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klecser

Practical Elder Race Play Questions

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10 hours ago, g33k said:

For a Dwarf -- it wouldn't be raised on a "family history" basis, nothing to create individualism, family "pride," etc...

For a dwarf, it must be project based! Did you complete on schedule, what disrupted the schedule, etc.

The Dragonrise would seem to be a major disruption, a breaking of the ritual to complete the Perfect Sky (that crack that Umath made is visible again!)

The most recent completed task is the Restoration of the Boat Planet. Finally got that spell by Zzabur dismissed.

Was the Great Winter a completed task? A primary step towards the completion of the Perfect Sky? Or was that an unexpected failure? Have to get Orlanth's Ring working again, oh, and this time get all the stars out there!

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Some other Dwarf events:

1470-1492 - Contract for the Five Cities awarded; Wilmskirk, Jonstown, Swenstown, Duck Point, Boldhome

Note: possibly a resurrection of the ancient 5 cities; each direction has a "foe" that attempts to stop the city rise; Grower disrupts the western city - must make arrangements with "Zzabur" (aka Delecti). Boldhome as the "Spike" must have an inherent flaw (some dwarf knows this).

1497 - Contract for the First Road awarded (Jonstown-Boldhome-Wilmskirk) 

15xx - Contract for the Second Road awarded (Boldhome-Swenstown) - special connection made to Copper Caves and Flintnail Temple; dangerous passage through the Dead Place

1539-45 - Disruption of magical energies by dragonewts; workmates dissolved by phantom dragonewts; roadways disrupted - many repair crews required; units dispatched to Flintnail Temple for assistance

15xx - Contract for the Dangerous Road awarded (Jonstown-Isle Dangerous) - undoubtedly some battle with the Creek involved

1560's - Dorasar's Contract for New Pavis - reopening of the Flintnail temple

15xx - Contract for Tarkalor's Roads awarded (the Duckton Road to Duck Point and the Whitewall Road) - disruptions by Kitori; extra "lights" required to build through the "darkness"

15xx - Contract for the Far Road awarded (Dangerford-Aldachur) - secret connection to Dwarf Ford or Dwarf Run opened? or connection of the Creek to the River (via Engoli River)?

1602 - The New Deal contract; dwarfs reassigned from Boldhome posts to other duties (ala Acos leaves his post, allowing Chaos to enter the Spike)

1621 - Contract for the Perfect Sky awarded

1621-24 - Corrections for the Boat Planet via the Cradle "bob" and the circumnavigation; raising of the Boat Planet

1625 - Dragonrise; Perfect Sky broken again

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Update: We are making characters tonight! This thread has given me some good ideas to go with. Chiefest among them are ways to integrate Elder Race backstories with humans of Dragon Pass and to encourage players that play Elder Races to write backstories.

I copied many of your comments into a document to use for future reference.

Thanks everyone!

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5 hours ago, klecser said:

I copied many of your comments into a document to use for future reference.

 

If you ever feel the inclination to release this into the wild,  I would not only be interested but thankful as well.

Cheers

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5 hours ago, klecser said:

Update: We are making characters tonight! This thread has given me some good ideas to go with.

Best of luck!!!

 

5 hours ago, klecser said:

Chiefest among them are ways to integrate Elder Race backstories with humans of Dragon Pass and to encourage players that play Elder Races to write backstories.

I think the biggest thing to convey is how very very un-Tolkein the Gloranthan Elves/Dwarves/Trolls are.  I'd try to deprecate even using those names, because they've become so very Tolkienized....

The Aldryami are plant-people, literally grown from the soil; some call them "Elves," but they are more Swamp-Thing than Legolas!  (though an "Ent" is also very Gloranthan, if not very PC-ish)

The Mostali are more like biomech's, like the "Cleaning Service" in the Labyrinth.  Some are stilted, programmatic, Robocop-ish.  Individualtiy is anathema to them.

Uz seem terrifyingly violent and  bloodthirsty... from the human POV.  They are actually an ancient high culture, with primal Darkness (and its associated features of cold, devouring, secrets, etc... all of which seem terrifying to humans) as a central feature.

Maybe get some art (I think some of the good Gloranthan artists have DeviantArt and similar accounts, so you can call up typical images) to show at the gaming table?

 

Let us know how things go!

 

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1 hour ago, g33k said:

The Aldryami are plant-people, literally grown from the soil; some call them "Elves," but they are more Swamp-Thing than Legolas!  (though an "Ent" is also very Gloranthan, if not very PC-ish)

I'm digging about for a reference, but isn't there some (potentially non-canon) assertion that player-character Aldryami -- the ones who look and act essentially like humans -- may have been grown by a forest specifically as "ambassadors" to other Man Rune species?

!i!

[Edit: I may be conflating this with the rationale behind Mostali player-characters.  However, sauce for the goose...]

Edited by Ian Absentia
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On 7/24/2019 at 2:54 PM, Ian Absentia said:

I'm digging about for a reference, but isn't there some (potentially non-canon) assertion that player-character Aldryami -- the ones who look and act essentially like humans -- may have been grown by a forest specifically as "ambassadors" to other Man Rune species?

!i!

[Edit: I may be conflating this with the rationale behind Mostali player-characters.  However, sauce for the goose...]

Certainly this is possible.  Canonically I believe such elves are just basically considered crazy (rootless) elves by the others.

On 7/24/2019 at 1:51 PM, g33k said:

Maybe get some art (I think some of the good Gloranthan artists have DeviantArt and similar accounts, so you can call up typical images) to show at the gaming table?

 

There's an even more ample trove of screen shots from Guild Wars 2 players, their Sylvari are very much how I imagine Aldryami look:

Never mind evil dragons. The Sylvari's real horror came when they discovered a race of giant humanoid woodpeckers. It was a knotty problem when they realised their bark was worse than their bite, so the whole forest just packed up their trunks and left.

some more plantlike than others of course: here's the page for their art direction https://www.artstation.com/artwork/ngogr LOTS of good stuff there.

kristen-perry-kperry-sylvariartdirection-02.jpg?1530072489

 

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I still don't get why they remain mammalian; unless, as Ian Absentia writes, they've been bred as ambassador/spies among humans. "The far end of the plant spectrum" seems much more likely for day to day Aldryami.

Even then, what role do motile plants play in the forest ecosystem? They seem like very expensive defense systems when you could just mobilise forest dwelling animals.

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1 hour ago, Rob Darvall said:

I still don't get why they remain mammalian; unless, as Ian Absentia writes, they've been bred as ambassador/spies among humans. "The far end of the plant spectrum" seems much more likely for day to day Aldryami.

Even then, what role do motile plants play in the forest ecosystem? They seem like very expensive defense systems when you could just mobilise forest dwelling animals.

I don't see any reason for "mammalian" either, but the features may be intrinsic to Man Rune entities.

And despite the Plant, Aldryami also do have Man Rune as part of their beings.

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9 hours ago, Rob Darvall said:

I still don't get why they remain mammalian; unless, as Ian Absentia writes, they've been bred as ambassador/spies among humans. "The far end of the plant spectrum" seems much more likely for day to day Aldryami.

Even then, what role do motile plants play in the forest ecosystem? They seem like very expensive defense systems when you could just mobilise forest dwelling animals.

A lot of dryads use forest dwelling animals in their defense (or ambushing trespassers even though they aren't aiming a the dryad's inner grove), but the man-rune aldryami aka elves are more like independent agents while those animal waves are more like drones with quite limited range. Elves provide long range intelligence, strike forces, and avengers without having to expand the forest to the doorstep of the enemies. Something like that is in preparation, but that, too, uses elves rather than beasts controlled like drones.

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Update. We have:

-A Silver Mostali

-A Pixie

-Two humans

-One undecided.

Everyone has great ideas as to how they will weave together interacting. The posts here really helped!

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4 hours ago, klecser said:

-A Pixie

(...)

Everyone has great ideas as to how they will weave together interacting. The posts here really helped!

A pixie! Wow, that is uncommon. Please tell us what ideas they've got and how everything goes. :-)

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7 hours ago, klecser said:

Update. We have:
...
-A Pixie
...
-One undecided.

If you're going to have a pixie, I think you need a minotaur to go with it.

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On 7/26/2019 at 12:58 PM, styopa said:

Certainly this is possible.  Canonically I believe such elves are just basically considered crazy (rootless) elves by the others.

The "crazy" elf/dwarf/dragonewt ruling has proven pretty useful over the years because, well, that's how most players play them.  Especially players new to Glorantha.  (Curiously, Uz seem to work just fine for most newbies, though they usually don't want to play them.)  But for seasoned players who've boned up on the Elder Races, I'd welcome characters with backstories that emphasise a reason for cooperation and mingling with human society, and generally behaving like a human without being an outcast or slouching into the "young Prince Hal" trope.  Even a dragonewt may have an inscrutable reason for mimicking human behavior for several years before resuming more traditionally draconic pursuits.

On 7/26/2019 at 10:09 PM, Rob Darvall said:

I still don't get why [Aldryami] remain mammalian...

By that you mean boobs, yeah?  I guess the Man Rune is pretty figurative in that regard.  And maybe, as you suggest, it goes toward supporting my theory that spiritually active forests occasionally grow PC elves as interfaces with their human neighbors and cultivate them to human's behavioral and anatomical expectations.

!i!

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4 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

... And wood.

NOT strictly mammalian.  But point taken.

Wait, no.

Carry on.

!i!

Edited by Ian Absentia

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8 hours ago, Ian Absentia said:

The "crazy" elf/dwarf/dragonewt ruling has proven pretty useful over the years because, well, that's how most players play them.  Especially players new to Glorantha.  (Curiously, Uz seem to work just fine for most newbies, though they usually don't want to play them.)  But for seasoned players who've boned up on the Elder Races, I'd welcome characters with backstories that emphasise a reason for cooperation and mingling with human society, and generally behaving like a human without being an outcast or slouching into the "young Prince Hal" trope.  Even a dragonewt may have an inscrutable reason for mimicking human behavior for several years before resuming more traditionally draconic pursuits.

By that you mean boobs, yeah?  I guess the Man Rune is pretty figurative in that regard.  And maybe, as you suggest, it goes toward supporting my theory that spiritually active forests occasionally grow PC elves as interfaces with their human neighbors and cultivate them to human's behavioral and anatomical expectations.

!i!

"The world's magical so don't assume your real-world expectations apply here."

aka

the "A wizard did it" excuse.

(stock explanation for anything in Glorantha that doesn't conform to someone's preconceptions)

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8 hours ago, Ian Absentia said:

By that you mean boobs, yeah?  I guess the Man Rune is pretty figurative in that regard.  And maybe, as you suggest, it goes toward supporting my theory that spiritually active forests occasionally grow PC elves as interfaces with their human neighbors and cultivate them to human's behavioral and anatomical expectations.

35 minutes ago, styopa said:

"The world's magical so don't assume your real-world expectations apply here."

aka

the "A wizard did it" excuse.

I don't get it - you quoted some specific suggestions for actual explanations, and then paraphrased them as a general dismissal of the question.

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2 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

I don't get it - you quoted some specific suggestions for actual explanations, and then paraphrased them as a general dismissal of the question.

Not a dismissal of the question, a(n apparently-failed) mocking of the common mode of dismissal.

I guess an example of Poe's Law.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe's_law

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4 hours ago, styopa said:

"The world's magical so don't assume your real-world expectations apply here."

aka

the "A wizard did it" excuse.

(stock explanation for anything in Glorantha that doesn't conform to someone's preconceptions)

While it can be -- and is! -- overused, it's ALSO a very-fundamentally-Gloranthan thing.  SO MUCH differs in cause from the RW, that in those cases where exceptions-to-expectations occur, it often really IS "the myth is driving it" -- both the pieces as we expect them, and the pieces that very-much are UNexpected.

Overused (and perhaps abused) though it may be, it remains a staple of the experience of Glorantha.

YGMobviouslyV !

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I was actually thinking that I was going down with a typical Sci-Fi trope.  "On your planet, we have assumed forms your species can understand without fear..."

The more I think about it, the more inclined I am to suggest that Aldrya and Mostal are up to the same game when it comes to player-character versions of the elf and dwarf species.

!i!

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