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Atgxtg

Officer Pay

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I'm having trouble figuring out what the officer bonus pay would be for Salisbury. According to table 3.4 in the Book of the Warlord, A Marshal's bonus pay (devoted to his upkeep) is, according to the customary revenue: £100= £1, £300 = £3, £1000= £5

Salisbury has a customary revenue of £1574, so what would the Marshal's pay be? I assume there is some method to figure this out by court costs of something but I don't know what it is.

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My suggestion? Round the revenue to the nearest hundreds of libra (here, to £1600), then follow this table:

image.png.40324fa669446eaf3b4a37c1e0dc7039.png

It was obtained from the best Excel fit of the data provided, with this function:
pay = 1.736 * ln(revenue) - 6.9625

In this instance the officer pay would be £5.8, or £5  16s. 

I don't know how this relates to any court costs, however.

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Or if you want to make it a bit simpler...

x1.7 in income = +£1 in bonus pay

x3 = +£2

x5  = +£3

x10 = +£4

So Salisbury ought to be about £6.

It doesn't really matter in that scale whether it is £5 or £6. Or if you want it to be something else. The Great Baron can easily afford to pay more to a Favorite Marshal if he wants to.

 

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I approached it from a different angle. In order for the officers to have some standing they must be above average. This also is reflected in their financial status. So an officer of an earl should maintain himself as a rich knight. The Earl will pay them out enough to maintain this standing. In my game each was awarded some rights that they are able to ber rich knights.

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7 hours ago, Cornelius said:

I approached it from a different angle. In order for the officers to have some standing they must be above average. This also is reflected in their financial status. So an officer of an earl should maintain himself as a rich knight. The Earl will pay them out enough to maintain this standing. In my game each was awarded some rights that they are able to ber rich knights.

That's actually what the bonus pay is, per the BotE and BotW. For instance a typical officer gets around £3 in bonus pay, which is automatically used to improve his standard of maintenance to rick. 

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So based on the answers I take it that there is no official method? Okay that makes it easier. Thanks.

The reason why I mentioned court costs is that there is an throwaway line that links officer pay to the revenue generated by a lord's court. But tying it to revenue is a lot simpler. 

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The officers' bonus pay is budgeted as part of the Court budget, but the exact numbers within the Court budget are more of a guideline. They were sanity tested so that the High Officers should appear with some bonus for a minor baron (£100), should be rich knights at a regular baron's court (£300), and then a bit more than that around a duke's court (£1000). I forget why it was put to £5 instead of £6. Might have been some legacy reason, or simply to keep the income logarithmic but the increase arithmetic, as the court size keeps growing, too. Since more people to want a nibble on the bonus cake, too, the individual proportional portion has to come down. In other words, even though the Marshal gets 1% of the liege's income as OBP at £100 liege level, he only gets 0.5% at £1000 liege level.

 

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I wonder if trying it to the discretionary funds instead of the Total Customary Revenue makes more sense, since discretionary funds increase at a slower rate?

BTW, does anyone remember what book has the income for Uther? Is it Book of Uther, Warlord, or Estate? I want to compare the 9 for Royal Marshal to the value derived from mandril_one's formula. I'm working on a streamlined table based on his formula, rounding everything off to the nearest quarter or half librium. I'm thinking I can just add a list of multipliers/modifiers to get the other officer positions, bribes and such, so we could scale the results for any holding. 

 

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57 minutes ago, Atgxtg said:

I wonder if trying it to the discretionary funds instead of the Total Customary Revenue makes more sense, since discretionary funds increase at a slower rate?

Proportionally, Total CR and DF increase at the same rate, absent Free Income. Tying it to DF just complicates things.

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2 hours ago, Morien said:

Proportionally, Total CR and DF increase at the same rate, absent Free Income. Tying it to DF just complicates things.

Okay. I rounded off mandrill_one's formula to the nearest £0.5, similar to what you did, and matched it up to the existing values. I'm going to combine the values so that we get ranges like: £1000-1200 = £5, 1300-1600 = £5.5, £1700-2200 = £6 and so forth. 

That should give us a much smaller table, and be easier to scale for different officers and bonuses. Something like this:

  Income Landholder Pay Bonus  
  £60.5-£80 Minor Baron £0.5  
  £80.5-£107 Minor Baron, Bishop or Abbot £1  
  £108-£143 Minor Baron £1.5  
  £144-£191 Minor Baron £2  
  £192-£255 Minor Baron £2.5  
  £256.5-£340.5 Baron £3  
  £342.5-£454.5   £3.5  
  £457-£607 Rich Baron £4  
  £610.5-£810 Duke £4.5  
  £814.5-£1081 Duke £5  
  £1087.5-£1443 King Cadwyr £5.5  
  £1451.5-£1926 Count Salisbury £6  
  £1937-£2570.5   £6.5  
  £2585.5-£3431   £7  
  £3450.5-£4579   £7.5  
  £4605.5-£6111.5   £8  
  £6147-£8157   £8.5  
  £8204-£10887 King Uther £9  
  £10950-£14530.5   £9.5  
  £14614.5-£19393   £10  
  £19505.5-£25883.5   £10.5  
  £26033-£34545.5   £11  
  £34745.5-£46106.5   £11.5  
  £46373.5-£61536.5   £12  
         

 

Edited by Atgxtg

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Well, if you like income ranges as a function of pay (the latter rounded off to the nearest £0.5), you probably also want to round off a bit the income range figures too. For example:

image.png.a888f2d425caa06935104037ad837c3a.png

(of course, instead of 451-650 and 651-850, you could write 450-649 and 650-849, and so on).

Edited by mandrill_one
Errors in some ranges

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On 5/21/2019 at 6:22 AM, mandrill_one said:

Well, if you like income ranges as a function of pay (the latter rounded off to the nearest £0.5), you probably also want to round off a bit the income range figures too. For example:

(of course, instead of 451-650 and 651-850, you could write 450-649 and 650-849, and so on).

Yeah, I did use your formula listed above with some rounding off, which is why the values are fairly close.

 

On 5/21/2019 at 9:18 AM, Morien said:

Also see p. 30 of ESTATE. It has a Steward at £50 estate with £1 bonus pay.

Yeah, but it looks like some officers also cap out (i.e. castelllans at £3) while other do not. 

So I'll have to put the low cap down around 50 for £1. At least for Stewards. 

 

 

 

I was also thinking that maybe the glory awarded to an officer should vary depending on who he is an officer of. It would seem to me that being the Marshal for a king should be more glorious than being the Marshal of a minor estate holder. 

 

 

Edited by Atgxtg

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To Atgxtg

   The glory for the marshal of a king is already greater because every time he goes out and leads troop he does so as the army commander which gives a flat glory award at every battle he leads no matter the outcome. Donj't forget that he will be participating in extremely large battles which give extremely large amounts of glory along with the fact that he is most likely to survive every round and gain glory from it. Plus there is also all the time he will be at court with the king and the other great nobles which offers him even greater chances for more glory.

While the little marshal to some £100 lord is gonna have none of those chances to gain additional glory.

So as you can see the additional glory you are wanting to award is earned through other glory mechanisms that the players might not see on screen because they are simply not present as lowly household knights to some minor baron or even to some of the greater barons.

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I'll grant that, but what about the other officers, who generally don't get much glory from their office?. 

 

Oh and I did (eventually) spot the +25% Glory increase to "High" Officers, so it does seem the there is greater prestige for serving someone of a higher rank.

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