svensson

4 hours ago, metcalph said:

Bandits would worship Orlanth.

 

Bandits are quoted in KODP as worshiping Gargarth the Ill-Wind, who is the Storm patron of outlaws.

17 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Probably in my Glorantha, Tatius would assign the Coders to take the Magics of the Cradle at all costs.  Giants are a race of Disorder and possibly Darkness - the antithesis of Tatius' solar magics.  Her fate is immaterial to Tatius.  But the Red Goddess might well whisper words in Anderida's dreams to have her protect the baby, or offer her to Gerra - after all, the Moon is the balance of Light and Dark.  What Tatius takes to power the Light of the Reaching Moon must be balanced by the Dark of the Dying Moon.

Fair points. Your knowledge of Lunar ritual is deeper than mine; I have no idea who Gerra is in Lunar mythology.

Also, wouldn't the Giants also be affiliated with runic Earth somehow?

The kontos and xyston are just longspears or pikes used while horseback. There is no functional difference in construction between a sarissa and a xyston, except perhaps length. What matters is that they are used while mounted by a trained rider. A medieval combat lance [NOT a jousting spear a' la 'A Knight's Tale'; those are sporting implements, not combat tools] is made of hardwood and iron or steel. The shaft is 10' to 12' long and the head is usually fitted by a socket instead of a riveted tang. The spearhead is usually leaf shaped, although some have been found with a pyramidal square point [this is usually dated post-1300 or so when coats of plates were prevalent]. And these characteristics are exactly the same as the long spear of the same period.

So I have an odd question about cults for the odd ducks in Lunar society... those who differ from the Seven Mothers, Red Goddess archetypes. You know, the criminals, the jokers,  the dissenters...

For the Storm cults we have Eurmal the Trickster for those in society who go against the grain. It's not an 'honorable' cult by any means, but it's accepted. Kind of like the drunk uncle at the family Christmas party, really. For the out-and-out criminal, there's even Gargath the Ill-Wind... he's in the family, but he's the one doing 10-to-15 for burglary and nobody actually likes him anyway...

There's even a couple of generic non-pantheon cults in Lanbril and the Black Fang Brotherhood, but these are fairly nasty mobsters and cutthroats.

Now, as I understand Lunar Empire it's core is overlaid on two cohabitant societies... the Solar [Yelmic] Dara Happans and  Pelorian Earth cultists along the Oslir River valley. In both pantheons, the closest thing to dissenter cults are Babeester Gor and Maran Gor, both of which would seem to be too violent for the Lunars to stomach in their Imperial core.

In the Lunar pantheon itself, we have only Danfive Xaron as a redeemer cult but nothing else.

Given the importance of magical institutions in Glorantha, where does the Lunar citizen go if he's a drunkard, or pickpocket, or jester, or whatever? The HeroQuest 1st ed. supplement 'The Lunar Handbook vol. 1' mentions a few names that I've never heard of, mostly cultural contexts, but give no details at all. And the obscure references there are not repeated in the Guide to Glorantha.

Anybody got thoughts on this?

Postscript:

Why such a weird question? Easy. Inspired by the Vostor pre-gen character, I thought it would be fun to put together a Lunar Army deserter who was from a family of smugglers... maybe an escapee from the Punishment Legions of Danfive Xaron. The concept is there, some of the mechanics are there [I'm having trouble deciding if Prior Experience ought to be Merchant or Thief], but run into a wall at magical skills or abilities. His version of 'honor' and 'heroic' ought to be WAY different than an Orlanthi or Seven Mothers cultist, but given how much a cult influences some of these decisions it's been a rough go to get the numbers crunched.

My Great Treasure from GenCon was kinda personal.

I'm a long time Glorantha fan [played RQ2 and RQ3, had a hell of a time with HeroQuest], and I wanted the new edition the instant it was on sale. A friend of mine was going and I gave him the cash to buy one at the Chaosium table and I asked for signatures if he could get them.

He came home with the new edition with Jeff Richard's and Greg Stafford's autographs.

And then Greg passed away.

So that book is now part of my personal 'voodoo stuff' [keepsakes, memorials, that sort of thing]. My heirs will never understand it [I don't have children and my nieces and nephew just don't get gaming that isn't gambling or on a screen], but while I live that book is a treasure.

My take on the motives of the Coders in the Giant Cradle is altogether more nefarious.

Tatius the Bright would assign the Coders to take the Baby at all costs... for the specific purpose of sacrificing the Baby in some Lunar ritual [possibly empowering the Sartar Reaching Moon Temple].

Julan still harbors the noblesse ideals of his cult and upbringing. Yes, Lunar society can be harsh but it's for the greater good. It certainly isn't evil, right? His orders are discouraging, yes, but he's done worse in war and peace to make his way in a cruel world.

Anderida is a mother, and when Argrath tells her just what Tatius had planned for the Baby, she balked at her orders for the first time her life. This is especially true when Argrath tells her that he was sending his allied spirit to report Gonn Oorta on the Baby's fate. With troubles at court, the nobles infighting, and the stresses of trying to weave several societies into the fabric of the Empire, she was sure that the LAST thing the Moonson wants is for his Provincial Governor to start a war with the giant race.

Nose Ring and Maculus wouldn't give a fig in a wine vat about the fate of the Baby. Both are well familiar with the true nastiness in the Empire [up to an including watching the Crimson Bat], so their empathy is utterly shot. Maculus is an Illuminate after all; morals are just limitations to him. After the mission, Nose Ring checks himself back in to the Punishment Legions and is never seen again.

Eslas stays airborne and remained ignorant of the whole affair until the Cradle's escape, her naivete providing a shield to her soul. This was the mission wherein she lost her innocence [if not her virtue], but she has yet to fully sell her soul for the sake of the mission. [Which might provide some interesting post-Dragonrise adventures for a fully mature Eslas -- you know, in case you guys were thinking in that direction or something...]

Alright, I'm speaking from the following three points of experience:

a. I'm a lifelong military historian and game geek

b. When I was on active duty in the US Army, I served in Germany and traveled a lot. I hit every museum I could get to, including [but not limited to] the Royal Armories in London and Edinburgh, the Oslo Ship Burial Museum, the Roskilde Ship Museum, etc. Admittedly I was not looking at the displays with a student or scholar's eye, but my later interests in 'practical history' bring many of these visits to mind.

c. A medieval reenactor [and fighter] in the SCA specializing in pre-1200 history.

I'm certain that professional archeologists or historians might find some discrepancies with my thoughts here,  but my opinions are also influenced by 30 some-odd years of wading through game rules and applying all this knowledge to the game table.

There is a lot of parsing of rules in most games regarding spears.

Let's get a few things clear about spears. The spear is the 3rd weapon invented by Man... after Stick or Rock and Sharpened Stick or Rock, Rock-Tied-To-Stick followed very quickly. Spear is just a variation of Rock-Tied-To-Stick.... short stick plus rock = dagger, medium stick plus heavier rock = club [or axe if sharpened], and then came Long-Stick-Tied-To-Sharp-Rock. And the Great Arms Race was born....

Other than the length of the shaft, there are very few physical differences in spears. Therefore, the issue is with the technique used to wield it.

Let's get some parameters here:

-A 'javelin' is a light spear designed for hunting or armor piercing. The shaft is usually a light, often soft wood in order to get the desired range. Length is between 3 and 5 feet [1 to 1.5m].

-The generic 'spear' is designed to be a general use weapon, adequate for throwing but sturdy enough for melee. Its shaft is constructed out of denser, sturdier woods for durability, and the length averages about man-height or 6 feet [roughly 2m].

-A 'longspear' is constructed much the same as its shorter sibling. It is designed strictly for melee as a 'stand-off' weapon to keep enemies out of close combat range. Its length is about 8 up to 10 feet [roughly 3m].

-A 'pike' is the ultimate spear weapon, with a very heavy shaft and a length of up to 18 ft [roughly 5.5m].

Any one of these weapons [save the javelin] can be used as a lance from horseback. What matters is the technique you're using while mounted. There are only two techniques to using a spear on a mount. The first is the overhand thrust, where you ride close to your target and stab downward at him. This technique is often depicted in pre-Renaissance artwork from Sumerian bas-reliefs to the Bayeux Tapestry.

The second technique is the couched lance or 'jousting' technique. This is the technique of Middle Ages and, slightly modified, of the Byzantine kataphraktoi. It is the shock technique of a massed cavalry charging with lances lowered. [kataphraktoi used two hands and a small shield while European knights used a one handed couch with a much larger shield].

I know from personal experience that it is actually easier to hit your target overhand. With your downward stabbing motion, you can account for the movement of the target and your own mount easier. However you surrender the impetus of the 1000 lbs [450kg]. mount moving at 15 mph [20km]. You hit, but without the huge force your mount offers.

The couched lance hits with all that force, but you have to hit within a much smaller aiming radius... less than a third of the target point of the overhand stab.

So the way I adjudicate all this at the game table is this:

It is actually somewhat difficult for the average Orlanthi clansman to learn the couched lance. Much like the Yelm /Yelmalio 'Kushile Horse Archery', the couched Lance requires specific training. That training is assumed in the Heavy Cavalry prior experience or the appropriate Praxian background [Bison, High Llama, and Rhino Peoples primarily -- I would seriously recommend against trying Couched Lance while riding an Ostrich..... 😮 ], AND the primary weapon of Lance. Without that prior experience, getting access to the training is tougher. First you have to find a trainer, and in Glorantha that is always complicated. Even within your own clan you'd have a hard time getting your clan sage /lawspeaker to train you in the secrets of Lhankor Mhy without being an initiate. Now try learning a warfare technique from a foreign group with a different cult....

Training requires a minimum Ride of 50% and a full Gloranthan Season of training from a Weapon Master with both Lance and Ride at better than 90%. Yes, that makes it a major source of income from certain Waha and Storm Bull cultists in Prax and Elmal cultists or Sun Dome Templar cavalry masters elsewhere. Neither the nomadic Sable tribes nor the Impala people practice the couched lance. This is due to the small size of the mount in case of the former, and the leaping gait of the impala in the latter [along with the nature of the tribe -- the Impala People eshew armor and prefer horse archery]. Lunar heavy cavalry DO practice the couched lance, both on sables and horses; the grain-fed sables of the Empire are larger but less agile than their Pentan or Praxian counterparts.

Resolving mounted combat works like this at my table:

-Mounted spear attacks are assumed to be overhand unless the attacker declares differently before the beginning of the round.

-Fighting with any weapon while mounted incurs a -25% penalty to attack ratings.

-If attacking a target on the ground, apply +10 the Hit Location Table, modified by target SIZ

-Attack does the rider's Damage Modifier

If the attack is a declared couched lance attack the procedure modified as follows:

-The base attack percentage is the *lower* of either the attacker's Lance Attack or Ride score.

-You must use the Charge action with minimum charge distance [20 meters /65 feet].

-The rider may direct a war-trained mount to Charge OR Trample, NOT both.

-Damage is the spear's damage rating plus the mount's damage modifier.

Let me offer a couple of basic but oft forgotten things:

1. Cover and concealment [!]

There is more to sneaking than a successful Hide check. Just because someone knows you're there doesn't mean that someone has enough of a bead on you to accurately fire at you. It's not unreasonable to cut ranged attacks in half if the conditions warrant it. And that's a life-saver for the unprepared or lightly armored. 62% Composite Bow Attack [reduced because of lighting, brush, or whatever else have you] beats the Hells out of %124%, don't it?

And on that subject, remember a basic fact that is drilled into every soldier in Basic Training... 'cover' and 'concealment' are NOT the same thing! Cover is a barrier between you and enemy fire, concealment is terrain that does not provide that barrier. While both assist in preventing detection, only cover prevents getting hit by direct fire. Apropos of nothing whatever, one notices that there is a dearth of hand grenades in RQG...

2. Animals, Spirits, and Fetches do more than just attack or provide spell support. A lot of people forget about the scouting function. Remember that Allied Spirits perceive the world through Spirit Sight, not physical senses. The little guy you wrote off as 'just another trollkin' might actually have a high POW, spirits in crystals, or enchanted gear... all of which are indicators of its threat potential.

3. Dig into the Sorcery rules. Nothing throws a Wind Lord for a loop like an Adept with Strength Enhancement 8, duration 10 cast... Yeah, I know they can get complicated in a hurry, but there are some simple Sorcerous buffs that can up-end the plans of a party of Initiate levels.

As of last Christmas I was made to understand that the slipcase set [consisting of leatherette editions of the RQG rules, the Bestiary, and the GM Pack] wasn't going to be offered.

Then a friend who reads blogs more than I do tells me that it will be offered, that its publishing date was late, that the product is in transit, ought to be at FLGS distributors by April, and is expected to retail for US$120. Is all that correct?

Thanks all!

Just... damn.

The Great Table has a another chair filled... Gary Gygax, Dave Arneson, N. Robin Crossby, MAR Barker... so many of us Original Geeks.

I am heartbroken at the loss to us all, but can take a small solace in Greg's literal Life Well-Lived. They brought This Thing Of Ours out from the basements and into the limelight with no apologies and absolutely no shame. Being a gamer and a fan was once seen as a social taboo and was nearly classified as a mental disorder, but Sandy, Greg, and all the other writers, publishers, and imagineers wouldn't let them stifle us. They wouldn't let Frodo die or shunt Gilgamesh or Beowulf off into the dusty halls of academia where only the odd ducks of society would ever encounter them. They brought them out into the light of day for all of us to enjoy.

And for that, I shall always thank them.

I remember having to pass through picket lines of evangelicals screaming about 'devil worship' in order to spend my hard earned allowance on DnD, Traveller, Tekumel, and Glorantha. Now, I am privileged to have a signed copy of RQG sitting a place of honor on my shelf. And I by-God STILL have some of those books that I had to pass through the pickets to buy.

If the respects and condolences of an old cavalry corporal are worth a fig at this time, please accept mine.

Thank you, Greg Stafford, for everything you've given me.