Armor & Helmets - Errata?

[Narl]

Reading through the armor descriptions, in the helmets section on page 260 it says:

If a helmet is not worn, reduce the armor value by –1 for a light helmet, and –2 for a heavy helmet. If using a random value armor system, modify the range by -1 or -2 as appropriate.

Based on what I see elsewhere in the book, I believe this statement to be incorrect. In the creatures section, the dwarf, orc, and knight all have armor with helms listed, and the helms add to the base armor amount in all three cases.

I also noted the random armor values in the table seem very close to Stormbringer 5 random armor values without helms. I would think you would add the helm to those values.

Should this be added to the errata section of the wiki?

[eric71]

i think the -1 and -2 modifiers refer to armors that traditonally feature a helmet,such as full plate,riot gear and futuristic assault armor. If your wearing full plate without a helmet you would adjust its armor rating -1 or -2. wearing chainmail plus a helmet would add +1 or +2 to your armor value.

[pansophy]

Edit:

"Almost all of these armor types also have helmets. It is assumed that full suits of armor include helmets."

The Knight on p362-363 has Armor 10. The Armor List shows Full Plate as AV 8, so adding a Heavy Helmet would add the missing 2. Looks like Narl is right and there's an error somewhere.

The Priest lists Armor 8. So at least the error is consistent

Jason? Are you around? Or somebody else of the playtest group? Any light here, please?

Edited February 23, 2011 by pansophy

[pansophy]

Ah! Hang on!

A closer look at the Armor List p399 shows a hint: only SOME armors (where under 'Location' 'All' is listed) have also the footnote "2" on it.

So that means to me, only the modern and advanced armors which cover all areas do include a helmet. The Ancient and Medieval Armors do not (as shown as "All but head").

Chain may cover the head as well, but does not include a helmet. It was possible to wear a chain mesh and a helmet over it - so this would make sense. Same is true for Thick Clothes.

Edited February 23, 2011 by pansophy

[Al.]

Jason? Are you around? Or somebody else of the playtest group? Any light here, please?

The equipment chapter wasn't part of the playtest (way back when) I'm assuming because with so many different official and houseruled sets of numbers for each bit of kit that Jason and Sam were expecting a very low signal to noise ratio in any discussions; and so decided that life was too short.

The random values don't really map to the RQIII fixed values but do almost fit the RQII fixed values (which makes sense since the random numbers first came about in StormBringer which was written just after RQII but before RQIII). So which set to choose? And which group gets narked off that their favoured implementation is orphaned?

On which note ()

My take on helmet/not helmet is to change the spread of the points a little rather than having a bonus or penalty.

i.e. Plate no helmet 1d10-1 helmet 1d8+2

eric71 and pansophy seem to be on the right track looking at RAW

[Chorpa]

Continouing this post on armour errata.

I came across this when writing an adventure. Riot Gear has a split AP of 12/6. But there is knowhere to find when or against what it does apply.

I assume it is the same as with the other armors with split AP and I assume they just forgot to include the footnote on Riot Gear in the list.

1. First value is vs. melee or low-velocity missile weapons; second value is vs. firearms.