Playing the Lightbringers Quest from Sartar - Kingdom of Heroes

[Soccercalle]

I am running a RQG campaign with Six Seasons in Sartar as the "main campaign". But I have also included the "Colymar Campaign" from the Herowars book "Sartar - kingdom of Heroes". The two first parts (Red hands of Hofstaring and Howling Tower) have been quite easy to adapt for RQG but I feel quite overwhelmed with running such a large HeroQuest as the one saving Hofstarings soul from Lunar Hell.

I wonder if anyone have run it for RQG and if they have any advice? I have the book "Secrets of Heroquesting" but dont really see how that can help me. I am waiting for the official HQ rules and are not interested in pools for Hero Points. I have no idea how the official rules will work (but I know that Runes and Passions will be very important).

I have one "lead character" for the quest who is an Orlanthi trying to win the hand of Ernalsulva. And I guess that the rest of the players - and maybe som NPCs - can fill in as the rest of the Lightbringers.

[jajagappa]

6 hours ago, Soccercalle said:

but I feel quite overwhelmed with running such a large HeroQuest as the one saving Hofstarings soul from Lunar Hell.

I wonder if anyone have run it for RQG and if they have any advice?

It's not a trivial effort, but it is doable (speaking as someone who has run Underworld quests, or pieces thereof, with both HQG and RQG).

The chart on p.31 in Six Seasons is a useful starting point as this is about the Hero's Journey.  If you break down the quest to save Hofstaring into that circle then you can start to organize accordingly and think about what you need in RQG terms.

Any HQG test that notes the use of Runes, Passions, etc. just becomes an RQG test of the same - and you can Oppose that with a relevant value as appropriate (e.g. Moderate = 65%, Hard = 90%, Very Hard might be 120%-150%, while Nearly Impossible is likely 200%)

Here's some starting thoughts.

1) Call to Adventure - this is Ernalsulva's challenge, and you can best think of this stage as Preparation (SKoH p.335-339).  This is all this-world, but it's the opportunity to figure out the steps likely needed.  It's investigative - PC's go to their temples and try to learn about their cult's Underworld knowledge.  Also go to the LM temple for same. The goal is to have some "map" including what path to set out on, and what accoutrements they need.  Figure out what "role" each PC takes for the chosen path (e.g. if they follow the Lightbringer's Trail, then each is one of the Lightbringers) - maybe they get masks or special objects, and these give bonuses for the relevant "deity's" Runes.

2) The Crossing/Threshold - use a Worship ritual as the starting point (whose ritual will depend on the path chosen to descend).  Since you noted the Lightbringer's let's use them as example.  All PC's will participate in the ritual, and all should roll for Worship (even if not their usual deity - they've taken on a role here, so are part of the ceremony, and their "mask" may help them - i.e. gives them a bonus of 20 or 30%).  Dance, Sing, Meditate - anything that bumps up the Worship roll is useful, and should give a "carryover" bonus on one or more of the Runes of the "deity" they represent.  (You'll have to determine whether that's for first usage or while they wear the mask or through the whole quest.)

Also, note that you do not need to complete an ENTIRE Lightbringer's Quest!  That's not the PC's goal.  They are trying to get into the Underworld here. 

The Lightbringers are associated with Orlanth, so take the simple approach - Orlanth's Ring (i.e. his home) goes to the Underworld every two weeks, so take advantage of that.  Conduct the ritual on the night when Orlanth's Ring disappears from the Sky and returns to the Underworld.  Getting to Karulinoran/Storm Home should be easy - that's not the threshold.  When they step out the door, they are in the Underworld version of Storm Home - a dead place.  And outside it is a Guardian who they have to defeat to go on.  I like a Hell Hound here, but a Demon, monstrous troll, or similar would work fine too.  Just use standard RQG abilities - perception to spot it before it sees the PC's, stealth to surprise it (and gain attack advantage) - but you need to pass it to go beyond.

3) The Ordeal/Challenges - SKoH p.344.  Now they are in the Underworld.  Figure out a reasonable number of Ordeals/Challenges.  Minimally three, but could equal the number of PC's and each is tailored for one of the Lightbringers to best overcome.  Night Wood/Wild Hunt is a good option as one.  Use Opposed Rolls to try to avoid (e.g. Hide/Move Quietly vs. their ability to Sense the Living or whatever you wish to call it), but they may well have to fight or hide.  Ordeals are not just physical attacks - there could be a Corridor of Mirrors; or a parody of an Orlanthi stead where a demon rules, but you still must accept its Hospitality; etc.  Use Cult Lore rolls to help understand where they are and what they might do to survive.  Play up the deity roles they have taken on, including their natural foes/enemies.

4) Eventually they reach the Path of Silence - SKoH p.346.  They gain a Mentor here (e.g. a guide along the Path of Silence), though it is likely temporary.  This is a respite, but may be an opportunity to learn something more about the dead souls.  They reach the River of Swords (or the River Styx - whichever is preferred).  Use the Truth Rune or Honor Passion, perhaps with Orate, to prove they can pass.  Or perhaps they have lied at some prior point?  Alternately, if at the River Styx, they have to Bargain for passage with the Ferryman of the Dead - maybe he just wants coins, or maybe he wants something else (maybe he's crippled and wants their hamstrings, which would cripple one of them in turn). 

Use Runes, Passions, Movement Rate (i.e. hamstrings), parts of their soul (characteristics), knowledge (i.e. Lore) as bargaining chips.  They can trade some or all of these away to achieve some goal.  The Underworld is a place of constant trade-offs - give up something to get beyond.

5) Havan Vor and the King of the Dead - SKoH p.347-9.  This is the place of Judgment of their souls.  Make Hate and Reputation rolls to see if foes come to speak against them; make Love, Honor, Loyalty, and Devotion rolls to call forth those who would speak for the PCs; but they may need to invoke specific Runes (Movement, Air, Death, etc. as noted on p.349) to demand they be sent to the Lunar Hell, or they transgress some custom of the place (Trickster can be good at this) that automatically sends them beyond.

6) Pit of Hell/Hellmouth - SKoH p.349-51.  This is the Abyss, the very rock bottom of the adventure.  Each PC ends up lost and alone.  Each must find their way out alone.  Use the most negative Passion or the negative aspect of their highest rated Rune - these are the flaws or weaknesses in their personality.  They need to find something positive to oppose it with.  I like extended Opposed contests vs. a single opposed roll as it gives the PC some opportunity to try different strategies to save themselves. 

Will try to add more later, but hopefully the above provides some thoughts on how you can approach without resorting to anything more than basic RQG skills, Runes, and Passions.

 

 

[Soccercalle]

3 hours ago, jajagappa said:

 

Will try to add more later, but hopefully the above provides some thoughts on how you can approach without resorting to anything more than basic RQG skills, Runes, and Passions.

 

 

Thank you very much! This was very helpful!

[jajagappa]

Some additional comments.

6) Pit of Hell/Hellmouth cont.

Feel free to draw on images from things like Dante's Inferno or Neil Gaiman's depictions of Hell in the Sandman comics or even just the raw blackness and sense-depriving images that Nick Brooke depicts in his Black Spear (I do highly recommend this for some more RQG heroquesting ideas).  This place should be terrifying to all who have entered - a place of nightmare, whatever those are for the individual PC's (feel free to liberally draw upon any identified Fears; also, I encourage twisting Love and Loyalty Passions into Fears - if they Love someone, the PC sees them threatened, doomed, etc. and they cannot do anything about it!).

Fyi, there's another vision of the Hellmouth in the HQG Eleven Lights work.  It talks a bit more about the PC's got chomped and mangled by the Hellmouth.  Everyone should get chomped and mangled - and it's where they get separated from everyone else (if they haven't already).  Once they are through, and alone, they've got to find a way to pull themselves back together.  This is at the deepest part of the unconscious mind - let each PC figure out what is at the core of their being.  Maybe it's a Rune, or a Passion, or a characteristic (possible some PC could decide on one single skill, too).  I might allow some limited augment (Meditation upon their plight, a Song in the midst of nothingness, Dance even though they are crippled, etc.).  And a roll on whatever they identified as their core being.  With a success, they pull themselves back together (and definitely reward them with a bonus to that core essence).  If they get a special or critical success, they've gained something new (a Star Heart, SKoH p.350 would make sense - you can treat it like a new Passion with a rating of 60% for a special or 70% for a critical; and it's something they can draw upon as a last resort in desperate times).  If they fail, well, they didn't find something when they pulled themself back together and are now crippled somehow (maybe they lose half one of their three highest Runes?).

--------------------------------------

NOTE: What happens if they die in the Underworld???

Well, normally if you die, your spirit separates from the body and heads for the Underworld… but both parts are here, and the spirit doesn’t have to travel anywhere. And this gives you some options.

(1) The adventurer’s spirit may urge their companions to “heal” their body. If the body’s hit points are brought above 0, the spirit can re-enter the body. There is a cost: I'd reduce the adventurer’s CON by 1D4 and reduce their Fertility Rune by half - after all, they've REALLY died once.

(2) The spirit continues on with the adventurers. The companions can carry the body with them to Havan Vor, where the spirit is judged. If their deity shows up to plead for them (i.e. successful Devotion or Loyalty(temple) roll), the deity restores life and the spirit to the body.  (If it's after Havan Vor, then likely this is no longer an option.)

(3) As with any ghost/spirit, they can be bound into a Spirit matrix (if they have one along - always good to be prepared!!!), OR attempt to possess another creature’s body in the Underworld and use that!  (there are "living" creatures in the Underworld - could just be a troll, could be a hell hound, or even a black horse!  Maybe they’ve already encountered a spirit who tried to possess one of the adventurers to escape Hell, or a demon suggests they could do so?

(4) If the player is amenable, the adventurer’s spirit vanishes to Haran Vor, where it is judged worthy and sent to the afterlife. The party then has an encounter that introduces a new PC who joins the quest. How and why this character is in the Underworld is a good question.  A dwarf on a special mission?  A troll on a quest to Wonderhome who got lost?  A companion of Argrath's who got stuck? 

(5) The Underworld is a strange place. Perhaps the body turns into a zombie and shuffles after the PCs?  One of my PC's had a companion darkness demon who generally traveled with the PC as a shadowy cloak or shield (it was a "protective" spirit of darkness).  The PC died in the Underworld when they rang a curious little bell and shards of black glass fell from above.  The darkness demon used the opportunity to take over the dead body and become corporate, but it also "restored" the soul of the PC into a new "crystalline" form (the PC lost a couple of elemental Runes in the process and Water, in a solid form hence crystalline, became their new predominate Rune).  Weird things can happen in the Underworld.

--------------------------------------

7) Plateau of Suffering - SKoH p.351-3

This is the climax and you want a nice dramatic fight against these "gods".  Again I recommend Nick Brook's Black Spear with its ritual battle against the planetary deities as a good example of how you could run this.

You've got five foes here.  One is in the Very Hard 150% range; the others should be Hard 90%+, but scale to your PC's levels.  At least two need to be overcome and incapacitated to free Hofstaring.  It's a typical RQG battle - draw upon Runes, Rune spells (if they still have any left), and whatever resources they have left.

8 ) The Return - SKoH p.354

If they've freed Hofstaring, he carries them up and out of Hell - he knows how to do this.  Reward the PC's accordingly for their deeds - and this is a good chance to found a Hero Cult to Hofstaring to gain his Great Leap Rune spell (or whatever you wish to call it). 

There's a lot of other bits you can certainly fill in and around, but hopefully these notes give you plenty to work with.

 

[Soccercalle]

7 hours ago, jajagappa said:

Some additional comments.

6) Pit of Hell/Hellmouth cont.

Feel free to draw on images from things like Dante's Inferno or Neil Gaiman's depictions of Hell in the Sandman comics or even just the raw blackness and sense-depriving images that Nick Brooke depicts in his Black Spear (I do highly recommend this for some more RQG heroquesting ideas).  This place should be terrifying to all who have entered - a place of nightmare, whatever those are for the individual PC's (feel free to liberally draw upon any identified Fears; also, I encourage twisting Love and Loyalty Passions into Fears - if they Love someone, the PC sees them threatened, doomed, etc. and they cannot do anything about it!).

Fyi, there's another vision of the Hellmouth in the HQG Eleven Lights work.  It talks a bit more about the PC's got chomped and mangled by the Hellmouth.  Everyone should get chomped and mangled - and it's where they get separated from everyone else (if they haven't already).  Once they are through, and alone, they've got to find a way to pull themselves back together.  This is at the deepest part of the unconscious mind - let each PC figure out what is at the core of their being.  Maybe it's a Rune, or a Passion, or a characteristic (possible some PC could decide on one single skill, too).  I might allow some limited augment (Meditation upon their plight, a Song in the midst of nothingness, Dance even though they are crippled, etc.).  And a roll on whatever they identified as their core being.  With a success, they pull themselves back together (and definitely reward them with a bonus to that core essence).  If they get a special or critical success, they've gained something new (a Star Heart, SKoH p.350 would make sense - you can treat it like a new Passion with a rating of 60% for a special or 70% for a critical; and it's something they can draw upon as a last resort in desperate times).  If they fail, well, they didn't find something when they pulled themself back together and are now crippled somehow (maybe they lose half one of their three highest Runes?).

--------------------------------------

NOTE: What happens if they die in the Underworld???

Well, normally if you die, your spirit separates from the body and heads for the Underworld… but both parts are here, and the spirit doesn’t have to travel anywhere. And this gives you some options.

 

(1) The adventurer’s spirit may urge their companions to “heal” their body. If the body’s hit points are brought above 0, the spirit can re-enter the body. There is a cost: I'd reduce the adventurer’s CON by 1D4 and reduce their Fertility Rune by half - after all, they've REALLY died once.

 

(2) The spirit continues on with the adventurers. The companions can carry the body with them to Havan Vor, where the spirit is judged. If their deity shows up to plead for them (i.e. successful Devotion or Loyalty(temple) roll), the deity restores life and the spirit to the body.  (If it's after Havan Vor, then likely this is no longer an option.)

 

(3) As with any ghost/spirit, they can be bound into a Spirit matrix (if they have one along - always good to be prepared!!!), OR attempt to possess another creature’s body in the Underworld and use that!  (there are "living" creatures in the Underworld - could just be a troll, could be a hell hound, or even a black horse!  Maybe they’ve already encountered a spirit who tried to possess one of the adventurers to escape Hell, or a demon suggests they could do so?

 

(4) If the player is amenable, the adventurer’s spirit vanishes to Haran Vor, where it is judged worthy and sent to the afterlife. The party then has an encounter that introduces a new PC who joins the quest. How and why this character is in the Underworld is a good question.  A dwarf on a special mission?  A troll on a quest to Wonderhome who got lost?  A companion of Argrath's who got stuck? 

 

(5) The Underworld is a strange place. Perhaps the body turns into a zombie and shuffles after the PCs?  One of my PC's had a companion darkness demon who generally traveled with the PC as a shadowy cloak or shield (it was a "protective" spirit of darkness).  The PC died in the Underworld when they rang a curious little bell and shards of black glass fell from above.  The darkness demon used the opportunity to take over the dead body and become corporate, but it also "restored" the soul of the PC into a new "crystalline" form (the PC lost a couple of elemental Runes in the process and Water, in a solid form hence crystalline, became their new predominate Rune).  Weird things can happen in the Underworld.

--------------------------------------

7) Plateau of Suffering - SKoH p.351-3

This is the climax and you want a nice dramatic fight against these "gods".  Again I recommend Nick Brook's Black Spear with its ritual battle against the planetary deities as a good example of how you could run this.

You've got five foes here.  One is in the Very Hard 150% range; the others should be Hard 90%+, but scale to your PC's levels.  At least two need to be overcome and incapacitated to free Hofstaring.  It's a typical RQG battle - draw upon Runes, Rune spells (if they still have any left), and whatever resources they have left.

8 ) The Return - SKoH p.354

If they've freed Hofstaring, he carries them up and out of Hell - he knows how to do this.  Reward the PC's accordingly for their deeds - and this is a good chance to found a Hero Cult to Hofstaring to gain his Great Leap Rune spell (or whatever you wish to call it). 

There's a lot of other bits you can certainly fill in and around, but hopefully these notes give you plenty to work with.

 

Thanks again. I am thinking of a reward in the form of Leap AND Great Leap. Leap would be reusable and Great Leap one-use. I don't think that is a spell that should be used to often. I will also read Black Spear again to get more ideas.

I have actually started to write a "road map" based on your first comment. It will be a bit railroading (this is their first HeroQuest) but they will be able to choose btw violence, seduction and stealth on many stations. And of course which skills, runes or magic to use.

Edited April 13, 2022 by Soccercalle

[soltakss]

On 4/11/2022 at 7:48 PM, Soccercalle said:

I wonder if anyone have run it for RQG and if they have any advice? I have the book "Secrets of Heroquesting" but dont really see how that can help me. I am waiting for the official HQ rules and are not interested in pools for Hero Points. I have no idea how the official rules will work (but I know that Runes and Passions will be very important).

I ran a Campaign for the HeroQuest game, where members of our existing campaign went on a Lightbringer Quest. So, I ran each Station, or sub-Station, as a single session.

It worked really well.

@jajagappahas pretty much covered everything in his post.

I would expand each Station to be a HeroQuest in its own right, to make it a longer HeroQuest.

 

 

[Soccercalle]

6 minutes ago, soltakss said:

I ran a Campaign for the HeroQuest game, where members of our existing campaign went on a Lightbringer Quest. So, I ran each Station, or sub-Station, as a single session.

It worked really well.

@jajagappahas pretty much covered everything in his post.

I would expand each Station to be a HeroQuest in its own right, to make it a longer HeroQuest.

 

 

I guess it depends on the group. Some stations may be one session. Maybe we will have time for more than one station on some sessions. We play appr 2 times a month for 3-4 hours. Most players have kids and career jobs. The "Colymar Campaign" is run together with Six Seasons in Sartar so Eurmal will probably be the Clan Trickster and Ginna Jar will be "the Royal". I only have five players in the group. 

[jajagappa]

4 hours ago, Soccercalle said:

It will be a bit railroading (this is their first HeroQuest) but they will be able to choose btw violence, seduction and stealth on many stations. And of course which skills, runes or magic to use.

There are some sections where things naturally flow to the next place (e.g. you cross the River of Swords or the River Styx and you reach the place of Judgment).

However, the Ordeal provides plenty of opportunity for PC-choice, and consequences from those choices.  It's also a time when the tried-and-true solutions don't work.  The shadows that plague them cannot be slain, the ghosts of the dead cannot be seduced (by ordinary means), there is nowhere to hide upon the Plains of Black Ash, the path they take they discover approaches the place they just left (but now the demon they snuck by knows how they got by last time), etc.  There should be some sense of "No Exit" (to borrow from the title of Sartre's play set in Hell) no matter what they try (until at last, perhaps surprisingly, they do reach the Path of Silence).