davecake

I'm struck by the certainty that the Triolini must know more about The Closing than they are letting on. All those sea monsters must be understood more by them than by boaters.

The Red City is in a number of sources about its significance in prehistoric Naveria, but the 900 ST really highlights the way it has suddenly become independent in the late Second Age, This is mentioned when we get to that area later, but we don't have much detail about why.

The Red City is in a number of sources about its significance in prehistoric Naveria, but the 900 ST really highlights the way it has suddenly become independent in the late Second Age, This is mentioned when we get to that area later, but we don't have much detail about why.

If the Feldichi are connected to the Gold Wheel Dancers, that is largely just combining two mysteries into one! Which kind of leaves us with very little to go on either way.

Joerg, I think you are right that these maps should be interpreted as political maps - and as we know Aldryami are usually quite happy to cohabit with Hsunchen, I think the big changes here are best interpreted not as drastic ecological difference, but as Aldryami being supplanted by Hsunchen as the dominant force. This probably does coincide with a lot of land clearing, but not quite as drastically as the map makes it appear. Same goes for eg Jorestl's Forest. It is on the map as a political entity at the Dawn, and has disappeared by 265 ST - but that may indicate the loss of Aldryami, at least in numbers for political control, rather than loss of the forest itself. But I disagree with the idea that its just passive ecological change, due to the shock of the Dawn or otherwise, or just as an active result of Hsunchen lifestyle change. We know this period coincides with the internecine battles of Aldrya's Woe, so we don't need to seek other explanations. it is quite possible that this may manifest as the loss of the specific trees that support elves, etc.

Talsardia - this is an Orlanthi Kingdom that suddenly appears in Hykimi territory between the Second Council and Nysalor period. It is an Orlanthi kingdom, founded by King Talsardian. Is it entirely Second Council troops moving from Council territory to the North East, or are there more local Orlanthi that for part of the kingdom? If the latter, there might also be a Vadrudi connection?

Thanks, Peter. Any more info about these nations?

Ok, the Mralani are present both in what will be Teshnos, and next to what will be Esrolia. There is no doubt some explanation for why the same culture is in such widely separated places. And I would guess they are pig-hsunchen? Amtal could conceivably be a Dune reference? http://dune.wikia.com/wiki/Amtal_Rule/DE

The Dawn age civilisations west of Teshnos I know very little about. I can't find a single reference outside of these maps to Amtal, Inzagril, Mralani, etc. There is clearly a lot more to the story - and the history presented in the Teshnos chapter doesn't (I know I'm jumping far ahead here, but only to determine that the question won't be resolved when we get there). There is clearly some document from which the names come, but what?

Of course Harmast's insights would have been shared with Arkat, and when Arkat begins to understand modern heroquesting he is building on Harmast's insights - but with the advantages of having experienced the same Godtime moments from wildly different perspectives.

This chapter makes it seem as if the Feldichi ruins and what was learnt/recovered from them were fairly significant in First Age history, but we know incredibly little about them, except that one weird sun-powered flying sled thing in Dorastor. And I kind of hate the sled thing - it seems rather too science fictional rather than magical to me. The other Feldichi magic we have described - the ice that only melts in liquid, magic translator scrolls, singing wards - don't leave me much less confused. Anyone got anything more on the Feldichi?

At the Dawn, Genertela West of Pent/The Wastes is basically mostly Elf Forest - and none of the previous discussions of the Dawn Age had ever given me that impression to this extent. The massive deforestation in the early First Age is the most obvious geographical change, and it is huge. I expect to some extent this is really more de-Aldryami-isation - that is, the areas remain somewhat forested but the Aldryami are driven out or, as in the Elder WIlds, reduced to a scattered remnant - otherwise the ecological change would be even more extreme. Still, very significant. The disappearance of the entire Tallseed Forest. Almost the entirety of Fronela South of the Janube. Huge swathes of North-East Ralios. The Elder WIlds. The entire Jorestl's Forest. Presumably almost all of this is down to the internecine fighting of Aldrya's Woe, in which case it is was truely vicious and catastrophic. In most cases, it was too the benefit of Hsunchen - the Hykimi and Enjoreli in Fronela, the Serpent-Beasts in Ralios, the Pralori and Mraloti in Maniria. I'm assuming this warfare is mostly fought with ecological weapons, rather than anything resembing conventional warfare. Diseases, parasites, animals that target seeds, etc. The virulent rot that the Pamaltelan elves are fighting at the Sunstop may be an example of this (and if its fungal, it does raise the issue of how the voralans fit into the whole thing). Two notable exceptions to the great forest die off. The Warm Wood in Teshnos is barely scratched - it gets a little smaller but only a little. Presumably its physical isolation sees it relatively outside of hostilities and its mild shrinkage is due to conflict with humans. And the elven forests actually significantly expand to cover the Lendarshi lands. That is worth some discussion, as it presumably tells us something significant about human/Aldryami relations in Peloria.

I agree with Joerg that I would love to see similar for other areas - particularly Pamaltela, though a lozenge wide 'age of Empires' map would also be handy. My impression is the Pamaltelan history isn't in that mature a state yet, though.

Mastery is usually some form of power of others, and so manifests as being controlling or charismatic. Sometimes Mastery is self discipline, and so manifests as self control and confidence. Spirit manifests in ways that in our world would get you diagnosed with Schizotypal oersonality disorder. Its just that in Glorantha they are functional, and so not a disorder. The voices are real and your magical thinking perfectly valid. Similarly, I think the Disorder rune and Illusion Runes manifests in the personality traits that if they are strong would be 'cluster B' perspnality disorders such as sociopathy, narcissism and histrionic personality disorder. That is a who a Trickster is, a bad person who can't stop lying and stealing because it is intrinsic to their nature.

Even if you have thrown the bag of silver at them, they are not obliged to accept it as weregeld. I think if you straight up walked in an killed someone and threw a bag of money on the ground next to the corpse, they would be within their rights to reject it as weregeld - and then declare that as it was left in their hall, they were taking it anyway, and anyone who wanted it was welcome to visit them in their half and ask for it back.

Yes, Kana Poor is one of those Gloranthan mysteries. Has been canon as casting one of the Four Arrows of Light since the Redline history was first published in Wyrms Footnotes, but apart from an association with Time that is virtually all that I know. Trawling through ancient digests via Google, Nick Brooke once posted this excerpt from Greg's Lunar WIP : Kana Poor : Scribe of Time : A disciple of Irrippi Ontor, Kana Poor mastered secrets of the Red : Goddess and inaugurated the recording of Lunar history. He was first : to discern the fifty-four year cycle of the Lunar Wanes, hailing the : inception of the Second Wane during the New Year festivities of 1302 : S.T. (This has forever after been 2/1 in the Lunar calendar). He is : also regarded as first among the Chronomancers, those Lunar magi who : have a special understanding of Cyclical Time and the waxing and : waning flux of Lunar energies.

I do not think Mostali have technology that makes golems. I think they have sorcery that makes golems, and that is entirely different. So I very much think you are looking at it wrong, in my opinion! Jolanti, for example, are not mechanisms made of stone. They are living stone. They are Stone that sorcery has restored to its God Time original state, before Death came to Stone. And other Mostali creatures like bronze goats are similarly metal given life. They do not get the energy required to live from being wound up, they get it from eating food like other living beings. And see, now we have leapt from 'maybe Mostali have technology like the best of the ancient Greeks' to Mostali definitely have the technology of the 19th Century, that is, IMO, a huge and inappropriate leap. Canonically aeolopiles are a big deal for them as far as complex mechanical devices go. They have gears, but not precision manufacture. I think this presentation of the Mostali entirely ignores that the Mostali technology is Magic, and so leaps to assuming they have the technology of an entirely anachronistic non-magical technological civilisation. They don't think of men and clockwork as the same, because our concept of energy and the Gloranthan concept of Energy are totally different - the best clock still has no POW, Clocks lack the Man Rune, etc. It isn't conservatism that holds them back from making computers, its that the live in a magical world that operates on different rules, and makes it far more likely they'll develop a universal solvent or find a way to bottle memories. We need to draw inspiration not from 19th century science inspired fiction. We need to look at magical ideas that are mechanistic or pre-scientific. In Glorantha Alchemy isn't the predecessor to chemistry that will become more scientific and less magical as our understanding grows - rather, Alchemy is a true understanding of the world that enables more impressive magic as we understand it better. We need not to turn Mostali into 19th century steampunk munchkins. We need them to be magicians, magicians who see the world as a complex interacting set of alchemical processes. Mostali machines are covered in magic inscriptions, have bizarre (and at high levels, like the dwarves of the Eddas, impossible) ingredients in their alloys, work on the basis of magical correspondences of substances and colours and shapes with the runes, the planets, and alchemical concepts. And like the alchemists, they think to make things perfect. I've long thought that producing adamantium, the perfect substance, is a major goal of Mostali alchemy, their equivalent of the Philosophers Stone. I also disagree with this interpretation. The Mostali don't 'distance' themselves from heretics. They fight vicious, ruthless, merciless wars.

I presume YS stands for Yelmic System or similar, but in that case the sentence that talks about 'the YS system' is ungrammatical.

The only other reference to 'The Weapon of Ghani' (or Ghani at all) I can find is in the Arcane Lore reference that this paragraph comes from.

Wind Children - I didn't know about the range of colours. The mention of mountain spirits implies they don't work only with air spirits, wh h is also news to me.

Ogres - they are in every culture apart from the Brithini, but we know relatively little about them in eg East Isles, Pamaltela, the West.

Interesting that the keets are described as a sub-species of duck, rather than the other way around. Also, that the majority are still ducks - I would have expected duck-keets to be just another minority species.

Interested that the Beastmen seem to have their own opinions about who is a valid beastmen, but it seems pretty inclusive. I'd like to know more about beastmen outside Genertela.

I agree with Scott that there is a lot we don't know about sea mythology. I'd particularly expect the Ludoch to feature more in Genertelan and East Isles myth. And I'm also interested in how they relate to Pre-Dawn seagoing cultures like the Helerings.

I have tended to assume that the Merfolk were almost exclusively theist - but this chapter, and elsewhere in the Guide, makes it clear that many are animist (and fairly potent ones, I assume). While the merfolk per se aren't sorcery users as far as I know, that's because the role of sorcerous Water culture is filled by the Waertagi.