dumuzid

11 hours ago, Orlanthatemyhamster said:

Yes, you give me your money and I tolerate you and don't eat your children. Hence the Tax War. ZZies fights Chaos and look how loathsome they are.

Ah, how the memories of men wither with all that sunlight beating on their heads!  Better to spend some time in the shade, and regain their wits!

How soon they forget that their people were fed and protected in the Darkness by the valor and generosity of Ezkankekko and his trolls of the Black Glass Palace!  The Kimantorings who braved the dying cosmos to connect the last holdouts of life, and the wealth and sustenance spread among those holdouts through Argan Argar's night markets!  The secrets of Darkness shared freely, and the leadership of the Only Old One at the Unity Battle! 

The Shadowlands were the debt of honor and gratitude the peoples of Genertela owed the Only Old One.  He asked for two things: tribute, which he shared back among the people through the night markets and the Equal Exchange; and recognition, of debts owned and honors received.  In return he gave back his friendship and protection, the benefits of trade and peace, intercession with the powers of Darkness, unity with friends and against enemies.  The Orlanthi of Dragon Pass rejected their place in the network of trust and tribute that had united Kethaela through every generation between the Unity Battle and the rise of the Bright Empire.  They did so with methods that ensured the Shadowlands and Only Old One personally would never completely recover, possibly retreading some of Eurmal's most sordid steps in the Lightbringers' Quest to accomplish it.  After the Tax Slaughter they took their newfound 'freedom' from Only Old One's counsel and went on to found the Empire of Wyrms Friends. 

Didn't that end splendidly for everyone?  I forget.  Too much time in the sun.

That's an astonishing number of CA worshippers for such a place

The first major arc of the campaign I'm currently running revolved around seeking one of the more unique characters in Gloranthan lore: the Cleansed One, demigod of the Zola Fel River.

The story goes that the Cleansed One was a conventional broo of the Praxian wastes, who somehow became aware of the horror of their Chaotic condition.  Rather than take out their self-loathing on the world like many other self-aware Chaos entities, this unnamed broo sought to drown himself in the waters of the Zola Fel to end their existence.  Rather than drown him though, the river showed mercy: Zola Fel allowed the broo to breathe his waters, and walk on his riverbed.  The broo followed Zola Fel's course to the ocean, and from there followed the river's current into the deeps, where by some mysterious agency of the Water powers he was purified of Chaos.  He returned to the river a whole, unmutated broo, either as his kind were before they were cruelly changed by the Unholy Trio, or as something new.  In my campaign I've also portayed him as an illuminate, but there's no textual evidence to back that directly that I'm aware of.

Are there any other known broo who've overcome their condition the way the Cleansed One has?  There's a discussion active on the RuneQuest board as a right this that mentioned a broo having the capacity, if not the motivation or self-control usually, to worship Chalana Arroy.  Are there any known broo in Glorantha who've done such a thing?  Does anyone have thoughts on methods a broo might take to purify themselves as the Cleansed One has?

On 8/29/2021 at 7:35 PM, Eff said:

something like a zhanmadao

This is how I've always characterized the 2-hand sword wielded by a Marazi amazon NPC in my current campaign.

I'd happily pay into a Kickstarter to just get access to the manuscript of Gods of Glorantha at long last.

The Artmali had moon boats made from blue clouds they could summon at will, or they summoned clouds that looked like boats.  No reeds required.

in my Glorantha's version of Genert's Garden there was an enormous blue elephant descended from the Blue Moon walking around, as well as an enormous blue antelope.  a big but not gigantic blue goat seems another reasonable non-human child of the Blue Goddess.

I would expect Lunar redsmiths to worship one of Lodril's Ten Sons and Servants, an entity southern redsmiths may or may not recognize as their Gustbran.  Someone with a better grasp of Pelorian myth can probably correct me or expand on that point though.

14 minutes ago, soltakss said:

n our RQ2/RQ3 Camapign, we simply gave an increase of the stated amount after the stated time of study. So, if it gave a +20 to your skill and takes 5 weeks then you got +20 after 5 weeks of study. no need to roll or anything, that's the advantage of the scroll.

this was my thinking more or less exactly

On 7/23/2021 at 1:32 PM, Nevermet said:

Somebody goes on a heroquest to create a Loper Light Cavalry unit.

Not sure who or why, but it happens.

I don't think that's so much a heretical Glorantha as a natural output of the unfolding Hero Wars in Pamaltela

Thanks @Squaredeal Sten, those are all good suggestions.  You frame all that sort of...theoretically, though?  As in, you're speculating about ways they could be used.  What I want to know is the mechanics of these items in the edition they were released.  Surely if @Ludo Bagman came across an item as specific as a training scroll of "+20% Throw Javelin" there's some indication somewhere of what that actually meant in practice. 

How did 'training scrolls' work mechanically?  That's not treasure I've encountered in modern RQG

In KoDP and Six Ages I always spent those seasons learning the mysteries, doing magic, and making spirit bargains.  The weather's miserable, and there's cruel things abroad.

28 minutes ago, Joerg said:

The OOO would make sense,

couldn't be him: no sunglasses

11 minutes ago, Akhôrahil said:

Since only one point of POW has to be provided by the caster of the enchantment, it seems reasonable to assume that in many cases, the Rune Level will try get away with the minimum investment, while getting others to stand for the rest (volunteering or getting strong-armed).

I've been thinking about these same spell mechanics in the context of Fonrit, and wondering if Fonritian slavers don't have magic that lets them offload all the POW costs of enchanting onto their slaves.

4 hours ago, Joerg said:

There apparently is an Avalor's Saga in Greg's western cycle, but other than the title I haven't seen anything from it. If it is part of the foundations of Glorantha series that was sold in extremely limited numbers as fund raisers, Avalor would be found in the Book of Heroes in that 14 booklet series, I suppose.

Well there we go, that would be the decisive evidence.

I don't suppose anyone on this board has access to Avalor's Saga and would be willing to disclose any further details of the story?  This 'Foundations of Glorantha' series doesn't sound like something I'm likely to get my eyes on anytime soon.

22 hours ago, Joerg said:

Avalor left Teshnos in 950 ST as a well-established (greatest) king of God Learner Teshnos. Sigur became king in 980.

Assuming that Avalor was around 30 - 40 years old when he left Teshnos, he would have been 60 - 70 years old at the overthrow of the Adalla dynasty of Fronelan God Learners, with at least 20 years of presence in the land.

This is true, Avalor would be a pretty senior man by the time the revolt in Fronela concludes if he lived a conventional lifespan, and we assume Avalor and Avlor are the same person.  I don't think that in itself is disqualifying, given the powers Avalor would've been exposed to and connected with as the greatest God Learner king of Teshnos.  I would not be surprised if some magical influence or another kept Avalor mentally and physically hale beyond the normal human span. 

There's also the chance that Avalor and Avlor are two different people.  There's thirty years between Avalor's abdication and Avlor's arrival in Fronela, time enough for Avalor to father and even raise a child, die, and that child to come of age and carry the sword to Fronela.  I would love further textual sources, because none of this cloud of ambiguity is helped by the simple fact that

22 hours ago, Joerg said:

Avalor had presumably recovered his (presumably exotic) wife when he settled the sword in Spada.

we don't actually know what became of Avalor's wife.  The guide says Avalor leaves Teshnos in 950, and no one from there ever learned what became of him.  Selenteen of Alampish went as far as the Zola Fel in search of him, but made no further progress; and by then the trail was over 200 years cold.  There's no evidence in the guide of what happened to the bearer of the Red Sword between Avalor's departure and Avlor's appearance in Fronela, no later than 980.

With the available evidence there's intriguing hints, and plenty enough for a GM to fabricate their own answer, but not enough for a fixed conclusion from the text alone.  Which is fine, there's enough threads here to spin the story out of in a few different directions.  I'm mostly just curious to see if any official writing has expanded this element of the late Second Age further.

9 hours ago, Deanjday said:

1. Which version of Runequest do you run? Or perhaps even another system? 

2. How long have you ran your campaign? 

3. What time period in Glorantha did you start? 

4. Where in Glorantha did you start? What regions has your campaign covered since? 

5. Where are your pcs from? 

6. What products from any version of Runequest have you used? Which were particularly useful? 

7. Is it a sandbox or more plot led campaign? 

8. How much have you followed the arching events of the time period or has your Glorantha varied? 

9. How would you describe your campaign? 

10. What advice would you give newbie gms to runequest and glorantha? 

1) RQG.  I've sometimes referenced rules material from other editions, but only to port things into RQG

2) We've playing every week or two since late June of last year.  With five players and a GM spread across five time zones and two continents scheduling can get tricky

3) 1626, the only way we diverged from RQG core book character creation was to allow Elder Race adventurers.

4) The first year of the campaign was set in Pavis and the wider Zola Fel basin.  Action has mostly taken place between Corflu and the Blue Sable Altar.

5) Most are from Prax or Pavis, one is a Sartarite duck by way of Esrolia, the other a Lunar Tarshite renegade.

6) The RQG Adventure Book has excellent appendices that I use most every session.  The Bestiary and the Red Book of Magic come up almost every session too.   I've been using the HeroQuest supplement Pavis: Gateway to Adventure as my main setting book for the region, supplemented by the Guide to Glorantha and the Glorantha Sourcebook.  I've made use of Drastic Resolutions: Darkness and the old Trollpak for portraying Darkness entities and goods.

7) There's a plot thread, and each season the players get a discrete mission from their patron, but they have pretty wide latitude in how they accomplish their goals.

8) I've payed pretty close attention to the timeline of events as presented in RQG, partly to follow it carefully, and partly to diverge from it in considered ways.

9) The premise is that the player characters are part of the first cadres of Eaglebrown Warlocks trained by Argrath.  They've been doing missions for him up and down the Zola Fel since Sea 1626, and it's now mid-Storm of that year.  in Sea Season they plan to take ship with Gebel, the Teshnan hero-sailor, and Gabaryanga the Fonritian rebel slave, on the quest for the Red Sword of Tolat and the Bones of Artmal, as Argrath's agents to ensure the quests' success.

10) Read the Guide to Glorantha section about whatever region you're setting your game in.  develop in advance a sense of what mythic and elemental forces will fill out the opposition to your players.  Read Greg Stafford's Arcane Lore.  And don't be afraid to embrace the lighter, sillier elements of the setting; getting ducks involved is always good for lightening the mood, between grimmer and more serious subject matter.

Bumping this thread because one of my players has raised an interesting theory regarding the present circumstances of the Red Sword of the Zaranistangi.

We've established that the Red Sword brought by Ordanal to Melib in the Second Age, and taken from Melib into the Wastelands by Avalor in the twilight of the Middle Sea Empire, came to rest at the Temple of War in Spada, Loskalm, after the overthrow of the God Learners there.  The only account of this course of events that I or my player have access to is what's written in the Guide.  The Guide says in a few places that the revolt against the God Learners in Fronela was helmed by the great wizard Halwal, Tryensaval (named as an Ascended Master in a list that includes Halwal as well), Avlor (who may or may not be Avalor of Eest), and Sigur, who is crowned king of a restored Loskalm by Halwal at the end of the revolt.  Those four names are associated with the sucessful revolt that begins in 980, no others. 

However!  While Halwal and Tryensaval are always mentioned as leaders, they are only ever associated with Avlor or Sigur in the same sentence.  Avlor is called "the foreign Hero" in the guide, while Sigur's background is never mentioned, and they are never mentioned together.  it's always either "Halwal, Tryensaval and Avlor," or "Halwal, Tryensaval and Sigur."  My player's theory, based on this textual evidence, is straightforward: that Avalor/Avlor and Sigur are the same person.  They contend that Avalor assumed the new name and presumably other Loskalmi cultural trappings after the successful revolt as part of his ascension to the throne.  Presumably a part of this change was interring the Red Sword at Spada.  The cult of the god of the Red Planet is alive and well in Fronela under the name Vorthan; a pre-Malkioni Temple of War in the region would likely be at least partly dedicated to the Red God.  Avalor/Sigur sheathing the sword in the earth of the greatest temple to the Red God in his new kingdom also has a pleasing symmetry with the sword's journey east with Ordanal.

So, are there textual sources I'm not familiar with that support or disprove this theory?  In the absence of further evidence, I find it pretty compelling.  What does the tribe think: are Avalor and Sigur one and the same?

Don't the talars of Jonatela fight pretty regularly?  Do they just not have much Rightness as Malkioni?

The Third Eye Blue learned their smith-craft from a dwarven decamony that adopted a version of Hrestolism in the First Age, and was ruthlessly purged as heretics by the Nida dwarves, with Brithini assistance, for their caste-breaking and Openhandedness.  

While the Earth religious complexes of both groups revere Kero Fin, my impression is that Sartarite Orlanthi look towards Esrolia to learn the deep earth mysteries, while Tarshites look primarily to the Shaker Temple, and so have a greater Gorian influence on their Earth approaches.

The late 1620s see the re-establishment of a necessary and prophesied Darkness + Earth + Harmony power in Kethaela and Dragon Pass: the Only Old One returns, either personally or in the form of a troll (or man (or both/neither)) embodying his principles and influence in the Middle World, in the same way that Argrath seeks to embody Orlanth.  The Shadow Tribute is first re-established after the Battle of Dunstop, when Fazzur Wideread offers it to the new Shadowlord on behalf of formerly-Lunar Tarsh in exchange for protection and intercession in peace negotiations with Argrath's Sartar.  More Shadow Tributes follow as the woes of the Hero Wars increase and the people of central Genertela reach back to the survival magics of the Great Darkness, where the Only Old One's pacts lie waiting to be renewed.  The New Black Palace becomes a place of refuge for the people and gods of the former Unity Council lands when the ocean rises in the Flood.  When the Hero Wars reach their climax, and the Monster Empire comes slouching and oozing south, there will be a Unity Army to meet it, to win the Unity Battle in the Middle World and change the course of Argrath's Lightbringer Quest in the otherworlds..

When I played in a game and we needed to refurbish a large ruined settlement for a new community, at Sacred Time we ran the Wooing of Esrola heroquest.  In the finale of the quest we compelled Lodril/Veskarthan to build the Palace of Black Glass in the God Time, and when our questers returned to the Middle World the ruins were rebuilt in gleaming obsidian.  They still needed furnishings to be properly livable, of course.

21 minutes ago, metcalph said:

Within four generations of a God or another Emperor is the Dara Happan standard.

sure, but that's the requirement for becoming emperor, not joining the Yelm cult period