French Desperate WindChild

i imagine that more than SIN we should see the STR of the mount.

After all an impala with STR 2000 should not have any issue to carry a troll. The issue would be more if the troll's feet are on the ground or not

43 minutes ago, Shiningbrow said:

Urban, rural, nomad, and....

hunshen 😛

30 minutes ago, Joerg said:

 

3 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

1) should an esrolian farmer know farming "more" than an old tarshite farmer ? I would say yes (because probably Esrolia is more "advanced" in farming)

What gives you this idea? 

Esrolia has a very high proportion of unfree and semi-free folk toiling on the fields. Old Tarsh on the other hand has freeman farmers who immigrated from Saird, a region nearly as productive as Esrolia, and with as old an Earth cult to support that farming. Add to that the Heruvernalda and Shaker Temple rites, and the Old Tarshite may be the more knowledgeable farmer. Not necessarily the farmer with the better harvest, though.

the core book rule gives +25 farm to any esrolian (so esrolian farmer) when old tarsh gives +15 farm to any tarshite (so old tarshite farmer).

I m not able to explain the difference by my low knowledge , i just interpreted the simplest (for me) way ; if esrolian farmer as +10% than old tarshite farmer, I suppose there are better technics known in Esrolia, (note that the bonus is not you have a bonus when you work in Esrolia, the bonus is anywhere in the world if you are Esrolian, so that is knowledge not localization)

42 minutes ago, Joerg said:

 

4 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

2) should an esrolian fisher know farming "more" than an old tarshite ? I would say no (that's not because you know the basic of farm ok, but to know the "high level" of farming developped in Esrolia should need investment)

Define Esrolian Fisher first. Do you mean some of the coastal or estuary fisherfolk reaping the wealth of Choralinthor and the tides, or do you mean some riverine fisherfolk harvesting fish from the irrigation or drainage ditches between the grain fields? The former is bound to know a lot less about farming than the latter.

There is only 1 fisher occupation in the core rules. But I agree you may find different types of fishers, with different knowledge. To be honest my first idea was "sailor" (those who go far on the sea) but it wasn't in the rule

47 minutes ago, Joerg said:

 

4 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

3) could a bison rider in the wastes choose a fisher occupation ? maybe but then would (s)he be able to ride like any more "standard" bison rider ? probably not.

That would be a "one unique thing" as per 13th Age, really. While there are occasional bodies of water in the Wastes, few are stable enough to support fishing year around. The creatures from the bogs in the Wastes aren't exactly useful for human consumption.

yes we agree. I used fisher because it was fisher in my second point and prax because the idea seems so weird. But as it is possible (by rule and with your example), the question remains about riding at a high level when your occupation is not based on daily riding.

53 minutes ago, Joerg said:

 

4 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

4) should noble occupation be the same in all cultures ? Should Talar have good war skill for example ? Should Praxian noble have developped large skill in manage household ?

Talar: depends strongly on the Malkioni sect. In the Kingdom of Seshnela (Tanisor really), the talar caste has added the roles of the Men-of-All to their duties, so yes, as good a selection of war skills is to be expected as for Orlanthi nobles. Orthodox Brithini talars may have a few defensive skills with bashing sceptres or throwing crowns if they regularly get to command military forces, but otherwise definitely not.

A Praxian noble should have herding-related and magic-related skills rather than agricultural or administrative ones. The Oasis folk are self-organizing, and any direct Praxian involvement in their business is bound to result in a reduction of productivity.

As it depends, the question is valid. My (sometimes not convinced) examples were just to illustrate the point that homeland has not the same impact depending on the occupation. Now I haven't find an organized rule (aka tables) covering all the options without adding complexity. So my best way would be "up to the player, and let's both player and GM explain why this % for this character. And you will probably have a lot of better "based on background reasons" than me to explain any % 🙂 )

57 minutes ago, Joerg said:

I used to abuse the RQ3 lifepath system to allow medium-aged characters a few "career changes" due to changes in their previous life. Parental skills up to a certain age, then occupational skills similar to those you get free checks in in RQG.

yes life path is an option I have in mind (even to creating a young adventurer). but that doesn't allow all the options. For example it is not possible, by any means I think, to create a lunar scout speaking very well kralori (> 60%) even if background allows it. Of course there is the mgf keay word, and that is thing I apply (in the same way I don't follow the core rule background by default, only if player wants to apply it). But rules speaking, it is not "allowed"

 

 

 

I agree that having more a matrix of occupation x homeland, listing skill bonus would be more interesting (for me)

few examples

1) should an esrolian farmer know farming "more" than an old tarshite farmer ? I would say yes (because probably Esrolia is more "advanced" in farming)

2) should an esrolian fisher know farming "more" than an old tarshite ? I would say no (that's not because you know the basic of farm ok, but to know the "high level" of farming developped in Esrolia should need investment)

3) could a bison rider in the wastes choose a fisher occupation ? maybe but then would (s)he be able to ride like any more "standard" bison rider ? probably not.

4) should noble occupation be the same in all cultures ? Should Talar have good war skill for example ? Should Praxian noble have developped large skill in manage household ?

 

but to make me happy with all these things, rules should probably have so many tables that, at the end of the day, I would be bored 😛 so don't know what is the best way

 

If I had to design rules, I would probably work in another way, where players buy anything during the creation (characteristics, skills, status, number of gods initiation, heirloom...) with some limits like "you can't have more than custom 30% in any other culture than yours " (or you pay more to have more) etc..

but that means more complexity for players. Some are already afraid when they see the rules even if, once you are familiar, it is simple. so not sure my ideas fit with a lot of people

 

 

3 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

My 2 bolgs worth...

Firstly, it will greatly depend on why said bandit has become a bandit! What's their relationship to their clan? (also, what's the purpose of the question? For a PC, or for NPCs you're creating??)

I think you should strongly consider .... none! For a few reasons...

Firstly, while Orlanth has been mentioned numerous times, if the bandit has been thrown out of their community, they may no longer feel that bond that could be felt through the god - effectively, their god has abandoned them!

Secondly, if your bandit has been forced into a life of crime, I don't see the need to change into one of the darker cults. They should just try to stick with whatever cult they had before becoming a bandit. Only those who made the decision to go bad would actively choose a bad god to follow.

Thirdly, access to worship rituals. Unless your bandit crew has a high level initiate or above, then any initiates aren't going to be able to readily partake of worship ceremonies (in order to access or recover Rune Points/Spells).

This leaves the rather obvious situation - they are often spirit cult worshippers, and only get their magic from shamans they can pay. (or not bothering to worship anything at all).

Then consider likely scenarios - they've committed kinstrife... Orlanth and the clan no longer recognise them, so they can't go back home. But, they aren't evil murderers and so don't want to switch over to worshipping some other god. What if they used to be a farmer, and worshipped Barntar? Well, that's pretty pointless now, but again, why change? Maybe they were Ernaldan - again, is there much point in switching gods for an unfortunate circumstance?

 

(yes, I'm looking at this from a more human perspective - not the 'I chose the bandit occupation')

But you can commit bad acts in a region and go every season far from that in some friendly lands/ temple 🙂

13 hours ago, mfbrandi said:

It does (Scenario One), but I reckon it is also possible for there to be entirely independent cults of a deity not funnelled through a “unifying” übercult (Scenario Two). No?

What is a cult ?

For me only a hierarchy of mundane worshippers. for example. Are the cult leader of Orlanth in Ralios and the cult leader of Orlanth in dragon pass in the same hierarchy ? They follow the same god, they agree on that. But one is not higher than the other. (Well I think)

then

I would follow your both scenarios but with some wording changes

scenario 1

unified religion with mask subcults (bisos, stormbull) focus on some aspects, then sub’ sub cults (if any) for specific heroes or lesser deities

 

scenario 2 

mask religions with sub cults (if any) for specific heroes or lesser deities

 

 

1 hour ago, Akhôrahil said:

It's pretty questionable with Issaries as well as equal exchange is his deal. Might not be enough to call down spirits of reprisal, though.

well yes the issaries looter  will always "lose" if there is a deal the victims will save their lives when the looters will only gain some goods.

However I would say that solving a situation without wounds is accepted by Issaries

I would say that these guys (Humakt, Chalana, Issaries, etc...) are not following any holy path but may be not rejected by their gods (even if the established cults may reject them)

 

(well if we suppose that live is always greater than goods, but unfortunately the current events tend to prove the opposite.)

 

1 hour ago, Richard S. said:

I think the Hero Soul is basically the Rune Magic equivalent of a Fetch.

I may be wrong, and, until there are no supplement (I will by it the D day 😛 ) for that, every thing may change for sure.

But I understood* that when RP is what part of your soul you "sacrifice" (or "entrust") to your god, Hero Soul was what part of your soul you "store"/ "separate from the mundane world" in the god time for yourself (it is still a part of you, in this sense, yes i agree, like a fetch).

so my hypothesis is that HS is not technically dependant on a god

- you can "fuel" any of your runepools (if you have one or more) with it because as a hero you have a facility to manipulate the gate between mundane and god worlds

- but you can't "fuel" your HS from one of your runepools because "your" runepools are not "yours" but only a kind of your part in your god(s) power

 

after all , you may be a hero (HS) without any initiation, so without any runepool. How to recover it then if you need to worship a god ?

 

* the white bull campaign is my source for all my post

Officially -and temporary-, until the rules are published, David answered "yes"

but what I understand until now :

- you can use heroic pow for heroic abilities (when they are not automatic) and heroic spells you may know / have

- you can use heroic pow for any use a runepool can be used.

- you cannot recover heroic pow by worshipping anyone. The only way is to be worshipped by others (but I don't have any metrics)

 

Am I up to date ?

by the way, adding skills doesn't really demonstrate anything :

 

what is the most interesting between [Read/write kralori +90%] and [dodge +50%] when your setting is Seshnela ?

Is there any trouble if a warrior from esrolia has 50% in plant lore when a warrior from prax has maybe 15% ?

 

what is the most efficient warrior between ?

[weapon A +20%] [weapon B +20%] [weapon C +20%] [weapon D +20%] [weapon E +20%] [weapon F +20%] [weapon G +20%]  = +140%

and

[weapon A +80%] = 80%

 

so I would say that the balance between pc is more a GM responsability (offering anyone situation where their pc is good and is the one who will drive the group)

i see storm bul from the fear perspective :

 

there are different fear answers :

- submission

- flight

- violence

 

I think that when the world was so desperatly "invaded" by chaos, a lot of gods were as anyone in a mental disposition like "Even if I fear it I will face chaos but I know I will lose" when the Storm bull was only in "I will destroy what I fear, there is no other option, the rest has no importance". And when the Devil fights with both physical violence and psychological violence, he was unable to have any psychological hold on the Bull, and then was defeated

that's the first point what is storm bull for me : a raging / hater god ,. That doesn't mean he is not able to have friend, not able to have love, peace, loyalty etc... Just Storm Bull is not able to keep peaceful when there is a big frustration or a danger

 

On this basis, it is normal to not have too many stormbullers in his sphere of influence. Most people want to live quietly (at least among their own clan / family) Managing two or three haters in a clan is possible, managing 50% of haters in a clan is just the end of the clan.

In the same way, Storm bullers are not "those who hate chaos". About anyone worshiping the storm pantheon hates chaos.

the difference with others is that Storm bullers, facing chaos, will not hear at all the fear they may have, there is no option they must destroy it, their own survival doesn't matter. If they feel any fear, their answer will be more rage to destroy this fear. If they think they will die, their answer will be more rage, more violence, more destruction, no other option.

For me, you don't choose Storm bull (or the god doesn't choose you) because you hate chaos. You choose Storm Bull, because your answer to any threat is always violence, total violence.

 

Except chalana arroy and humakt i would  say any his is available (and you even may find one of them in the group maybe disapproving their acts but for any reasons staying with them)

 

depending on their gods(desses ) and their potential loyalties / passions the bandits will decide to attack or not an opportunity

ban’s followers may decide to attack any men but not touch women for example

Gargarthi will attack anyone (I think)

Orlanthi may not attack their kin etc..

and a mixed group will be interesting :

one bab’s among Valindi will protect the women even if she will kill their husbands/brothers if death is the choice.

the humakti will refuse to ambush but once their Orlanthi friends have started the fight they may propose a honorable duel to avoid too much violence.

when the white lady will heal anyone once 

 

2 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

I think an important question that hasn't been asked is - what's the SoL and ransom for a 'high' Initiate or God-Talker?

ransom is what others accept to pay if you are not able to pay yourself. So the point for me is more how many kin / firends / followers  you have. I would say that during the play it is not a rule (aka : [well you are a warrior, 500 is your ransom]) but more [well... your secret lover is the husband of the Earth temple priestess... he may convinced her wife to pay a bigger ransom than 500, maybe 1200]. Or maybe [your affair is not so secret... and the priestess will order anyone to not help you at all and your ransom will be less than the "rule standard", maybe .. 80]

now for the Sol.. it is about the same, I don't consider that you lose your status if you are not able to pay your Sol. For example if the priest of Orlanth is unable to pay the noble Sol (because war, raid, illness) should it be considered as a cottar ? No, he is priest, he is seen as a leader by his clan. However his clan, and himself, are "just" very poor

so if you have a position of leader (priest, clan ring) you will still be seen as noble. But if you are not in these official positions, and have not enough money to be seen as "a prince" (low sol), well you're just "like me".

 

10 hours ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

It also seems to me that when the clan chief's son or daughter goes adventuring or caravan guarding, they give up that noble status and Standard Of Living until they return home.  Though they may be treated with noble social status by those who know them, or clan chiefs  who know their father.  I would even change their character sheet and their SOL in the year end calculations, while they are away from home.

Something like Jamie Fraser in outlander ?

i would agree

i think (just now) there is another option in Orlanthi lands (aka « we are all equals and we choose our leaders. What ? Our leader is the child of our previous leader ? Oh didn’t see it before you told me »)

If I simplify a lot : nobility gives order to others (I mean others when you don’t pay them to do something )

then there are two levels of nobility

- ring member and priest (« job position ») : people. They lead their community (and we may find sub levels: clan chief, tribe chief, archipriest… in these organization )

- people who impress other (« social position ») I put there (ring member/priest)’families and any people rich enough to have the standard of living of noble (they have clients). These two categories have a great access to the ring and temple. So they are « respected »  ( do you think that would you have the same service than Brad Pitt everywhere ? Why if you pay the same price ? ) or « feared »(I will not annoy them in case of)

 

4 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

They likely become cottars,

probably

but I think cottars are semi free. Or I don't understand the difference which is... possible 😛

On 10/30/2023 at 3:48 PM, Akhôrahil said:

for instance, the children become free

well... they become free to move and to do what they want of their lives, not "free" as the status.

 

I understand the three levels of free / semi free / and unfree as

 

unfree / owner : you have some rights (probably few...) but you cannot leave your owner. You must obey and act as desired by your owner (in the limit defined by your rights) Anything you produce is for your owner. Your owner has the responsability to feed and shelter you

 

semi free / boss : you can do what you want of your life, you can leave your clan(adventure or definitly), change job etc... However you don't own the source of your revenues (land, shop, mine...). So if you work for someone you must follow their decision: if you are herder your cannot decide to kill/sell the herd and plant vine for example. You even can't decide to change the process of production (you could however propose any progress to your boss). A part of you produce (outcome) if for your boss, a part is for you. You have the responsability to feed and shelter your family

 

free / temple-ring: you can do what you want of your life, you can leave your clan (adventure or definitly), change job etc... However you don't totally own the land (the Earth temple is the true owner) but you can do what you want in the limit of the decisions of your clan/temple in your land/shop/mine/etc...

 

 

now from a war perspective (still it is my understanding)

On 10/30/2023 at 2:58 PM, Techpriest said:

Cottars do fulfill important military roles though. Cottars form the core of skirmishers and light infantry for a clan - they throw javelins, act as archers, scouts, slingers, and screening forces

I agree about importance of skirmishers etc..

However i don't define any "rule" like ("free / carl" must have armor) or (semi free / cottar must be skirmisher)

 

Semi free fighters are probably skirmishers, not by rule but because they don't have enough money to buy close combat gear (good armor etc...) There is no reason to forbid a semi free fighter to wear "dad's plate armor" if daddy were able to own a plate armor.

 

free fighters are probably good standing warriors with good armor (nobles have better in most cases) not by rule but because they have enough money to buy close combat gear and probably have time to train themselves better than semi free. There is no reason to forbid a free figher to wear no armor or to use a bow... If Jojo the berserker is able to cut a head every minute but cannot wear any armor or Koko the flying scoot is able to hit a wasp 500 meters away, you will not require them to wear heavy armor just because they are free or even noble.

 

the issue I faced on this point is the status (social position) versus the occupation (job position)

there is something in the rules about the status : the standard of living , well designed (aka I have nothing to change for my taste) p 422 of the core rules

So for me, in any culture where you can change your sociale class (orlanthi as example) you can be considered as a noble if your standard of living (what you pay, what you show) is 200+Lunars

Of course in a rigid culture (Yelm without Red moon, maybe even with Red moon) you are noble only if your family is noble or if the great leader decides that now you are noble

And don't forget the cult which is important too to define your role.

Then, in my Glorantha at least, you may have a noble (status) merchant (occupation) of issaries (cult), or a noble (status) warrior (occupation) of orlanth (cult)

if you  start the game with a young character, change (occupation) by (parent occupation) but that is exactly the same, you learn from one of them

 

you can see then 2 "default noble" (aka std of living) occupations, the noble (aspect war and leadership) and the priest (aspect cult and leadership).

As the start it means a young character have learnt from their parents* one of the two often activities of a noble : lead the war/clan (occupation noble) and lead the cult/clan (occupation priest)

* note that if your pc was cared by the temple, you may have learn the skill of the priest occupation even if your parents are/were not with the noble status. The noble status there is the temple which protected you

 

Any combination is possible to define your role in the society

 

noble (status) merchant (occupation) of issaries (cult). You may decide to focus your activity on business and let someone more spiritual lead the cult. So you are not a priest. However you are probably god talker and have some responsability (in all cases, as a noble you should show that you have Issaries favor !) You may be the official clan trader, if there is no temple of Issaries in the clan

noble (status) noble (occupation) of issaries (cult). You may decide to focus your activity in politic more than business or spiritual lead. So you are not a priest, not a merchant. War is part of your duty, but you like to lead negociation (orate noble + issaries) and plan the clan supplies

noble (status) priest (occupation) of issaries (cult). You may decide to focus your activity in the cult, you love to teach skills to young people, to organize the community of merchants, to plan the clan supplies, etc...  Maybe you love to have authority on other merchants because your position, even if your skills would not allow you the same power...

noble (status) noble (occupation) of orlanth (cult). You may decide to focus your activity on negociation with other clans and outsiders. Of course war is part of negociation but not only. Of course when the war you lead a part of the warriors clan, maybe you are the war leader. Of course some would dislike war with the same "tryptich" and other would prefer war than anything else. There is no rules, only examples

noble (status) noble (occupation) of humakt(cult). You may decide to focus your activity on negociation with other clans and outsiders. Of course war is the best part of negociation but sometimes , few times not only and you will probably not be in charge of this rares cases . Of course when the war is come, you lead a part of the warriors clan, maybe you are the war leader. You love to organize, to plan and to train others.

noble (status) warrior (occupation) of any war god(cult). You may decide to focus your activity on war. Other, more patient than you will negotiate before you are involved (or too often they succeed to decide that first the clan must negotiate and if it fails then you will play). You love to fight, to train yourself and other, to show how strong, skilled andpowerful you are. You love to see respect and fear in the eyes of the others. And what a pleasure to show your well designed, full of jewels armor and sword ! In combat you don't lead other with your words but with your acts. The fighters will be courageous not because you tell them to be but because you show them how they must be.

standard (status) warrior (occupation) of any war god(cult). You may decide to focus your activity on war.You don't have to decide when and how war must be followed. You applies the orders. You train yourself and other, you guard and protect daily the clan or your boss . Maybe you are an adventurer, no or few responsability for your clan. Maybe you are a mercenary, responsability for your company

standard (status) noble (occupation) of any war god(cult). You are not rich or your dislike to show your wealth or you are just prudent and want to save a lot of money for your old days/your family in case of.... You are rarerly involved in the decision of the clan but you can advice the leader. When it is war time, or when you are in a mercenary company, you are in charge of other warriors you lead them and follow the plan of the war/company leader .

 

Just some examplesand no restriction 🙂

 

 

 

On 10/24/2023 at 11:34 PM, g33k said:

There is a *huge* amount of really top-tier art already in the Guide!
The new art is undeniably good.  But I don't see that it's really an improvement.

I think there are a couple of very-minor textual tweaks they'd like to do, but nothing that (IMO) really justifies a new edition.

IIRC, Chaosium has (informally) speculated about a reprint / new edition.
They have indicated that such a project would likely move to 4 standard-sized volumes, rather than 2 oversized.

it depends on the perspective

 

for me (as an example) I don't need to buy this version because what I want is new textual information, aligned with the rqg background and/or rules.

But,

- if I were a new customer, I would like to buy my new content in the same style/fashion than the first RQG book  (core rule) I would have bought

- If I had a most "art" inclination, even if the text is the same, I would buy it too. I m not saying that I dislike Loic's creations (quite the contrary, I m happy to find them in the products I buy) but it is not a "trigger" for me

 

So it makes sense to me that chaosium creates a new version even if I'm not in the target.

8 hours ago, Lordabdul said:

Well that messes up my argument

et oui ! ... 😛

14 hours ago, Lordabdul said:

I mention it just in case @French Desperate WindChild wanted something where, say, a PC/NPC goes to see some Heler priest who is able to cast that sort of magic on them

my expectation is a "self experience" 🙂  Heler doesnt change other I agree (well from my little knowledge), (s)he is fluid so has a fluid shape. I m not asking for  "a eurmal power", in fact I m not looking for "fun" here just for difference, and how to manage it (if a table has no issue to manage it)

the point for me is the fluidity, the   two broken lines, could be seen for the different "states" (irl gender, interesting @Qizilbashwoman runic-gender, organs and their potential, etc...)  today you are "A", maybe tomorrow you are "A" maybe "B" but another one may be "B" all the time except when there is a trigger, I don't know.

Keeping this "fluidity" and "proving" it as a spell if you need energy to move to another "state" in the mundane world, like telmori, or yinkini..) or as a skill % (you "learn" the inner power of your god, like storm bull) or as an automatic ability (no roll, it is just part of you, as a shamanic ability) seems to me important

 

14 hours ago, Lordabdul said:

Changing sex isn't something that Heler did in the God Time, that's just what they are.

(...)

Barntar doesn't have magic to make you look like a super fit Viking farmer, and Humakt doesn't have magic to make your skin dark.

mmm, we saw that yinkin and brothers offer the capacity of change. For me, the capacity (spell, skill, ability) you gain from a god is not because they did something but because it is part of the main definition of the god.

It is important to see Yinkin as a cat, so you can transform yourself to "become" a cat

It is important to see Odayla the hunter as a bear, so you can transform yourself to "become" a bear

It is not important to see Orlanth as a XXX even if he changed himself into XXX to do something

Is Barntar's look important for Barntar ? Is dark skin important for Humakt ?

Of course what they did may be important too,  but "doing" is not enough. Any air god did fly, however just few can give the flying power to their worshippers. Why ? because for some of them,  flying is important for their definition, for others no

 

I expect that helering are helering because what they are. In the same way that shamans are shamans because what they are (-> fetch)

if it were not something important in the god time, why "this" place, "this" ambiguity in the society.

 They are ambiguous, they are different, and as I understand Glorantha they are accepted with their difference. I just need the difference.

 

But again, I m not strongly requiring  any change (who I am to say it must be?) . I just ask if it is an oversight (so it must be in the rule one day) or an editorial choice (so I must houserule if  I'm not convinced by this choice - and not yet I am 🙂 )

 

6 hours ago, davecake said:

Exactly! Not initiating large complex self-interested projects reliably! It’s Eurmal magic, it’s for initiating bedlam! Not project management initiation meetings! 

remember we are  illuminated. And maybe in a community of disorder, you may even meet one able to plan and follow it, even without illumination

 

(I agree with you on my table however, but here we have a munchkin excercise)

2 hours ago, Darius West said:

I am a little surprised that you didn't opt to abuse the possibility of a knowledge religion due to the training and earning advantages they provide. 

the issue is there is few rules about it so why wasting time on skills you don't use  (from my definition of munchkin) 🙂

this one is a little bit different than my previous one :

A rpg is not only rolling dices (and sometimes there is no dice at all) but is too social interactions.

In this option, I focus the character on "how to obtain powerful results in any domain even if you are not able to have powerful skills/spells/abilities in any "adventurer's " domain

 

the sugar baby career (SBC)

 

two cults seem to me the best to start this career.

- Initiate of Uleria  

Spells : Erotocomatose Lucidity, Community and Unity. Asap Extension (seems there is no automatic « common spells »

- Initiate of Ernalda

Spells : Charisma, Arouse passion, Bless Champion

 

Then choose a strategy !

There are two ways then to gain « levels » in the SBC. It is important to decide the path you will follow (it is possible of course to change during the story but it would not be optimized so not a « munchkin way » 😊  )

We need the spells effects of the 2 goddesses two optimize our progression :

 

First path : become initiate of both cults. And one day of the joker of course (We need….. lie !)

In this path, you have another choice to make : become smart (INT) or resistant (CON)

 

Second path : Heroquesting and Sorcery. Harder than the first path (well we don’t have the rules) but for an « end game » perspective more powerful results.

In this path too, you have another choice to make : become dependant (CHA) or become autonomous (POW)

 

Third Step determine your profession and apply the start plan !

You have decided to follow one strategy between INT / CON / CHA or POW. I’m happy for you !

 

I propose (in spoiler to increase the readability)

INT :

 

CON

 

CHA

 

POW

Now what happen for a sugar baby adventurer ?

Depending on your level you can use different powers :

(since I've bought the last baldur's gate, i m coming to be corrupted)

 

Level 0 (POW, CHA)

You have access faster and for free on any knowledge required for the adventure

POW : you can support your party by the choice of the few sorcery spells you have (enhance -charac, damage, armor…-, heal or magical attack, it depends on your choice).

CHA : You are not the best warrior / farmer /merchant of the group but you are good enough in your occupation.

CON : NA (start level 1)

INT : NA (start level 2)

 

Level 1 (CON, CHA, POW)

you have relationship with a large range of people, easy to obtain knowledges or special gears

In addition of your occupation, all your magic and network is useful for :

-          Thief scenario : you want to steal something ? enter by the door ! Seduce the owner, give them enough pleasure, once tired by all their effort to follow you (yes you need to train your cardio) they sleep and it is easy to sell what you may find

-     Murder scenario : you want to kill someone ? learn vigor, then enter by the door ! Seduce the owner, give them enough pleasure, once tired by all their effort to follow you (yes you need to train your cardio) wake them and do it again (need enough rp to cast 3 LU), until they die (the best death they may hope, rejoice !) If you are in a hurry, once they sleep, use a dagger. Note that if you apply this strategy too often you have a cumulative risk (+1d6 % after the first murder by season) to become a succubus/incubus

-          Street fight scenario : you have a lot of friends in the street… 3 or 4 thugs in addition means you have now new abilities

o   « 4 medium (60%) attacks per round »

o   « 4 lives per session »

-          Trade scenario : with your network you have facility to hire (or be hired) any companion, obtain help on the road, have access to better prices, etc..

 

Level 2 (all paths)

Now you deal with the clans ring (if you are not following INT strategy, you still have access to your old friends, for the best ... or not)

So you have access to a lot of things that ring member will even not share with others ring members (except, if, like you, they meet them in their bed)

-          You have the support of cult leaders to organize some heroquest, even if it is not really required for the good of the clan

-          You can obtain good thanes for any fighting adventures. Here the new abilities :

o   « 5 good (80%) attacks per round »

o   « 5 lives with good armor per sessions »

-          You have access to a lot of secrets of the clan (or clans depending on how many lovers you can manage…) secrets maybe knowledge useful for magic, investigation, blackmail, ….or even regalia objects, spirits, etc…

 

Level 3

Requirement for level 3 :

-          skills and spells > 100%,

-          5 big prizes spells per season (= RP >15 per goddess and/or heroic ability available)

-          Pass a easy test : seduce this dumb Polaris, after all if this red hair a#@! Ho#([e (as your friend Leika name her) succeed it, it is a easy test, right ?

emperors themselves look for your presence. You can obtain anything in the mundane world

you have access to new abitilities

            invoke 5 rune lords (or any rune level) as body guards, duration their lives. Capacity to replenish your « rune lord pool » by one per season if you lose one of them

 

Level 4

Apotheosis. You are worshipped every where in the world.

In Peloria you are Ulernda the « too smart concubine to be good, but it is so good mmmm »…

Yelmites are so proud and so hypocritical.

In Orlanthi land you are Eurmulernald the « lover impossible to keep for yourself, and at the end you miss something »….

Orlanthi are so dumb…. and of course the subcult in Sartar give you a weak spell we did not discuss before.

In Esrolia you are Ernalduleria the « sacred power behind the throne you should not try to challenge or visit, my daughter »…

Mothers know so much to protect their daugters and grand mothers know that the queen is a little bit jealous and want you for herself.

 

 From a rule perspective

 

Ulernda, subcult of Uleria provides « bless champion » and « arouse passion »

Eurmulernald, subcult of Eurmal provides « arouse passion », « Erotocomatose Lucidity » and .... of course ! « lie »

Ernalduleria subcult of Ernalda provides « Erotocomatose Lucidity » and « Community »

Special rules for Ernalduleria :

- to become a priestess you must be Esrolia’s queen’s lover

- this subcult is the only way to become priestess of Ernalda if you are not a mother (even men can become priestess)

 

The future
 

 

56 minutes ago, David Scott said:

his cultists have an ambiguous position in society. No one will question the gender of a Heler initiate as they can be what ever gender they want.

so your point is that "anbiguous" means that facing a heler initiate, you don't know "what" (sorry for my english not sure if it is what/who for this question) is the character where it is clear when you see someone else ?

 

59 minutes ago, David Scott said:

It's likely that elsewhere he's worshipped in some other form that gives Become (other gender) as a Rune spell.

Will we have another version of the cult in the sea/water cult book ? Or where will we find it (in official books I mean) ?

As I see the heler in the lightbringer book is more a subcult of Thunderous as it provides only feat related to rain/weather.

 

35 minutes ago, Cassius said:

As I see it, to become a man or a woman, Helerings don't need any spell :  they change their inner disposition and, as a consequence, their voice, their gait, their gestures, etc. What is fascinating about them is their ability to be fluidly between what men and women usually look like, to wander at their ease on all levels of 'virility' or 'femininity'.

If your question is about becoming a male or a female, about changing your body, it seems a little more difficult. The only god I can think of who enables this is Eurmal-Shapechanger (see p. 56 of the Lightbringers Cult book). The spell Become [Other sex] appears to be related to the Illusion or Dirsorder rune. But in your Glorantha, you can have this spell linked to the Movement rune and allowed to Heler's worshippers. It's up to you !

I agree with you, but what you see (and i see the same) and what is up to you/me is houserule 🙂

I wanted to know where in the rules except this key word "ambiguous" I did not understand like David does (but I have english at the same level than a babboon adventurer has tradetalk 😛 so it is not a surprise)

 

1 hour ago, kalidor said:

I think that is a heroquest gift

then there are two options:

1) it is an easy heroquest, as easy than learning a spell --> why not considering it as a spell or just having the gift described somewhere in the cult description ?

2) it is a hard heroquest --> so why this ambigious position when 90% of helering will not have this ability ?

Heler is very interesting. In previous versions of glorantha I had, I understood her/him as (s)he was a powerful god (after all (s)he was one of the Sea army leader). Now it seems to me just like an Orlanth subcult. If (s)he just gives rain, that's sad.

Quote

Social/Political Position and Power :

Heler’s cultists have an ambiguous position in Orlanthi society because of Heler’s ability to change sex.

I thought I would find in the cult book a spell (or an ability like sense weather, sense chaos, ...) allowing cultists to change sex.

But I don't see anything about it. Do I miss something / somewhere ?

 

A helering has no mean to change sex  (don't tell"heroquest" 😉 ) and worship a god able to be male or female or both or none or...

A orlanthi initiate worship a god that can be male or female (hello Vinga) and probably, as any god, is able, even if it is not a very important thing for his/her myths, to be both or none or...

 

So I see  nothing different between Orlanthi and Helering in the society. I would like to see the difference, I would like to have a spell for that. (And I will, but does that mean houserule ?)