Ali the Helering

1 minute ago, Orlanthatemyhamster said:

That's very rare in cats. Is in a, 'By sometime next week.' kinda way?

Nah.  Probably 'smack on the nose if you disagree' kinda way

On 12/19/2019 at 9:34 PM, Crel said:

Geese is the only acceptable plural of geas and dammit that is a hill I'm willing to die on.

Sorry, buddy.  Geasa is the plural in Erse.

The problem is that that description of the Kitori is not common to all the sources, and they all will feed into many different understandings of what the Guide actually means!

Trust me, I'm a theologian.  Canon ain't all it's cracked up to be.  😇

2 hours ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

As far as I know the Kitori tribe includes both human clans and Uz clans.  They seem to have developed a common culture or at least overlapping cultures, under the Only Old One. 

The problem with this is that ideas of who and what the Kitori are have varied significantly over the years.

14 hours ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

Just as everyone human in Sartar worships Ernalda at sowing and harvest festivals, even though they may be Orlanth or Issaries initiates

I can't agree with this. 

Kolatings don't, as far as I know, and there will be Maranites who have their own festivals, for whom sowing and harvest may be less important than to farmers.  A case could also be made for Odaylans, who are separate from those cycles as well as less connected to the community.  For the same reason (separation) Humakti probably don't participate in those festivals.

I have to admit, I tend to view the Uz as a very highly developed culture.  The weakness in its depiction is the uniformity of its religion.

Yay Bill!

Over the last six months I haven't been active on the forums to the same extent either, for much the same reasons.  When did some of us forget that this was supposed to be a fun activity?  

I have always felt that this is an implicit element to the Cosmic Horror of it all.  The inexplicable should not be explained.😈

I give them a thousand opportunities for self-destruction, but never kill them

27 minutes ago, Jeff said:

But for whatever reason, it always comes down to Elmal. Like Templars in an Umberto Eco story.

Actually, it doesn't, but it is the most obvious fracture point.  When Greg revealed Elmal, I was highly resistant since I liked playing Yelmalions.  However, mythologically it was appropriate.  

Personally, I think that the understanding of religion per se was best exemplified in Thunder Rebels and Storm Tribe, with the simplification since being a real loss.

What it comes down to is Glorantha, and how Greg hooked each of us.  That will determine our vision, and our personal canon. 

3 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

What you are describing is an archetype. I would say one Eurmali would have a part of this behaviour, but no reason, to me  at least, to get all.

You may find a drunking glutton who never steal, or a facetious liar who never eats more than the bare minimum

Indeed.  Being a trickster could even mean behaving normally in every way, while declaring yourself an Eurmali.  

10 minutes ago, Jeff said:

I was curious what you were basing it off. Obviously not RQ, but the SKoH stuff I wrote. OK.

But as a creator, I am perfectly entitled to say that I don't think the stuff I wrote in SKoH really fits the setting we've put together since the Guide to Glorantha. I've said for years that SKoH is not canon, and Heortling Mythology was NEVER intended to be canon.

I made no reference to SKoH, so no, not that.  Even if it were, saying it isn't canon doesn't mean it wasn't in the past.

While HM wasn't canon, Storm Tribe was.

12 hours ago, Jeff said:

Greg had very little to do with that writeup. And Book of Heortling Mythology was filled with draft ideas from us without any editing. I am sure I have said many times that Greg was ambivalent about publishing that for exactly that reason (same with Arcane Lore).

Nonetheless, you asked for sources.  There they are.  Repudiating them now doesn't mean they don't exist and weren't established and published canon for years.

7 hours ago, Jeff said:

And your source is?

"Greg Stafford and friends" writing in HW Storm Tribe. 

• Elmali are Hearthguards (p48),
• Victorious Sun Day ritual bonfires to destroy his enemies (p49),
• Truth Day trials by fire (p49) - the only holy day shared with Yelmalio,
• The Long Night when priests "burn with the infusion of Elmal's renewed sacred flame, and this allows them to heal" (p50),
• "Heortlings dedicate the first hearth of any stead to Elmal.  As such it is kept aflame all day" (p50)
• Elmalharan Feats of Dry Field, Sunripen and Resist Frost, Redaldan Rekindle Hearth Fire (not shared with the main Redaldan cult) (p54)
• Yoskati agents of reprisal, preventing warming by sun or fire (p55)
• "In the morning his brightness burned"  (p57)

"Greg Stafford and Jeff Richard" writing in The Book of Heortling Mythology)

• "The vengeance of Elmal the Burner was so great that the wall melted" (p86)
• "The crops were warmed by a flickering Elmal" (p121)

A short perusal (15 minutes) - when time permits i will give a deeper reading

7 hours ago, Jeff said:

None of the Little Suns or Cold Suns have fire magic (hence the common name). And gets Command Horse from Hippoi.

And yet Elmal does, or did before he was neutered.

9 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Again I don't know why people would expect that the cult of the Little Sun is going to look very different from Yelmalio, regardless of name. 

 

A small matter of fire and horse magics, perhaps?

10 minutes ago, Darius West said:

In ancient Greece, only the fat and bones went to the gods:

Prometheus vs Zeus

Actually quite common across the  Ancient World - the Bible speaks of 'the fatmost parts'. 

I still like the pragmatism of the Nuer - when a cow sacrifice was called for, if the individual couldn't afford it then they cut a cucumber in half, throwing one half away to be consumed by the spirits.

Ah, but is it eldritch, squamous and rugose?

5 hours ago, Ironwall said:

Realized a great question. When would the Yelmalio Cult have reached Heortland and Esrolia and converted the local Elmali

Just a few years ago, when they realised the error of their ways after reading a new publication...

May I recommend 'Musiques de l'Antique Grecque' by the Ensemble Kerylos?  

8 hours ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

As far as I know we have no musical notation from the Bronze Age.  So it is pretty much up to imagination as to how any surviving lyrics were sung.  But we do have performers of Homer's and other epic poetry, and their performances seem to my ear to emphasize the rhythm of the poetry rather than complex tunes and harmonies.

 

In the early 1990s a musicologist published a paper suggesting that markings against the earliest documentation of the Biblical psalms might be the relics of musical notation and (if IIRC), suggested that it could be related to some marks on Bronze Age Egyptian monuments.  I don't think the idea ever gained much traction, though. 

On 4/20/2022 at 12:13 PM, Shiningbrow said:

Or go down instead of up... an earth elemental opening up a pit under the front row would cause havoc.

Or a few thunderbolts.

Or a durulz rolling under the pikes and chopping off the legs of the Yelmalions.  An unexpected tactic, but very effective at disruption.🦵😒

9 hours ago, JDS said:

See, I don't see occult items (books are another matter)as that hard to make; if you apply the transformative principle, than use should equal creation. For example, Aztec sacrificial knives becoming attuned to Yis after X number of heart extracts. The greater the use, the stronger the connection, which should keep the number fairly small, but still enough to ensure a few escaped the Spanish policy restricting invasive medical procedures. It also explains why items keep cropping up.

Gotcha.  I follow the concepts of ritual magic in my games, so we will inevitably differ.  Your Cthulhu Will Vary😁

There have been various stories involving vampires only being vulnerable to the holy symbols of their own religion, so perhaps terrain features would only work for true believers.  One reason for occult items being rare is that they should be really difficult to make in the first place, unless the powers behind them are deliberately using them as booby traps for the unwary.  (Dear God, not another Lost Ark!  How many is that this year?)

4 hours ago, JDS said:

Not holy to me, so nah.

Only to about 1/6 of the world's population, so I can see why it wouldn't bother you.  (By the way, I am a Christian minister!)