Relation between STR and SIZ

[Shadowdragon]

Is there any relation between a creature's STR and it's SIZ? If I drop a creature's SIZ by 5 should I also drop it's STR by a similar amount? If larger creatures are supposed to have higher STR scores then isn't that pretty much the same as adding SIZ twice when figuring out a creature's DB? Maybe DB should just be determined by the creature's full STR value.

[Atgxtg]

Realistically, yes. but as far as rolling up stats for an individual , no. It is just assumed to be factored into the rolled characteristics.

Real world-wise, the sqaure/cube law would apply (if you double the size of something, you'd cube it's mass and square it's muscle power). In game terms, if you are using ther SIZ table, this woks out to about +2 STR per +3 SIZ and -2STR for -3 SIZ. At least up to around STR 90 or so.

[Shadowdragon]

OK, lets say I'm trying to stat up a 20 foot tall giant. Should such a giant have the same STR range as a regular human but a much higher SIZ range? Such a giant would have longer limbs, denser muscles, and stronger bones, making it much stronger than a normal human, but how much of that extra strength comes from the giant's size? Should those factors be represented by a higher STR, or are they already represented in the really high SIZ?

[travellingbeetle]

STR in the SIZ range would be the normal. He can't have human STR if he is to wield a tree as a club f.ex..

SGL.

[Mechashef]

OK, lets say I'm trying to stat up a 20 foot tall giant. Should such a giant have the same STR range as a regular human but a much higher SIZ range? Such a giant would have longer limbs, denser muscles, and stronger bones, making it much stronger than a normal human, but how much of that extra strength comes from the giant's size? Should those factors be represented by a higher STR, or are they already represented in the really high SIZ?

A good question that perhaps doesn't have a good answer.

I'll give you one an answer that is based on the write-up of giants in RQ (Which grow up to 16m tall).

Can your giant lift its own weight? Many GMs would use the Resistance table, with STR as the active and SIZ as the passive.

If your giant has a SIZ of 40 and a STR of 40 then it would have a 50% chance of lifting its own weight. Note that following this logic, the average human has less than a 50% chance of lifting their own weight :-(

If your giant has a SIZ of 40 and a STR of 15, then it would have no hope of succeeding, and btw, unless you come up with a special spot rule, many humans would be able to beat the giant in an arm wrestle.

So yes, I would also scale up the SIZ. That makes giants really dangerous.

I’ve always loved RQ giants. A 16m tall giant is really scary. A 2m tall human would come about halfway to its knee. It can be really fun for characters to explore a house built on that sort of scale!

[Atgxtg]

My scaling post was based on the idea of making an individual creature larger or smaller (like with some sort of sci-f8i/magical device).

If you are scaling up a species, (like making giant ants) then you should raise STR to go with SIZ.

Realistically, the square/cube law limits how much you can scale up a being. Past a certain point no only would a creature not be able to move, but it bones couldn't support it, and it would suffocate under it's own bulk (think beached whale).

But, for a magical species and atomic horrors, like giants, dragons, or huge insects, or radioactive lizards, just scale STR and SIZ equally.

Most creates in BRP have average STR scores that are fairly close to thier average SIZ scores.

[Atgxtg]

OK, lets say I'm trying to stat up a 20 foot tall giant. Should such a giant have the same STR range as a regular human but a much higher SIZ range? Such a giant would have longer limbs, denser muscles, and stronger bones, making it much stronger than a normal human, but how much of that extra strength comes from the giant's size? Should those factors be represented by a higher STR, or are they already represented in the really high SIZ?

Mathematically, if he were made out of the same "stuff" as a human, his STR would sclae up a a slower rate than his mass (weight). So if you scaled up a average man (say 5' 10" and 170 pounds) up to 20 feet tall (about 3.42 times as tall), you would cube that for a weight of 6800 pounds! Since his mucle cross section would increase according to the square of the difference in height/SIZ he would be about 11.75 times stronger than a normal man.

In game terms, this works out to about +28STR (STR 38-39) and +42 SIZ ( 55 SIZ)

In the "real" world, there are reasons why creatures can only get so large, and why smaller creatures are stronger in proportion to their weight.

But in a fantasy game (or for a superhero who can grow) you might just assume STR keeps the same porportion to SIZ. It7s not realsitic but is a better fit for fantasy.