Basic Spirit Magic representation and use

[klecser]

Spirit Magic record-keeping and use questions:

Spirit Magic spells are often listed as "Spell X"

1) This number represents the maximum number of effect gained by that character and it may have come from a combination of character creation or a character later doing favors for temples/cults that grants them boosts to magic, correct? I might start with Heal 2, but do a thing for the Cult and they give me one more "Spirit Magic spell point," essentially?

2) Let's say I have Heal 3. This means that I can cast Heal with 3 MP. Can I also Cast it with just 1 or 2 MP if I so desire?

3) If I have Dullblade 3, that caps the effectiveness of my Dullblade, but it doesn't stop me from spending MP to get past magical defenses, correct? So if I  cast Dullblade 3 at 6 MP, it would only have the "strength" of the 3, but the rest is to overcome a raised magical defense, correct?

4) Spirit Magic "spell ranks" are ultimately capped (CHA), but rarely do you see starting characters with Spirit Magic spell rank totals approaching the cap. Would it be fair to say that one of the many, many goals of adventuring is for some characters to do quests and other duties that allow them to gain more access to magic from their Cult?

5) Unlike Rune Magic, where any character can cast from the General list, Spirit Magic is entirely dependent upon what a temple or cult teaches you, correct? Most players start the game with only about 1-3 spells, depending upon rank but they potentially gain more as they quest?

I know these questions likely seem obvious to veterans. But they are not necessarily obvious to new players, especially as we code switch from other games. I'm trying to build my logical consistency within the game right now so I can effectively GM it.

Edited May 27, 2019 by klecser

[jajagappa]

50 minutes ago, klecser said:

This means that I can cast Heal with 3 MP. Can I also Cast it with just 1 or 2 MP if I so desire?

Yes.

50 minutes ago, klecser said:

If I have Dullblade 3, that caps the effectiveness of my Dullblade, but it doesn't stop me from spending MP to get past magical defenses, correct?

Correct.

51 minutes ago, klecser said:

Would it be fair to say that one of the many, many goals of adventuring is for some characters to do quests and other duties that allow them to gain more access to magic from their Cult?

Yes.

51 minutes ago, klecser said:

Spirit Magic is entirely dependent upon what a temple or cult teaches you, correct?

Not restricted in this case to the cult you've initiated to. It's what any temple or shaman might teach you. If you're an Orlanthi but out performing some quest for an Ernalda temple, your reward might be specific spirit magic known to that Ernalda temple.  Thus you can get an array of interesting and distinct spirit magic beyond what is taught by your cult.

53 minutes ago, klecser said:

Most players start the game with only about 1-3 spells, depending upon rank but they potentially gain more as they quest?

Yes.  As noted RQG p.73: If your cult teaches spirit magic, choose 5 points of cult spirit magic. Typically that will be 2-4 spells. The spirit magic spells taught by the cult are listed. An initiate can start with spirit magic spells taught by an associated cult. Definitely draw on the associated cults if a player thinks those might better fit their character (and within context of the GM's game). 

[Joerg]

Ninja'ed by Harald, so editing duplicate replies.

56 minutes ago, klecser said:

I might start with Heal 2, but do a thing for the Cult and they give me one more "Spirit Magic spell point," essentially?

Sort of. You'd be taught Heal 3 rather than "one additional point of Heal".

 

 

56 minutes ago, klecser said:

4) Spirit Magic "spell ranks" are ultimately capped (CHA), but rarely do you see starting characters with Spirit Magic spell rank totals approaching the cap. Would it be fair to say that one of the many, many goals of adventuring is for some characters to do quests and other duties that allow them to gain more access to magic from their Cult?

Accumulating a range of useful and powerful spirit spells for yourself and your spirit companion is indeed one of the ways to "level up" your character, besides skill increase and (rarer, more time-consuming) characteristic increase. Learning spirit magic takes comparatively little time.

 

56 minutes ago, klecser said:

5) Unlike Rune Magic, where any character can cast from the General list, Spirit Magic is entirely dependent upon what a temple or cult teaches you, correct? 

While there is a handful of rune spells common to most cults, the selection of rune spells you can learn is limited by your cult's (or cults') catalogue. Spirit magic on the other hand is an open catalogue. The cults may have limited spell teaching resources, but they will make them available to lay members in good standing, too. (Bring a large enough gift and be from a neutral or better cult, and you'll be in good standing unless you or your ethnicity have some negative history with the temple.)

Even less limited is the array of spells that a shaman can teach, but then the shaman can only teach you spells for which he knows the spirits. An experienced shaman may have access to a great range of spells. It might happen that he only has a "Heal 5" spell spirit and no "Heal 4" spirit at his beck and call (or he may be lying about that), so you might be forced to learn the higher version to be able to cast the lesser effect. Small temples might have a similar problem.

 

56 minutes ago, klecser said:

I know these questions likely seem obvious to veterans. But they are not necessarily obvious to new players, especially as we code switch from other games. I'm trying to build my logical consistency within the game right now so I can effectively GM it.

True. "We hold these truths to be self-evident", you might say, meaning we might fail to point it out to a new player. Keep asking.

[HreshtIronBorne]

Further Training and Experience

The Rune Priest gains an automatic 1-point increase in cult spirit magic each Sacred Time. Pg 277 RQ:G Core Rulebook

I have been confused by this passage and this seems like a decent place to field this question. How does one learn spirit magic, in terms of higher point values? This passage leads me to believe that you stack on additional points when you learn more powerful versions of a spell.

This also seems to indicate that, at least for cult spirit magic spells, that a Rune Priest could end up specialized in a couple different spells at fairly high levels, or just one spell if they really wanted to be a one trick pony. Matrices can always patch up spell knowledge for other stuff if a Rune-Priest/Lord wanted to have say a Bladesharp 7-21 or a Protection 7-21. We have always used 2d6-5 to determine the magnitude of variable spells found randomly on spirits and such. 

 

Currently our GM is loathe to hand out spells greater than 4 points to non-Rune-Priests/Lords and 6 points for Rune Masters, 7 points if the shaman finds a lucky spell on a spirit. So, most characters learn several 4-point spells, a bunch of utility spells, and a Disruption/Befuddle/Demoralize/Insert POW Struggle Spell Here. Lol. All depending on what matrices you find though.

[klecser]

2 hours ago, jajagappa said:

The spirit magic spells taught by the cult are listed. An initiate can start with spirit magic spells taught by an associated cult. Definitely draw on the associated cults if a player thinks those might better fit their character (and within context of the GM's game). 

Ok, this is a nuance that was not clear to me on first read, but hearing you explain it this way, in this context, made a difference.

[jajagappa]

4 hours ago, HreshtIronBorne said:

How does one learn spirit magic, in terms of higher point values? This passage leads me to believe that you stack on additional points when you learn more powerful versions of a spell.

The cult (or shaman) summons a more powerful spirit and you learn the more powerful spell. The "effective" cost is equal to the # of points of the new spirit magic spell (e.g. Heal 3 costs 3x Heal 1), but the end effect as to what you can cast is Heal 3 (whether you think of it as replacing or stacking onto, the end result is the same).

4 hours ago, HreshtIronBorne said:

that a Rune Priest could end up specialized in a couple different spells at fairly high levels, or just one spell if they really wanted to be a one trick pony

Yes, that could be done.

4 hours ago, HreshtIronBorne said:

our GM is loathe to hand out spells greater than 4 points to non-Rune-Priests/Lords and 6 points for Rune Masters, 7 points if the shaman finds a lucky spell on a spirit.

Likely the cost/danger for the temple to bring in more powerful spirits is dangerous. But I would have no issue with a shaman finding one for a character.

[g33k]

22 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

The cult (or shaman) summons a more powerful spirit and you learn the more powerful spell. The "effective" cost is equal to the # of points of the new spirit magic spell (e.g. Heal 3 costs 3x Heal 1), but the end effect as to what you can cast is Heal 3 (whether you think of it as replacing or stacking onto, the end result is the same).

Except for the co$t; particularly when learning from a shaman, for whom spell-teaching is their primary income.

A cult may teach a spell for free, or at reduced cost, to a favored cult-member.  But the shaman will charge the full cost of that Heal-4 even if the character already knows Heal-3.

Unless you can bargain some item(s) and/or services(s).

 

[Bill the barbarian]

So many good answers here I will only dip my toes so as not to drown out good advice from all.

7 hours ago, jajagappa said:

Not restricted in this case to the cult you've initiated to. It's what any temple or shaman might teach you. If you're an Orlanthi but out performing some quest for an Ernalda temple, your reward might be specific spirit magic known to that Ernalda temple.  Thus you can get an array of interesting and distinct spirit magic beyond what is taught by your cult.

7 hours ago, klecser said:

I believe this is how a lot of us rule it, roleplaying and all. And in my option the correct choice, again role playing and all. Why would a temple just sell away its treasures (lest that was it reason to exist, the god of selling out)?

By the game's rules (without the additional GM seasoning mentioned above),  I am not sure that you have to do anything but pay the prove listed in RQ RiG to the correct temple of a non-hostile cult that has no reason not to teach to the spell and voila, you have the spell. If your god allows it, that is, does not prohibit the spell. 

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

 Spirit magic on the other hand is an open catalogue. The cults may have limited spell teaching resources, but they will make them available to lay members in good standing, too. (Bring a large enough gift and be from a neutral or better cult, and you'll be in good standing unless you or your ethnicity have some negative history with the temple.)

 

See above

 

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

True. "We hold these truths to be self-evident", you might say, meaning we might fail to point it out to a new player. Keep asking.

Please, I am learning things I though i knew, (see other thread where I bone it... maybe, the jury is still out).

5 hours ago, HreshtIronBorne said:

I have been confused by this passage and this seems like a decent place to field this question. How does one learn spirit magic, in terms of higher point values? This passage leads me to believe that you stack on additional points when you learn more powerful versions of a spell.

 

me confused too.

[klecser]

11 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Please, I am learning things I though i knew, (see other thread where I bone it... maybe, the jury is still out).

I think the final judgment is that, if we are talking about RQ3, you nailed it. If we are talking about RQG, you boned it. But hey, you tried really hard and I'm no worse off. 😜

Edited May 27, 2019 by klecser

[soltakss]

19 hours ago, HreshtIronBorne said:

The Rune Priest gains an automatic 1-point increase in cult spirit magic each Sacred Time. Pg 277 RQ:G Core Rulebook

I have been confused by this passage and this seems like a decent place to field this question. How does one learn spirit magic, in terms of higher point values? This passage leads me to believe that you stack on additional points when you learn more powerful versions of a spell.

I think that it means you get a point of Spirit Magic that you can choose.

So, if you have Bladesharp 2 and Farsee, then you could get Healing 1 at Sacred Time, for example, or you could increase Bladesharp 2 to Bladesharp 3.

There has always been a difference in how people interpret variable spells, certainly from RQ2 times and into RQ3 and RQG. Some people think you learn Bladesharp 3 as a completely new spell, some people think you just add it to the Bladesharp 2 spell that you already have.

Personally, I think that each extra point of a variable spell is a new 1 point spell that just adds to the others. So, if you have Bladesharp 2 then you learn the (one point) Bladesharp 3 spell, that way you can cast Bladesharp 1, 2 or 3 easily enough. To learn Bladesharp 3 from scratch you have to also learn Bladesharp 1 and 2, although I play that you can learn them all together as one spell. The cost of the spell works that way, you have to pay for Bladesharp 1, 2 and 3 in order to get Bladesharp 3 from scratch.

[PhilHibbs]

16 hours ago, jajagappa said:

The cult (or shaman) summons a more powerful spirit and you learn the more powerful spell. The "effective" cost is equal to the # of points of the new spirit magic spell (e.g. Heal 3 costs 3x Heal 1), but the end effect as to what you can cast is Heal 3 (whether you think of it as replacing or stacking onto, the end result is the same).

It's not entirely clear that summoning a spirit is the way that cults teach spirit magic. It just says that priests can teach spirit magic, but that it takes a week (p277). That doesn't sound like the old RQ3 mechanism of summoning a spirit and beating it into giving you the spell.

[jajagappa]

13 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

It's not entirely clear that summoning a spirit is the way that cults teach spirit magic. It just says that priests can teach spirit magic, but that it takes a week (p277). That doesn't sound like the old RQ3 mechanism of summoning a spirit and beating it into giving you the spell.

No, it's not explicit as to what happens in that time period in RQG. In my game, they continue to summon cult spirits as part of the teaching (though there are likely other activities to inscribe the focus, learn the gestures, etc.).

[Shiningbrow]

16 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

It's not entirely clear that summoning a spirit is the way that cults teach spirit magic. It just says that priests can teach spirit magic, but that it takes a week (p277). That doesn't sound like the old RQ3 mechanism of summoning a spirit and beating it into giving you the spell.

 

2 hours ago, jajagappa said:

No, it's not explicit as to what happens in that time period in RQG. In my game, they continue to summon cult spirits as part of the teaching (though there are likely other activities to inscribe the focus, learn the gestures, etc.).

I think this 1-week thing doesn't really make any sense. Nor does the economics (particularly for shamans).

Carving a focus... it could be done within an hour. A focus is not magical in any way - it just helps the person to focus on the spell in mind, and then to utter the right words, intonations, maybe hand movements, etc.

As for actually learning the spells... if it's from Spirit Combat, then it can be done within 30 seconds! Especially since all the various spirits with X Spells (of Y variability) and Z POW would already be known to the cult/shaman.

Specifically for Shamans, if they're 'teaching' via the summoning of the appropriate spirit, I'd suggest the economy is broken (in favour of the Shaman). The summoning and temporary control of the spirit is going to take a similar amount of time, effort, energy, etc regardless of the spell being 'taught' (except in the case of fairly powerful spells). I don't imagine that every fresh-faced newbie shaman has to go out on their own to find their own spirits to help them out... instead, they'll be introduced to those that have been hanging around the tribe for generations so they can call upon their assistance (such as for teaching their spells!)

I would think it unlikely that a spirit with Heal 1 wouldn't also know Heal 2 and Heal 3 (meaning, it actually knows Heal 3, but could pass on its knowledge for only the 1st point).

So - if the spirit is already known, and the POW known, and the spells are known - and if the time, effort and energy for summoning and controlling the spirit with Heal 1 is about the same as for the Heal 3... then why is the Shaman charging 3x as much for the 3 as the 1? (or, why isn't the Shaman charging 150 for the Heal 1???)

[g33k]

49 minutes ago, Shiningbrow said:

I would think it unlikely that a spirit with Heal 1 wouldn't also know Heal 2 and Heal 3 (meaning, it actually knows Heal 3, but could pass on its knowledge for only the 1st point).

This point is key to your argument, but IIRC isn't addressed in the RAW.  I suggest that, instead of making THIS assumption, you assume a rarity of sprits knowing higher-MP variants (and difficulty of finding them) that closely matches the cost differential.

In other words, make the assumption that has the rules be sensible, instead of the assumption that has the rules seem broken...

[Shiningbrow]

37 minutes ago, g33k said:

This point is key to your argument, but IIRC isn't addressed in the RAW.  I suggest that, instead of making THIS assumption, you assume a rarity of sprits knowing higher-MP variants (and difficulty of finding them) that closely matches the cost differential.

In other words, make the assumption that has the rules be sensible, instead of the assumption that has the rules seem broken...

But, for the Shaman, who has been part of a spirit tradition handed down for generations, there's no need to go finding those higher MP variants - they're already known entities. Especially for the more common spells (Heal).

Sure, my suggestion fails if the spirit loses the spell (for some reason, the knowledge is transferred out). Otherwise, spirits usually being 'immortal", then it's not an issue. And, this is especially especially true for ancestors - and again especially for Shaman ancestors (Summon Spirit Teacher + Summon Specific Ancestor).

I'll make the assumption that the rules be sensible rather than broken when there is reason given to support it. After all, it seems extremely illogical to suggest that the rarity of a spirit is an important factor, given that said rarity doesn't impact on time... whether it's a 1pt Heal or a 20pt MultiMissile, it still takes 1 week to finish the teaching. (again, odd, given that a spirit can teach a spell - any spell to any variable point level effectively instantly).

[Joerg]

21 hours ago, soltakss said:

Personally, I think that each extra point of a variable spell is a new 1 point spell that just adds to the others. So, if you have Bladesharp 2 then you learn the (one point) Bladesharp 3 spell, that way you can cast Bladesharp 1, 2 or 3 easily enough. To learn Bladesharp 3 from scratch you have to also learn Bladesharp 1 and 2, although I play that you can learn them all together as one spell. The cost of the spell works that way, you have to pay for Bladesharp 1, 2 and 3 in order to get Bladesharp 3 from scratch.

I can understand that point of view if you came from RQ2 Battle Magic which didn't suggest there were spirits involved, except when you went to a shaman to learn one.

Coming from RQ3, I imagine that you wrestle with a spirit for the entirety of its spirit (or battle magic) spell knowledge. If the spirit is a Bladesharp 4 spirit, you can learn Bladesharp 4 from it. If you only have three points of spell capacity left, you immediately forget one of those points, but you still learnt 4 points, and that's what you will be charged for.

What I am not clear about is whether a used spell spirit is released back into the spirit world where it can somehow recover its spell knowledge, or whether it resides covertly within the spell caster who learned the magic. In one case, if you have its name, you can sic it on applicant after applicant, allowing for some regeneration in between. In the other case you will have to provide a different spell spirit every time you provide someone with that knowledge.

The HQ1 model appears to imply that the spirit stays with the owner of the charm. Spirit magic is something you have.

[PhilHibbs]

3 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

I think this 1-week thing doesn't really make any sense. Nor does the economics (particularly for shamans).

Carving a focus... it could be done within an hour. A focus is not magical in any way - it just helps the person to focus on the spell in mind, and then to utter the right words, intonations, maybe hand movements, etc.

We don't know that, it's an assumption. A focus might take days to make. I've never made a spell focus so I don't know.

3 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

As for actually learning the spells... if it's from Spirit Combat, then it can be done within 30 seconds! Especially since all the various spirits with X Spells (of Y variability) and Z POW would already be known to the cult/shaman.

Again, the evidence from the rules is that it is not from Spirit Combat and it takes a week, not 30 seconds. Even if spirit combat is involved, it could still take a week from start to finish. Spirits are not USB drives that you can just plug in and copy data from. Well, I'm falling into the same trap - making an assumption - they might be just like USB drives, but in that case MGWV.

3 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

Specifically for Shamans, if they're 'teaching' via the summoning of the appropriate spirit, I'd suggest the economy is broken (in favour of the Shaman). The summoning and temporary control of the spirit is going to take a similar amount of time, effort, energy, etc regardless of the spell being 'taught' (except in the case of fairly powerful spells). I don't imagine that every fresh-faced newbie shaman has to go out on their own to find their own spirits to help them out... instead, they'll be introduced to those that have been hanging around the tribe for generations so they can call upon their assistance (such as for teaching their spells!)

Again, assumptions. Sure, there's a spell for summoning a spirit, and it takes X amount of time. There's a spell for controlling a spirit, it takes less time. But there's no spell for transferring the knowledge of a spell from a spirit to a person. The other spells are necessary but not sufficient, there is clearly a third process going on, and it is the most time-consuming of all.

3 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

I would think it unlikely that a spirit with Heal 1 wouldn't also know Heal 2 and Heal 3 (meaning, it actually knows Heal 3, but could pass on its knowledge for only the 1st point).

So - if the spirit is already known, and the POW known, and the spells are known - and if the time, effort and energy for summoning and controlling the spirit with Heal 1 is about the same as for the Heal 3... then why is the Shaman charging 3x as much for the 3 as the 1? (or, why isn't the Shaman charging 150 for the Heal 1???)

In the old days, you HAD to learn Heal 1 before you learned Heal 2. Then, you know both, and each takes 1 point of Free INT. So in that sense, the spirit that knows Heal 1 may also know Heal 2. The fact that this has been somewhat simplified and we just talk about "learning Heal 2" doesn't mean that the underlying "reality" has changed. The game mechanic has just been simplified.

RQ3 is out of the window. Forget everything you knew about RQ3 spirit spell teaching, which absolutely was just "summon it, beat it up, done".

[Shiningbrow]

19 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

We don't know that, it's an assumption. A focus might take days to make. I've never made a spell focus so I don't know.

The descriptions for what constitutes a focus include some things that (can) take a very short period of time - tattoo, scarification, carvings. And, we have real world examples - our Earth Runes from various cultures (obviously, Norse being the most obvious). However, they serve as more than just a focus (closer to a matrix). The actual carving is simple.

 

19 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

Again, the evidence from the rules is that it is not from Spirit Combat and it takes a week, not 30 seconds. Even if spirit combat is involved, it could still take a week from start to finish. Spirits are not USB drives that you can just plug in and copy data from. Well, I'm falling into the same trap - making an assumption - they might be just like USB drives, but in that case MGWV.

I think the USB analogy works for learning the spell directly from the spirit (or you'd be pretty much out of it for quite a while in normal circumstances). You enter spirit combat, defeat the spirit - Yay! - but then can be stuck in a mental limbo for the next few days as the spirit imparts its knowledge to you? I don't think that's what was intended (if so, there would.should be rules for being fed etc, and needing to have your body guarded... or some other mechanic. As it is, it's "defeat spirit, learn spell").

The week may well be preparation from the Shaman.. but my bigger concern/argument is that it takes the same amount of time and effort to learn Heal 1 as it would for Multimissile 20 (RAW).

(I'm also assuming that the Shaman doesn't have knowledge of every single spell to high variable levels kept in mind, or within all of their spirits. That is, at some point, the Shaman is going to have to go fetch (pun intended!)

 

19 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

Again, assumptions. Sure, there's a spell for summoning a spirit, and it takes X amount of time. There's a spell for controlling a spirit, it takes less time. But there's no spell for transferring the knowledge of a spell from a spirit to a person. The other spells are necessary but not sufficient, there is clearly a third process going on, and it is the most time-consuming of all.

True. But, again - Heal 1 vs Multimissile 20....

 

Where's the old "1 day per point"???

 

[PhilHibbs]

2 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

You enter spirit combat, defeat the spirit - Yay! - but then can be stuck in a mental limbo for the next few days as the spirit imparts its knowledge to you?

Where does that come from?

2 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

 

 

[Shiningbrow]

1 hour ago, PhilHibbs said:

Where does that come from?

Merely a hypothetical.

Since we're discussing options of how things work with no information to go on. Other options are...???

(remember, this is the "Any adventurer defeating a spirit in combat may gain one of its spirit magic spells (player’s pick). If the spirit possesses a variable point spell, the adventurer may gain possession of as many points in the spell as the spirit possesses". )

There's no indication of how long that takes, nor what happens during that time.

I initially suggested that it happens virtually instantaneously (USB analogy), but that was questioned (denied?). So, I posed another alternative based on what I see as fairly logical (in that, I don't think the spirit is obligated, nor forced to hang around and wait for the student to be ready to learn the spell at their own leisure - it needs to happen immediately, or the spirit is free).  So, what's happening to the student while the spell is being mystically transferred from the spirit to the person learning it? And, obviously, how long does that take?

I don't think that you can wander around for a while learning the spell while actively engaged in doing anything else (especially since you're not supposed to be able to do that the harder way). And, what would happen if your concentration is broken while doing the learning?

I'm quite happy to hear other scenarios for how this all works

[g33k]

One thing I would suspect takes a while is producing the focus.

I envision it as a long meditation, then you mark a certain line or swoop to be tattoo'ed, or make one stroke of the whittling-knife... then you meditate for a while to get the exact NEXT mark, etc.

It's not this blazing image of certainty that needs to get out, so you scrawl it quickly and boomDONE... 

It's a brain-bending Otherworld sigil that needs to be perfectly represented in order that you should have your brain bent in just the right way, reliable even in the heat of battle, or the fog of just-woken confusion, or the unfocused agony of a brand new gut-wound.

 

[Runeblogger]

Just my two cents:

• When players learn the focuses of their spells can be tattoos, they'll only want tattoos as focuses, because they are very rarely lost!
• Never let Chalana Arroy initiates or priestesses teach Sleep to initiates from other cults. It should be exclusively for Chalana Arroy initiates/priests/esses.

[Shiningbrow]

6 hours ago, Runeblogger said:

Never let Chalana Arroy initiates or priestesses teach Sleep to initiates from other cults. It should be exclusively for Chalana Arroy initiates/priests/esses.

They don't. It's a cult secret. Like, really secret secret.

[Shiningbrow]

13 hours ago, g33k said:

One thing I would suspect takes a while is producing the focus.

I envision it as a long meditation, then you mark a certain line or swoop to be tattoo'ed, or make one stroke of the whittling-knife... then you meditate for a while to get the exact NEXT mark, etc.

It's not this blazing image of certainty that needs to get out, so you scrawl it quickly and boomDONE... 

It's a brain-bending Otherworld sigil that needs to be perfectly represented in order that you should have your brain bent in just the right way, reliable even in the heat of battle, or the fog of just-woken confusion, or the unfocused agony of a brand new gut-wound.

 

I totally appreciate that's how your Glorantha works.

However, not so in mine. 

I base mine on real world examples. The mind can be trained to focus relatively easily, especially if it's been taught to (as I imagine is the case in Glorantha as well). 

As an example, I have a "focus" of putting my thumb and forefinger together that makes me almost instantly more awake and aware. Others use prayer beads to focus their attention on something. 

The focus itself isn't important, it's the attachment to it (which, I grant, can be time consuming to associate).

(Also remember that a simple charm of feathers could be a focus).

Other real world similarities would be time carvings, which tend to come as a whole and not line by line.

 

But, again, your Glorantha, your way...

[SDLeary]

8 hours ago, Runeblogger said:

When players learn the focuses of their spells can be tattoos, they'll only want tattoos as focuses, because they are very rarely lost!

Come now... This is RQ. There are plenty of ways to loose tattoos, especially if they are on a limb!  😉

SDLeary