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Rick Meints

Old glorantha publications and the Meints index

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12 hours ago, lordabdul said:

Here are some notes I think might be worth adding:

  • Mentioning at the top that all the links are for the PDFs, but add a note specifically next to GtG, GSB, and the 4 books in the new line, that those are available in dead-tree format too.
  • Make a note of reprinted material where the previous material is also in the list (since I'm not sure why you would want to buy both the old and, err, less old book, except for historical value or completing your collection):
    • Glorantha Classics Griffin Mountain is a second edition of Griffin Mountain.
    • Glorantha Classics Cult Compendium collects and revises Cults of Prax, Cults of Terror, Rune Masters, TrollPak, RuneQuest Companion, and some magazine articles including some from Wyrms Footnotes.
    • Glorantha Classics Borderlands & Beyond collects and revises Borderlands, Plunder, Rune Masters, Nomad Gods, RuneQuest Companion, and some magazine articles including some from Wyrms Footnotes.
    • Apple Lane was (AFAICT?) heavily revised for the RuneQuest Gamemaster Pack.

Please do not take my comments as criticism. Clarity is always preferable when talking about things, often to avoid confusion. The thing is, some things are a bit hard to define and provide full clarity for without extensive descriptions and notes. The product list at the start of this thread is meant to be short and elegant, and descriptions would add a lot to the page. I believe that is why links are included to other pages where much more descriptive detail is found. As for details:

Gloranthan Classics Griffin Mountain wasn't meant to be a second edition. Yes, it has some new art and some designers notes. I see it more of a director's cut than a second edition.

The Cult Compendium collates material but does not really revise anything. It mainly collects a lot of cults together in one place. I'm not sure why you list Rune Masters as being a part of that book, since I can't think of anything from it in this book. The only thing from the RQ Companion is the Illusion magic article.

Borderlands & Beyond doesn't include all of the material found in the original Rune Masters book. I didn't include all the treasure charts and such. Once again, this book doesn't really revise anything. None of the Classics are meant to revise anything other than fixing simple typos.

I'm one of those guys who very much wants to know about every edition and printing for every RuneQuest and Gloranthan publication out there. That's why I wrote a 100+ page book on what's in all the gloranthan/runequest publications I could track down that were published between 1975 and 1999. That book, the Meints Index to Glorantha is currently out of print. I'm toying with updating it, but including all of the publications from 2000-date is a bigger task than I first thought.

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1 hour ago, Rick Meints said:

The product list at the start of this thread is meant to be short and elegant, and descriptions would add a lot to the page.

Fair enough!

1 hour ago, Rick Meints said:

The Cult Compendium collates material but does not really revise anything

I got this from the Credits page. The version currently available on the Chaosium store seems to be the 2nd edition of the Cult Compendium which (according the gray boxed text at the bottom) is a "second edition revised and corrected, with new material". It's the same wording for the other books.

1 hour ago, Rick Meints said:

I'm not sure why you list Rune Masters as being a part of that book, since I can't think of anything from it in this book.

I got that from your preface in that book :)  Maybe I misunderstood the context of what your wrote there, but that's what's mentioned in the first paragraph ("Ever Forward", page 3). Most of what I wrote in my previous message was taken from those prefaces, actually.

It sounds like I got a lot of things wrong, but as a result I would love to get more information about it, or at least enough information to know how useful/not useful it would be to get the original sourcebooks if I own those "Glorantha Classics" bundles?

1 hour ago, Rick Meints said:

That's why I wrote a 100+ page book on what's in all the gloranthan/runequest publications I could track down that were published between 1975 and 1999. That book, the Meints Index to Glorantha is currently out of print. I'm toying with updating it, but including all of the publications from 2000-date is a bigger task than I first thought.

That sounds like an awesome piece of gaming archeology and would love to see it in PDF some day :)  (and, if annotated, the exact thing I'm looking for!)  If that helps, it sounds like the type of work that you could crowdsource somehow.

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5 hours ago, Rick Meints said:

That book, the Meints Index to Glorantha is currently out of print.

But still very useful in compiling a campaign when I'm going "now where was Darjini pottery mentioned?" or the like. (I exaggerate, but only a little)

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4 hours ago, lordabdul said:

Fair enough!

I got this from the Credits page. The version currently available on the Chaosium store seems to be the 2nd edition of the Cult Compendium which (according the gray boxed text at the bottom) is a "second edition revised and corrected, with new material". It's the same wording for the other books.

I got that from your preface in that book :)  Maybe I misunderstood the context of what your wrote there, but that's what's mentioned in the first paragraph ("Ever Forward", page 3). Most of what I wrote in my previous message was taken from those prefaces, actually.

It sounds like I got a lot of things wrong, but as a result I would love to get more information about it, or at least enough information to know how useful/not useful it would be to get the original sourcebooks if I own those "Glorantha Classics" bundles?

That sounds like an awesome piece of gaming archeology and would love to see it in PDF some day :)  (and, if annotated, the exact thing I'm looking for!)  If that helps, it sounds like the type of work that you could crowdsource somehow.

I overstated the "revision" statement. The Cult Compendium took the best and most complete version of each cult (circa 2002) and put it into a single volume. As the sole guy who scanned, cleaned up, and organized the content, I can guarantee I did not revising of material beyond fixing typos. The only editing done was maybe a teeny bit of grammar and such. Sometimes the original author of some of the material would post some errata in an article, and sometimes put that in if it was related to an error. The revision statement is the same in each book because I probably cut and pasted that from volume to volume and updated the overall preface. Other than the additional art in each book, I basically did all of the work needed to complete the last three volumes of the Gloranthan Classics. In the first volume, Colin Phillips and I both did the layout.

Strictly speaking from a content perspective, if you have all four classics, you basically have everything from the original Pavis, Big Rubble, Griffin Mountain, Borderlands, Plunder, Cults of Prax, and Cults of Terror. You will not have: most of TrollPak (other than the cults), most of the RQ2 rulebook, about half of Rune Masters, most of the RQ Companion, all 3 SoloQuests, Apple Lane, Snakepipe Hollow, or Foes. I included some text from the Nomad Gods war-game, but only a fraction of it.

What I really need to do is bite the bullet and release the Meints Index to Glorantha II as a PDF. It's been out of print for almost 20 years. Here's one sample entry if you want to know what it is like (as written in 1999):

4011 - Plunder, Rudy Kraft, 48 pages, August 1980.
This book has two sections, the 24+ pages of treasure tables (for that quick monty haul) and the 43 detailed magical treasures rich in history and cult specifics. I’ve already said more about the tables than they deserve, so I’ll focus the rest of the write-up on the treasures. Most are extremely rare or unique, but a few classics like Rhino Fat and Chaos Slime are more accessible.  Greg has said the Inhuman King version of the dragonewt skin 25 point armor doesn’t exist, but YGMV.  A variety of obscure heroes like Barjora (Humakt’s pal), Hortaga Dash (mistress race troll), Gazhmen (belt of fire giant strength), Zackhorn, Mazta (air spirit), Mazoo (vampire),Tora, Scala (rhino rider), Wantoo, Nosmas (wigmaker), and Minanen could be great fodder for writers. Of all the items herein, pity the Lunars, they get sweaters. Some Lunar nobles are lucky enough to have one for every day of the week.  Once again Rick Becker did a few pictures, which help. If you like Plunder items, Rudy wrote more in Pegasus magazine. Only a few of the items have been reprinted in Borderlands and Tales. The anorexic woman in a skimpy outfit on the cover harkens back to the early days of the hobby.

4023 - RuneQuest Companion, GS, et al, 72 pages, 1983.
The last RQ2 item by Chaosium. The introduction explains it was meant to replace the type of source material no longer available via Wyrm’s Footnotes. As such, many of its entries are reprints. Loads of artwork make it a rich addition. Contents are:

Expanded cult compatibility chartala Cults of Prax.  The most complete listing for RQ2.
Index of RQ cults, Sherman Khan.  A list of all the RQ2 cults in supplements, Wyrm’s Footnotes, and Different Worlds.
Jonstown Compendium, GS.  This is sprinkled throughout. It contains a variety of obscure background information.
The Harlot of Alone, Ron Nance.  WF#2 reprint. Why?
The Maze of Sharxy Oborok, Alan LaVergne.  A short solo with a chance for illumination.
Walktapus Cooking, Bill Johnson. WF #2 reprint. Being a big fan of Beatpot Aelwrin, Serves enough for two RQ cons.
Holy Country, GS. Detailed geography information and maps. The most info printed until the RQ3 Genertela box set. Still, this deserves a reprint. Probably the most missed piece for RQ3 fans.
Species Spotlight: Unicorns, Sandy Petersen. Gateway Bestiary.
The Dispatch of Fadabius, Jim McCormick.  WF #3 reprint.
Illusion Magic, GS. Trickster spell info. Better defined later.
Skullbush, Sandy Petersen. Useful plant.
Prince Argrath’s Entry into Boldhome, Ron Nance.
The Smell of a Rat, Alan LaVergne. Hard boiled detective fiction.
More on Trolls, Sandy Petersen. TrollPak leftover.
A History of My Black Horse Troop, GS.  WF #1 reprint with Hungry Jack, Sir Ethilrist, and Keener Than.
The Ivory Plinth, GS.   WF #3 reprint.
RQ2 Changes and Additions,  WF #10 reprint also included in the boxed rules.

The book also has EXTENSIVE lists of where to find stuff like Spells, Creatures, Cults, and similar. Here's a small sample for Cults:

Cult List

Cults may be listed as gateway (G) or partial (P). Multiple listings are in rough order of completeness. 

Cult                                                          Source
Aeolus (G) (P)                                                        Griffin Island
Agados (P)                                                             Drastic Darkness
Aldrya                                                                      Cults of Prax
Aldrya                                                                      Elder Secrets
Aldrya                                                                      Gods of Glorantha
Amanstan (P)                                                        Troll Gods
Amaterasu (G)                                                       Land of Ninja
Amida (G)                                                              Land of Ninja
Ancestor Worship                                                 Gods of Glorantha
Annilla                                                                    Troll Gods
Apollo (G)                                                                DW #5
Aranea                                                                     Troll Gods
Aranea                                                                     TrollPak2
Argan Argar                                                            TrollPak2
Argan Argar                                                             Troll Gods
Argan Argar                                                              Gods of Glorantha
Arkat                                                                          Troll Gods
Armanstan (P)                                                         Cults of Prax
Arran (P)                                                                   River of Cradles
Arroin (P)                                                                  Cults of Prax
Arroin (P)                                                                  River of Cradles
Artmal (P)                                                                 Troll Gods
Asrelia                                                                       Gods of Glorantha
Asrelia (P)                                                                 Troll Gods
Atyar                                                                          Shadows otB
Bagog                                                                       Cults of Terror
Bagog                                                                        Lords of Terror
Bagog                                                                        White Wolf #22
Bagog                                                                        Gods of Glorantha
Bagog (P)                                                                  Drastic Chaos
Balazar (P)                                                                Griffin Mountain
Baldr (G) (P)                                                              Vikings
Basmol                                                                      Drastic Prax
Basmoli Berserkers (P)                                           GoG
Belorkal (P)                                                              Drastic Darkness
B’stard Gee’Em (G)                                                    Pavic Tales #9
Black Fang                                                                RQ2 Rules
Black Fang (P)                                                              Gods of Glorantha
Blackfinger (P)                                                              Gods of Glorantha
The Black Sun                                                               Troll Gods
Blood Sun (P)                                                                Troll Gods
Bloody Tusk                                                                      Elder Secrets
Bloody Tusk                                                                 Pavic Tales #3
Bluegloom (P)                                                            Big Rubble
Blue Star (G)                                                            Thieves’ World Comp.
Borists (P)                                                                    Gods of Glorantha
Borukug (P)                                                                 Drastic Darkness
Boztakang Chaos-fighter (P)                                    Troll Gods
Brithini (P)                                                                    Gods of Glorantha
Brother Dog (P)                                                           Griffin Mountain

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Thanks for the updates and info @Trifletraxor.  And thanks to @Rick Meints for the insight into the contents -- and yes I'd love to see that index book sometime :)

I might be worth saving what Rick said by moving those messages in a new thread instead of pruning them?

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3 hours ago, lordabdul said:

Thanks for the updates and info @Trifletraxor.  And thanks to @Rick Meints for the insight into the contents -- and yes I'd love to see that index book sometime :)

I might be worth saving what Rick said by moving those messages in a new thread instead of pruning them?

There you go! ;)

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