my RQ 3 campaigns who travelled for a week in new territory a World Lore practice gain roll (same 1D6-2 roll as training but only 1% if you took the guaranteed advancement in place of the roll).  I  wonder if I got that by noticing the week of riding giving a check but missing the rest.  I vaguely recall giving either a practice gain roll or an experience roll for the first week of riding the one and only time it happened in Balazar. Actually, anything intense for a first week was considered and possible checked in my games if it made sense to do so (again I seem to recall using practise rolls not training for this HR). 

 But the rest, that really was a What the heck moment for me. I finally got the full gist of this rule when reading the core rules for material for this thread. Until then I have done just as PhilHibb's, check and go. 

In fact, doing this thread and the others as well have been great for my understanding of the rules.

Cheers all.

[DreadDomain]

15 hours ago, Jeff said:

Plenty of people used the special Ride experience rules - I did, Greg did, Dunham did, Sandy did, etc.  That's how characters who spent a long time in Prax got to be good riders even if they weren't making a lot of ride rolls. It could also be handled through Experience Between Adventures, but we thought it would be better to let folk who are spending a lot of time Riding to just get the experience rolls.

Jeff

Yup, it always made a lot of sense to us as well. Experience checks were not always only about making rolls but also just practice. Ride is good example of that but not the only one. I always liked games woth "training" rules (RQ, GURPS, Mythras...)

[Joerg]

6 hours ago, DreadDomain said:

Yup, it always made a lot of sense to us as well. Experience checks were not always only about making rolls but also just practice. Ride is good example of that but not the only one. I always liked games woth "training" rules (RQ, GURPS, Mythras...)

By this logic knowledge skills should gain checks for weeks spent doing (directed) research on some subject, too. Directed research as in finding details about the myth that would be used for the next heroquesting like special weaknesses of the expected opposition.

[Kloster]

8 hours ago, DreadDomain said:

Yup, it always made a lot of sense to us as well. Experience checks were not always only about making rolls but also just practice. Ride is good example of that but not the only one. I always liked games woth "training" rules (RQ, GURPS, Mythras...)

 

10 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Interesting I always gave folk in my RQ 3 campaigns who travelled for a week in new territory a World Lore practice gain roll (same 1D6-2 roll as training but only 1% if you took the guaranteed advancement in place of the roll).  I  wonder if I got that by noticing the week of riding giving a check but missing the rest.  I vaguely recall giving either a practice gain roll or an experience roll for the first week of riding the one and only time it happened in Balazar. Actually, anything intense for a first week was considered and possible checked in my games if it made sense to do so (again I seem to recall using practise rolls not training for this HR). 

In RQIII, we had a similar rule with 'Speak (Language)'. Somebody that new at least a certain percentage could gain by simply living in another language country. I don't remember the values, though.

[Bill the barbarian]

2 hours ago, Joerg said:

By this logic knowledge skills should gain checks for weeks spent doing (directed) research on some subject, too. Directed research as in finding details about the myth that would be used for the next heroquesting like special weaknesses of the expected opposition.

Under the right circumstances I really can't see why not. As the rules for trying and practice have changed drastically, I will have to rethink how I would HR that but... that's another day's puzzle.

[soltakss]

On 4/16/2019 at 2:06 PM, Richard S. said:

Speaking as teenager right now, I honestly can't remember the last time my group actually followed combat to the letter. It just feels really clunky and slow in some parts, especially for those of us who play CRPGs in which combat is a noticeably quick affair. And no, I don't think there's ever been an instance of any of us cheating.

A lot of people adjust all aspects of the rules to suit the way they play. Combat can also be adjusted without any problems.

Glad to see that you have found a better way of doing combat. Would you be able to post what you do differently?

[soltakss]

On 4/17/2019 at 4:26 PM, styopa said:

Wait, you get a POW check for resisting?

Checking, and yeah, that seems to be the implied intent of the paragraph:

That has always been the case, in the rules. We have never played it that way, we have always played that Overcoming POW is an Active thing and that is how you get POW Gain Rolls, just resisting is Passive and doesn't get anything. However, the rules have always said differently.

[soltakss]

On 4/17/2019 at 4:49 PM, PhilHibbs said:

Back onto "What the heck check that out" features, if you beat off a Disease Spirit you immediately gain 1D3 POW. Bestiary p.169. Risky, but lucrative.

Right, off to summon a POW 5 Disease Spirit and set it on my mates, again and again and again ...

[Austin]

1 hour ago, soltakss said:

Right, off to summon a POW 5 Disease Spirit and set it on my mates, again and again and again ...

Unfortunately the disease spirit loses the POW stolen, and in the Bestiary entry all disease spirits have a Spirit Combat of 75% and POW stat of 3D6+6 (p.169)... but the principle remains the same!

I'm just waiting on my assistant shaman player to try using this exploit. It's deliciously risky.

[Joerg]

54 minutes ago, Crel said:

Unfortunately the disease spirit loses the POW stolen, and in the Bestiary entry all disease spirits have a Spirit Combat of 75% and POW stat of 3D6+6 (p.169)... but the principle remains the same!

I'm just waiting on my assistant shaman player to try using this exploit. It's deliciously risky.

That just means you have to find one of those POW9 spirits, learn its true name, and reuse that over and over. IIRC only embodied foes get POW checks...

(This really belongs in the egregious munchkinnery thread...)

[DreadDomain]

5 hours ago, Joerg said:

By this logic knowledge skills should gain checks for weeks spent doing (directed) research on some subject, too. Directed research as in finding details about the myth that would be used for the next heroquesting like special weaknesses of the expected opposition.

Sure but with a huge difference: the GM is in full control of what specific knowledge can be gained through research. A player might declare his character will spend a week,na month or a year researching about the myth that would be used for the next heroquesting like special weaknesses of the expected opposition but if the information is simply not available (GM's call), he won't learn anything.

[styopa]

3 hours ago, soltakss said:

That has always been the case, in the rules. We have never played it that way, we have always played that Overcoming POW is an Active thing and that is how you get POW Gain Rolls, just resisting is Passive and doesn't get anything. However, the rules have always said differently.

If by "the rules" you mean RQG, maybe so.

But not RQ 3, as I'd quoted the pow gain rule previously.

[PhilHibbs]

5 hours ago, soltakss said:

That has always been the case, in the rules. We have never played it that way, we have always played that Overcoming POW is an Active thing and that is how you get POW Gain Rolls, just resisting is Passive and doesn't get anything. However, the rules have always said differently.

The way you have played it has always been the way the rules were written. You don't get a POW check for resisting spells, and never did in any Chaosium edition.

[PhilHibbs]

7 hours ago, soltakss said:

Right, off to summon a POW 5 Disease Spirit and set it on my mates, again and again and again ...

...until you've taken 5 points off it, at which point it is destroyed.

[Bill the barbarian]

Wasn't sure if this thread was gone or not but a conversation in the prison thread sent me scurrying to the RQ RiG for a quote and then here with a Chalana Arroy Priestess resurrection spell in tow... Credit for my checking this out goes to soltakss Joerg, and Metcalph. Thanks.

and the new addition to Wth... Cto! are the following rules from the Equipment and Wealth chapter of RQ RiG page 406:

Storing Treasure 

Temples serve as storage centers for grain, livestock, precious metals, and other valuables. Most cults do not charge their initiates (or those of associated gods) to store goods within the temple; lay members typically pay 5% of the value of the goods. 

Important temples serve as local centers of economic activity. Some temples make loans, charging an annual interest of 3D6+6%. Failure to repay a loan often results in a visit from the cult’s Spirit of Retribution or worse. 

Most temples do not recognize deposits made with other temples, even of the same cult. A deposit made to the major temple of Ernalda in Clearwine cannot be redeemed at the great temple of Ernalda in Nochet. A notable exception is the Issaries cult. Deposits made at an Issaries temple are recorded with a sealed letter of credit that can be redeemed at another Issaries temple, thereby facilitating long-distance trade.

Sweet!

Edited May 7, 2019 by Bill the barbarian
oooh r**#&!** *#^! spelchekr

[Brootse]

On 4/18/2019 at 11:30 AM, Runeblogger said:

But that's not the case, you only gain a POW roll if you successfully defend from a magical attack. 

I like this rule. Otherwise many munchkins would learn offensive spells just because that's the way to get POW-gain rolls, which makes no sense at all.

There was some broo gang in the old Pavis & Big Rubble campaign setting that had this exact tactic.

Edited June 5, 2019 by Brootse

[Imryn]

On 4/19/2019 at 12:39 PM, Joerg said:

That just means you have to find one of those POW9 spirits, learn its true name, and reuse that over and over. IIRC only embodied foes get POW checks...

(This really belongs in the egregious munchkinnery thread...)

Don't Rune Lords allied spirits get POW checks for worshipping etc? I know they are normally embodied, but I don't think embodiment is actually required for the POW check. 

[Kloster]

2 hours ago, Imryn said:

Don't Rune Lords allied spirits get POW checks for worshipping etc? I know they are normally embodied, but I don't think embodiment is actually required for the POW check. 

Allied spirits are initiated, so the should be able to perform worship.