JDS

Interesting points. 'Why do people Cthulhu?' is a question that I think is too often left unexplored. 'Evil' or 'insane' is usually tossed out and it is business as usual. But I believe it is something that, if explored, gives villains and cults greater depth. Admittedly, some Mythos beings don't attract followers with depth, but there's always room in any campaign for serial killers and murderous nutjobs. CoC is very inclusive in that regard. The way I look at it, the business of being a cult leader for one of the more 'rational' of the mythos entities is akin to playing 3D chess with the stakes being your life, and getting the keys to the vaults of the Bank of England. If you do it right, you not only get power, but you get power that no one else has access to. That last part is something that often gets overlooked. Some people crave the unique; it is why some people pay staggering amounts of money for the original of a painting, when a $500 print is just as vivid. The idea of having something that no one else in the world does is very intoxicating to some personalities.

Heresy! The problem with CoC is that scenarios tend to copy Lovecraftian fiction: one villain or small group, deranged, who is/are working to summon forth (insert elder being here). PCs save the world, and are scarred for life. It's a tough sell, because if all it takes is one whack-job who finds a book or artifact to bring down all of Mankind, we wouldn't last long enough to read this thread. The key is to go corporate: Cthulhu isn't going to get up early because of one guy with a book. No, to really get Elder Being face-time, you need a proven track record, a portfolio of success, and lots of support. Drawing a Elder Being should be about as complex as building a Fortune 500 company. Devoted people are going to have to extract the maximum effort out of a lot of wage slaves over an extended period of time to have a shot at the big time. There's going to be set-backs, hostile take-overs, and recessionary impacts.You're going to need to absorb smaller cults who have fallen behind the times, and merge with fast-climbing cults who will bring energy and assets. This will give the PCS endless opportunities to investigate seemingly-unconnected things that start becoming connected, to shoot it out with gun thugs, amoral security, and low-ranking believers, and generally have the sort of good times that PCs expect. The first season of True Detective is a prime example of how this works: they plugged away for years, uncovering layer after layer that went back generations. Another great source is the McCarthy view of communism and its infiltration of the West. Or the expansion of Wal Marts. You want lots of minions who are just following orders, looking the other way, getting a few bucks on the side. Then people who have seen unearthly things, but had their curiosity numbed by the application of money. Then the first people who actually know bits and pieces. And so on. So, first you build your occult organization, and then you set your PCs against it. You include lots of violence because that keeps players interested, and it keeps a lot of NPCs from sharing information (because they're dead). Slowly, a bunch of unconnected (make sure some scenarios are really unconnected) events start piling up until the players trust no one and nothing, and see conspiracy everywhere. That's how I see it being done.

Electric sheep.

The pocket Bible/book, etc stopping a bullet is true enough on the face of it, but a key issue that is seldom considered is how much power the bullet had when it hit. The Army has conducted detailed studies of body armor in four wars, and the problem that undermines the studies is the lack of data on the shooter; in Vietnam particularly, poor quality of ammunition saw numerous incidents where Americans and South Koreans were struck by gunfire that did minimal damage (one example was a US soldier shot in the face by an AK-47 at a distance of under 20'; the bullet pierced his cheek, knocked out a tooth, and chipped a tooth on the opposite side, coming to rest in his mouth. One issue I personally believe helped spawn the beliefs in the early years, particularly in forested eastern America and in the Philippines, is that shooting through dense brush and/or branches can cause rounds to deviate from the point of aim. So to people uneducated in the mechanics of firearms, shots from relatively close range missing could appear to be magically inclined. And there's just the vagurities of war: in one documented case, a British officer in the 1777 Saratoga campaign emerged from a fight uninjured, but with 27 bullet holes in his (loose fitting) clothing. Some of that count would be entrance and exit holes, but that is still an impressive incident. Similar evens have been documented in other conflicts.

You're right, some Boxer groups made the same claim. I guess if you're about charge US Infantry armed with Krags, and your guys all have big swords, you want to buck up the troops.

Way ahead of you, bunky. 😉 As a point of fact, not long after the Revolution several groups appeared with much the same philosophy of the northern, late-cycle Ghost Dances (removal of the whites, return of the lost, trappings that defeat bullets). Interestingly, the US Army encountered groups claiming to be able to defeat bullets via fetishes while putting down the insurrection in the Philippines.

Those are all good, but most are in fact the core occult villians in the core book, so I don't want to use them. Plus I don't know if any of my group are Masons. I've gone with three obscure European groups with the serial numbers filed off, and two Native American groups that are a mix of Mythos and local legends. I initially wanted an African-based group, and thanks to you I found an excellent one, but after careful thought I decided to save it for the 1920s. Even for a long campaign I have more than enough material to work with, what with the incredibly-layered politics of the American Revolution, the equally complex politics of the NA tribes, five cults, a variety of small independent groups and creatures, and then just a few nutcases tossed in to muddy the waters.

American, of course. 😉 Actually. I'm running a historical Flames of Freedom campaign. I'll check out the African societies; they could be very interesting, given the involvement of slavery in the conflict. Flames of Freedom's cults are just awful, and worse, they're in the core book for everyone to see, so I'm going with the Mythos, because you can't beat it for occult issues.

Nah, I got what I needed from Nozbat's post and a CoC wiki. Throw in some symbols from Pinterest, and I'm good.

It's nonsense. All it's doing is dumping more work on the GM, because I've got a lifetime supply of the old pronouns, and see no reason to switch. But it will impact my willingness to buy more products, at least until they stop discriminating against me.

The BBC is entirely fictional modern cults. Decent stuff, but not really transferrable. Thanks, Nozbat, I'll start the Wiki searches immediately.

So I've got the Big Book of Cults and Golden Dawn. They are helpful, but I am planning a long-run (50-odd weekly sessions) colonial-era game, and most of the BBC do not translate. What I want are a couple (more) well-developed cults, probably emigrating from Europe or Africa rather than local developments, for my setting. Anyone know of a product that can deliver this? I expect I will have to adjust to the time period, so long as the cults are not too embedded in a particular time period (as the BBC are).

Stepping out of the rules system, to bring a building down you need to attack the load bearing framework. You can punch holes in a building all day, so long as the the LBF stays reasonably intact. Since the PCs are moving the bombs, they're not too heavy. If it is pre-WW2 and the Mob, odds are it is commercial dynamite, medium-speed explosives at best, untamped, you're not looking at too great of a threat unless placed directly up against key structural points. Since it is a very tall building, it probably has an exterior box structure, which means the PCs may have moved the bombs to bad positions. But the bombs are pretty far apart. If the bomb planners had been smart, every bomb would have been on the second or third floors. If it is post-WW2 military-grade explosives, still untamped, the risk is higher. But all things considered, if the PCs run like hell, they should be OK. Bystanders outside are in extreme danger, though, as it will be raining lethal-velocity building materials for a city block.

Player Agency: I have the players be part of an informal organization, generally working for a single patron. This allows me to fee the PCs missions rather than endlessly involving friends and family. This also lets me use non-mythos (X-files) missions and purely secular missions to keep things varied. Companion NPCs Other than the patron and a patron-cut-out, I don't run NPCs as part of the party. I find players tend to meta-game input from such NPCs. Planning Connections and Arcs The patron is an individual, not an organization, and missions come down via the cut-out; as an individual, the patron's whims eliminates a deep need for connections. 'The boss read about this, and wants you to check it out' will suffice. Being informal, if the PCs decide to track down connections from a case for a while, there will be little opposition, as the patron has no pressing agenda, nor a need for justification. Weird Tech As Sustained Projects for Investigators I do not use weird tech. It clashes with my view of the genre.

Count me in!

The key to a long campaign IMO, is creating Mythos cults with depth of layers. And, as you noted, non-mythos sidebars. Plus I like to throw in the odd 'X-file' case, where it is supernatural/occult, but not tied to anything bigger. I view the credit rating as a social indicator. The next campaign I'll run will be in 1925, with the PCs being recruited (via a cut-out attorney) by Andrew Mellon. They will have (modest) salaries and expense accounts, but no official standing; they will probably use insurance adjustment as a cover if need be. Mellon's interest in all things financial should provide occult, criminal, and some political investigations.

I'm pleased with my house rule, and I'll keep it.

I'm not really using the credit rating system; players will be tracking income as is usual for most games. I run long campaigns (40+) sessions, so the PCs will be dealing with a lot more cultists than Mythos entities.

I'm doing for for a sense of accomplishment for the players. Most players want to see their PCs improve, even if it is in small increments. I posted my house rule in this sub-forum, but basically in addition to attribute points, it adds hit points and luck points. Small numbers, but I think it will do the job.

Leveling up (This in addition to the regular skill improvement system) PCs will be awarded Reward Points (RP) for Innovation, ideas, role-play, knowledge of setting, use of the IC chat, and any other contributions to the game. Expending 100 RP (200 for levels 11+) and taking three days downtime will advance the PC to the next level. Upon reaching a new level, the PC will have ten attribute points, each of which can raise a single Attribute (STR, CON, POW, DEX, APP, or IQ) 1 point. EDI and SIZE cannot be improved by this method. The player also receives ten Skill points, each of which can raise a single skill by 1%. Finally, the PC receives 2 additional Hit Points (3 if SIZE 75+), and 2 additional Luck Points. A Clarification of the Combat Round A round is six seconds long. During his turn, a PC may make a Movement Action, and one Attack Action. If at any time during an engagement, an enemy leaves the PC’s melee-weapon range (provided he has a melee weapon in hand), the PC can make an attack of opportunity. Attack Action: During an attack action, a PC may employ a ranged or melee weapon against any enemy within weapon range. Certain firearms allow more than one shot fired per round; these are rolled individually, with a penalty die added (p.114). This does not apply to full auto fire. Movement Action: A movement action can be split into multiple segments as desired, so long as the total distance moved does not exceed the PC’s total. If no attack is made by the PC, he may take two Move actions. Disengaging (safely leaving a melee-equipped foe’s range) costs half the PC’s movement, and moves the PC 5’ away. Additional activity: Communicating simple messages does not affect actions. A PC can drop an item in hand without cost. Picking up or passing one item is free, while additional items cost -5’ of movement. A PC can holster/sling one weapon, or draw/unsling one weapon, for free. If he chooses to draw/unsling or holster/sling a second weapon, it costs -5’ of movement. Reloading costs movement. Applying First Aid takes a full Movement or Attack Action. Other actions cost movement based upon the current circumstances. I plan to adjust reloading to cost movement, and add the BRP rule for suppression fire. I plan to use the optional rules for Point buy (p.49), Starting Skill cap (p.49), and spending luck (p.99).

Not a bad choice for urban use.

So you talk before the fight starts. But generally, cultists don't volunteer information to outsiders, at least in my setting. They tend to be less than chatty to outsiders. Drawing a weapon does not take long. But yes, ambushes occur. Don't have firearms with us? That hasn't happened yet. You're not going to walk around town lugging a BAR, sure. But a pistol under your coat was perfectly legal pretty much everywhere in the 1920s, and in the USA today. Sure, shoot-outs in town are not wise, but cultists tend to set up away from public view. I haven't yet had CoC cultists conducting ceremonies at high noon in the city square. Usually, they're out in the boonies, or in a cellar of a house on the outskirts. Yes, I've run very varied combat scenarios since I started gaming in 1979. No, its definitely a concrete combat system issue. I've already knocked out a paragraph laying out the possibilities for a six-second combat round that will surely serve our needs. Like I said, I've run Mythos campaigns before, just not using the CoC rules.

Nah, I do not like the pulp genre. I prefer a more serious, grim tone in any case, particularly when using the CoC setting. I've used a lot of CoC scenarios, starting in the 80s. I'm new to the system, not the setting. If a PC can survive a fight with a werewolf while armed only with a wood club, why would having a BAR make him more vulnerable? As to the nature and frequency of combat, that's in the GM's hands. It won't be a problem. I normally run high-risk systems.

I don't like 5e. I quit using D&D in the 80s, and only returned to 5e for a couple campaigns. Thanks for the rule references! I love the system, but the organization of the book is a bit scattered in places. I don't see questions arising in a firefight. Good point about a fellow PC losing it, though. But still, that's easily accommodated in a more defined combat round. I'm certainly not going to allow someone to run over a hundred feet in a single combat round.

I don't see melee coming into play in a 1920s setting, or even in an 1880s one. I can't imagine a player deciding that running up to a killer and punching them is superior to shooting them multiple times from a distance. Or at least, I don't see any point in keeping a player who thinks like that. But it's not a problem. A six-second combat round, and a short clarification of what is possible in terms of movement and action will suffice. They didn't develop excellent firearms rules and a really quality weapons list (plus the excellent weapon supplements) if a tactical game wasn't considered a valid option. I didn't pay a hundred bucks to Roll20 for dynamic lighting so players could free-style encounters. 😉