Tywyll

That's pretty cool. Perhaps starting skill in a spell could be different for hard spells and VHard spells. Though, the next question is: how do you learn them at character creation? Can you just put 1% into them and then get them at 30%+1%+Magic Category+Magery? How would you handle the spell mastering ability (i.e. the fact that at certain higher skill levels you stop needing to use gestures and such, and the spells cost less)? Would you leave the duration as they are in Gurps (baring in mind that Fatique recovers faster than MP) or would you upgrade the durations? Or would you simply allow MP of characters using this system to recover more quickly? Cheers!

What is unsatisfactory about it? It seems like it would not only make larger creatures more accessible, but allow characters to feel the difference in their stats more. I'm curious why they didn't like it.

One of the things that bothered me about the BRP system, especially coming from playing d&d for years, was the relative lack of significance to attributes (this was because I was mostly playing CoC which lacks attribute category bonuses). This was especially true for strength based damage. I guess I didn't feel the system was 'grainy' enough. But then I came across the flat bonus from RQ4, and that seems to solve the problem. Has anyone used that? What are the feelings about it versus the bonus die method?

If you end up writing up any specific rules for this, I'd be interested in viewing them.

I look forward to seeing more details on both those proposed systems, when you are all ready to share!

Hey, thanks for the details. That's good to know. Now, if the book would just get here soon... I'm still probably going to go with stat vs stat, though, if stat has no limits... humm, I'll have to think that through.

I think that last sentence kind of spells out my issue with handling it that way. MP vs MP works if you accept a world in which POW storage crystals/spirits/etc or outside sources of mana are fairly common (at least as magic items go). If you don't want such items to be common, then the idea becomes wonky I'd think. Personally, I'd rather see mechanics that allow the caster to increase their personal MP's beyond POW (if you need to Cap Pow, otherwise just let it increase) so that a powerful mage is powerful even when his toys are removed. Then, I've usually run campaigns in worlds were magic items were fairly rare and significant, rather than one with the core RQ and D&D assumptions I think. Just a taste thing, but I'd like to see the mechanics allow for that stylistic choice.

Oh, I totally agree that the promise of that genre exists. I'd love to see BRP do something in that field, with player's portraying supernaturals in the modern world. What changes happened in the Liber Ka book? My biggest disappointment with Nephilim was that it didn't actually give you enough to run a campaign in the rule book (always a bad idea, I think). I understand that the Gamemaster's Guide really fixed a lot of that, but still...

I don't know why you couldn't just use straight POW vs POW, to avoid this problem? It didn't seem to be a problem when we played that way (though, to be fair, we weren't playing Fantasy or magic heavy settings, so I don't know).

I can get the whole idea of the mage weakening... but I guess my reticence to use that as written is simply I would prefer not to make casters entirely 'stuff' based... needing magic items to bolster them and be effective. This is, I suppose, a reaction to long play of d&d where characters tended to look like christmas trees at high levels and breaking any since of realism.

Hey, I was thinking of an old BRP game I had, Nephilim, a Chaosium rewrite of a French (I believe) game. I played it a few times, but that was years ago. Does anyone remember it? Any thoughts or comments on its magic system? Was it any good? Worth yoinking for use in BRP?

Having done all this rereading of old rules sets in preparation for BRP, I realize that my group from back in the day was playing the system (in some aspects) incorrectly. I've noticed that in RQ at least, Resistance struggles involving magic are MP vs MP rather than Pow vs Pow (which was how we did it in all the other BRP style games we've played, specifically in CoC sorcery). Now that always seemed to work fine for us. However, I'm wondering how it would have worked if we'd been doing it 'right'. Doesn't MP vs MP lead to spell casters being unable to affect targets as they run out of juice? Even dumb brutes eventually have the edge on the caster, especially if they've buffed any of their friends. That just doesn't seem particularly fair to the caster who already has such a limited resource pool for spell casting. Is it a problem? Am I overlooking something?

Hey Peterb I just read your system and it sounds really interesting. It might even be a fit for what I'm looking for (converting a world that was in d&d to brp). Couple of questions that I think I missed in the read: 1) What is the base cost of a spell in FP? Is it only 1 regardless of the spell level? 2) What is the casting time of a spell? Cheers!

What rules for training does BRP0 use? Can you train a skill or attribute in downtime?

See, that's why we need a Martial Arts supplement... Seriously though, yes, I think there should be MA advantages to: Parry Dodge Grappling Escape Recovering from Knockdown Resisting Knockdown Disarming et al. All depending on the MA studied of course.

You are totally right, the original vampire is /nothing/ like the modern one. They are more like ghosts or zombies, haunting their former loved ones and all that, which from a roleplaying perspective, is kind of lame. However, I like your vampire gangster idea, it definitely has some merit.

These could work for some vampires mythos, but definitely not all and in general, I wouldn't be real thrilled about some of them (and I don't agree with the last one). If you are going strictly Dracula, this isn't true. Dracula moved about during the day and in sunlight. Van Helsing states that: "He can do all these things, yet he is not free. Nay, he is even more prisoner than the slave of the galley, than the madman in his cell. He cannot go where he lists, he who is not of nature has yet to obey some of nature's laws, why we know not. He may not enter anywhere at the first, unless there be some one of the household who bid him to come, though afterwards he can come as he please. His power ceases, as does that of all evil things, at the coming of the day. "Only at certain times can he have limited freedom. If he be not at the place whither he is bound, he can only change himself at noon or at exact sunrise or sunset. These things we are told, and in this record of ours we have proof by inference. Thus, whereas he can do as he will within his limit, when he have his earth-home,his coffin-home, his hellhome, the place unhallowed, as we saw when he went to the grave of the suicide at Whitby, still at other time he can only change when the time come." So, coffins and unhallowed places work for him, otherwise he's locked in whatever form he's taken when he last slept (and it might be inferred that he grows weaker without those places, though its not specifically stated). This is inferred, perhaps, but not necessarily set in stone. I think as a rping game, the more free-will PCs have, the better. However, I do like the idea of the Vam vs Vam resistance roll, so a vampire can shrug off commands from their maker. I've never seen this anywhere. Dracula is not the progenitor of all vampires, merely one of the greatest. Also, Mina doesn't die when dracula does, and in fact she is only cured because she hasn't fully turned yet. The other problem with this is the idea of spontaneous combustion of vampires because some unknown ancient gets accidentially unearthed somewhere, which I don't think is necessarily good. The only myth where I have seen this is in Anne Rice, and the only vampires it worked for was the very first vampire, as the 'spirit' of all vampires was connected to her... but they even got around that problem with some work. One way I can see to run a vamp game would be as if it were a gangster game. Each gang is a group of vampires whose boss is loyal to some other more powerful but unknown vampire. The gangs are fighting other gang who are loyal to yet another vampires. But, all of the gangs are eventually loyal to Dracula who trying to keep all these cold-blooded killers under control and working on some evil master plan. Meanwhile the PCs are working for their gang while secretly plotting to kill their way up the Vampire food chain, eventually killing Dracula himself and taking over the whole show.

Actually, I was hoping it might have to viable (in an offensive sense) systems of magic. See, I'm thinking of my own campaign setting which has three types of magic. Innate (Sorcery in my terms, limited in purview, like a Fire Sorcerer, or Life Sorcerer), Learned (Wizardry...more generalist, can learn all different kinds of spells, but the spells are fixed) and Divine. For Divine, I'll probably use RQ style magic. I'm trying to figure out which to do for the other two. The Magic rules /might/ work for Innate, but I think that RQ sorcery with its Manipulations might more fit the bill. One idea I had was to modify 'Spirit Magic' from RQ3/MRQ to be Learned Magic, since the spells are already set and don't really change except intensity, and even that is fixed once you learn it. I don't know, how much can you manipulate spells in the new Magic rules? The WoW that I recall they just got more powerful, but I don't recall being able to affect more targets or make them last longer (though I could be wrong on that).

Hey, In the new BRP, in the Sorcery system, how much is there in the way of direct damage, offensive magic? I know in Elric!, offensive magic was typically limited to 'debuff' style effects rather than something that could hurt or kill outright. Does BRP keep this distinction? Cheers

Thank you very much! Would you mind sharing why they are your favorites? What is it about Sandy's that works so well for you? What is meant by an 'Art' in his style of magic and what leads to you getting one? Are there 'direct' offensive spells (those that cause damage)? Do you have any experience with RQ4 Sorcery? Cheers!

Honestly, I think that would be too powerful, unless there was some way to block it/reduce it.

Not to mention Green Ronin's True D20, Mutants and Masterminds, et al. If the GSL doesn't change, its unlikely they will kill those lines (at least right now) to join the 4th Ed bandwagon. I do think that MRQ will grab more players than BRP, just on the basis of greater market saturation. How Chaosium could combat that, I don't know, short of pumping out tons of new material to support BRP (which, from a finanacial stand point, is the best way for a company to stay afloat)

Actually, from what I'd read, it definitely appeared to be the simplest of the systems (and in many ways, the most playable). My concerns with it are the following: 1) As mentioned, I think many spells need to be tweaked so as to prevent abuse. 2) Improvement. The system works in MRQ where you decide which skills go up, but since you activate several skills in a single role, how do you decide to handle improvement rolls in a "use=skill check" system? I was thinking that each time you used meta-magic skills while casting, you'd only get a single check and it could go to any one of the skills involved. 3) Power. I definitely agree that its finally a potent magic. Is it too potent though? Any Sorcerer can through out an Intensity 5 or 6 spell for a single MP, while spirit and even divine mages are struggling. Is this not imbalanced too much? I mean, I guess since I'm not using Glorantha I could ditch Spirit magic full stop, but I'd probably use Divine magic for Priests and I guess Sorcery for Arcane. Any thoughts or experiences would be appreciated. Cheers!

Is there a list or errata anywhere that has the spells that need fixing? I read some complaints on the Mongoose board, especially about the Heal spell, but they mentioned a few others. Anywhere where that's been put together in one place? I'd think the easiest fix for Heal would be to say that its not cumulative... a wound can only be healed by magic once, so do you want it to be a Heal 12 or a Heal 1? After that, you are left with time and first aid.

Well, actually you gave me a pretty good run down right there. I've read and understand MRQ pretty well. The stuff in Sandy Petersen's stuff seems interesting, but perhaps more complicated than its worth. I've not had a chance to read through RQ4 in detail, and I was always underwhelmed by RQ3's Sorcery.