Tywyll

thanks Dalmuti, that is exactly what I was looking for. Cheers!

And I agree that Fast Talk, Persuade, etc have certain expectations that make them fail for less specific uses. It's why I wish there was a 'Bluff' skill rather than Fast Talk, because Fast Talking is very specific while Bluff is much more general. To me at least.

I didn't remember the Humakti thing, and I'm not sure I consider a one-off thing from Plunder much support, but your point is taken.

I was aware of the Humakti thing... it never struck me as a really smart choice... you take a permanent 'flaw' in exchange for a weapon that might get broken/stolen/lost.

The cult of Humakt has gift that have a permanent effects on a sword.

In Plunder (reprinted in a supplement whose name escapes me) there is a ritual to permanently enchant a sword with a bladesharp 1 (2?) effect

Some saint's blessings give a permanent effect (Paslac, Gerland) but I don't know if they are official

Jean

It must be in the reprint then, I can't find it my copy of Plunder.

So, back in RQ 1/2 days, you could make a Power Crystal to store Magic Points and that was the main way of getting extra ones.

Then, in RQ3, you could summon and bind spirits. But you could still make Magic Crystals.

As I understand it, a single point of power going into a Crystal allowed it to store 1 mp. Meanwhile, a single Pow could also be used to make a binding object for a Power Spirit, with its 2d6+3 Power.

Now, granted you had to summon and control said spirit, but other than following the original rules set, what possible advantage/purpose was there for the magic crystal? I know a lot of house rules made it store d10 mp and stuff because I'm not the only one who saw this disparity. Does anyone know the rationale?

Additionally, what about balance... is one permanent Pow worth 10 mp (on average)? It seems like that would get out of hand fairly quickly.

Did these ever get posted? the website doesn't seem to have been updated since October, unless I missed something.

If your using BRP, then you don't need to use much of Arduin's game mechanics. The only thing you might have to work out is how you would convert the spells. Arduin's manna point system works a lot differently then how magic is depicted in BRP.

Um, yeah, I wasn't suggesting using any of the mechanics, just making some changes to BRP to capture the flavor (and converting the special tables because, lets face it, they are awesome).

Was thinking about BRP Arduin on the way to work today. I don't think I'd use Con+Siz for HP, simply because starting characters (hell any level of character) could be as easily frangible as standard BRP characters.

What I might do instead would be to allow characters to sacrifice a POW for a permenant +d3 HP, or d3 PP for Casters. Something like this would allow for the 'levelled growth' of characters overtime that did occur in Arduin. I might cap HP at Con+Siz, and PP at 2xPOW (or probably POW + Racial Max, so that a character's sacrificed pp don't fluctuate with their expended POW).

I might allow a POW to buy a single point of permanent Armor. Possibly cap these at 1/4th your Con (or 1/8(Con+Siz)).

If I used a magic system like the Wizardry one, I'd probably drop damage dealing spells down to 1pp per level, or in some way make the spells more useful (possibly allowing for casters to 'prepare' ahead of time and those spells they prepare will be 1 for 1, but those cast on the spot will be 3 for 1).

I'd make a whole bunch of messed up monster...

I'd let characters roll on the special table after creation, giving them whatever they've rolled in BRP terms.

That'd do for a start I think.

I've been a huge Arduin fan since I first learned of it... which unfortunately was shortly after the 8th Grimoire came out, shortly after Dave died.

The first 3 books are definitely a White Box dnd add on, but man, the ideas in them. Sure, a lot of it was pure crazy, but so was a lot of the early dnd stuff that has bled into becoming recognizable tropes. The later Grimoires were always more interesting to me, simply because they had more of the 'feel' of the setting. The rules contained obviously were drifting from dnd by that point, but you couldn't really build a cohesive game from them or even idea of what you were supposed to do with them.

Complete Arduin came out after Dave passed away. I'm fairly sure he wrote most of it, but I don't know for certain. It's definitely different from what was in the Grimoires, even the later ones, but was close enough that they could be used together.

I think BRP could do an Arduin game quite well, but I agree that you'd have to leave out the more gonzo stuff (which I always did anyway). That or simply accept that all characters will eventually become Supers on top of whatever they started as.

Empcho is trying to publish a new, modern Arduin system. They have talked about it on their boards and I can't really say any more than that.

Anyone know if there was ever any official rules for 'always on enchantments' in RQ3 or Adventures in RQ? I mean something like a sword that is always +10% and +2 to damage rather than one that has a Bladesharp 2 matrix on it?

I know in the old modules there were some sick enchanted items (I remember one spear that was permenantly True Weaponed!!!!). But the rulebook didn't have any direct rules on enchanting such.

Anything official ever get published?

I can't speak about the problems Interplanetary has had. I've had hit and miss with Dustin, but my most recent communication resulted in a response the very next day. *shrug* Granted, I was just touching base so that might have had something to do with it.

It's a lovely dream, and some of us (Vagabond and or myself not least) may yet release fan conversions - but sadly I think any "official" BRP version is doomed to remain a dream I'm afraid.

I'm just glad, given what's happened to Morrigan Press recently, that they never got involved with Jorune...

Cheers,

Nick

What happened to Morrigan Press?

Now this doesn't need to be a major exercise for them. if you go back through the various incarnations of BRP a lot of Monsters have been produced. Problem is that they're scattered across a lot of different products many of which are long since out of print. Thinking of RQ3 alone there's a good few that haven't made it into the BRP rulebook, compile them together with things from other supplements and thats a start. Now veteran BRP players here will be saying " hey I've got all that stuff already, why do I want to buy it again " The point is though a newcomer won't have that stuff, and isn't going to want to fork out $30 for an out of print copy of a RQ3 product just to get a stats block for a panther....

Got to go, so I'll talk about magic'n'stuff when I get back

I agree that some generic BRP supplements would be awesome. Monograph or actual print, either would be cool, though I'd prefer an actual book (I realize the difficulties in such). Heck, they could do a monster book like HERO did its beastiary-real world creatures, then various fantasy tropes like undead, intelligent races, dragons, etc, then move on to mutants, sci-fi beasties, and more.

I think that would be a great idea.

In addition, I think any generic BRP supplements would be good. I am not bothered by settings... I'm so pressed for time these days, I only run one setting, my own homebrew. I do raid other settings for material but I much prefer crunch to fluff, personally. I'd like to see more generically useful supplements, rather than ones tied to a specific setting.

As for magic, well... that's what my Monograph is all about... :thumb:

But, if the supplements have already been written and submitted and are not being released, then where is the delay?

Is that the case? Has anyone submitted a finished monograph and is still waiting for it to be released? Or do they not have any finished ones read to go?

In fact, this is an example that came up when someone got on here complaining about what happened with powers and magic interacting, when Jason tried to patiently point out that he mentioned not all the systems are entirely compatible together. He apparently wouldn't take this as an answer as I recall...

Yeah, that's my problem with people saying 'just use superpowers'. While some of them can be modelled with that system, many, especially the really low-powered ones, cannot. And some just unbalance things full stop if you aren't running a full on supers campaign.

That's the real issue here; some things are simply not well represented by skill-like functions, or frankly anything with a die roll; they're steady-state traits where no die roll makes any sense. When I was younger, before the joys of age cut in, I had a much higher range (as in I could here frequencies above what 99.99% of the human populace could) hearing; while hearing at all was something a die roll could represent, there were sounds I was simply going to be able to notice than most people wouldn't. It was an either or sort of thing.

Exactly Nightshade! That is the absolute crux of the situation. Thanks for summarizing it so nicely.

Ambidexterity, in my experience, was pretty substantial.

And, I disagree - all of those traits can be learned. I knew a kid in high

school who taught himself to be ambidextrous. He definitely wasn't when

he was younger, but by the time he graduated, he was.

-V

Which doesn't invalidate the need for representing characters who are born with such an ability.

I'm all for the system having a means for characters to buy the abilities after character creation. But the system should allow for beginning 'low-level' characters to possess special traits that set them apart, probably at a cost of skill points to keep the system balanced.

As for ambidexterity, it completely depends on the system. If ambidexterity means simply 'use other hand at no penalty, INSTEAD of normal hand' it's not really that big of a deal. If it means 'get extra attack' then it is.

Hmm, I'm on the fence here. I think I prefer that you "earn" those abilities

later. One of the things I disliked about D&D3 was the whole "Feat Management

and Optimization" system. I don't mind that feats have prerequisites, nor that

you can potentially learn more than one, but getting these special heroic and/or

legendary abilities from the get go and at regular intervals seemed way too

much for my tastes.

I think that is also one of the reasons I never latched onto GURPS or HERO.

Some of the advantages were severeley overpowered, and having those

kinds of skills from the start did not appeal to me.

-V

See it entirely depends on what they do.

Should a beginning character be able to have Rune Lord like divine Intervention? Well, maybe, depending on the story and the campaign.

I agree completely that optimization should be avoided, I do loath it. However, I disagree that /all/ such abilities, or even the majority of them (especially in Gurps or Hero) come close to unbalancing.

I mean, things like Time Keeper, Eidetic Memory, Ambidextrous, Bump of Direction, Good Swimmer, et al are hardly overpowered, but they are relavant to some concepts and allow for thinking of character aptitudes beyond simply what they've been trained to do (skills).

They also represent traits that beginning characters could have, and aren't exactly the kind of thing you 'earn'.

I would also submit that becoming an Agent/Champion of Law/Chaos/Balance

(or reaching Apotheosis) in Stormbringer/Elric! also granted new "feats" -

special abilities that went beyond simple percentile adds.

-V

Absolutely, as did becoming a Priest/Rune Lord (Divine Intervention) in old RQ. Joining a faith did in some cases as well (the specialist skills).

The downside to a lot of those is that some of them are overly restrictive (why could only members of one faith become Courtisans in Glorantha?) or limited to high level/high skill characters.

There should be many such abilities that are available 'out of the gate' (like ambidexterity... though I suppose that would require a decent two-weapon fighting system in BRP).

From what I've seem, MRQ Legendary Abilities fall into the same pitfalls as other cut & paste/multiply bonus by 5 copycat attempts.

I would suggest rereading the Legendary ABilities. I can only think of a tiny handfull that add bonuses to rolls. The vast majority of them go beyond what a skill can do to provide new and interesting abilities for characters. Of the 18 in the basic rules book, only 4 add to the character's rolls, and in all cases that is not all they do (in fact it is a minor aspect of their overall ability).

Same thing with Gurps and Hero (heck many of the feats that exist beyond the basic 3.X rulebooks)... most of the ads and disads are not simply "bonuses" to a small set of abilities. They are new capabilities that go beyond what skill and attribute rolls represent, or methods of altering abilities that one possesses as a virtue of class or skill.

Superpowers, as presented in BRP, while certainly a fairly decent starting ground, is woefully inadequate for representing such abilities. Namely because there is no supported system for using them alongside non-super characters, or gaining them in play. If the power system were a more robust, effect driven system, like HERO then I'd say yeah, you could, but right now there is not enough meat on it for that.

(this isn't to say that the super power system isn't perfectly good for what it is intended mind you).

So, if someone wanted to start kicking ideas around, I'd love to contribute. I'd like to see BRP benefit from an integrated Adv/Dis system, as well as something like LA or Ki Abilities coming back (though I think that represents something very different from 'feats' or Adv/Dis, more like 15th+ level abilities in dnd).

Earthblade ignoring armor seems weak, seeing as really good attack results ignore armor anyway. I'm really keen on the knockback concept. Target must resist with a successful SIZ or STR roll, or be knocked back 1 meter for every 5 points of damage.

Moonblade just screams 'Insanity!'. Target must resist accumulated Moonblade damage or suffer a temporary insanity.

I think ignoring armor would be fairly dramatic... I mean, you need a crit to ignore it, so that only happens 2-5% of the time, while this spell improves that amazingly. Fireblade just does more damage, which arguably you get from an impale.

However, I do definitely agree with the Moonblade idea!

In Poker, a successful "Poker Face" is achieved with some skill.

Some are good at it, some aren't. It takes effort.

I would say, a general "Bluff" skill roll would suffice. One need not

say something to bluff someone, just providing a demeanor is

sufficient (trying to look cool under duress for example).

-V

I guess that's it. Perhaps I'll just tweak 'Fast Talk' to make it 'Bluff' because Fast Talk is very specific, to me at least, while Bluff is a bit more generic.

What happened with Seraphim Guard?

See, it's possible to be 'hard to read' without lying or concealing anything. It's a property of the person who's being read, which only allowing a roll for the viewer misses out on the opportunity to represent that.

One place I think in which BRP shows its age is it's poor contested skill mechanics.

I was noticing this recently when I was thinking of people who are 'hard to read'. As the game works now, a character gets an Insight roll versus another character and, unless they are lying deliberately, that's it. You can't play a 'Mystery Man' style character who simply conceals their motive and emotions, or has a good poker face. Your poker face is determined by how well the other character rolls, which seems odd.

I suppose you could make it an opposed Insight roll. ANy other ideas on how to handle this sort of thing?

Actually the wind blade is harder to parry/dodge, and the earth blade ignores some armor.

While the debuff idea is interesting, and I might go that route, but I don't think it compares (unless you are suggesting it be cumulative per strike) with 3d6 damage.