dracopticon

Hello!

I don't know if this has been proposed before, but I need an addition to the Priest occupation in my scenario, as I want the magic to be something you get gradually, as a process. And that is mirrored in the addition of an Assistant Priest occupation, for me, that is is the same as an Acolyte. This is the write up I was thinking should describe this occupation (below). What do you think? If my English is faltering, please excuse me and I really would like some help in that case, because I a Swede and this is not my native tongue.

Assistant Priest (Acolyte)

Thsi is a person assisting the Priest in all religious duties, processions and daily services of the temple and the faith. The Acolyte is also trained in the more profound ways of Rune magic, just as the Priest. Acolytes either go through the rites and rigorous training to become true Priests or early on develop their style of support for the temple as a God-talker, either way, there are often several Acolytes helping and supporting the Priest, accompanying them on whatever duty is needed for the faith and local community. An Acolyte can also act like an envoy or leader for a small group on an important task, temporarily carried out for the temple or the community where it is placed. Acolytes are also a sort of "Nobles-in-training" as the Priest occupation has that elevated status.

Homelands: All.

Occupational Skills: Any Cult skill +5%, Cult Lore +10%, Dance+10%, Play Instrument +10%, Read/Write (Own language) +5%, Charm +5%, Orate +20%, Insight (Human) +30%, Manage Household +10%, Sing +10%, Worship (Deity) +30%, Meditate +10%, Prepare Dead +10%.

Standard of living: Free.

Base income: 70L.

Cults: All (except Daka Fal, Eurmal and Waha).

Favoured passions: Devotion (deity) or Loyalty (priest) or Loyalty (temple).

Ransom: 500L.

Equipment: Writing implements and materials (within a wooden carrying case), instrument of choice, good religious clothing and paraphernalia, composite helmet (3 pts), Heavy leather (2 pts), leather vambraces (1 pt), cultural weapons, shield, one riding animal, finer clothing, 70L coin and 150L worth of personal goods.

On 5/18/2019 at 10:33 AM, soltakss said:

We are using a hybrid of Revolution and RQG at the moment, but in Dark Ages Britain.

I am using Revolution's excellent Skills/Traits/Stunts system with some spells from RQG. If I need to use stead management, I'll use the RQG rules. Combat is really RQG with Revolution Combat Effects, which seems to be working well.

As Revolution is quite close to Mythras, in many ways, it would probably be as easy.

The trick is to decide which parts of which system you are going to use and sticking with them. Also, you'll need to Hopuse Rule some stuff, especially where the two systems don't gel as much.

Exactly. House Ruling is, as so many times before, absolutely essential. I do it all the time, with every game I run. But this time it seems, when I want *Heroes* for Hero Wars, I can't really go with certain parts of the basic RQG. The character's are generally too weak, there's too much magic flying around for my own taste - even if Glorantha IS steeped in magic. Still want to see magics as something rather mystical, at least the Runic part. The Spirit magic less so. I think I will go with the fact that the PCs are not initiates from the beginning, and they get that status during play, but can start with one Spirit Magic spell, unless you're playing a priest, in which case I allow Runic Magic and 3 spells at start. I'm also down sizing the opponents magic in the adventures.

I beg forgiveness if this thread started in the wrong department. Please move it or delete, whatever suits you moderators. It was not intended to aggravate.

13 hours ago, Raleel said:

my guess is you could import the Rune rules in wholesale (or close to it), and use similar cultures/careers in Mythras and you'd have what you want.

Thanks for the suggestion Raleel! I will look more closely at that possibility.

22 hours ago, hkokko said:

Running Glorantha happily in Mythras + Aig. check my blog. Notesfrompavis.wordpress.com

Thanks for the tip hkokko! I have already been reading your fantastic resources on the net! I am going to use the spell pages, but with much less beginning magic for starting characters than original rules use, like beginning PCs can take one spirit spell before initiation (which I choose to move to an ingame development). Likewise downsizing opponent magics and abilities. That last part will probably be a hairy business. 

22 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

I recall thinking that RQ 6 was incredibly modular and that it had been designed to shed or accept whole areas of rules. Whitaker and Nash even suggest doing this. I do not think that RQ RiG is as modular but thankfully it is BRP so it is inherently modular, though with a lot of modularity designed out. If Mythras has maintained the RQ 6 modularity you might need to use it as the base and graft on passions, runes, cults etc to taste from RQ RiG. I am going to guess going this route is should be slick. Keep us up to date please. 

To avoid bending noses out of joints I should ask... is this the right forum for this topic or like dracopticon has suggested, are we swearing in church and this thread should move to Mythras?

Yes, the modularity of RQ6 should be a basis for easier mixing. I just assumed, just as you said, that by both of them being BRP it would not be that much problem. That someone already had, and it seems by hkokko's words, it's possible. I will be checking. Thanks for asking the important question if this should be ported to the Mythras section. It probably should.

The general idea is that I want: hero points, I want less magic to beginning characters, I want (as I said earlier) more robust characters HP-wise/combat wise. I am also probably going to be using my own idea that character's have as much minus-HP as they have full total HP, but become unconscious at zero HP. And also, I am not a big fan of hit locations, which perhaps will be much harder to avoid.

Hello everybody!

I just want to thank everyone here who helped me before with ideas on how to possibly change the statistics rolls and other stuff earlier.

Anyway, now I am going "Swear in the Church" (a Swedish proverb, meaning "to say something out of place" or "not allowed"). The thing is, I adore some parts of the new RQ: Roleplaying in Glorantha, especially the setting and general feel of the game. It's just fab to be able to roleplay such wondrous RQ characters and we owe so much to the many talented people making that possible in this age of AD&D/D&D spinoff OSR and other horrid stuff, *shudder*, most prominently of course Greg Stafford himself. I am so lucky to have been able to buy a 1st edition from him on Ebay.

But: I am also in love with some parts of the Mythras "RQ" system, such as the combat system, the (better) strike rank system, the general robustness of the character in Mythras compared to RQ:RiG and other parts. So, my question (my swearing in the church) is: has anyone made some kind of hybrid system of these two, where the best/most balanced parts of both BRP variants have been put together into a better thing? Thanks for any replies to this.

I apologize if this has already been replied to in another (by me unread) thread.

//Erik.

1 hour ago, Crel said:

I'm not sure if this will be helpful for your game, but I also wanted to tune down the quantity of Rune magic in mine, so here's what I've been playing in mine:

All cults have access to all common magic, because I can't be bothered to keep track of which's which. Stackable spells have to be bought at each point, although the RP pool in total can be used for whatever. Each adventurer begins play knowing each common spell at their base value, has 3RP, and 3 points to add to their known spells. So for example, an initiate of Orlanth might choose Flight 2 and an extra point of Dismiss Magic, so they can get rid of spirit magic spells up to 4MP. When you sacrifice POW, you get that number of Rune points as well as that many points extra "learned" of spells of your choice.

I should note that I am actually considering removing this, or perhaps removing it for special Rune magic but keeping it for common magic (which I think would have the effect you desire--only "professional magicians" tend to have access to significant Dismiss Magic, Warding, Sanctify, Divination, etc.). Ultimately, with the Rune point economy my game has experience, at this time I don't think trying to avoid my players casting season-long Shield spells with freely known Extension is too relevant.

Now, if someone would roll up a POW-18 adventurer and drop 8 POW at creation for 11 total RP, I'd probably be a bit more hesitant to reverse our current rule... But you've really gotta reach that 10+ mark, I think, before some of the shenanigans options really come to the fore. Otherwise you've got your big spell, but no reserves.

Also to piggy-back off my characteristics post I just double-checked the Pre-Gens and wow those are some stats. Across them, there is one 9, on Harmast, and three 10s (one each on Vasana, Vostor, and poor Harmast).

That is helpful, although I still don't have that total overlooking grasp of the whole magic system.

But I'm wondering, what would happen if I was to allow just one spell per character and that's IF they reach intitiate level (as lay member nothing)? The priest/shaman on the other hand would have 3 spells (Priests = rune magic, shamans = spirit magic both 3 each) from start. And the type of spells as I (and you) mentioned earlier: Dismiss Magic, Warding, Sanctify, Divination, etc. are the domain of just the priest and/or shaman?

2 hours ago, Crel said:

Back on the subject of characteristics...

On p.53, the book notes that if an adventurer's rolled characteristics (before Elemental Rune bonuses) equal 92 or less, that adventurer gains +3 points spread where they wish with a max of 18. Minus 12 from the racial bonuses to SIZ and INT, that's assuming 80 points over 19D6, for an average of 4.21 rolled per die, whereas the usual D6 average is 3.5. 

Another way to look at this is taking that 92, subtract 26 (for average SIZ and INT of 13 each), then divide the resulting 66 among the five 3D6 characteristics, for an average across them of 13.2.

Further, in the "Perfectly All Right" sidebar on the same page, it notes that players may want to throw away adventurers which don't have average characteristics of 12 or greater.

So I think the obvious conclusion is that yeah, adventurers should absolutely have better characteristics than those generated by the RAW roll generation. Interestingly, the average on the classic D&D 3.5 and forward roll of "4D6 drop lowest" comes out to 13! So I'd say that method of characteristic generation is well suited for rolling STR, CON, DEX, POW, and CHA. Maybe even re-rolling ones atop that, or keeping the ">92? add 3" rule; it seems to me that the text implies a total of 92 points across the characteristics is an "average" or "slightly weak" adventurer.

Yes! This sounds very good as a soothener on my concern that I might have overdone it a bit. Thanks for clarifying this. And I myself should clarify that I only have the pdf's of the basic rulebook, but the physical books of everything else that has come out for RQG (except the bestiary and the GM pack). I have gotten a heads up from the store it is being packed and shipped today (I am awaiting the slipcase set).

I am also not much of a mathematician. In real life I am a social worker, so not much use of that there.

16 minutes ago, Tywyll said:

Older versions of RQ had you start before you became an Initiate and then it was something you did in game. You could always do that if you wanted (remove the Cult section of character creation, drop their spirit magic maybe, though even laymember learn some spirit magic, and ditch their rune points.

I understand that my approach to the whole "Hero Wars character feel" is confusing, as it seems I want beefed up characters in the characteristics departement but not in magics. The reason for this is that I want magics and runes to be more of a mystery and something that comes from experience. So yes, I think I will both run the "before-initiate" start for PCs and also lessen the amounts of possible magic they can have/use, and give the majority of such knowledge to the priests/shamans.

2 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

I think you've misinterpreted the rules (or, I've misinterpreted your interpretation...)

Players in a Rune Cult (ie, deity/spirit cult) have only sacrificed 3 POW to get 3 Rune Points - total! What's available to cast with those 3 Rune Points are all those Common Spells (if their cults have access to them all), and 3 choices of the Cult Special Rune Magic. For some cults, those 3 RPs are going to have to last a season (or more). And, some spells cost all 3 points to cast.

The 5 points of Spirit Magic isn't that powerful, especially when it's over in 2 minutes max.

Burning those 3 RPs early in the game is usually not a wise idea, unless you've started your campaign close to a Holy Day

Thank you for explaining this! Yes, I probably have misintepreted the rules a bit, but... I still think it's a lot of casting possibilities for budding heroes. As I say, just the possibility of all this casting is too much for me, let  alone understanding for the players as they are quite new in this here. It should be a lesser amount in my mind - except when you are a playing a true representative of the temple/faith, such as a priest or a shaman/assistant shaman.

I also think that the role of a representative of the faith is really lessened when this much magic and this type of magic is spread throughout to just about everyone. In my eyes, if a group or a person that is not this kind of representative(s) finds some rune magic laid on something hindering them, let's say a Spirit Block or a Warding, then the interesting thing would be to have these people understand that they can't solve that kind of thing themselves. They need a priest or a shaman to take a look on this problem. In my eyes, only such a person should be the solution to something like this.

5 minutes ago, Smokebadger said:

So the answer is maybe. Guess it's not worth the hassle 

That is sad! I'd like to see your battle maps.

7 hours ago, Tywyll said:

No I agree its a lot, and I dread running powerful enemies against my players. Luckily, for most combat encounters you really only need to know how a few spells work-bladesharp, protection, countermagic, shield, heal wound, dismiss magic...maybe speeddart and multiarrow. That's not so bad. 

Thank you for making me feel less alone in my view on the spell question. And the kind of ironic thing is that the foundations for this game is laid by the same man - Greg Stafford - that (in Pendragon) said something like this about magic; "It's not the flash bang nonsense of D&D". Don't get me wrong, I am a huge fan of almost all of his work, but while that line may have been solely meant for the KAP game, I would like the sentiment to be a basic law here too. I am NOT a big fan of land slides of magic being hurled back and forth for just about any encounter. It's much more OK if let's say, there's a big battle between the Lunar College of Magic and Sartar's equivalent. I have a very great desire to just let priests have that much access to magic, and the other occupations only one spell a piece. That would also mean downgrading the amount of magic on "ordinary" opponents.

Hmm...

A related question (but one in the opposite direction, at least for me as GM) is: do anyone else feel that it is A LOT of magic flying around for starting characters to be able to use? I mean 11 common rune magic spells, 3 pts of special rune magic and another 5 pts of cult spirit magic (if the cult has it)? As a GM I feel overwhelmed with the potential rules browsing this presents once the fighting begins, even if being well read up on the spells!

If I have 4 or 5 players and everyone wants to lay different spells and they also meet opponents with a similar plethora of spells, phew! is the only thing I want to say. I understand that after a while the familiarity with the most common of them kicks in, but I still have a lot to run book keeping on during battle. 

And to be totally honest, the common rune spells of Command Cult Spirit, Dismiss Magic, Divination, Sanctify, Soul Sight, Spirit Block and Warding all sound like a priest would likely be the expert on, not just anyone, while the spells of Find Enemy, Heal Wound, Multispell and Extension sounds like more common to me. Am I totally in the wrong here?

//Erik.

13 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

And if you want an excuse for the adventurers having good stats, you can say that their mothers all had Bless Pregnancy cast on them with a ton of Rune Points stacked on.

Excuse me for being slow on this! I didn't understand there really *was* such a thing in the rules, util Crel told of his use of it.

1 hour ago, Crel said:

I've had some of the same concerns as OP. The raw roll of 3D6 can feel really, really mediocre. And as @Ian Absentia points out sometimes a low characteristic makes for great roleplay, but at other times it's just vexing. Currently, I've been having my players choose three points first to add where they want, as if from Bless Pregnancy, to be "what my family hoped I would be." Sometimes this remains true to character, sometimes there's tension. Then I had them roll characteristics in order, which seemed what's going on RAW before finally adding their bonuses from Elemental Runes. I somewhat like how this works, because you can end up with a really surprising characteristic which results in unusual play (like a Zorak Zoran berserker with CHA 18 who's just persistently, weirdly compelling...).

After, if the array was super garbage, I let them re-roll it. Almost every adventurer we've created has re-rolled two or three arrays and picked one. So I feel like yeah, 3D6 is rough to get "feel-good" numbers on, even if the adventurers still might be playable (so long as that 3D6 CON is reasonable...)

I like the idea of 4D6 best 3, like in D&D. From my experience it makes for pretty good characters and you've usually got some lousy stat somewhere. I could also just see a flat rule of "reroll under 8" or under 10. Under 10's what I've done when I'm generating "elite" NPCs for our game.

Another idea I'm tossing around is having my players roll 19D6, record the numbers, maybe reroll 1's. Then, use those generated numbers where they please to create adventurers. I feel like this absolutely encourages minmaxing but might also end up with these bizarro characters with like three amazing characteristics and four mediocre/terrible ones.

Has anyone tried a point-buy system? Know of one from a different rendition of RQ/BRP? I'd be curious to see how that works. Or a stat array like in Pathfinder.

Wow this is a really interesting reply to my question! Many thanks Crel! And was laughing out loud when I read about the "persistently, weirdly compelling" Zoran Zorak berserker! That's the stuff of legend. Also very interesting with your Elite NPC approach and I have never heard of the 19D6 idea either, but I understand it's the comprised D6 dices from all the characteristics. Could it perhaps be 19D6 + 12 (or +6/+6), as the fixed bonus on SIZ/INT could be incorporated, that may be too much though?

The Bless Pregnancy is much more in theme and a wonderful idea! I have many times felt, from experience of GM:ing many other systems, that even if there are a whole lot of dice as a basis for attributes/characteristics, the players almost never roll 6s. Sure, they end up with a quite a few rolls in the high range, but they most of the time end up 16s and 17s (with bonuses), which is of course also very high. The things I should tell you is that "normally", in other systems, whether BRP games or non-BRP and even in my own BRP-based game of EBROS, I have a rule that says: "If the player rolls 3 natural 6s on the same roll, they are entitled to go on rolling another die. If that die shows a 5 the 18 goes up to 19. but stays there. If the extra dice shows a 6, the 18 goes up to 19 but the player continues to roll the extra die. And this goes on until the die stops showing a 5 or a 6." This is a very old rule that we've had since the eighties. Not sure if I am adapting it to Runequest. But I may do that.

Interesting to hear so much good views on this! I salute everyone that makes such good character play with what you've got! And yes I agree, the player "Heroes" doesn't need to be big buffing tanks or superheroes all the time, at least not from the start. Just playing through all the various feelings of danger or mystical surroundings and laying ones words on a gold scale during important discussions with NPCs are what really makes for memorable roleplaying. After all, this IS real social roleplaying and not a computer- or video game.

I just want to give my players some basic security during those beginning steps of my RQG adventures. And I admit, it is cheap feelings of security, anyone can die in any situation. But it's very much the looks of the characters that the players first get in their minds. Then again, that look can differ very much from the more basic archetypes of fantasy, as it should - especially in this game of Runequest. I feel that translating that "ethnic and religious feel" that I soak up as I read in all the sourcebooks (including the two monster books of The Guide to Glorantha) is very difficult to convey to some of the players, to be honest - it's the majority of players. I want them to feel at home in this world, but I understand it takes time.

Anyway, thanks for all your replies! //Erik.

Hello everybody! My name is Erik Brickman. I live in Sweden, Europe. I have been collecting Chaosium/BRP stuff since 1985 and started with Call of Cthulhu but pretty soon started to buy and play Runequest. Back then it was the Avalon Hill version, but I managed to collect an earlier version (version 1) and I love some of the adventure material for the Avalon Hill version (such as Dorastor, River of Cradles, Sun County, etc.).

I puchased the rules for Runequest: Roleplaying in Glorantha and was amazed by the new colorful look and general feel of this new version. The only thing that vexes me, and I understand this is going to make (probably a lot) of you RQ players irritated, is the generation of real heroes in the Hero Wars. I understand the general deadliness and feel of danger is very important to adventuring in this world. And generally I'm not a GM to hold back on these things during play (but am NOT a follower of "I'm the GM, so I'm an enemy of the players" attitude). I like the danger to be just that and I feel that a lot of the adventure material absolutely manages to produce just that. BUT: while testing the character generation of RQG, I felt very much let down by the rules as I feel the possibility of creating real player character heroes is a slim chance at best, even with the Rune affiliation bonus and Homeland modifiers.

So, I tweaked these rules. Quite a bit. I'll present these here, and I would like to hear what you think of them. Are they waaay over the top or perhaps something to be further evolved with better ideas, such as yours - if you want to give them? 

First of all: the Characteristics. You roll 3D6 for five of them and 2D6+6 for SIZ and INT. Being an old Call of Cthulhu Keeper/GM this is total basics for me. But I got hooked on the words: Hero Wars. So I changed this, as my first roll was for STR: 8 pts. Sorry but even with some boosting from Runes and Homeland bonuses I'll maybe get it raised to something like 12 or 13 (or even that). Not good.

So my first change was to let the players make rolls with 4D6 (take the best three of those, discard the fourth and baddest) and reroll ones as long as you need, for each of STR, CON, DEX, POW and CHA. I also made the change that these five starting rolls were free to put on whatever characteristic the player wanted to use them for. So no roll was stuck to a certain characteristic, but only these five rolls could be used for the first five characteristics. Then, after that, the player rolls 2D6+6 for INT and SIZ, with my addition that they can be switched before play. So if the player rolled a 16 on SIZ and 9 on INT, he or she could switch them for 16 INT and 9 SIZ. 

Then some small changes were made for the skill points to put out on the sheet. As my test character was an Old Tarsh, or Tarsh Exile warrior, I changed his skill bonus for Farming +15 (which was very strange as the text told me this people hunt or raid for survival and very little land is arable) to Hunt +15. 

I have thought of other changes, and maybe I'll go through with them, I don't know. I'll present them here if there are any interest. But this was the most important change for me.

What do you think? Have I done something sacreligious? I am not a stranger to harsh critique, so please say what you want (except perhaps personal insults and the like). Thanks. //Erik.

Another giant ascends the afterlife. May your further enterprises at least be as good as they were here in this dimension, Wizard of the Velvet Circle and Tailor of the many Masks of Nyarlathotep.

I use AH Runequest + older BRP versions + my own home brew called EBROS. 

On 12/30/2018 at 5:30 PM, Darius West said:

A good rule of thumb is that a penny will buy a cooked meal for an adult or 2 kids.  If you cook your own meal, then you make savings for as long as the food lasts.  If you lack money you have to forage in the wilds, rummage after scraps, beg, or steal.  Rent will vary, but will be sensitive to market forces.  Cooking, heating and lighting will rely on a supply of firewood, dung chips, reeds, pitch, or oil and will be more expensive in cities than if obtained in rural areas.  It is a good idea to think of your lowest denomination coin as a tradeable meal voucher.  Unskilled labor will live a semi-nomadic existence unless they cop a break.  Once you know this rule, you get a better sense of what to charge for things, as you add up the effort to find the raw materials (items/day), transport them to market (quantity/time), then you need to calculate the time it takes to make the item against the daily wage of the craftsperson, add the raw material cost, and double it (profit).  Halving the value will give you the minimum value the craftsperson might be prepared to reluctantly sell an item for if it is just sitting on a shelf for months.  Note that Guilds offer their membership a lot of protection, but they also act to set prices for items citywide.  In fact the whole idea of a RPG price list is pretty close to how medieval cities used to operate thanks to guilds.

This is absolutely awesome! Things is, I am not the kind of number cruncher I should be though, so I'll try to implement this but may get lost someway half through. Thanks anyway, this kind of economic insight is EXACTLY what the feel of reality that I search for, needs.

On 12/30/2018 at 6:25 AM, Algesan said:

Of course, remember if anyone gets ahead in this kind of culture, immediately their family and neighbors will pressure them for a "loan" since it would be "sinful" to hold on to such wealth.  And this is actually more detail than 99.9% of the campaigns out there need. 😕

 

Good point!

Thanks all for the tips on what to base Starting Money on! I am sorry I didn't reply earlier. It's been a little hectic with both X-mas preparations and building my own RPG including three tests of the player character generation. This is still going on.

//Erik

8 hours ago, drablak said:

@dracopticon (and others) if you want a detailed price list for Hârn let me know, I made one years ago.

I think I actually have that one, at least the one they made for the game. I own several versions of Harnmaster, but I can imagine yours are better, fan made stuff often are!

8 hours ago, Atgxtg said:

Low/High fantasy doesn't matter so much as how much money and what type you have, and why it changes. If you are using a D&D type model with thousands and thousands of gold pieces, then where does it all go?  You might be going from an economy where 1 gold coin won't get you a room at an inn to one where 1 gold coin can provide for you and your family for a year. 

If you are unsure as to what to use for money, you could invent some new metal that cam about during the catastrophe,or has been recently discovered. 

 

Good ideas! Thank you!