Joerg

9 hours ago, mfbrandi said:

• We have wyverns and dream dragons, and I wonder whether we have a dragonewt equivalent.

My own theory is that a dragonewt is a dream-dragon-like projection of the immature dragon in the egg, a vehicle for making experiences while growing to size. Whether this dream experience has to follow normal time or whether dragonewt experiences now may be part of an already adult dragon's experience - provided that a dragonewt egg conserves some of the timelessness and potential for non-sequential experiences.

If this is the case, then one and the same True Dragon could have manifestations of its own egg all over History and Godtime, in all manner of stages.

That would frame the Dragonkill War as self-defence, unless one and the same dragon is able to branch out in all manner of experiences, including the Magisaur or the Dinosaur paths.

The role of Hykim and Mikyh as ancestors of all animals actually suggests such a branching out.

15 minutes ago, Darius West said:

Consider the large size of Beaked Dragonewts, and the fact that a klanth is effectively a bastard sword.  This seems like a perfectly adequate combination for mounted combat.  The fact that dragonewts haven't adjusted their warfare to incorporate a lance is typically dragonewt.  Remember these dragonewts are the dumbass failures of the clutch.  Some haven't even figured out eating yet.  All the actually good dragonewts have already become True Dragons.

That's one theory, repeating the assumption that all dragonewt eggs have existed since before the Green Age.

There is a rivalling theory that there might be some form of dragonewt procreation involving individuals from all sexes. If there are newer eggs, then the "useless" argument doesn't bite.

There is an indication that the number of dragnewt survivors in Dragon Pass at the Dawn is lower than the number of dragonewts active on the cusp of the Hero Wars, and that's after losses suffered in the early stages of the Dragonkill War. That might be a "proof" for dragonewt propagation by other means. (Or simply a vastly incomplete census at the Dawn.)

31 minutes ago, Scotty said:

I'd never expect a group to try and eliminated all of the packs, as most will just run off and regroup.

If I learned one thing in my four decades as a GM it is never to expect sense or sensible decisions from players.

Belintar used heroquesting to build things up. Understanding mythology was necessary for his feats (like raising Loon Island, installing the magical bridges and the Fish Roads, creating the Building Wall...) and for achieving the Proximate Holy Realm that brought divinity to his lands, or at least his City of Wonders.

And then there is building to empower the heroquesting - all the edifices created by Belintar served to support his questing. Just like the roads and walls of Sartar, the Daughter's Road, or the Reaching Moon Temples. Malkioni urban architecture was developed to optimize magical support (for the sorcerers, but later also used by the Men-of-All).

Greg was very keen on tracking the support infrastructure of the heroquesters, and would use the Hero Wars/HQ-mechanics to simulate the economics of such support. RQG offers a different method of tracking such investment, it will be interesting to see Jeff's solution for this mechanic.

1 hour ago, glarkhag said:

And disrupt would still only have 5% chance of killing the last pack...

If the pack has 7 individuals, I would have allowed it to disperse after five to nine uses of the spell, each use leaving an individual squealing in pain or dead.

5 minutes ago, glarkhag said:

So one pack is indeed 5% and killing the last pack could take 20 melee rounds (or more). 

That's pretty tedious. 

Time for those "Disrupt" or even "Ignite" spells.

1 hour ago, mfbrandi said:

Is there a whole scaled-up “land of the giants” ecosystem to go with the giant insects? Giant fruit trees? Giant pollen? Giant insectivorous birds?

The Vale of Flowers along Giants' Walk in northwestern Dagori Inkarth ticks at least giant flowers and giant pollen, collected by the Bee tribe of Dagori Inkarth.

No incident of giant fruit trees I have heard of outside of Hidden Greens - if those enter into a fragment of Genert's Garden that somehow escaped devastation. There would have to be a grove of a giant dryad in there.

If there have been giant insectivorous birds in the region of Giants' Walk at the time of the arrival of Gash and Gore in Dagori Inkarth, I suppose they were eaten by trolls before the Greater Darkness started.

1 hour ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

Is there really a difference ? As individual, I agree with you, you join your [local] profession's cult, in the same way that you join the guild (well... probably the guild is the cult or a subcult)

But in a world where gods actions are visible and not discussed at all (aka this entity exists there is no doubt. The question is more "is it good to worship it or not"),

I m not sure that carpenters will follow the god of carpenters if it is known that this god is unable to work wood (so unable to bless wood workers).

In fact the god of carpenters is the god of carpenters because it is the god who have mastered/created Carpentry.

The question is whether such a god will have a cult and initiates, or whether the god will be an associate of one of the greater temples with a shrine and a single rune spell, or a spirit cult with a shaman or godspeaker officiating for the guild.

Most professional cults don't offer much in the way of answering the big questions or offering an afterlife (other than endless toil).

7 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

So it surely doesn't get so rocky a boat could not pass... 

The big question is did the God-king use the fish road to get into and out of Hell? What type of craft did he deploy? Was it a Gato-class submarine? More likely it was like the old Captain Nemo's submarine. On the other hand, couldn't he just go to the underworld if he willed it?

The point of the fish road is that you can travel the sea (or river) bottom as if it was a road on dry land. No special vessels required.

Theoretically, walkers could tow a submersible that did not pass through the nexus but was brought into the Fish Road waters from regular waters.

Come to think of it - the Syphon part of the Fish Road might serve as a towing path.

The Syphon has a channel deep enough to maintain a fish road throughout its course, although that may become uncomfortable and akin to spelunking as the river flattens out at the ford of Backford, and then climbing up cliffsides and meandering into the Stone Forest and Foulblood Forest.

My model for the ancient rivers are tendrils creeping inland but carrying the energies and nutrition back  to the Sea. This involves a structure of currents and counter-currents inside, the turbulent outer current pushing water up the land and eroding the soil when in contact, while there would remain a laminar inner current returning to the Heart of the Seas carrying the goodies. There may be interior zones of stillness or of stationary rotating loops, growing and shrinking.

As a rule, clay dwarfs aren't produced from clay any more, much like humans aren't - that would beat the purpose. Instead, they replicate through a Growth process carefully supervised and as soon as possible turned over to a Making conditioning. Engaging in that Growth process, and acknowledging the possession of (and performance of) sexes is deeply disturbing to the clay dwarfs selected to perform that duty.

Dwarf bodies do have a source code - it relies heavily on the Man Rune, of course, refined with all manner of internal and job-induced refinements. Living Rock, Elder Mostali, clay mostali all can be healed through application of the Harmony rune and perhaps a small side order of Fertility/life. Nolonger quite as alive material can be imbued using the Stabilize sorcerous rituals.

The most detailed study on dwarf physiology is (ironically) in Troll Pak, where the nutritional reception of dwarf bodies or body parts by the troll digestive system is discussed. To human and troll eyes, dwarf blood probably is red.

Blood enabling life tends to be red, blood carrying out death tends to turn blue. Death is collected by the air in the lungs and spread out, until overcome by Aldryami efforts to keep things growing.

40 minutes ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

I don't think ANYONE in Glorantha have DNA, to be honest.

I would assume everyone has some Divinely Notated Ancestry immanent in their bodies that will lead to their bodies developing in a certain way. Most likely not in the shape of a double helix of desoxyribonucleic acid, I agree.

1 hour ago, Darius West said:

Remember that there are many parts of the Empire where Rune Lords aren't required, as they are civilized and peaceful places. 

Seven Mothers rune lords will be good trainee material for dart competitions, at least as defense.

2 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

Potatoes grow in Darkness.

Potato tubers spoil (become poisonous) in direct sunlight, which is why they remain in the shelter of Earth, but the bits above the ground hog as much sun as they can (being members of the nightshade family).

You can of course grow Lunar tubers which have crimson starch, but the common tubers you will find in our worlds market places are full of the sun's blessing when sliced open, collecting it in the shelter of the earth.

Rather than fish pens, my idea of coastal Kethaela are fish fences oriented against the quick flow. In most of Kethaela that would mean catching the outgoing flood of the falling Blue Moon, but the orientation of the Syphon current will orient the fences in the opposite direction.

I wonder whether the falling Blue Moon will actually increase the uphill current in the Syphon, as the pull would also befall the river's head into the Chaos hole in Foulblood Forest.

If the Red Emperor Argenteus takes an interest in any matter, then most likely because a guest at one of his orgies manages to amuse him while relaying their concerns. There will likely be some other sycophant with a court office who will receive a "make it so!" order. Jaxarte Whyded may have many companions in both ambition and misery.

1 hour ago, Shiningbrow said:

While I wouldn't disagree with the last bit (entirely), it does go back to the original question posed - what is 'tapping' actually? Is it complete destruction? Or is it a temporary altering of state?

When one 'Tap(s) Breath' and the Air gets converted to MPs, does that completely remove that 'air' (whatever that actually is!) from the universe?

The reply to this might be in the nature of the Neliomi Sea in the Gods War, which was tapped out of its movement rather than out of its substance. What remained behind was stale, lifeless water, devoid of spirit.

Tapping an element will rob it of its distinctive features - fire will lose heat and light, earth will lose stability, air and water lose their motive energy, and darkness may lose space (i.e. shrink) and fear.

Tap may be the inversion of the Mostali Stabilize magic (although that too may take motion, or at least random motion, out of air and water).

23 minutes ago, Akhôrahil said:

Since Darkness is an element, it's not merely the absence of light. However, it's hard to see how tapping darkness wouldn't make the place less dark. Perhaps there's a neutral, gloomy spot that you get if neither Darkness nor Light is there, and tapping either brings you closer to it but not past it?

Tapping Darkness might be problematic - there is only one orthodox Malkioni/Brithini school of sorcery able to deal with the special energies of Darkness (and Arkati troll sorcerers would not tap their native element, ever).

Just now, Malin said:

I was talking about the fact that no Gloranthan potato myth was created in the past (unlike for Maize). However, if my players ever do the potato heroquest I have half boiling in my head and bring potatoes to the land, I will certainly draw inspiration from the real deal!

To be fair, we had hardly any myths for barley or wheat, and even less for oats and rye (and an experiment which proved land goddesses could be switched), with the assigned grains for land goddesses changing between RQ3 and RQG.

We know plenty variations of rice and sweet grass from The Glorious ReAscent of Yelm (and the Sky) which we have little culinary or mythical information about. There are plenty other harvests which have no myth and little information about their role or importance in the diet of the people who grow them. Which is absolutely fine for a rpg setting or even a well-described literary creation. 

We ask for a lot from Glorantha, don't we?

It is quite astounding that we have as much information as we do.

1 hour ago, Jeff said:

the Poor Fund came up. Greg said the poor fund would give maize bread (because maize is the Lunar crop after all), and just drop potatoes as a reference.

What did the Teelo Norri poor fund distribute before Hon-eel brought back maize? Something like the Jerusalem artichoke?

The carnivorous winged horses of the early Golden Age may very well count as terrible demons from above. While Hippoi lost some of those traits, there may well be intermediate states, or re-breeding efforts like the carnivorous stallion bred by the Char-un. When interacting with Godtime entities, horsefiends are a real option.

Another fiendish variation would be a horse retaining raptor claws that may be folded into hooves.

The demibird alone is a melee weapon - it is basically a variation on the Terror Bird, and it might be the rider's job to defend their beaked attack weapon. I guess the Klanth works well as a parrying weapon, taking blows on the hardwood back rather than on the obsidian blades. The mounted scouts prepare the shock of the beak attacks with their slings.

Earth cult burial practices tend to aim at the preservation of the dead body, at least of the body shape. Mummification or other forms of embalming are typical.

The dead of Nochet claim a great lot of land, making the overland import of fresh goods almost impossible. There obviously are ways to "repatriate" the dead, otherwise the temple of Esrola would be surrounded by tombs.

Sooner or later, skeletons may be what is left of a body.

I wonder what the idea is about keeping the body remains of an individual whose spirit/soul no longer lingers in Ty Kora Tek's halls. Daka Fal shamans may learn about a spirit departing to Rebirth.

1 hour ago, Ian A. Thomson said:

That makes sense for the canon and common ideas about Pavis. The background of my campaign (and part of the whole Grand Plan evolution) is that the Pavis Cult have a lot more resources being developed than are commonly known about, and thus are not needing to lean towards 'any port in a storm' as much. Plus there's the new specific ideas on how certain Lunars (including agents of the Seven Mothers) are supporting the semi-hidden Lunar agenda of taking over the Grand Plan and subverting it for their own benefits, to the detriment of the entire purpose of the plan.

Is the entire priesthood informed about the great plan? And may a Red Marriage plot have been used as a ploy to give the Lunars a false impression of progress?

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

Very much like the Japanese processions to Kyoto but its to collect in Glorantha whereas its to force the warlord to send money travelling with the entourage as well as getting the taxes.

The Sartarite model has the City Rexes pretty much stationary, and the royal palace of Boldhome isn't just for absentee ostentation, either, but I wonder whether King Sartar ever stopped traveling his realm, and how much his successors did outside of overseeing their building projects.

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

Where do we find reefs if at all along the Heortland Coast? Do we need to go south of Kenstone, maybe 3 Step, what about Seapolis?

My mapping of the intertidal and permanently submerged areas of the eastern Mirrorsea Bay sadly has not advanced a bit in the last months. I have plenty of scenario seeds and sandbox entries waiting to be detailed.

That said, IMG there are children of Veskarthen trying to raise their heads above the sea bottom or the water level much of the time, but not unopposed. There are shattered pieces of land remaining from Worcha's onslaught underwater, possibly including Golden or Storm Age settlements fallen or glided into the seas, maybe one hanging almost sideways from the bedrock that fell into the water now providing shelter for a pod of Ludoch. There are mussle banks and sandbars accumulating from the play of currents and tides, and also destroyed again. There are corals in the Mirrorsea Bay, though no barrier reefs (yet), but part of the Building Wall magic may have been related to coral reefs growing.

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

But are the nobles the most magically inclined? Yes knights/soldiers for physical weapons combat but are always felt the nobles were even more magically capable then any of the priests that were not nobles as well?

The magical and fully literate caste among the Aeolians are the zzaburi, with the nobles using Orlanthi magic instead - possibly becoming rune lords or rune priests of Orlanth, Issaries, Humakt or the Earth goddesses in their roles as rulers, traders, administrators and judges.

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

Where might this be? Is it like right outside the walls? Are these glazed bricks and can colors or even wall murals be made to order? (I didn't read my Nochet book yet... sadly.) The Kiln is in the city but I have not looked in detail.

Meldektown sits among the clay pits south of the walled city of Nochet and is home to one of the greatest urban populations of Aeolians in Kethaela, possibly greater than Mt. Passant and quite likely greater than in Vizel or Refuge. The Aeolians share  the suburb with adherents of other Malkioni denominations and certainly also a significant number of non-Malkioni. See Harald Smith's Nochet - Queen of Cities for details and the map.

2 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

Discussion regarding The Kiln in Nochet and brickmaking has me thinking that Dwarves would be the quintessential ceramicists in Glorantha?

Read about Jolanti creation which seems close to ceramics?

Joerg said: Clay dwarfs are one of those badly diminished Elder Race expressions. Their self-replication mechanic stolen from Grower (or finally implemented from the Man Rune, unlike their elders), they are somewhat expendable repair crew following the Gold foreman exegesis of the available copies of the origin...

Are Clay Dwarves made in molds and what work order made the original Clay Dwarves?

I am guessing Clay Dwarves would be the ceramists?

The dwarves might be to high and mighty to use terracotta whereas humans would do so for pottery and bricks. Dwarves would wish for perfection and would use molds rather than a potters wheel, just guessing at least those that are traditionalists?

One rumor states the dwarvish ceramists intend to perfect their adiabatic turbo-compound steam engine(s) as part of the repair of the World Machine.

Do dwarves use "living clay" to make these engines?

Are the molds for flintlocks and blunderbusses made of ceramic material which are more resistant to high temps or do they use sorcery to make the weapon components?

 

 

 

 

Clay dwarfs are the conceptual copy of the various races of humans made from clay (like the Agitorani, the first Dara Happans, the Thinobutan ancestors, the second children of Vimorn etc. etc.) rather than the result of ceramics. The clay in question definitely is unfired.

Jolanti are carved out of living stone, quite different from golems shaped with wet clay and then fired in a kiln before receiving their written OS. No idea which mad magicians build these in Glorantha, if anywhere.

Dwarfs are renowned for masonry, working rock into building blocks. They also know concrete, poured rock. While they could work with fired bricks, I don't see much to inspire them to go in that direction.

Rather than pottery, dwarfs delight in the use of glass produced by the Lead caste, and their notion of ceramics probably comes as semi-molten rock inside glazed surfaces. In cooperation with rock dwarfs, they might produce glazed concrete containers if blown glass bottles (not necessarily made of clear glass) don't serve.

The other high temperature caste of the Mostali are the brass mostali, and they might have an interest in heat-resistant chamotte. Possibly provided by a cooperation of Rock, Lead and Quicksilver caste brethren.