Joerg

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Joerg last won the day on April 26

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About Joerg

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    Gloranthan studies
  • Birthday 01/03/1965

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    www.sartar.de

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  • RPG Biography
    Former president of Deutsche RuneQuest-Gesellschaft aka Chaos Society, Glorantha know-it-all (almost), some mentions in Glorantha publications
  • Current games
    Occasional HQG, RQ and Cthulhu
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    Kiel
  • Blurb
    Into rpgs since1984, into world building since the 70ies, into RQ since 1989, active on RQ-Daily and successors since 1993
  1. Star Captains are powerful inhabitants of the sky, either native demigod sky people of the Fire Tribe, or powerful heroes (e.g. Orlanthi) who conquered a place in the Upper World and established themselves as a star. At least four of these returned to the Vingkotlings after Vingkot's Death and assisted remnants of broken tribes, creating successful new ones. .
  2. To me this means that the cultists need to participate in the ritual hunts, with the site where the prey is cornered and slain being the temporary holy place.
  3. According to Dara Happans and others, the Votanki are supposed to be related to the Zarkos yelmalio-worshipping goat breeders. The citadel dwellers have adopted Mralota for their "urban" pig breeding. Pastoralism is as much linked to the fire rune and the earth rune. The Dara Happans bred gazzam, then cattle and horses, the Kestinliddi flightless birds, the Pentans horses and cattle. Sheep are as much linked to the water rune of Heler as they are to the storm rune of Orlanth and Sons. The Balazaring Votanki ended up as non-herding hunters of wild beasts, including potential Praxian mounts (Bison, Sable).
  4. Genert's Garden is mostly a Golden Age story. Some Green Age stuff is associated, but most of it is Golden Age (e.g. Seolinthur entering is a result of the invasion of the Ocean of Terror, an event triggered by the Birth of Umath and re-introducing Change to the Stagnant Empire (again - there are well-documented cases how Brightface usurped rulership from the White Queen in Entekosiad, and RQ Companion describes three victories of Yelm on his ascendance, so there was a period before Yelm from which he struggled into his role as emperor). I have come to the conclusion that "Green Age", the "First Events", can happen well into the Gods War, changing the Cycles to include the consequences of these First Events. Like Death entering the world. Like the Separation of the Living and the Dead (one of the last First Events, starting the Gray Age or Silver Age). Like Waha's Covenant. The Survival Covenant is somewhat exceptional in that the Survival method that led into the Gray Age still continues, but other peoples hunt or slaughter their totem beasts too. Genert revived will lead to the Garden blooming again, restoring it to Golden Age or Early Storm Age splendor. (Nobody wants to go back to a time before the rivers entered the Garden, do they? This is true for basically all of Glorantha, without any exception for the land of Prax. The beasts we slaughter don't rise the next morning! (Whatever next morning means in Godtime...) People having been numerous... Lots of small groups of very different, often bizarre peoples. Like e.g. the Beast Riders. There is human sacrifice for crops (maize rites, Maran Gor rites, Esrolian male sacrifice). Survivalism isn't tied to apocalypses, it follows to ordinary warfare, epidemics, or natural disasters several steps short of an apocalypse. Think of e.g. the consequences of the Black Death, the Irish Potato Famine, or the Thirty Years War. Marsh dwellers, jungle dwellers, people inhabiting tidal flats, mountain dwellers all can claim the same thing - they all survive because of the special knowledge and rites of their culture, and foreigners get claimed by their everyday hazards.
  5. Yes - born in the Garden, in Tada's kingdom (which apparently stretched all the way to the Shan Shan, and south to the slopes of the Spike). The tiny little land now known as the Plains of Prax are what is left after Worcha eating up the southern shores (hence the cliffs above the marshlands), and Chaos and Genert's Death devastating the places east of Zola Fel. It isn't clear what protected modern Prax from the bad results of Earthfall to the extent that makes it appear lush compared to the Wastes. Storm Bull's last stand, Tada's trickery hiding Eiritha from Death and her continuing presence when most other Earth Deities were lost, and the troll victory at the Castle of Lead up in Shadows Dance may all have contributed. Prax, Tada's Kingdom, and Genert's Garden may have been used to describe the same place prior to the Earthfall. And that's only the tribes that survived the Greater Darkness. There are likely others that were lost before Waha's Covenant, and not necessarily to Chaos, but e.g. to the Seas, to the Basmoli, or to the Zaranistangi. Possibly also to the Hyalorings. The Flood Age and the Lesser Darkness saw changes in Genert's Garden which brought strife and death. We know at least one son of the Bull who perished, Orani. I don't mean this as attacks on your position, David, but as a means to find out new interesting facts about the history of Prax, and, as you wrote, new plot hooks. By presenting a different perspective on the place that has been viewed through Beast Nomad eyes mostly, we might find out more about the Garden - like e.g. the sudden appearance of Brown Elves in the early conflicts with the trolls. Clearly they weren't yet asleep then, and the continued presence of Genert may have been a factor in that, as was the continued survival of Flamal at Hrelar Amali before Eurmal and/or Zorak Zoran laid the axe to the primal tree. There must have been attrition of clans, especially for the tribes which emerged as minor at the Covenant and after the Dawn. I wonder whether the Sables were the only tribe with a variant origin that beats your Eirithan Genealogy above, or whether other tribes of the early covenant had similar variant roots, phratries and queens. Impala, Bison and High Llama don't, but we have no idea whether other tribes (including the rhinos, long noses and plains elk) might have had. Likewise, we only have two variant beast rider tribes (ostrich and bolo lizard) emerging from the Greater Darkness and joining the Covenant. Lots of others in a similar shape may have been lost due to their distance from the Storm Bull. Lastly, the Hyalorings... Neither would the various Tada-Shi communities have been much bigger, except possibly for the Sleeping City and the precursor of the Paps and other such high holy places. The Tada-Shi and the Oasis spirits appear to have been allied from before the devastation, much more so than the Beast Riders. Is there any evidence of lost oasis altars in the Wastes? There are other grand ruins in Prax - Monkey Ruins, Winter Ruins, Ex. The Wastes might have other such places with forgotten (but possibly somewhat retrievable) histories, which might help contribute to a reconstruction of Genert. But then, exactly a success of that project might put the Beast Riders or at least their Covenant out of business.
  6. As far as I know, the Beast Riders roamed Genert's Garden in the Storm Age after immigrating from the slopes of the Spike, much like Orlanth led the Durevings and the Ram People north from Dini, and various other herd beast leaders like the Andam Horde or the Bisosae did further west. Eiritha was a lot more mobile before Tada hid her underground when Death walked the lands. There aren't significant reports of interactions between Vingkotlings and Beast Riders, either. There is one single (pre-Vingkotling?) myth, the story where Orlanth used lariat and stick to overcome the bull. Tada was killed in the Lesser Darkness, which overlaps with the Storm Age, but definitely after the arrival of Storm Bull and the Beast Riders. Clearly a part of Tada? Like the Basmoli Berserkers are clearly a part of Basmol? Or the Beast Riders a part of Storm Bull and/or Waha, and of course Eiritha? So they suffer from a similar loss as the Heortlings did during the "Orlanth is Dead" episode 1621-1622, but ongoing. Their survival sites are in Prax, around the place where Tada had buried their ancestress to hide her from Death. Their birth sites where the slopes of the Spike met Genert's Garden were most likely destroyed by Sshorg or Worcha, and their habitat was throughout the Garden. They all followed Storm Bull's call to the Eternal Battle, though, and that's how they ended up in Prax, conveniently close to the Eiritha Hills, which are quite likely located on an ancient site of Ernalda worship of the Tada-Shi. Or do you have ancestral grazing sites for the long noses, the plains elk and other such lost tribes in Prax? I don't see the slightest evidence that the birth sites of the Beast Nomads were where Eiritha was buried. Eiritha is acknowledged even way up in Pent as cattle mother. There are myths which credit Tada with raising the Shan Shan range, too. The Tada-shi weren't necessarily restricted to Prax, either, but that's where they survived, and where their most holy places sit. They were neighbors of the Orlanthi at the end of the Downland migration, and there were marriages between the two peoples who worshipped their common Earth Mother. Possibly including Beren/Redaylde and Orgovalte/Ulanin, followers/descendants of Yamsur. The Praxian savannah may have been home to the Hyalorings before their migration to Saird, rather than the offspring of Storm Bull.
  7. What people tend to overlook - the real Praxians are the Oasis folk. The Beast Riders are immigrants who used to roam a much wider area (slowly re-discovered as The Wastes, parts of them drawn back from the Hidden Greens) and who did not like the ancient Redwood savannah of Prax very much, but tolerated it for the sake of their ancestress Eiritha. If Sandy's idea that the Covenant made the "winners" smarter rather than the "losers" (the grazers) dumber, I am inclined to agree that the Beast Riders have no notion of the value of writing, and never had. The Tada-shi are a different case, though. Are there written versions of elemental languages? I don't really think so. Writing appears to be a human activity. Sure, there are dragonewt plinths with depictions that might be glyphs, and there might be dwarven schedule engines yielding certain types of clacks in certain sequences, but putting language into a type of writing appears to be a human endeavour. (Lhankor Mhy cultists might beg to differ, but given the suspicious of his western origins, his writing and that of the Tadeniti might be the same.)
  8. I would have thought that there is an Oasis Folk complement at the Paps, too, probably serving the 48 Old Ones, and providing a self-replicating population in the place.
  9. The use of water elementals for propulsion was a Waertagi trademark - the biggest ones were called waves, up to Tidal Wave. Here's the question whether the God Forgotten are closer to Malkioni seafarers or closer to the ancient Brithini allies, the Waertagi. The Ludoch will probably be firmly in the Waertagi camp, but the Rightarmers are the first and maybe most dedicated followers of Dormal, and wouldn't be very agreeable to the High Seas taken away from them again. I am far from convinced that getting a bound fire elemental to heat the water would be cheaper. While the God Forgotten don't have any elemental preferences, the availability of such elementals would be limited. The equivalent to an oil lamp array isn't that hard to manufacture, and much less of a risk in a ship with a metal hull. Without a wicker, most oil sorts won't burn.
  10. The Orlanthi might have a similar drive, fueled by the Trickster Fart spell, which might have been the original version of the Slontan precursor of these barges, too. Are these barges turtle-clads, like the fire-barges mentioned in the History of the Heortling Peoples (pp.57, 62)? In my old setting, I had a nation of (RQ) ogres who used seal skin stretched over flat-ribbed metal frames for their ship hulls. I suppose the God Forgotten might also have a few windbag-runners using captured air elementals pushing platfoms surrounded by a leather skirt just above the surface of water or tidal flats.
  11. This is slightly longer than Platon referring to the Thera eruption and tsunami in the Kritias dialogue as Atlantis. No documents older than Platon's are known to refer to Atlantis, so one can assume that Platon took the role of a Grey Sage writing down oral tradition. There is the earth temple at the Paps, however, with its semi-literate priestesshood retelling the stories with the support of cave paintings or similar, possibly in the style of Elusu's story-telling in Prince of Sartar.
  12. Yelmalio is listed among the Noble Brothers (Esrolia p.38), but the Esrolians have a hate relationship after having betrayed a Tharkantus-worshipping king (p.43) whose temple was placed on their lands by the dragonlords without saying pretty please. Seems to be a typical sequence - a queen woos a militarily powerful leader, helps him destroy her enemies, then backstabs the king and his people, and puts all the blame on the dead husband. Anyway, hoplites next to triremes make sense, though not exactly on triremes, especially if the triremes are primarily ramming ships rather than corvus-equipped infantry platforms. Neither are Bronze Age, although they make good visuals if you don't want to look for other iron age cultures.
  13. Bad wording for your criticals - "Rolls of 10, 30, 50, 70 and 90 are criticals" would have been clear, and in about the same number of characters. Agreed, that gives a 1 in 20 chance, and at the same steps. The visual system does provide the same overall probabilities for a very large sample or rolls at every skill level up to 100%. It totally fails for skills above 100%, but given the slow progression once you reach this region, I am cool with having every roll under effective skill minus 100% a special, and every fifth such roll a critical, using the non-visual system, in addition to the benefits from the visual system. I still say that divorcing the roll that determines specials or criticals from the success dice is the easier option for skills under 100%. In RQ and derived systems, crits are specials, so basically you don't have a 20% of you skill percentage chance for non-critical specials, but a 15% chance. How do you model that? Criticals that don't get the effect of specials?
  14. I want them to have a separate oxidation mechanism using stored peroxide esters, so just a dismutase wouldn't help here. Also, generating nascent oxygen doesn't reduce radical stress. Their respiratory system is adapted to extreme oxygen levels - in fact, I wonder whether Terran organisms might be combustible under such conditions. Compare the death of Arkadi in Red Mars, when Earth-sponsored saboteurs increase oxygen partial pressure inside the tent habitat held by the separatists. I intend the Blue Ones to move about with breath masks, spreading the stench of xerox machines (ozone) and mouthwash. Them having a rather low life expectancy might actually make them an interesting culture, and the offer of prolonging their life expectancy might split their society in a similar way that my setting's humanity has been split into various incompatible fore-runner and retrograde cultures. I note that I need to define the procreation and the family life of both my alien species. I think I am going for a hermaphrodite species and one with boring two sexes. Both species are gregarious. The Kurus live under an emergency government focussing all their energy to the task of species survival. The Blue Ones' home system Gate (all of these are human names, unwilling to twist their vocal organs around the native language of the Blue Ones) occupies one of the major jump beacons for advanced, long range traffic which means there is a presence of one of the (mainly human) major players among the technological fore-runners, but they profit from the availability of wares from distant sectors and the unusual opportunity to provide organics in-system at a blue giant binary. I need to read up on the life expectancy of blue giants, but I suspect that the planets of the binary system are older than their main sun, with life re-emerging after an extreme mass extinction event (during their capture by the new star system) creating the new flora and fauna of both Gateland and Gatesea.
  15. My statement is correct. Look what a 5% shift does to a skill of 55% and what it does to a skill of 65%. In one case it is fairly dramatic (10% more positive and 10% less negative "critical" outcomes), in the other case no effect. Criticals ought to occur 1 time in 10, not half of the time.